the Destruction of SW.. indignation

metalraro · November 2016

which the next HAMSTER that will make the SW?
I heard that will nerf the tyranical ,
it is true?
really tried to spoil the class, but it does not completely destroyed
why not delete such class soon?
much easier.
launch an item to exchange class, so we will change to gwf or any other class that does not hinder the administrators of the game.

jenax002 · November 2016

it will be better if we all stop playing this game. One class ruling the whole game. every other class is just obsolete

metalraro · November 2016

jenax002#5227 said:
it will be better if we all stop playing this game. One class ruling the whole game. every other class is just obsolete

really, I do not buy more zen... my vip is over and will not buy more
And if that happens nerf, seriously think about stopping playing ..
something that already should have done in the past nerf

nubmaker · November 2016

Yup..if they did that they would have to acknowledge they nerfed the class, but im mean, its really not that bad even tho i am striker dps that act as tank lol.

tutelo · November 2016

Seems craptic pulled the Nerf gun out and just started shooting, no questions asked. Pallys BO took a critical hit, TC is getting "fixed" again and now it looks like ranger's Plant Growth got ninja nerfed. Wth!!!

kallephi · November 2016

I was planning to buy some zen for the possible Black Friday, but hell, no. I won't give money to a game where the devs don't know what they are doing. This is just like DDO, they know nothing about the game, they don't play. A player has more knowledge than them about the game.

They nerf and fix things without checking if the nerf/fix is going to maintain that class at the same level as the others.
This game is full of bugs, full of unbalanced stuff.

I know SW and GWF were ruling the game, and now it's just GWF. But I didn't want to be the best, actually, I was angry to run with TRs doing HAMSTER dps, not because they are bad, but because this game is completely full of unfair and unbalanced stuff.

I still play, yes. The game is fun after all. It's not the creator's fault that the devs are not doing what they are supposed to do...

jackharper · November 2016

Why you think "SW and GWF were ruling the game"? Because the most of people play this char?

kallephi · November 2016

jackharper#1224 said:
Why you think "SW and GWF were ruling the game"? Because the most of people play this char?

Because if you got a tiamat, edemo or whatever group with good, very good SW and GWF, they would be top charts.
And that's what I'm saying. I was happy with my powerful character? Yes. But I say that all classes should be powerful and do equal dps.

schietindebux · November 2016

Judging a class from a 10-25 man raid is not the way to get an impression.
There are more classes that perform pretty good, not only GWF and SW. I met Hunter that topped those edemo/Tiamat runs easily, maybe bugged?
And I also did some runs in FBI with pretty good Hunter, dealing huge damage.
I met enough CW´s till now to state that this class with maxed gear can even do same or better than a GWF... Desintegrate average damage 600k+ in FBI.
Warlock definitely doesn´t belong in that group any longer, till things get balanced again.

jackharper · November 2016

@kallephi maybe for you this characters are the best, but they offer only good attack, nothing else. Dont help other players in pt. TR/HR/CW are more interesting but SW/GWF is a joke. I play GF and a lot of time see GWF/SW who run quickly to the opponent did not wait for other players, only to inflict as much DPS. A lot of time they die first and thinking that they are the most important in party because "I'm a DPS". Embarrassing

fuglymook · November 2016

@jackharper, since you do not play a GWF then you do not understand it's mechanics. A GWF has to build stacks to start doing good dps, the first 10 seconds of a fight the GWF hits like a limp noodle. A GWF uses 2 of 3 encounters to buff himself/herself then has to get off a series of at wills to get their determination maxxed out. On trash clears most encounters last mere seconds. The GWF also gets bonus power for using up their stamina bar and that is why they sprint ahead to maintain their stacks and get bonus power. Most tanks worth their salt move on to the next group once the dps has got things in hand and gain agro before the rest of the group arrives.

denvald · November 2016

Eagerly awaiting word from the devs or Andy on this. Literally before and after etos run I've dealt half of the dps I usually did.

50% dps loss is a big loss.

flowcyto · November 2016

tutelo#5367 said:
Seems craptic pulled the Nerf gun out and just started shooting, no questions asked. Pallys BO took a critical hit, TC is getting "fixed" again and now it looks like ranger's Plant Growth got ninja nerfed. Wth!!!

ITC for MI rogues also got nerfed pretty bad since it now (on PC) can't be activated in the middle of other anims w/o at least resetting them (mostly impacts Duelist's Flurry use), and changes like that- which can greatly impact how a class can play- just snaked their way into Live. The devs are really not instilling any sort of confidence anymore, and I'm the type to grant a lot of leeway..

kallephi · November 2016

jackharper#1224 said:
@kallephi maybe for you this characters are the best, but they offer only good attack, nothing else. Dont help other players in pt. TR/HR/CW are more interesting but SW/GWF is a joke. I play GF and a lot of time see GWF/SW who run quickly to the opponent did not wait for other players, only to inflict as much DPS. A lot of time they die first and thinking that they are the most important in party because "I'm a DPS". Embarrassing

I was just talking about dps. The only buff I give to the party is Dark Revelry, and it is already very good (20% power and movement). I must admit, I don't invest in party buffs because I'm totally focused on dps.

kallephi · November 2016

kallephi#0836 said:

jackharper#1224 said:
@kallephi maybe for you this characters are the best, but they offer only good attack, nothing else. Dont help other players in pt. TR/HR/CW are more interesting but SW/GWF is a joke. I play GF and a lot of time see GWF/SW who run quickly to the opponent did not wait for other players, only to inflict as much DPS. A lot of time they die first and thinking that they are the most important in party because "I'm a DPS". Embarrassing

I was just talking about dps. The only buff I give to the party is Dark Revelry, and it is already very good (20% power and movement). I must admit, I don't invest in party buffs because I'm totally focused on dps.

schietindebux said:
Judging a class from a 10-25 man raid is not the way to get an impression.
There are more classes that perform pretty good, not only GWF and SW. I met Hunter that topped those edemo/Tiamat runs easily, maybe bugged?
And I also did some runs in FBI with pretty good Hunter, dealing huge damage.
I met enough CW´s till now to state that this class with maxed gear can even do same or better than a GWF... Desintegrate average damage 600k+ in FBI.
Warlock definitely doesn´t belong in that group any longer, till things get balanced again.

I'm judging from various epic trials + dungeons, not a single one. I know that a party composition can change things. So I'm comparing 2 very good players with the same ilvl and player capabilities, with a GF in the group, going to the same head, in the same party,, getting the same buffs. That's what I tried to say.
I don't make comparisons in just one run or one dungeon/trial. I'm talking about a lot of different runs with the same people.

Yeah, we dont belong to that group any longer =/ Well, I'm still playing my class, it's fun anyway

kolatmaster · November 2016

kallephi#0836 said:
I must admit, I don't invest in party buffs because I'm totally focused on dps.

I've played like that in the past, however when doing end game content personal DPS must be balanced with party buffs for the overall DPS of the group. Some Mods going solo-DPS is/was the way to go as overall you contributed more, while other times the Dark Revelry angle is the best one.

Given the fact our personal DPS isn't so awesome right now with the TC change/fix/nerf, I'm leaning toward the party buff and Dark Revelry honestly...

However it is worth testing of course!

merhunesdagon1 · November 2016

kolatmaster said:

kallephi#0836 said:
I must admit, I don't invest in party buffs because I'm totally focused on dps.
I've played like that in the past, however when doing end game content personal DPS must be balanced with party buffs for the overall DPS of the group. Some Mods going solo-DPS is/was the way to go as overall you contributed more, while other times the Dark Revelry angle is the best one.

Given the fact our personal DPS isn't so awesome right now with the TC change/fix/nerf, I'm leaning toward the party buff and Dark Revelry honestly...

However it is worth testing of course!

so you would rather focus on buffing other dps classes instead of focusing on your own dps, and as a result you are underperforming compared to the rest of the party? sw is meant to be a striker class, it offers basically nothing in terms of buffs/debuffs when compared to classes which are designed to do just that. it is meant to be a striker class. if u want to buff another class, go with a gf or dc, not a striker dps class to buff. In a sense, i get what you are trying to say, that the class would be next to useless if u arent offering any buffs to the party...what i am saying is that the class was built to be a primary striker, which should be topping dps charts with ease, and offering dps, not buffs or heals, u have healers and tanks which are supposed to be buffing, u have striker classes like gwf cw sw tr which are supposed to be dps. the class was not meant to buff. period.

merhunesdagon1 · November 2016

If you are buffing and going for overall dps of the group in endgame content, you will find yourself as a striker class extremely lagging behind the group when compared to other striker classes, and that is before the TC changes in 10.5....-_- sure i would like to see my group doing well in endgame content, but at the expense of my overall performance? hell no...and dark revelry is next to useless without a decent amount of lifesteal.

schietindebux · November 2016

Dark revelry is 24/7 active with some LS as far as I can say.
Apart from that you are right.
Warlock= striker
Warlock should be top dps.
I can confirm: The class reached the bottom and get' s beaten by every GWF, Hunter, CW, TR, GF with a DPS build.
You can't compensate a 40 (SB) to 60% (HB) damage loss.

tom · November 2016

the problem is that DR sucks. Its like a so marginal dps boost that u dont even notice it.
There are no buffs/debuffs the sw has atm which would justify taking a buffsw over any other buffer in the game atm

schietindebux · November 2016

Atm a warlcok can´t do anything than spend some buffs/debuffs and mediocre dps, that´s it.
Infernal wrath , dark revelry and if you are HB PoP on top.
You can go for Dread theft wich debuffs for another 20% and boost the "real dps classes" quite ok for 8 seconds.
Building a warlock and focussing exclusively on dps will lead to nowhere atm, since we are no striker any more.
All we can do is sit and wait, or play another class, since there is no compensation for this rubbish fix/nerf.

I would prefer a build like this one:
http://nwcalc.com/index.html#/sw?b=1oa5:k6rwk5:8dep:5tb7d,19iiu2i:15550z1:1000000:1550u00&h=0&p=hlb&o=0

Over that one, dealing maybe 15% more dps but still sucking compared to striker classes , apart from the fact taht I would go for Soulbinder due to IS (the old SS-spammer-build) if I intend to try myself as striker in mod 10.5:
http://nwcalc.com/index.html#/sw?b=1oa5:k6rwk5:8dep:5tb7d,19iiu2i:15z5uzv:1000000:1000000&h=0&p=hlb&o=0

qtpiekay · November 2016

My only real question here is with all due respect , are the devs reading our feedback here ?

schietindebux · November 2016

no, even if they do, they don´t care about the opinion of potential customer and that´s why I won´t pay a HAMSTER and think about wasting my time anywhere else

merhunesdagon1 · November 2016

That, my friend is the question of the day. Hypothetically speaking, Suppose they were running actual "tests" comparing the dps classes in a reasonable way? suppose they found that sw compared to the rest of dps classes were overperforming when it came to dps, and found in said "tests" that it was somehow possible for some builds out there to possibly be able to deal say 1.5-2 times as much as a similar geared striker class with a dps build? now the 1st thing they would say is "this has to be addressed." So instead of scaling the other classes to be more in line with the "so called" overpowered sw (and even this I found myself laughing considering the almost class destroying nerfs they have offered us so far) which would be taking the difficult route, lets go for the quickest fix possible. the quickest fix possible would be to downgrade what they already have had on the chopping block for years now...hypothetically speaking.

I was never a fan of duck in plate, to me it was always a cop out (something that avoids dealing with a problem in an appropriate way) and something to give the players in order to compensate for effectively butchering Tyrranical threat (rip). In all seriousness, no other daily could compete with it, so I understood the frustration of players. What I would like to see from the devs regarding this issue (and this may seem like asking for too much) is to apologize fro what has been an occuring trend for for about 6 modules. They have not been paying attention to sw for 6 modules. TC was gutted, ls was gutted to nothing, when attempting to
"balance the class", certain class features were gutted. The only thing sw (which was created and intended to be a top striker class) has to offer are a few mediocre buffs which imo look fairly silly when used ingame. PoP is something which looks like it should belong to a tanker, because tanks would usually stand in one place or walk in circles attracting mobs, while buffing the party as well. For a striker class with probably the most mobility in the game, it is pretty much PoP weighing them down as a result of gaining the most buffs effectively by standing in a circle (or a plate as Etelgrin said) looking like a duck on plate, ready to be eaten.

melasov13 · November 2016

Dear All good day
First of all I want to congratullations of my frends and my acount frends with 10 year of exeming playing game "Neverwinter".\
Only one mistake that I can reolage please see and fix one bog when one person can defeat all anemeas/
best regards

russ4ua17 · November 2016

I dunno how bad the nerf is. I'm hoping there has been a lot of exaggeration. If it's too bad, I won't reroll. I'll quit NW. Not interested in changing classes, spending money, and getting nerfed again.

schietindebux · November 2016

The nerf of OP caused a lot of anger and threads. I run some dungeons allready and obviously there are builds to run content pretty good.
Warlock can't adapt to a 50% damageloss.

russ4ua17 · November 2016

schietindebux said:
The nerf of OP caused a lot of anger and threads. I run some dungeons allready and obviously there are builds to run content pretty good.

Warlock can't adapt to a 50% damageloss.

It's a big "if" for me. I'm on PS4 and hoping that it isn't a total annihilation of SW dps or that some compromise is reached before 10.5 hits. I don't need to double everyone except GWFs but I don't want to become irrelevant either. I'd even settle for a supprt role, if valuable and fun.

kallephi · November 2016

schietindebux said:
Atm a warlcok can´t do anything than spend some buffs/debuffs and mediocre dps, that´s it.
Infernal wrath , dark revelry and if you are HB PoP on top.
You can go for Dread theft wich debuffs for another 20% and boost the "real dps classes" quite ok for 8 seconds.
Building a warlock and focussing exclusively on dps will lead to nowhere atm, since we are no striker any more.
All we can do is sit and wait, or play another class, since there is no compensation for this rubbish fix/nerf.

I would prefer a build like this one:
http://nwcalc.com/index.html#/sw?b=1oa5:k6rwk5:8dep:5tb7d,19iiu2i:15550z1:1000000:1550u00&h=0&p=hlb&o=0

Over that one, dealing maybe 15% more dps but still sucking compared to striker classes , apart from the fact taht I would go for Soulbinder due to IS (the old SS-spammer-build) if I intend to try myself as striker in mod 10.5:
http://nwcalc.com/index.html#/sw?b=1oa5:k6rwk5:8dep:5tb7d,19iiu2i:15z5uzv:1000000:1000000&h=0&p=hlb&o=0

My dps is not mediocre, but yes, it is not what was in the past. I miss my dps, it dropped a lot, but I'm trying to adapt.

nyghoma · November 2016

russ4ua17#7677 said:
I dunno how bad the nerf is. I'm hoping there has been a lot of exaggeration. If it's too bad, I won't reroll. I'll quit NW. Not interested in changing classes, spending money, and getting nerfed again.

Yup, this is what i see in the future. You spend a ton of real life cash to perfect a toon, and with one idiotic stroke Cryptic destroys your work. They did it to the foundry too. If they expect people to reroll and spend more money, they have another thing coming for them. People should be calling up their credit card companies now....

the Destruction of SW.. indignation

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