test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Options

Getting the rug pulled out from under

gphxgphxgphxgphx Member Posts: 184 Arc User
edited July 2015 in General Discussion (PC)
Been playing a while. At one point I spent a ton on various trade skill assets. Then IWD came out and because one could easily get better gear there than the best made by trade skills, most of crafting became essentially useless along with the assets I worked so hard for.

Recently I invested a great deal in alchemy assets because unified elements appeared to be worth making. Now they are so relatively cheap on the AH it's foolish to waste days making them when in the same amount of time one can make enough AD to buy several with Leadership. Alchemy assets are now basically useless too.

So Leadership was the one remaining trade skill I still found worthwhile and would nurse all day long on the Gateway.

And you just killed it

Seriously, why not shut down trade skills and the Gateway entirely

Or better yet why not just shut down the game?

There's no point in me investing time and money if everything I build you just tear down and make worthless

We're not talking about progression of gear here, we're talking about entire aspects of the game you keep making worthless

If you finally decide to shut down botters in zone chat will you simply shut down zone chat?

Change is fine but what I can't abide is the lack of trust in you

Developers don't understand players are coming to view them as akin to the person who joins a guild only to rob the guild bank and steal everything the players have accumulated

If you make it pointless to invest in and accumulate anything because it will be rendered useless by executive fiat you make it pointless to play

Edit: Correction, you have already done so.
Post edited by gphxgphx on
«1

Comments

  • Options
    drkbodhidrkbodhi Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,378 Arc User
    Good points.
    ez0sf4K.png
    Atwil "At" - Tiefling TR / Saardush - Black Dragonborn GWF / White - Tiefling OP
    Leadership Council of Civil Anarchy
    SYNERGY Alliance
  • Options
    plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,255 Arc User
    When they shut down the game, they will tell us:

    We listen to you players. That is why the game is now shut down. It is also the best way to kill the bot.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • Options
    karakla1karakla1 Member Posts: 1,355 Arc User
    Such thing happen in every MMORPG.
    But if you still have your alchemy assets you can start and craft unifies elements again. Currently they sell around 37-100k AD.
    plat.png
    Platypus wielding a giant hammer, your argument is invalild!
  • Options
    plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,255 Arc User
    karakla1 wrote: »
    Such thing happen in every MMORPG.
    But if you still have your alchemy assets you can start and craft unifies elements again. Currently they sell around 37-100k AD.

    It was around 15K. I am not sure if it has any use for mod 7. Will that be useful in mod 7 (I really don't know)?

    I am worry when I actually finish one UE, the price will drop back to 15K or lower if everybody views this as a better alternative.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • Options
    gphxgphxgphxgphx Member Posts: 184 Arc User
    karakla1 wrote: »
    Such thing happen in every MMORPG.
    But if you still have your alchemy assets you can start and craft unifies elements again. Currently they sell around 37-100k AD.

    Well there's that at least. Thank you for pointing that out. It won't help me at this point because I'm probably going to take a few weeks off playing and reevaluate.

  • Options
    ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    You can still do Leadership via the game, which is pretty much just as fast as the Gateway. The only disadvantage is that you have to *gasp* log into the game. People are acting like Leadership has been completely removed.

    It's getting to be a bit ridiculous.
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • Options
    plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,255 Arc User
    ironzerg79 wrote: »
    You can still do Leadership via the game, which is pretty much just as fast as the Gateway. The only disadvantage is that you have to *gasp* log into the game. People are acting like Leadership has been completely removed.

    It's getting to be a bit ridiculous.

    When you are playing the game, you cannot manage another character's leadership unless you logout from your current character. Before this patch, you can spend 10 seconds standing somewhere (such as on camp fire in a dungeon) and adjust another character's leadership task through a browser.

    Now, you cannot do that. If you need to spend another hour in the dungeon, that task will be started an hour later.
    If you are doing a dungeon loop with a party, it will even be longer.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • Options
    ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    If you're in a dungeon with a party, maybe you should be doing that dungeon instead of tabbed out updating your professions. And to that end, if you're logging in with time to update your professsions, why not just take 10-15 minutes to update each toon before you start playing, then not worry about it.

    I know it's not as convenient as the Gateway, but it's still doable and you can earn lots of AD with very little effort...just not as little as before. That hasn't changed.
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • Options
    plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,255 Arc User
    edited July 2015
    ironzerg79 wrote: »
    If you're in a dungeon with a party, maybe you should be doing that dungeon instead of tabbed out updating your professions. And to that end, if you're logging in with time to update your professsions, why not just take 10-15 minutes to update each toon before you start playing, then not worry about it.

    I know it's not as convenient as the Gateway, but it's still doable and you can earn lots of AD with very little effort...just not as little as before. That hasn't changed.

    May be I did take that 10-15 minutes already and there are tasks did not finish when I start to play?
    Should I wait another half an hour before I play?
    I use dungeon as an example. May be I already in the party and was waiting the queue to come up in loop number 2? May be I was waiting for the dead comrade to come to the scene?
    Everything is doable including not doing it.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • Options
    tripsofthrymrtripsofthrymr Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,624 Community Moderator
    Lots of us aren't in a position to be in front of a game-capable computer all the time. The ability to update leadership on a mobile device really helps casual players. On the other hand, bots are always on a computer. It won't even take 24 hours for the hard-core botters targeted by this change to start doing leadership via the game client rather than via the gateway. The need to switch toons will slow them down ever so slightly, but then they're always on, day and night, so no real impact to them.

    Impact to players: Yes
    Impact to bots: No

    Do players sometimes spend real money: Yes
    Do bots sometimes spend real money: No

    Getting the bots in check is very important to the long-term health of the game, but this will be merely a speedbump to them, but it is a permanent inconvenience to honest players.
    Caritas Guild Founder (Greycloak Alliance)

    Sci-fi author: The Gods We Make, The Gods We Seek, and Ji-min
  • Options
    myowmyowmyowmyow Member Posts: 1,923 Arc User
    edited July 2015
    ironzerg79 wrote: »
    You can still do Leadership via the game, which is pretty much just as fast as the Gateway. The only disadvantage is that you have to *gasp* log into the game. People are acting like Leadership has been completely removed.

    It's getting to be a bit ridiculous.

    You need to consider that some people are in different situations than others before calling this issue ridiculous.

    I CANNOT manage Leadership during the day because I am at work and cannot download the game on my work PC (unauthorized software). I can, however, work the gateway because it is browser-based and does not require software download. Lately, the only time I have to work professions is during a break at work. I have given up invoking completely.

    So, this "update" basically killed my AD earning. The "update" was absolutely ridiculous and will NOT reduce bots abusing Leadership because bots don't care about abusing inside the game.

    The current state of this game panders to whales and those that can play for hours a day. The rest of us are screwed.
    SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! (repeat indefinitely)


    myles08807 said, "Back in my day, we didn't have any of this fancy Mulhorand gear while we were leveling . . . we walked uphill both ways while dying once every five seconds while leveling, and we liked it fine!" . . . Now, get off my lawn, you kids!"
    pointsman said, "I don't rue the game. In fact I don't feel any regret for the game at all."
    looomis said, "I don't like people changing to alts and then bragging about their mains like schizophrenic role players."
  • Options
    plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,255 Arc User
    As I said in another thread, I don't think the real agenda is about bots. Bots is just a pre-text.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • Options
    ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    myowmyow wrote: »
    Lately, the only time I have to work professions is during a break at work. I have given up invoking completely.

    So what do you do when you get home from work? Or when you get up in the morning before work?

    I understand it's frustrating to people who can't manage their video games on their employer's time now. That does suck.

    But it's not the end of Leadership. That's my point.
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • Options
    reiwulfreiwulf Member Posts: 2,687 Arc User
    it worries me that to many people, the ultimate goal in this game is to make AD. it really reflects how bad are things in here :(
    2e2qwj6.jpg
  • Options
    karakla1karakla1 Member Posts: 1,355 Arc User
    I have the feeling the only people raging about the shut down of leadership from the gateway are the one that had botted.
    Seriously i am sad too because i logged in two times a day to manage my 8 toons and first was also angry but they said they will do something about and the change already works. The ZAX backlog is down to 900K. Yesterday it was at 3 million and still slowly growing. The illegal generated wealth must be huge.
    plat.png
    Platypus wielding a giant hammer, your argument is invalild!
  • Options
    ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    reiwulf wrote: »
    it worries me that to many people, the ultimate goal in this game is to make AD. it really reflects how bad are things in here :(

    Agreed, too. It's really symptons of a larger problem. Ideally, people shouldn't be spending all their free time managing Leadership on the gateway. They should be in the game playing.
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • Options
    myowmyowmyowmyow Member Posts: 1,923 Arc User
    ironzerg79 wrote: »
    myowmyow wrote: »
    Lately, the only time I have to work professions is during a break at work. I have given up invoking completely.

    So what do you do when you get home from work? Or when you get up in the morning before work?

    I understand it's frustrating to people who can't manage their video games on their employer's time now. That does suck.

    But it's not the end of Leadership. That's my point.

    With the hours I work, I don't have that much time in the morning anymore. I am about to absorb the role of two jobs for several months and now preparing for that (will start in about a week). When I get home, I have MANY responsibilities around the house since I have two teenage kids. I make dinner some of the time, practice with the kids, spend time with the wife, etc. I am not married to this game, like some people might be. I play casually for "fun" (well this game used to be fun).

    I do not do this on my employer's time! I work 10 hours a freaking day! I take 10-minute lunch. The only other non-work time I do is spending 20 minutes working leadership on the gateway and an occasional message on these forums takes a few minutes of my time.! Most other employees here work 8 hours a day as well as taking 30-60 minute lunches and TWO 15-minute breaks.

    Bah!
    SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! (repeat indefinitely)


    myles08807 said, "Back in my day, we didn't have any of this fancy Mulhorand gear while we were leveling . . . we walked uphill both ways while dying once every five seconds while leveling, and we liked it fine!" . . . Now, get off my lawn, you kids!"
    pointsman said, "I don't rue the game. In fact I don't feel any regret for the game at all."
    looomis said, "I don't like people changing to alts and then bragging about their mains like schizophrenic role players."
  • Options
    reiwulfreiwulf Member Posts: 2,687 Arc User
    If you have so little spare time to play I think you should better try some facebook games, what's the point in playing a game that you don't have time to actually PLAY? Not tryong to be be mean or anything, but Ive seen so many people posting about how they have aprox 45 secs to play each day and I keep on wondering why would they even play this game if they can play something much more rewarding in that short time.
    2e2qwj6.jpg
  • Options
    ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    edited July 2015
    If that's the case, then I would find a game that's actually fun and rewarding for you to play, given your situation.
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • Options
    vyperdrivevyperdrive Member Posts: 56 Arc User
    reiwulf wrote: »
    it worries me that to many people, the ultimate goal in this game is to make AD. it really reflects how bad are things in here :(

    For me, it's also the this baffling desire to achieve bis. In all the other mmo's I have played in the last 15 years, full bis has been unachievable for the vast majority. You had to be in the top 3% of pve raiding guilds, or pvp players to even have a shot at it.

    My gear level is 2765 - I doubt I will attain bis in this game ever. Yet that level allows me to quite handily do that content that I undertake. I understand the problems bought bis causes with pvp, but that is down to the poor/non-existent match-making system.

    Why can't people just play a game and be happy to improve in increments over time (not that Cryptic couldn't make improvements in this area btw), and be content to leave bis to the best players with the most time (or in this case, the ones with the fattest wallets as well!)?

    People don't need bis to be able to play the content of this game - they just need to be able to achieve a reasonable level of gear in a reasonable amount of time. That's the level of gameplay we should be working towards.
  • Options
    crimpatulcrimpatul Member Posts: 197
    reiwulf wrote: »
    it worries me that to many people, the ultimate goal in this game is to make AD. it really reflects how bad are things in here :(

    Whats your plan to upgrade M7 buildings without AD?

    Or gear, or enchants, or all. Go to play habbo hotel, it fits you better than mmorpg. lol

  • Options
    myowmyowmyowmyow Member Posts: 1,923 Arc User
    I have dedicated over 2 years to this game as well as about $250 of my money. I love the concept of the D&D-based game and the graphics.

    I have no clue where to go now. I have started playing a new card-based strategy game a little, but miss the MMO world.

    This game used to be fun and didn't require so much time investment each day! Sigh.
    SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! SEC! (repeat indefinitely)


    myles08807 said, "Back in my day, we didn't have any of this fancy Mulhorand gear while we were leveling . . . we walked uphill both ways while dying once every five seconds while leveling, and we liked it fine!" . . . Now, get off my lawn, you kids!"
    pointsman said, "I don't rue the game. In fact I don't feel any regret for the game at all."
    looomis said, "I don't like people changing to alts and then bragging about their mains like schizophrenic role players."
  • Options
    reiwulfreiwulf Member Posts: 2,687 Arc User
    I'll play the game and upgrade my stuff with the AD I get from playing one char, both actual playing dungeons and stuff and leadership on my character, I don't NEED to get BiS or anything, and actually playing it with tens of leadership alts just to earn AD just makes cryptic think they're doing it the right way. which I clearly not think so.
    yeah, because I enjoy playing dungeons and skirmishes I should go play habbo hotel, real logic there mate. I see it the other way, if you want to play the game just for leadership and getting ad then go play a facebook or mobile game, I assure you it's much more rewarding, with the same few mouse clicks.
    2e2qwj6.jpg
  • Options
    crimpatulcrimpatul Member Posts: 197
    You cant upgrade anything with dungeon and skirmishes, and you will not upgrade your stronghold. Jox Minosclav, if you dont upgrade your enchants and gear, Im very sad for your team mates in T2.

    Im sure that you dont pvp. See you in habbo hotel.
  • Options
    silverkeltsilverkelt Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,235 Arc User
    edited July 2015
    this only impacts the days that I cant log into game.. which I will admit are few, maybe 3-4 weeks out of the year when Im on the road.

    I have to say its a little cheesy of a move..
    But strictly speaking, I much am more irritated about RP gain and experience nerfing then this. Those things are much worse on the playerbase then this is.

    Even though every mmo has game changing items, it never seems to be to this extent, or so often as this game does it. I think thats part of the point..

    I cant really think of one change that has helped legit players to any extent for mod 6..

  • Options
    twilightwatchmantwilightwatchman Member Posts: 2,007 Arc User
    reiwulf wrote: »
    it worries me that to many people, the ultimate goal in this game is to make AD. it really reflects how bad are things in here :(
    Without AD you can't progress. Period. I really wish it were otherwise but some things required for gear/boon progression need AD (and often large amounts of it). Plus the whole time there is a ZAX people will want AD to buy Zen.

    The current game design actively encourages a fixation on AD generation.
    Jenna Sunsoul - Justice Tankadin
    Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
    Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
    Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
    Darquess - Soulbinder
  • Options
    plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,255 Arc User
    reiwulf wrote: »
    not interested into getting in an argument with you or anyone crimpatroll.
    I'll upgrade things my own way, like I always have, at least I know that every moment I'm spending in the game I'm having fun playing it, contrary to pressing buttons over almost an hour for leadership over over 10 toons.

    You play the game your way and you enjoy it. Perfect.
    Other people plays the game their way and prefer to enjoy the game their way.

    It does not take an hour to do leadership over 10 toons per day. It takes minutes here and there in different hours.
    The capability to do the little things in different hours to optimize output is now gone.

    The different hours can be when people in transit, when people taking a break, when people having lunch, when people is watching TV, when people is not in front of his game computer, when people is actually playing the game but with different character.

    I know you don't miss that. That is fair but other people does not do the same thing you do.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • Options
    twilightwatchmantwilightwatchman Member Posts: 2,007 Arc User
    reiwulf wrote: »
    I'll play the game and upgrade my stuff with the AD I get from playing one char, both actual playing dungeons and stuff and leadership on my character
    Which is absolutely fine and probably works well with one character. However, many people like to play Alts.
    reiwulf wrote: »
    I don't NEED to get BiS or anything, and actually playing it with tens of leadership alts just to earn AD just makes cryptic think they're doing it the right way. which I clearly not think so.
    Hard to disagree with this. Personally I have no particular drive to get to BiS at all, but even modest progression ambitions are hard to achieve with the game in its current state.
    Jenna Sunsoul - Justice Tankadin
    Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
    Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
    Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
    Darquess - Soulbinder
  • Options
    nps4nps4 Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    karakla1 wrote: »
    I have the feeling the only people raging about the shut down of leadership from the gateway are the one that had botted.
    Seriously i am sad too because i logged in two times a day to manage my 8 toons and first was also angry but they said they will do something about and the change already works. The ZAX backlog is down to 900K. Yesterday it was at 3 million and still slowly growing. The illegal generated wealth must be huge.

    Sorry to wreck your "feeling", but I have never botted nor do I know how ( maybe I'm just to stupid or ignorant ). I do not use exploits/bugs either. I am just a casual legit player and I think this is a stupid decision that actually has very little to do with bots as many people have already posted. This MAY slow them down a tiny bit but it really hurts the casual gamer. Granted this is not as bad a decision as pretty much the whole Mod 6 thing, but it is 1 more nail in the coffin for this game. I have already stopped spending any more money on this game since Mod 6 released and it is slowly but surely pushing me to abandon it all together.

Sign In or Register to comment.