I've actually seen people get kicked in this game for talking lol
I can top that, I was kicked four times attempting to join a dungeon. One of those times,
I did not take more than five steps from the spawn. Supposedly, the 'fix' fixed that issue.
I'm not sure I care who gets there first most of the time, as long as nobody gets upset I'm not standing there soaking up damage. (Although even still, I'm somewhat unsure if others are aware that it's not always possible to be getting attacked by 10 mobs at once and still tank them effectively, especially if there's not much control or healing or dps going on....) As long as I don't get blamed for not doing what i can't do because of others, or if I have to run around trying to self heal or what have you, right now at least what's the difference. In this game on this platform. Which isn't any other game on any other platform, no matter how similar.
Although right, if the Xbox One Neverwinter systems change to like what it will be/should be/could be/ might be, a lot of folks might be surprised and upset. Hopefully all of those that don't like it because they can't just do whatever they want solo and that can't adapt all just leave and go someplace else and do something else. Scrabble and what have you.
I get kicked once during dungeon delves with full HIGH VIZIER SET on.
One guy inspected my gear and said nice stuff and then another guy probably got jealous..i don't know
who said that I didn't deserve no more loot, cause my GS was too high and i already have the stuff i needed..
And boom out of nowhere, i got kicked...
i was like....REALLY??
I get kicked once during dungeon delves with full HIGH VIZIER SET on.
One guy inspected my gear and said nice stuff and then another guy probably got jealous..i don't know
who said that I didn't deserve no more loot, cause my GS was too high and i already have the stuff i needed..
And boom out of nowhere, i got kicked...
i was like....REALLY??
WOW, I would ride those coat tails. No sense in avoiding the obvious, I need your help to get where you are. Folks this is not COD, its D&D! The present philosophy/mindset of today's players is out of sorts for D&D. Shame.
I just hit lvl 60 a couple of days ago. Lucky for you guys, my GS is not very high so doing T2 dungeons is out of the question. I will admit to being first hand ignorant of proper battle techniques. I'm pretty new to this style of game play (i usually play FPS) and it could be that other players are totally unaware of how to play as well. Being a TR, i just rushed right in past everybody and started beating on the first thing i saw. Now after having read this post, it totally makes sense to hang back and have the GF go in first. Maybe speaking up in game and educating people would help out those of us that are unfamiliar with the tactics.
People are just too greedy with drops. To avoid getting kicked from the higher dungeons such as Castle Never (Which can take up to an eternity to complete if you're carrying some low GS's, which I don't mind), Epic Lair of Lostmauth, etc, run with a group of three to gain majority.
BEWARE of lobby jackers. I was running CN with a group of three and some random joined and began booting everyone, unforutunately, some of my fellow companions weren't paying attention and we ended up loosing majority, leaving the lobby jacker to continue on with our Cleric, which was then booted as the Dracolich died.
If anyone wants to run T2 or even T1, I'd be happy to help as those are my only source of AD's.
Not sure why folk want to advocate the holy trinity. It's this very aspect of MMOs that ruin the game IMO. I understand the tactics answer, but what you really get is elitist individuals who think they are special and you have to throw rose petals at their feet as the progress through the dungeon. PuG Tanks in WoW have some of the rudest, twattiest people you can ever come across on the internet.
Is an instance easier with the trinity, yes it can be, certainly some of the T2s, but the fact you can complete any instance with any combination is something this games needs to keep too.
Though an MMO, this is the console version, which means certain things need to be different. Combat is different in this then WoW, and it feels more enjoyable (to me).
I understand it's annoying someone pulling quickly, but in truth if you have queued for the dungeon, waited for the loading screen, you should be pretty sure on what is going to happen, and in the main you know folk are going to range ahead, and those who know the dungeon know when to stop, and when not to overpull (well you hope anyway).
Since all us older gamers are chiming in, why not. I have also been playing MMO's since the 90's and tabletop since way before that. Played them all, just some longer than others.
Being old school I do like the classic party make up as some of you say the trinity group composition and would love to have more groups like this but alas I have given up on running Dungeons in this game until several things are fixed. So I level up characters. Learn what makes each character tick, their strengths and weaknesses. I have a level 60 of every class and 2 of some. My favorite as with all MMO's is the Cleric which is my main and pushing 14kGS mind you.
For the OP, when I did play in groups and was fortunate to get a Tank in the team I always said to myself, this should be an easy run as I know my healing abilities and I love Tanks (sponges). But to your point it seemed that several other classes enjoy watching their health drop in one shot and me pull them back from near death. Or at least that's how I saw it because they weren't effectively tanking anything. This puts a strain on the healer keeping that squishy non tanky player alive, puts strain on the actual Tank trying to pick up aggro and maintain battlefield control. And the kicker, its unnecessary. Let the Tank run in get them all grouped up on him then you can run in and DPS until your hearts content. Everyone is in a group meaning healing is easier. The mobs are on the Tank which means healing is easier. Everything dies and we move on a lot quicker than chasing around trying to heal that CW or TR that is running in circles because they pulled more than they can handle with their burst damage. This in turn requires larger burst heals which in turn causes aggro on the healer which in my case I can take a hit or two but its all so unnecessary if you just let the Tank, Tank.
But this is a new generation of younger players that don't understand and respect the foundation of the game. Can you run all content without a healer or Tank or even a well geared solo player? Why yes, yes you can, but as someone stated previously with an abundance of both, why would you need to?
Too many people run in thinking their invincible because they have a healer. Thing is, you're not. And if you get one hit, there's no way a healer can save you from that.
Whenever I run a dungeon with a healer, my main priority is to protect the healer, because without one, we could all potentially die and spend hours on the same dungeon because some people can't help themselves but try and get the most kills or out DPS other characters, or even try to rush it too quickly by running in solo expecting everyone to follow.
It's always nice to have a Tank as well. He/she takes all agro, DPS kills all, Cleric heals and everyone's happy.
As someone who has a couple 15k+ chars (HR and CW) and who has been gaming online since EQ I can kinda see both sides of the coin here. On one hand there is no need to make the run any harder by trying to prove you can out run the tank. On the other hand, both of those chars I mentioned can solo epic PK unless I lag out /dc. Often times I can obliterate groups of mobs in seconds long before the rest of the group catches up. I can only imagine some of the 18k+ players.
When you have players that massively out-gear the dungeon I don't see why not just let them smash everything lol. Even in the older MMO's there is the occasional group you will get in with some super geared player with whom all you get to do and run behind and pick up loot.
Now the guy with 9k GS running ahead and dying over and over...yea why? = )
I'm not saying out-geared people shouldn't run ahead. By all means, please do But I was mainly referring to the people who can't handle being hit, the squishy, low gearscore people who expect everyone to follow as they run passed mobs to get to the others.
I'm all up for picking up the loot behind the overpowered~.
Sorry there Jewt, but this isn't WOW, it's Neverwinter. A Rogue should always be the first in to attack a boss or strong guy in mobs. Stealth in and strike, daze, and kill. Stealth again and then you can pull aggro for adds that remain alive while i'm stealth killing and dazing everything. Actually we don't even need you to pull aggro on anything other than adds for a few bosses and a few choice large mobs in dungeons like Castle Never. The rest are easy and I would end altercations much, much quicker for all of us if I went in first than to wait for you. You call out ignorance in dungeons yet you come off as ignorant yourself not properly knowing character roles in Neverwinter. To assume roles are the same from one game to the next because it has a dungeon is simply foolish. Considering I'm usually in the lead by millions in damage and always in the top two for enemies killed, I'm pretty sure I'm going about everything right both individually and for the group.
> @jewt said: > Hello, my name is Jewt and I am a max level Guardian Fighter. I have been noticing some ignorance in dungeons. For example, as a GF, I am the tank. I go first then everyone else follows. Recently, a rogue rushed into a group of mobs and a boss and ends up wiping the entire group and I was kicked for making a comment. I come from a World of Warcraft backround, so i think i know what i am talking about, or maybe i am doing it all wrong. In my opinion, there should be an in-game lesson taught on the roles of each class and the general rules of dungeons. As a tank, it is frustrating seeing other classes rush into battle and I have to clean up there scraps. If you have anything to say to me or about the subject, please do, and thank you.
Super Saiyan God- TR Lvl 70 (PVP) Unleash The Wolves- HR Lvl 70 (PVE) <font color="Aquamarine">"Non-Pay-To-Win"</font> I hunt GWF "Magik" on sight.
I've been running Shores of Tuern for a few weeks now. It's not a dungeon per se, but a mini-dungeon skirmish which runs very quickly and has very good drops on average (from the free dungeon chest) and also from the boss fights. After running over a hundred times (as a CW) my observations with regard to the thread subject(s) are:
1) There are players who like to play SoT in a "rush forward and kill all mobs at once in the end" style, though the majority of players prefer to kill mobs one by one. Honestly that "rush forward" tactic does not work as they intend it to be as these runs usually take longer - up to 10 minutes - while a "kill mobs one by one" one takes 5-6 minutes. The reason is that the other players cannot always keep up with the fast (typically GWF) guys - because they don't understand what's expected or because they just cannot follow them - not everyone has 20K GS to stay alive in the middle of aggroing mobs. So the remaining players - continue to slowly work through the mobs - which is way more difficult with 2 people far ahead and only 3 (usually weaker) people in the back. Alternatively they try to run after the fast guys and get killed a lot, re-spawning and running again.
2) Specifically in SoT the fastest strategy seems to be for tanks to always start with the archers, cause this draws all the mobs in one place, good for AoE and CC. Otherwise we get multiple clusters - tanks fighting tanks and rangers/wizard fighting rangers.
3) The main boss in SoT has a heavy hitting range attack which would over time wipe most low geared players unless the boss is slowed down. So even if you otherwise prefer to play ranged (like some CW do) - come closer and start using steal time and various chill-applying powers.
4) Vote kicking players to get better loot happens. Perhaps 1 out of 5-10 times on average. When it happens I go browsing the log history and report the remaining players as being offensive. That helps me to vent off the disappointment but probably makes no difference otherwise. You know you are being booted if after looting an epic item/book there is a 15 second voting delay.
5) Players looting every green item also happen (1 out of 4-5 runs) and this is also annoying especially during mini-boss fights where it blocks the screen. In SoT good loot drops only in boss and ambush rooms.
6) After the completion of the run you have to grab the loot ASAP. It looks like as soon as everybody else has left the party you are automatically kicked from the dungeon even if you haven't yet gotten the reward from the box. So don't wait to long looking at the results or inspecting other players gear or you'll get no reward.
Freaking tr's no suprise. Always attacking everything because they can invis. Even if youre can skip it without pulling it at all. 90%will run right up and attack it anyways. Solution is vote kick. It's not worth the issues to play with most of them. Id rather be stuck running it 4 man because i hit the vote kicked limit than tr's ha ha.
Freaking tr hater no surprise. The fact is that there are some of us TR that know how to play our class properly, and yes that does mean that we can stealth and kill most things BEFORE anyone else even shows up. That is a GOOD THING, that means the runs are QUICKER, and that means the runs are EASIER.
TR is so overlooked and hated on. But the fact is with the ability to stealth and kill most ads in one hit, and put a huge blow on any bigger ad is EXTREMELY beneficial. Not to mention we can then stealth again and get away from anything we didn't kill. Then keep on fighting.
Most of the people who are crying about how bad the TR is, and how much they think the class is useless. Those are the people that I, along with my fellow TR's, have gone stealth to avoid ads.....IN ORDER TO PICK YOU UP FROM DYING. So you should be grateful that there is a class that can completely avoid agro to pick your dying *** up off the ground.
Regardless of what class a person is, they should not be kicked from pve matches unless they are not playing at all or keeps lagging out due to bad internet, gamers with the low (GS) is trying to build up same as the next person. People forget that this game is a TEAM effort game, not solo.
Most of the people who are crying about how bad the TR is, and how much they think the class is useless. Those are the people that I, along with my fellow TR's, have gone stealth to avoid ads.....IN ORDER TO PICK YOU UP FROM DYING. So you should be grateful that there is a class that can completely avoid agro to pick your dying *** up off the ground.
Exactly. BTW He's a hunter ranger, they usually think they're the best so the hate is expected. Even though they have to do the majority of their killing from a distance. I'll take it with a grain of salt.
Super Saiyan God- TR Lvl 70 (PVP) Unleash The Wolves- HR Lvl 70 (PVE) <font color="Aquamarine">"Non-Pay-To-Win"</font> I hunt GWF "Magik" on sight.
Hello, my name is Jewt and I am a max level Guardian Fighter. I have been noticing some ignorance in dungeons. For example, as a GF, I am the tank. I go first then everyone else follows. Recently, a rogue rushed into a group of mobs and a boss and ends up wiping the entire group and I was kicked for making a comment. I come from a World of Warcraft backround, so i think i know what i am talking about, or maybe i am doing it all wrong. In my opinion, there should be an in-game lesson taught on the roles of each class and the general rules of dungeons. As a tank, it is frustrating seeing other classes rush into battle and I have to clean up there scraps. If you have anything to say to me or about the subject, please do, and thank you.
Before the update im going to stress that point right there. But yeah, If the TR is really powerful you can. My TR was really good and would alot of times lead the way. I would use dazing strike with first strike and i would end up taking about a quarter of their health bars away plus it stuns them for everybody else then everybody else turns the mob into a blood bath. The TR can die easy though so after the initial hit you need to regroup. life steal will help. Right now after the update I would have to say they're out of their mind because the TR's nothing like it was. It needs alot of help. And thats saying it nicely, oh yeah and life steal sucks now.
Honestly I think rogues should go first cause they can daze an entire mob for like 10 seconds but expressing an opinion is not a reason to get kicked! Actually there aren't too many reasons to get kicked lol I think the GF comes after the dazing effect ends to attract the remaining mob but its just what I think!
You are correct, actually if you have like three rogues all of them do it then just keep attacking while alternating smoke bombs they cant do anything to anybody. They ruined the rogeus for pve for the moment anyway, After the update I dont even expect to get into a dungeon queue. Not the way the TR is now, it was hard enough before when I could still kill things.
Honestly I think rogues should go first cause they can daze an entire mob for like 10 seconds but expressing an opinion is not a reason to get kicked! Actually there aren't too many reasons to get kicked lol I think the GF comes after the dazing effect ends to attract the remaining mob but its just what I think!
You are correct, actually if you have like three rogues all of them do it then just keep attacking while alternating smoke bombs they cant do anything to anybody. They ruined the rogeus for pve for the moment anyway, After the update I dont even expect to get into a dungeon queue. Not the way the TR is now, it was hard enough before when I could still kill things.
How did they ruin the Rogue for PVE? I have no problems. My last time running ECC was a success the other day and I also led the group in damage. Delta, you don't even have to be really powerful to be the first to attack. When the group is ready and we're approaching a mob I'll stealth forward and lash, then drop a smoke bomb dazing everything and go crazy with DF while the rest of the group is throwing down ice or rooting and slashing away, then I'm back to dropping smoke again and repeat. It's easiest for a TR to dodge AOE and to attack from the sides and behind enemies. Also Random, we're not exactly talking about rushing forward to other mobs ahead when the rest of the group isn't ready or are still fighting the first mob. The topic starter was complaining because he wasn't the first to initiate contact with the first mob. Like I said, This isn't WOW, it's NW and even in Mod 6 the TR should be first in on every mob, unless a certain area calls for a specific strategy. The changes to the TR are drastically over exaggerated. People come into a mod 6 dungeon for the first time and think their TR has no power, not realizing that the enemy is running at Encounter strength and that this difference in difficulty to kill is felt by every class.
Post edited by yourenext2die on
Super Saiyan God- TR Lvl 70 (PVP) Unleash The Wolves- HR Lvl 70 (PVE) <font color="Aquamarine">"Non-Pay-To-Win"</font> I hunt GWF "Magik" on sight.
Comments
I can top that, I was kicked four times attempting to join a dungeon. One of those times,
I did not take more than five steps from the spawn. Supposedly, the 'fix' fixed that issue.
.. Teucer (HR) / Maximus Decimus (DC) .. GT: ApexDemon
Although right, if the Xbox One Neverwinter systems change to like what it will be/should be/could be/ might be, a lot of folks might be surprised and upset. Hopefully all of those that don't like it because they can't just do whatever they want solo and that can't adapt all just leave and go someplace else and do something else. Scrabble and what have you.
One guy inspected my gear and said nice stuff and then another guy probably got jealous..i don't know
who said that I didn't deserve no more loot, cause my GS was too high and i already have the stuff i needed..
And boom out of nowhere, i got kicked...
i was like....REALLY??
WOW, I would ride those coat tails. No sense in avoiding the obvious, I need your help to get where you are. Folks this is not COD, its D&D! The present philosophy/mindset of today's players is out of sorts for D&D. Shame.
.. Teucer (HR) / Maximus Decimus (DC) .. GT: ApexDemon
BEWARE of lobby jackers. I was running CN with a group of three and some random joined and began booting everyone, unforutunately, some of my fellow companions weren't paying attention and we ended up loosing majority, leaving the lobby jacker to continue on with our Cleric, which was then booted as the Dracolich died.
If anyone wants to run T2 or even T1, I'd be happy to help as those are my only source of AD's.
GT= NikkiNight
13.6k GS TR
Is an instance easier with the trinity, yes it can be, certainly some of the T2s, but the fact you can complete any instance with any combination is something this games needs to keep too.
Though an MMO, this is the console version, which means certain things need to be different. Combat is different in this then WoW, and it feels more enjoyable (to me).
I understand it's annoying someone pulling quickly, but in truth if you have queued for the dungeon, waited for the loading screen, you should be pretty sure on what is going to happen, and in the main you know folk are going to range ahead, and those who know the dungeon know when to stop, and when not to overpull (well you hope anyway).
Being old school I do like the classic party make up as some of you say the trinity group composition and would love to have more groups like this but alas I have given up on running Dungeons in this game until several things are fixed. So I level up characters. Learn what makes each character tick, their strengths and weaknesses. I have a level 60 of every class and 2 of some. My favorite as with all MMO's is the Cleric which is my main and pushing 14kGS mind you.
For the OP, when I did play in groups and was fortunate to get a Tank in the team I always said to myself, this should be an easy run as I know my healing abilities and I love Tanks (sponges). But to your point it seemed that several other classes enjoy watching their health drop in one shot and me pull them back from near death. Or at least that's how I saw it because they weren't effectively tanking anything. This puts a strain on the healer keeping that squishy non tanky player alive, puts strain on the actual Tank trying to pick up aggro and maintain battlefield control. And the kicker, its unnecessary. Let the Tank run in get them all grouped up on him then you can run in and DPS until your hearts content. Everyone is in a group meaning healing is easier. The mobs are on the Tank which means healing is easier. Everything dies and we move on a lot quicker than chasing around trying to heal that CW or TR that is running in circles because they pulled more than they can handle with their burst damage. This in turn requires larger burst heals which in turn causes aggro on the healer which in my case I can take a hit or two but its all so unnecessary if you just let the Tank, Tank.
But this is a new generation of younger players that don't understand and respect the foundation of the game. Can you run all content without a healer or Tank or even a well geared solo player? Why yes, yes you can, but as someone stated previously with an abundance of both, why would you need to?
Just my 2 coppers
Whenever I run a dungeon with a healer, my main priority is to protect the healer, because without one, we could all potentially die and spend hours on the same dungeon because some people can't help themselves but try and get the most kills or out DPS other characters, or even try to rush it too quickly by running in solo expecting everyone to follow.
It's always nice to have a Tank as well. He/she takes all agro, DPS kills all, Cleric heals and everyone's happy.
When you have players that massively out-gear the dungeon I don't see why not just let them smash everything lol. Even in the older MMO's there is the occasional group you will get in with some super geared player with whom all you get to do and run behind and pick up loot.
Now the guy with 9k GS running ahead and dying over and over...yea why? = )
I'm all up for picking up the loot behind the overpowered~.
> @jewt said:
> Hello, my name is Jewt and I am a max level Guardian Fighter. I have been noticing some ignorance in dungeons. For example, as a GF, I am the tank. I go first then everyone else follows. Recently, a rogue rushed into a group of mobs and a boss and ends up wiping the entire group and I was kicked for making a comment. I come from a World of Warcraft backround, so i think i know what i am talking about, or maybe i am doing it all wrong. In my opinion, there should be an in-game lesson taught on the roles of each class and the general rules of dungeons. As a tank, it is frustrating seeing other classes rush into battle and I have to clean up there scraps. If you have anything to say to me or about the subject, please do, and thank you.
Unleash The Wolves- HR Lvl 70 (PVE)
<font color="Aquamarine">"Non-Pay-To-Win"</font>
I hunt GWF "Magik" on sight.
After running over a hundred times (as a CW) my observations with regard to the thread subject(s) are:
1) There are players who like to play SoT in a "rush forward and kill all mobs at once in the end" style, though the majority of players prefer to kill mobs one by one. Honestly that "rush forward" tactic does not work as they intend it to be as these runs usually take longer - up to 10 minutes - while a "kill mobs one by one" one takes 5-6 minutes. The reason is that the other players cannot always keep up with the fast (typically GWF) guys - because they don't understand what's expected or because they just cannot follow them - not everyone has 20K GS to stay alive in the middle of aggroing mobs. So the remaining players - continue to slowly work through the mobs - which is way more difficult with 2 people far ahead and only 3 (usually weaker) people in the back. Alternatively they try to run after the fast guys and get killed a lot, re-spawning and running again.
2) Specifically in SoT the fastest strategy seems to be for tanks to always start with the archers, cause this draws all the mobs in one place, good for AoE and CC. Otherwise we get multiple clusters - tanks fighting tanks and rangers/wizard fighting rangers.
3) The main boss in SoT has a heavy hitting range attack which would over time wipe most low geared players unless the boss is slowed down. So even if you otherwise prefer to play ranged (like some CW do) - come closer and start using steal time and various chill-applying powers.
4) Vote kicking players to get better loot happens. Perhaps 1 out of 5-10 times on average. When it happens I go browsing the log history and report the remaining players as being offensive. That helps me to vent off the disappointment but probably makes no difference otherwise. You know you are being booted if after looting an epic item/book there is a 15 second voting delay.
5) Players looting every green item also happen (1 out of 4-5 runs) and this is also annoying especially during mini-boss fights where it blocks the screen. In SoT good loot drops only in boss and ambush rooms.
6) After the completion of the run you have to grab the loot ASAP. It looks like as soon as everybody else has left the party you are automatically kicked from the dungeon even if you haven't yet gotten the reward from the box. So don't wait to long looking at the results or inspecting other players gear or you'll get no reward.
TR is so overlooked and hated on. But the fact is with the ability to stealth and kill most ads in one hit, and put a huge blow on any bigger ad is EXTREMELY beneficial. Not to mention we can then stealth again and get away from anything we didn't kill. Then keep on fighting.
Most of the people who are crying about how bad the TR is, and how much they think the class is useless. Those are the people that I, along with my fellow TR's, have gone stealth to avoid ads.....IN ORDER TO PICK YOU UP FROM DYING. So you should be grateful that there is a class that can completely avoid agro to pick your dying *** up off the ground.
Unleash The Wolves- HR Lvl 70 (PVE)
<font color="Aquamarine">"Non-Pay-To-Win"</font>
I hunt GWF "Magik" on sight.
Unleash The Wolves- HR Lvl 70 (PVE)
<font color="Aquamarine">"Non-Pay-To-Win"</font>
I hunt GWF "Magik" on sight.