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Would you like to see tenacity offer piercing damage resistance?
tacobeast94
Member Posts: 66 Arc User
A while back I proposed that tenacity offer piercing damage resistance as a method of giving players a way to gain some form of defense against piercing damage. After some ongoing discussion with others in PvP, this seems to be a reasonable approach that will leave PvE completely unaffected.
To clarify: keep in mind that the amount of piercing mitigation can be maxed at like 10%, 15%, etc. Just use an arbitrary value, it doesn't have to be in line with the other stats from tenacity.
<font color="red">Please, this is a poll, not a discussion. There are plenty of threads where you can hash out your ideas for what you think should be done to change the mechanics in pvp.</font>
To clarify: keep in mind that the amount of piercing mitigation can be maxed at like 10%, 15%, etc. Just use an arbitrary value, it doesn't have to be in line with the other stats from tenacity.
<font color="red">Please, this is a poll, not a discussion. There are plenty of threads where you can hash out your ideas for what you think should be done to change the mechanics in pvp.</font>
Post edited by tacobeast94 on
Would you like to see tenacity offer piercing damage resistance? 52 votes
Yes
59%
31 votes
No
34%
18 votes
Don't care
5%
3 votes
0
Comments
Nothing mitigates it.
It does the damage stated in tool tip no matter what.
and hopefully the defelection will proc bit of heals.
EF set reflection doesn't work, though. Unless you consider 1 damage per proc to be the expected amount.
In order for Piercing damage to be changed, you must also change how much tank other classes have. My only problem with piercing damage is that limits should be in place by changing feats or passives. I.E. first strike or the EXE feats that allow power stacking and one shot builds that can hit for 200K +. HR damage, while very good, isn't the primary problem. They have too much survivability in combination with that kind of piercing damage.
The biggest issue is that several classes retain both high damage and good survivability, one needs to be sacrificed for the other. If you want to tank, your damage should be bad, if you want to kill then your defense should be bad (including lifesteal) you should not be able to retain both.
I don't expect someone who isn't versed in ALL classes to know this however, you seem a bit wayard as a wizard here m8, but thanks for referencing me so I can help you understand a thing or two.
The only way to compete then, is to give players the ability to pierce high levels of armor or else buff their base damage. If they buff base damage then they must completely reconfigure the class for PVE because those base damage buffs can do CRAZY things when power or crit or other stats can be stacked with Bonding runestones and pets. Thus to balance PVP they must rebalance PVE. I think this is the best route, however it's the most costly in terms of time and resources.
Ultimately if you nerf piercing damage you make HRs and TRs useless in PVP again and relegate them to CB + SB and Trapper builds. Crazy stupid CC and then someone will start a poll about nerfing CC lol. Thus is NW suggestions for "balance".
Thanks for your time.
Do you remember Deep Gash? Once upon a time when I had a bis pvp GWF I could at-will rush a target and if it was a crit that target would die of auto procs. Basically the same thing happens now when a person ends up vs a competent ranger on a node. The rotation is cast, the 2 second at-will window is used to its full potential and even 200 000 HP drops and it drops fast. The HR had that same ability in the past and it was nerfed. Bringing a nerfed ability back doesn't make it balanced now - it means the devs are desperately incompetent. PvP is beyond salvation thanks to a number of things but having a class, any class, capable of ignoring stats on top of the gear gap, the rest of the class balance problems, match making etc is bad. Simply bad. No argument can change that.
PS: You just gave us the solution btw and its a simple one. Instead of giving broken, cheat damage to some classes just adjust the amount of Armor Penetration resistance Tenacity provides. Kinda obvious really. If piercing damage needs to be a conceptual part of the game then adjust it too with internal cool-downs, with inability to be buffed. Make it so its an addition to the normal damage some classes do instead of it being the primary source of damage.
What you fail to see in your last statement is that if you adjust tenacity on armor pen, you're benefitting GWF as I just literally said they can power stack anything to insane amounts in PVP. As far as not needing to "know the math involved" actually you do. If you don't, you're making suggestions based off feelings you have. How do I know what IL or tenacity you are as a dev? How do I know your skill level? How do I know you're not just hopping in the middle of PG and letting them hammer you with at-wills? I don't. I only know what I read. If I read tons of complaints about a particular part of the game I may take notice and nerf it. Now, what have I don't to those classes? Relegated them to CC.
Now instead of death by piercing damage you get SB'd and CB'd in place while they cap around you or you get CCd in place with TRapper while another DPS kills you and you can do nothing about it. Careful what you wish for mate, I know personally what can happen.
That said, Lifesteal definitely needs adjusted but GFs surely are NOT tanky because of LS lol. They have a shield in case you haven't noticed. GWFs have only LS to keep them tanky, especially against piercing damage. Nerf LS and they will go from high survivability to none, most Destroyers are running between 20-30% DR and around 30% deflect max then 20% liftesteal and high HP pools. Take away LS and they will go down quickly, however if you also get rid of piercing damage and give straight base damage buffs on TR and HR it might be possible to make both work.
The major problem is the amount of time involved. If the devs would have to completley rework multiple classes to make this work, will they take the time to do a proper job? I wish so, I'd hope so, but like many I'm not holding my breath.
Thanks for your reply.
Ive been with the game since it first went live and the most real fun I can recall in pvp for example was back in pre pvp gear days (pre tenacity). Since then till now its been a never-ending cycle of buffs/nerfs which resulted in the mess we are in now. I don't need data for that, what I feel is what most people feel I'd wager. Cryptic proved unable to balance the classes for pvp. Yes the GF has damage that is too high for a supposed tank. The rooting rangers are extremely annoying but that dont kill you in 5 seconds. You can contest against them, against the pb you cant. You mention GWFs alot but I don't see them as parts of current meta. Its been awhile since a GWF has given me trouble when I queue (not very often admittedly). Most bis GWFs are all trying to be tanky anyway even with destroyer stacks they dont melt you in 5 seconds. TRs, the other piercing buddies, Im fine with them. With SE death is at a 50/50 chance (dodge, move away, AA etc ) with PB you either run or die, its a certainty. I honestly see the HR as it is now as way too tanky ( deflect= heals) and way too damaging via PB. Give him trans enchants, r12, rank 20 guild boons, mount insignia bonuses and you get the single most broken class at the moment. A class above all others, a class in need of adjustment. Thats what I feel.
Check this out as far as what should truly happen to fix PVP. Besides that I agree at least with HRs being both too tanky and having too much damage. They should have one or the other imho, not both. However, nerfing both TR and HR is NOT the answer which is what this poll is about.
if they insisit than make a feat/power the increse your ArP by 2X or something similar.
SE is one hit kill for so long that ppl can't find excuse for it anymore
and no, TR are not glass cannon and this is not the only skill they have.
HR mele doing 40% piercing damage??? beside attracting new palyers to PVP i dont see any reason why suddenly we all take damage like a training dummy
instead of fixing the PVP campign, bring some new gifts to PVP, balance the Q, etc.
all they can do to make PVP intersting is this piercing damage...
SH PVP was the biggest project of PVP in the last 6 months and look where it is now
ppl play PVP for allmost 2 years and can't complete the PVP campign.
With a good teamwork, crowd control and pvp drains, you can kill any class without piercing damage.
If you like killing so much, why not having a piercing damage boon for all classes ?
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But yes, I'd hate to see T3 contents be reduced to Arcane Reservoir difficulty.
Thanks for your reply
Thank you for your opinion.
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HR however I think needs a tone down.
I voted ''Yes'' but the poll itself needs to be more specific. Piercing Damage by itself is not a problem, the amount of piercing damage HRs can dish out coupled with their defensive capability is.
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