If you need more control duration... how about you spec for it, instead of going for damage? I swear CW's are just as potato like as the Hipster rogues. You (C)raptastic (W)hinebags already are ignoring 66% of the CC mitigation that is provided by tenacity. Now you either spec for CC and deal less damage or you spec for higher damage and the result will be less CC duration. Considered that the CW itself is already way too tanky (too much hp, too much DR, for a cloth/pyjama wearer.) this sounds like a fair tradeoff. Besides, it's not like every toon is running around with a r12 elven battle, so the usual 'CW-drama' is pretty uncalled for.
Take the CC feats and boons, or uninstall. The choice is your's, my kiddie friends.
It is pretty evident that your confident argument is -- unfortunately -- not backed up by experience. Instead, you are just assuming no CW player would be that crazy to actually run a build like that.
Why do you think I am complaining about TEB in the first place? Because I didn't build my CW "spec for CC and deal less damage"? You think I'm complaining about this because I've built a cookie-cutter DPS CW build like other guys and now I'm just whining about insufferably short CC durations despite I didn't make efforts to make it better? Like how some CW players always complain "we've got least control despite being a control wizard"?
No. I've built for it. My specs are;
27 WIS: +17%
Valyndra's set: +15%
3 artifacts + offhand stat bonus = +10%
offhand class feature bonus = +5%
Orb of Imposition + Oppressor feat = +24%
+71% Control Bonus
This is not the theoreical maximum but its still very high. From this point the only thing I can do is get the 4th artifact for another +600 control bonus, upgrade the rest 3 artifacts from leg. to myth., which would probably boost another 5~7%... and then get the triple ToD boon for control for another +15%.
Even against people with currently BiS PvP gearset that would give +40% resistance through tenacity, I can hold someone for around 4.0 ~ 4.5 seconds with a single shot of EF. Just like you say, I've sacrificed damage to specialize my role in CC, and guess how long EF lasts on someone with TEB enchantment slotted.
1 second. That's how long it lasts.
Now, I wouldn't be complaining if the DC or the Paly, knowing that someone can CC them heavily and have them focused down, has actually built up for CC-resistance like I have. If they choose item sets, artifacts, heavy WIS stat investments and CC-reducing powers/feats to do so, and if it was all a result of how they have chosen to embrace the weaknesses that comes along with specializing in one aspect of their class, then I really, really would not be complaining, because just like you said if someone makes their sacrifices in damage or DR or HP or whatever the result of building up for CC-resistance, then that's a fair deal. I accept the fact that I can't control those guys, because they've went through the process, took the steps, took in the gooid and bad to become so resistant to CCs. They've made their effort, fair and square, so if someone actually builds for CC-resistance like I've actually build for CCs, no complaints from me whatsoever.
But is that what TEB does?H3LL NO.
What TEB does is allow a Paly/DC to retain his supertank/heal build, a GF to retain his mega-damage build, a TR /CW/SW to retain his perma-DPS build, the HR to retain his own non-stop permadaze build... basically allow all classes to be themselves and at the same time run a permanent near-immunity to all CCs without even investing a single item slot or stat point to CC resistance, and simply embed an AH-bought item to your chest and just negate an entire game mechanic.
TEB just removes, CC from the game, period.
...
Like said, when somebody starts wearing TEB, then there is no stopping him whatever he does. Like mentioned many times, the entire PvP simply becomes "who has higher HP and higher damage". There is no 'skill' involved in what happens next. It's just a toe-to-toe slugfest because nothing, nothing else works.
So please, tell me again how I'm a hipster potato, whining about something that I didn't even try in earnest to gain. Heck, among ALL NW players who play CWs currently I'm probably the one that's walking around with the highest CC-bonus of them all... and none, none of my CCs work on someone who has TEB. Even with proning powers, they just bounce back immediately after they land on their backs.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
I've been getting quite long stuns from CW's, despite nearly 2k Tenacity (though i dont have elven battle). Perhaps instead of lowering the duration of CC it could block whole dmg from abilities which do control effects? This way you can still CC players, but CC powers will no longer deal dmg to target with TEB.
Thorned roots was proccing infinitely on my elven battle, after dying 6 times due to 2 HRs on the other team I decided to remove the enchantment. I died 3 more times in 30 seconds due to being perma rooted to the ground while everyone and their mother hit me. Conclusion, elven battle is WAI, minus the roots multi-proc bug. Without EB, it’s not even fun to play, at least for my playstyle.
Thorned roots was proccing infinitely on my elven battle, after dying 6 times due to 2 HRs on the other team I decided to remove the enchantment. I died 3 more times in 30 seconds due to being perma rooted to the ground while everyone and their mother hit me. Conclusion, elven battle is WAI, minus the roots multi-proc bug. Without EB, it’s not even fun to play, at least for my playstyle.
thats it!...facts from j1nn1
i think DEV should see and fix this...
IF..elven nerfed...what happen next?
they(CCheavy class) will UNSTOPPABLE....currently right now combo of them ...can locked down+kill any enemies
whos not wearing elven and which is majority of players..(because is expensive)....and IF elven nerfed again..they can MELT+LOCKDOWN any ALL enemies....using the broken PERMA CC , even with players wearing ELVEN...
THEY ARE UNSTOPPABLE...nothing can stop this combo CC (HR+CW/CW+CW/TR+CW/TR+HR)...anymore......
please people THINK!!!....
I've been getting quite long stuns from CW's, despite nearly 2k Tenacity (though i dont have elven battle). Perhaps instead of lowering the duration of CC it could block whole dmg from abilities which do control effects? This way you can still CC players, but CC powers will no longer deal dmg to target with TEB.
this... from quspiv...its make sense..this is OK
becareful what you wish/cry about this from "some crying CC players" =
1.HR matters will brought up because of this....(thorned roots)...
2.CC heavy classes combo..will Unstoppable...(possibly nerfing CC mechanics)
3.negation will bring up too,...if elven nerfed AGAIN...negation need to be nerfed also..CC classes(TR,CW,HR) cant be soooo TANKY theyre wearing cloth and leathers...its supposed to be squishy...
theyre unstoppable with broken perma + tanky lol....zzzzzzzzzzzzz...pleaseeeee...
well, stop crying..just go and play..NOT MANY ppl wearing ELVEN lol.....its freaking 13-14mil AD.
Thorned roots is the only real gamebreaker in this discussion. I managed to get a record bleed of 9K... and since I only have about 105K hp, I don't have a count for how many times it would tick. If it ever ended. Thorned roots would just likely be reapplied.
If anything about TEB needs urgent fixing, that would be it. You all say that one enchantment shouldn't destroy a build. Well, likewise, one passive shouldn't destroy an enchantment.
---
On the other hand, I'm still slightly in favor that TEB could use a little tone down in its uptime. I don't want a cooldown. That's bad. It will be more interesting to see a stacking buff every second, which activates upon reaching 10 stacks. The user glows a bright strikingly obvious color that signifies he is CC immune for a long-ish period. This simply gives TEB users a CC cap. Control them too much, and you have to wait until they can be controlled again.
Of course, that's something I'd like to see become accessible to every player. CC in this game is just "out of control."
Of course, that's something I'd like to see become accessible to every player. CC in this game is just "out of control."
The funny part here is how the class that has the most broken cc of all -- trapper HRs -- also make Elven Battle enchantments a drawback.
To me TEB looks a lot like a band-aid solution until the devs can really remedy the situation. And hopefully they find the time to do it. Soon. Control here is a necessary evil when you're dealing with classes that have infinite sustain. The better solution would have been to introduce an expendable resource like mana for casters, then something similar for combatants.
I personally think TEB should work more like Barkshield. Every so many seconds you become immune to one cc (although you would still take the damage). This would give players a break in pure cc chains, but also not just make them nearly immune all the time from cc.
Comments
It is pretty evident that your confident argument is -- unfortunately -- not backed up by experience. Instead, you are just assuming no CW player would be that crazy to actually run a build like that.
Why do you think I am complaining about TEB in the first place? Because I didn't build my CW "spec for CC and deal less damage"? You think I'm complaining about this because I've built a cookie-cutter DPS CW build like other guys and now I'm just whining about insufferably short CC durations despite I didn't make efforts to make it better? Like how some CW players always complain "we've got least control despite being a control wizard"?
No. I've built for it. My specs are;
27 WIS: +17%
Valyndra's set: +15%
3 artifacts + offhand stat bonus = +10%
offhand class feature bonus = +5%
Orb of Imposition + Oppressor feat = +24%
+71% Control Bonus
This is not the theoreical maximum but its still very high. From this point the only thing I can do is get the 4th artifact for another +600 control bonus, upgrade the rest 3 artifacts from leg. to myth., which would probably boost another 5~7%... and then get the triple ToD boon for control for another +15%.
Even against people with currently BiS PvP gearset that would give +40% resistance through tenacity, I can hold someone for around 4.0 ~ 4.5 seconds with a single shot of EF. Just like you say, I've sacrificed damage to specialize my role in CC, and guess how long EF lasts on someone with TEB enchantment slotted.
1 second. That's how long it lasts.
Now, I wouldn't be complaining if the DC or the Paly, knowing that someone can CC them heavily and have them focused down, has actually built up for CC-resistance like I have. If they choose item sets, artifacts, heavy WIS stat investments and CC-reducing powers/feats to do so, and if it was all a result of how they have chosen to embrace the weaknesses that comes along with specializing in one aspect of their class, then I really, really would not be complaining, because just like you said if someone makes their sacrifices in damage or DR or HP or whatever the result of building up for CC-resistance, then that's a fair deal. I accept the fact that I can't control those guys, because they've went through the process, took the steps, took in the gooid and bad to become so resistant to CCs. They've made their effort, fair and square, so if someone actually builds for CC-resistance like I've actually build for CCs, no complaints from me whatsoever.
But is that what TEB does?H3LL NO.
What TEB does is allow a Paly/DC to retain his supertank/heal build, a GF to retain his mega-damage build, a TR /CW/SW to retain his perma-DPS build, the HR to retain his own non-stop permadaze build... basically allow all classes to be themselves and at the same time run a permanent near-immunity to all CCs without even investing a single item slot or stat point to CC resistance, and simply embed an AH-bought item to your chest and just negate an entire game mechanic.
TEB just removes, CC from the game, period.
...
Like said, when somebody starts wearing TEB, then there is no stopping him whatever he does. Like mentioned many times, the entire PvP simply becomes "who has higher HP and higher damage". There is no 'skill' involved in what happens next. It's just a toe-to-toe slugfest because nothing, nothing else works.
So please, tell me again how I'm a hipster potato, whining about something that I didn't even try in earnest to gain. Heck, among ALL NW players who play CWs currently I'm probably the one that's walking around with the highest CC-bonus of them all... and none, none of my CCs work on someone who has TEB. Even with proning powers, they just bounce back immediately after they land on their backs.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
thats it!...facts from j1nn1
i think DEV should see and fix this...
IF..elven nerfed...what happen next?
they(CCheavy class) will UNSTOPPABLE....currently right now combo of them ...can locked down+kill any enemies
whos not wearing elven and which is majority of players..(because is expensive)....and IF elven nerfed again..they can MELT+LOCKDOWN any ALL enemies....using the broken PERMA CC , even with players wearing ELVEN...
THEY ARE UNSTOPPABLE...nothing can stop this combo CC (HR+CW/CW+CW/TR+CW/TR+HR)...anymore......
please people THINK!!!....
this... from quspiv...its make sense..this is OK
becareful what you wish/cry about this from "some crying CC players" =
1.HR matters will brought up because of this....(thorned roots)...
2.CC heavy classes combo..will Unstoppable...(possibly nerfing CC mechanics)
3.negation will bring up too,...if elven nerfed AGAIN...negation need to be nerfed also..CC classes(TR,CW,HR) cant be soooo TANKY theyre wearing cloth and leathers...its supposed to be squishy...
theyre unstoppable with broken perma + tanky lol....zzzzzzzzzzzzz...pleaseeeee...
well, stop crying..just go and play..NOT MANY ppl wearing ELVEN lol.....its freaking 13-14mil AD.
If anything about TEB needs urgent fixing, that would be it. You all say that one enchantment shouldn't destroy a build. Well, likewise, one passive shouldn't destroy an enchantment.
---
On the other hand, I'm still slightly in favor that TEB could use a little tone down in its uptime. I don't want a cooldown. That's bad. It will be more interesting to see a stacking buff every second, which activates upon reaching 10 stacks. The user glows a bright strikingly obvious color that signifies he is CC immune for a long-ish period. This simply gives TEB users a CC cap. Control them too much, and you have to wait until they can be controlled again.
Of course, that's something I'd like to see become accessible to every player. CC in this game is just "out of control."
To me TEB looks a lot like a band-aid solution until the devs can really remedy the situation. And hopefully they find the time to do it. Soon. Control here is a necessary evil when you're dealing with classes that have infinite sustain. The better solution would have been to introduce an expendable resource like mana for casters, then something similar for combatants.
TEB is no good for PVE and not all of us can afford a full set of Trans Enchants.