There will be new PvP gear with more Tenacity, so trust me you gonna need this armor pen, at least for pvp.
Man, do you realize what you are saying? If tenacity is hit by arpen and someone can just stack enough to get our resistances to zero we'll have this situation in pvp (I do not care at all for PVE, its not competitive, hardly challenging, boring overall):
GWF hits you with sure strike for 54k before mitigation (2hit kill)
CW hits you with desintegrate for 130k before mitigation (1hit kill)
It will be mod 5 all over again... Regardless of messing with tenacity or not, the new armor penetration will make players take so much damage it's ridiculous. I doubt devs even see these forums, but they are managing the good part of their game quite poorly.
Oh the new ArmPen is fine. If anything it'll force people to invest in it, resulting in sacrifices in other stats and then balance it out naturally.
What's unbelievably stupid is the tendency of the devs to come up with mounts or boons or any weird piece of krap that just merrily adds you free, insane amount of bonuses without having to sacrifice your other stats, like the ones in the pic above.
They make a good foundation, and then they dig it up and trash it with their own hands.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
LOL mounts, LOL boons (seriouly, 8k lifesteal?! Just imagine the spike damage classes healing from zero to hero in a flash), It is sad that every single move the people responsible for the game management move further from balance and closer to powercreep unplayability. Seems there will be a power mount, a lifesteal one, a crit one. There will be a moment when a step closer to balance will be unachievable.
Oh well, if this tendency keep up, I see you all in skyforge (patch comming in august 11)
Yea well for those that played Age of Conan and remember what happend when they allowed guilds to have citys that generated buffs + that they could smash down other guilds citys this is not good news....
Elite guilds tore through the game with buffs that made them immortals to all others and after about 3-4 month over 50% of the games population had left.
The major issue is that this move toward HUGE buffs from citys drives the casual players from this game, add that elite pvp guilds will be able to destroy what other guild worked for and you soon have a game with very little people left...
8k Lifesteal, arpen and/or power .... add to that 50% more AP from mounts etc *shakes the head while walking away*..
LOL mounts, LOL boons (seriouly, 8k lifesteal?! Just imagine the spike damage classes healing from zero to hero in a flash), It is sad that every single move the people responsible for the game management move further from balance and closer to powercreep unplayability. Seems there will be a power mount, a lifesteal one, a crit one. There will be a moment when a step closer to balance will be unachievable.
Oh well, if this tendency keep up, I see you all in skyforge (patch comming in august 11)
...you should have seen the AP-gain mount. In the older version, it takes something like 40 seconds or so from 0 to 100 AP as long as you're in combat WITHOUT any power input so long as you're in combat. That means if you're actually fighting and using powers, less than 30secs and probably well into late 10's ~ early 20's and brings forth a whole new meaning to DAILY SPAMMING. In one of the pics I've seen of the most recent version they nerfed the stats a little, but it is still totally. unbelievably thoughtless.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Yea well for those that played Age of Conan and remember what happend when they allowed guilds to have citys that generated buffs + that they could smash down other guilds citys this is not good news....
Elite guilds tore through the game with buffs that made them immortals to all others and after about 3-4 month over 50% of the games population had left.
The major issue is that this move toward HUGE buffs from citys drives the casual players from this game, add that elite pvp guilds will be able to destroy what other guild worked for and you soon have a game with very little people left...
8k Lifesteal, arpen and/or power .... add to that 50% more AP from mounts etc *shakes the head while walking away*..
For once, marnival, you and I are in total agreement, and your assessment is absolutely correct.
See, stuff like these, its like one's take on capitalism.
The ideal is that in a free market, when an opportunity is given, everyone has an equal chance and thus it will motivate everyone to build their own corporations and drive a healthy competition, thus helping the economy thrive and flourish with everyone benefitting from it.
The reality? Monopoly. The bigger and stronger a handful few corporations become, the more power and tools they get to drive out the competition. Within the boundaries of the law they will do anything, jump through any loops and slip through every cracks, jam past any hole to take the ULTIMATE FORM OF COMPETITION -- killing it totally. If you kill your competitor, then you are ALWAYS the winner forever.
This applies same in any game I've seen, and you are totally correct. At first, some smaller, minor guilds will also think casually to try it out and have some fun. But then, as times goes by, the huge, the power, the crack-shot group of BiS guilds will simply dominate all competition and reap all its fruits. Casual players, independent/single players will just get sick and tired of it and quit the game.
In a manner of speaking, hoping something like this to work well, is the equivalent of hoping the BiS people will find a sense of balance, decorum, and fairness, and stop making trollmades in pug-queue GG in the current game. Which, of course (ROFL), we all know what the reality is.
Think about it. The BiS/premade/elitist groups already make a mess out of GG, which doesn't even have any merit or rewards worth going for when you're already geared/built to BiS like that, and they still make a trollmade to crush and walk all over people. What's going to happen when you give them some content that involves insane amount of actual rewards for crushing your opposition?
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Yea well for those that played Age of Conan and remember what happend when they allowed guilds to have citys that generated buffs + that they could smash down other guilds citys this is not good news....
Elite guilds tore through the game with buffs that made them immortals to all others and after about 3-4 month over 50% of the games population had left.
The major issue is that this move toward HUGE buffs from citys drives the casual players from this game, add that elite pvp guilds will be able to destroy what other guild worked for and you soon have a game with very little people left...
8k Lifesteal, arpen and/or power .... add to that 50% more AP from mounts etc *shakes the head while walking away*..
For once, marnival, you and I are in total agreement, and your assessment is absolutely correct.
See, stuff like these, its like one's take on capitalism.
The ideal is that in a free market, when an opportunity is given, everyone has an equal chance and thus it will motivate everyone to build their own corporations and drive a healthy competition, thus helping the economy thrive and flourish with everyone benefitting from it.
The reality? Monopoly. The bigger and stronger a handful few corporations become, the more power and tools they get to drive out the competition. Within the boundaries of the law they will do anything, jump through any loops and slip through every cracks, jam past any hole to take the ULTIMATE FORM OF COMPETITION -- killing it totally. If you kill your competitor, then you are ALWAYS the winner forever.
This applies same in any game I've seen, and you are totally correct. At first, some smaller, minor guilds will also think casually to try it out and have some fun. But then, as times goes by, the huge, the power, the crack-shot group of BiS guilds will simply dominate all competition and reap all its fruits. Casual players, independent/single players will just get sick and tired of it and quit the game.
In a manner of speaking, hoping something like this to work well, is the equivalent of hoping the BiS people will find a sense of balance, decorum, and fairness, and stop making trollmades in pug-queue GG in the current game. Which, of course (ROFL), we all know what the reality is.
Think about it. The BiS/premade/elitist groups already make a mess out of GG, which doesn't even have any merit or rewards worth going for when you're already geared/built to BiS like that, and they still make a trollmade to crush and walk all over people. What's going to happen when you give them some content that involves insane amount of actual rewards for crushing your opposition?
We agree on alot actually, only time we dont is when it comes down to Tr/hr thingy which got out of hand looking back imho...
We absolutly share a common disslike for elite pvp guilds behavior and bad impact overall for most players.
I also agree to everthing you wrote above to 100% and I fear that if they not somehow divide pvp/pve so that elite pvp guilds cant grief pve oriented guilds this will be the same dissaster it was for Age of Conan and some other games....
There will be new PvP gear with more Tenacity, so trust me you gonna need this armor pen, at least for pvp.
Man, do you realize what you are saying? If tenacity is hit by arpen and someone can just stack enough to get our resistances to zero we'll have this situation in pvp (I do not care at all for PVE, its not competitive, hardly challenging, boring overall):
GWF hits you with sure strike for 54k before mitigation (2hit kill)
CW hits you with desintegrate for 130k before mitigation (1hit kill)
It will be mod 5 all over again... Regardless of messing with tenacity or not, the new armor penetration will make players take so much damage it's ridiculous. I doubt devs even see these forums, but they are managing the good part of their game quite poorly.
Tenacity gives more than dmg reduction so it's a good stat. Take in to consideration new defensive boons, such as +32k HP bonus, 16% crit dmg reduction, new VIP bonus (up to 10k HP when 5 VIP is close to each other). Imo the EHP boost is a lot higher than dmg boost.
I dont think any class will be able to do 1 shots anymore on equally BIS geared toon.
Tenacity gives more than dmg reduction so it's a good stat. Take in to consideration new defensive boons, such as +32k HP bonus, 16% crit dmg reduction, new VIP bonus (up to 10k HP when 5 VIP is close to each other). Imo the EHP boost is a lot higher than dmg boost.
I dont think any class will be able to do 1 shots anymore on equally BIS geared toon.
...except 99% of PvP is devoid of the 'clash of equally BiS geared toons'. So in the first 3 months every non-BiS individual will simply quit, or just be absorbed in all the BiS guilds. Then, all the BiS guilds will do nothing but meet the exact same people over and over and over and over and over again, and then get bored, and will quit.
Say buh-bye to PvP. We living in the end-times.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Tenacity gives more than dmg reduction so it's a good stat. Take in to consideration new defensive boons, such as +32k HP bonus, 16% crit dmg reduction, new VIP bonus (up to 10k HP when 5 VIP is close to each other). Imo the EHP boost is a lot higher than dmg boost.
I dont think any class will be able to do 1 shots anymore on equally BIS geared toon.
[/quote]
I don't think so, powercreeping the game is never the answer, we did not need OP boons, new BIS equipment or new armor penetration. Negation could have been solved by a 1sec cooldown between stacks, that would work or, a serious nerf without making their prices fall beyond reason. Tras feytouched will still be overly op, It just needed to be fixed and give you 18% damage, not 50 in some cases (some downtime in its effect is also needed) and some reason to use other armor enchants. There is this thing about pvp, people compete, in everything. PVPers will have the best gear, the best build and tactics, whatever is the best at the time. Negation was never the issue for BIS premades, Pugs complained the most.
PVP could be more interesting with class balance... and a better matchmaking system. A bigger playerbase would also be nice, but attracting players depends on the quality of the management overall. D3, for instance, was a failure at the first year, reaper of souls was a great expansion and the Blizz team made a very good management, and the player base is growing.
With the way a fully committed Lifesteal character is shaping up, SF will again be solidified as the best Armor Enchantment. Enchantments need another pass immediately.
Patch notes for stronghold: they fixed pure and t. negation. Maybe it will have some usefulless in PvP now.^^
Like someone mentioned in this thread, FoTM enchants are and will be T. Feytouch/T. Negation combination. This is a general necessity for endgame player versus player and if you don't have this combination, you are severely handicapped. An easy fix to this combination is give it a cool down just like Bronzewood has.
T. Feytouch and a whole line of the current enchants need a strong pass over, as what we are seeing currently with the PvP community within this game should give them enough data on how the other enchants are not being utilized.
Until this happens, PvP will be more broken than what it is currently.
I may not be considered by most the BEST PVP Warlock on the server but, I am the most HATED amongst them.
Comments
Author of GWF Speed Demon PvP Build (Mod 11) <- Click to reveal the Speedy Beast! >:)
Man, do you realize what you are saying? If tenacity is hit by arpen and someone can just stack enough to get our resistances to zero we'll have this situation in pvp (I do not care at all for PVE, its not competitive, hardly challenging, boring overall):
GWF hits you with sure strike for 54k before mitigation (2hit kill)
CW hits you with desintegrate for 130k before mitigation (1hit kill)
It will be mod 5 all over again... Regardless of messing with tenacity or not, the new armor penetration will make players take so much damage it's ridiculous. I doubt devs even see these forums, but they are managing the good part of their game quite poorly.
What's unbelievably stupid is the tendency of the devs to come up with mounts or boons or any weird piece of krap that just merrily adds you free, insane amount of bonuses without having to sacrifice your other stats, like the ones in the pic above.
They make a good foundation, and then they dig it up and trash it with their own hands.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Oh well, if this tendency keep up, I see you all in skyforge (patch comming in august 11)
Elite guilds tore through the game with buffs that made them immortals to all others and after about 3-4 month over 50% of the games population had left.
The major issue is that this move toward HUGE buffs from citys drives the casual players from this game, add that elite pvp guilds will be able to destroy what other guild worked for and you soon have a game with very little people left...
8k Lifesteal, arpen and/or power .... add to that 50% more AP from mounts etc *shakes the head while walking away*..
...you should have seen the AP-gain mount. In the older version, it takes something like 40 seconds or so from 0 to 100 AP as long as you're in combat WITHOUT any power input so long as you're in combat. That means if you're actually fighting and using powers, less than 30secs and probably well into late 10's ~ early 20's and brings forth a whole new meaning to DAILY SPAMMING. In one of the pics I've seen of the most recent version they nerfed the stats a little, but it is still totally. unbelievably thoughtless.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
For once, marnival, you and I are in total agreement, and your assessment is absolutely correct.
See, stuff like these, its like one's take on capitalism.
The ideal is that in a free market, when an opportunity is given, everyone has an equal chance and thus it will motivate everyone to build their own corporations and drive a healthy competition, thus helping the economy thrive and flourish with everyone benefitting from it.
The reality? Monopoly. The bigger and stronger a handful few corporations become, the more power and tools they get to drive out the competition. Within the boundaries of the law they will do anything, jump through any loops and slip through every cracks, jam past any hole to take the ULTIMATE FORM OF COMPETITION -- killing it totally. If you kill your competitor, then you are ALWAYS the winner forever.
This applies same in any game I've seen, and you are totally correct. At first, some smaller, minor guilds will also think casually to try it out and have some fun. But then, as times goes by, the huge, the power, the crack-shot group of BiS guilds will simply dominate all competition and reap all its fruits. Casual players, independent/single players will just get sick and tired of it and quit the game.
In a manner of speaking, hoping something like this to work well, is the equivalent of hoping the BiS people will find a sense of balance, decorum, and fairness, and stop making trollmades in pug-queue GG in the current game. Which, of course (ROFL), we all know what the reality is.
Think about it. The BiS/premade/elitist groups already make a mess out of GG, which doesn't even have any merit or rewards worth going for when you're already geared/built to BiS like that, and they still make a trollmade to crush and walk all over people. What's going to happen when you give them some content that involves insane amount of actual rewards for crushing your opposition?
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
We agree on alot actually, only time we dont is when it comes down to Tr/hr thingy which got out of hand looking back imho...
We absolutly share a common disslike for elite pvp guilds behavior and bad impact overall for most players.
I also agree to everthing you wrote above to 100% and I fear that if they not somehow divide pvp/pve so that elite pvp guilds cant grief pve oriented guilds this will be the same dissaster it was for Age of Conan and some other games....
Tenacity gives more than dmg reduction so it's a good stat. Take in to consideration new defensive boons, such as +32k HP bonus, 16% crit dmg reduction, new VIP bonus (up to 10k HP when 5 VIP is close to each other). Imo the EHP boost is a lot higher than dmg boost.
I dont think any class will be able to do 1 shots anymore on equally BIS geared toon.
...except 99% of PvP is devoid of the 'clash of equally BiS geared toons'. So in the first 3 months every non-BiS individual will simply quit, or just be absorbed in all the BiS guilds. Then, all the BiS guilds will do nothing but meet the exact same people over and over and over and over and over again, and then get bored, and will quit.
Say buh-bye to PvP. We living in the end-times.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Tenacity gives more than dmg reduction so it's a good stat. Take in to consideration new defensive boons, such as +32k HP bonus, 16% crit dmg reduction, new VIP bonus (up to 10k HP when 5 VIP is close to each other). Imo the EHP boost is a lot higher than dmg boost.
I dont think any class will be able to do 1 shots anymore on equally BIS geared toon.
[/quote]
I don't think so, powercreeping the game is never the answer, we did not need OP boons, new BIS equipment or new armor penetration. Negation could have been solved by a 1sec cooldown between stacks, that would work or, a serious nerf without making their prices fall beyond reason. Tras feytouched will still be overly op, It just needed to be fixed and give you 18% damage, not 50 in some cases (some downtime in its effect is also needed) and some reason to use other armor enchants. There is this thing about pvp, people compete, in everything. PVPers will have the best gear, the best build and tactics, whatever is the best at the time. Negation was never the issue for BIS premades, Pugs complained the most.
PVP could be more interesting with class balance... and a better matchmaking system. A bigger playerbase would also be nice, but attracting players depends on the quality of the management overall. D3, for instance, was a failure at the first year, reaper of souls was a great expansion and the Blizz team made a very good management, and the player base is growing.
Best hopes for neverwinter
Patch notes for stronghold: they fixed pure and t. negation. Maybe it will have some usefulless in PvP now.^^
T. Feytouch and a whole line of the current enchants need a strong pass over, as what we are seeing currently with the PvP community within this game should give them enough data on how the other enchants are not being utilized.
Until this happens, PvP will be more broken than what it is currently.
-Kymos