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Mod6 overview. Some complaints I understand. Some, not so much...
query523
Member Posts: 1,515 Arc User
Just to get it off my chest there are complaints that I see here constantly that are not really legitimate. But honestly come off as whining. So I will start there.
1. The content is too hard. Yes indeed the content is challenging. It is difficult and requires skill, teamwork, and (after a certain point) really good gear to succeed. How is this a bad thing? After several mods where content was rolled through, drunk, eating pizza, and occasionally glancing at the monitor having goals and challenges is likely the best thing that has happened to the game.
2. The gear scale is impossible to climb. No. Not at all. Look most people had to gring seals of ellement to get T1. Most people had to run T2 in that T1 gear. Somost people completing all of the content did soby completing content less than BiS. As that is the only way to get BiS gear.
3. My class is disadvantaged/ not needed/ useless. Confession time. I hate people who say L2P. It is a cop-out. But if 'your class' is something you have been working on and developing and practicing for months and you cannot fullfill your role you need to start taking a serious look at how your playstyle.
There are however in fact legitimate problems with the Mod6 rollout and I also want to address them. So I will ive it a whirl.
1. The way you raised difficulty is mighty stupid. Just raising DPS across the board and HP across the board and hoping it will work out does raise difficulty but not in a rational manner. DPS and HP are one aspect of an overall spectrum and using those stats to raise difficulty creates real problems. The easiest example of this is the tank role. Previously a tank could have 30-50% more HP than a striker which created leeway. With everyone getting all-HP gear you are lucky to have 20% more HP. As things stand dropping gaurd long enough to use encounters often results in death.
2. Lag and bugs. There is a laundry list. Go to bug reports and view the pages and pages of un-responded reports to get an idea of the magnituge of the problem. Lag I am sure we have all experienced. The things I called whining earlier are entirely surrmountable but only if we are not dealing with lags and bugs.
3. Ilvl. Ilvl is every bit as useless as GS used to be. Could we just drop the whole thing and stop pretending that any such arbitrary scale will actually represent performance in an instance? Because it does not. And it never will. In the end it only serves to encourage the worst instincts of the player base.
Overall I have to say that I like Mod6. It made the game interesting again. And that has been missing for a long time. This does not excuse the mistakes made in the implimentation. I merely hope to put this all into perspective.
1. The content is too hard. Yes indeed the content is challenging. It is difficult and requires skill, teamwork, and (after a certain point) really good gear to succeed. How is this a bad thing? After several mods where content was rolled through, drunk, eating pizza, and occasionally glancing at the monitor having goals and challenges is likely the best thing that has happened to the game.
2. The gear scale is impossible to climb. No. Not at all. Look most people had to gring seals of ellement to get T1. Most people had to run T2 in that T1 gear. Somost people completing all of the content did soby completing content less than BiS. As that is the only way to get BiS gear.
3. My class is disadvantaged/ not needed/ useless. Confession time. I hate people who say L2P. It is a cop-out. But if 'your class' is something you have been working on and developing and practicing for months and you cannot fullfill your role you need to start taking a serious look at how your playstyle.
There are however in fact legitimate problems with the Mod6 rollout and I also want to address them. So I will ive it a whirl.
1. The way you raised difficulty is mighty stupid. Just raising DPS across the board and HP across the board and hoping it will work out does raise difficulty but not in a rational manner. DPS and HP are one aspect of an overall spectrum and using those stats to raise difficulty creates real problems. The easiest example of this is the tank role. Previously a tank could have 30-50% more HP than a striker which created leeway. With everyone getting all-HP gear you are lucky to have 20% more HP. As things stand dropping gaurd long enough to use encounters often results in death.
2. Lag and bugs. There is a laundry list. Go to bug reports and view the pages and pages of un-responded reports to get an idea of the magnituge of the problem. Lag I am sure we have all experienced. The things I called whining earlier are entirely surrmountable but only if we are not dealing with lags and bugs.
3. Ilvl. Ilvl is every bit as useless as GS used to be. Could we just drop the whole thing and stop pretending that any such arbitrary scale will actually represent performance in an instance? Because it does not. And it never will. In the end it only serves to encourage the worst instincts of the player base.
Overall I have to say that I like Mod6. It made the game interesting again. And that has been missing for a long time. This does not excuse the mistakes made in the implimentation. I merely hope to put this all into perspective.
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The way the game works (no mana, no builders/finishers, just cooldowns) doesn't leave a lot of room for creativity when it comes to raising the difficulty. More sustained damage would work too if lifesteal was under control but it's still a blatant issue. Well, it will be once people understand that they merely need 20%, dots and the lifesteal boon from dread ring to go back to pre mod 6 again... Maybe, one day, lifesteal severity will be 10%, but as long as it's not the case high spike damage is the only good reason people still invite tanks and clerics.
Even good games with good difficulties (can't give names, but there are many) simply increase damage and hit points for the elite version of their content. They may add a couple of boss mechanics too but that's it.
2.) I never grinded for seals. I exclusively played the markets, used professions to get AD, bought stuff off the markets. When Icewind Dale came around, I got corrupted black ice gear. All the best stuff is now bind on pickup, although you can get some okayish stuff now. Bit harder, but I agree that the "gear is inaccessible oh no!" complaint is overblown.
3.) Eh, that's not really a serious response. You'd have to answer individual criticisms of any changes individually. But I play a CW, and those are pretty much godtier in PVE, so what do I know about classes that don't function anymore?
2) running dungeons is worthless for the need of the key even during dungeons delve. at the end of the farming day you lost money.
3) dragon hoard nerf is a joke.
4) few dungeons available
5) MUCH TIRED OF RECYCLING
6) bug fixing seems happening while introducing new bugs. +1-1=0
7) still no balance fix to paladins/gf, no change to storm spell/shield and generally speaking piercing damage.
8) too much lag in the dragon map
Then we bring up Well of Dragons and Icewind Dale both of those areas are easily doable with a party of 2 to 5. I have finished the quests in about 20 minutes with a guildie or 2. The only people, that I see, capble of soloing this would be certain classes or any player who has over 3k iL.
I agree that the GS/ iLvl... is ridiculous. It feeds the mindset around p2w concept. When you have a restricted economical base... the restriction of farming AD... a black market will be created. This black market was rampant in other MMO's and were created out of a need and a lack. Just like people who abuse any system for it's weaknesses and do so using it's strengths.
Farmers and Bots use these loopholes that tend to get bigger when actions are taken to remove them... then they use that lack to develop a larger chunk of the pie.
The AD economy is broken... and is now based on those players who spent years hoarding it. Funny how it is mirroring the RL global economy. Which is known to be broken.
a rank 10 used to be 3M in the best period of the game, now 1.2M
a perfect soul used to be 7M, now 3M
a perfect vorpal used to be 8M, now 5M
rank 7 used to be 100k and more, now 30k if you are unlucky.
botted supply of rank 5 offer rp at 20k... 20k...a stack of rank 5.
no the economy is not broken
Basically I agree with most of what you said, and even better you put it in a constructive, non-whiny, well thought out manner. Kudos to you!
Here is my personal opinion:
1. Defenders of Mod 6 are by thousands less, than haters, so there must be something wrong with the overall quality of Mod 6, if the majority doesn't like it.
2. Bug list is so long, that if we would report all of them, it would actually need a new forum for itself.
3. Most of us writing here are long time players, please don't lie to ourselves, who likes to see guilds getting empty day by day, friends leaving by masses? I personally don't, but call be an old fool.
4. Once again look into the mirror and tell me, do you like, that instead of many dungeons we had, now we have only 3-3. The biggest PR disaster in my eyes is the loss of the name giving Castle Never.
5. Who likes it, that nobody listens to us, the community, to our feedback? Communication is like zero.
6. Who likes it, that when they address something, it takes months or years or some bugs are ever present.
7. For me, my toons are like my children, i love them. Now if game would have started as PVP or PVE only, no problem then, but since this became a PVE and PVP game, who likes it, that there are such huge class imbalances.
8. Did any of you lovers look at the programming work done in the "new" maps. Recycled! Spinward Rise, which would be the only positive side, is laggy to the core and why, cause hasty and bad programming work was done.
9. Who on earth, with a right mind likes the loss of AD from the Lord, from PVP? No little and legit player.
10. Last, but not least, 1 shot trash Mob. Where on earth can this be found in DnD? Everyone, who emphasizes this, should give it a go and try to follow my example. I am a DM in a small club since 22 years and i must say, never in the world did i do such thing, nor did any of my fellow DMs tried to do such nonsense.
Thank you for hearing me out, i could actually go on, but don't wanna sound too grumpy.
P.S: If some of you would like to debate my opinion i invite them personally to our company, i will take him to Mercedes Benz, Bosch, Audi, etc. to some huge software makers, to world known Devs, maybe you will believe them, that this shot has gone in the wrong direction. I for myself have only contact with them day by day and i have 4 diplomas, 1 of them is an international IT programmer. This is not showing off, no by any means not, but i have to write it here so you can see, i know, what i am talking about and i have the experience to say, things are messed up.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
If you have not been playing for a long time it is very difficult to make AD.
If you hve been playing for a long time you will have millions of AD. Perhaps more than you could ever spend.
Gone are the day where you could mke 30k AD in day... from running dailies. When you create the shortfall it disrupts the economy.
@rayrdan... wht you are saying proves my point exactly. The fact that items have become cheaper because people are selling them at a lower price... to make them move... is an issue. What that will create, and I have seen the beginnings of it, is a market where some people will buy highly desired items at a low prices and sell them for a price that the market will bear.
In WoW... we called that "gold farming the AH". I made 100's of thousands of gold that I could never spend... because I needed for nothing.
It ultimately destroys the economy. When people sell low and the demand is high... there will be abuse.
@rebellionstuff... I agree... but many of these people have spent 1000's of RL dollars in this game and countless hours honing their abilities and professions. Many will stay to see tht investment pay off... through more and more enjoyment.
As I see it, the casual players who desire to spend only a couple hours a day in NW... are the ones making the choice to leave for good.
There may be a bunch of people leaving, but we have had an increase in membership in CA... which is due to old members returning to the fold and new members bringing in a new love for the game.
Well, that's what I did with the game pre-60 on my HR Archer, but now... I tried to fight enemies on level 71 as a 70 for the ToD campaign, I could survive the fights with massive amounts of dodging as well as luck, but by the third fight I just gave up because it was not fun and the thought of possible boss fight coming made me went to bang my head against the keyboard. Focusing on a fight and having a bit of a challenge is both relaxing and fun for me, but when the "weakest" enemy in a group hits for at least a fourth of your hit points, it just made all of my progress feel absolutely worthless. It literally made me cry.
I've seen a casual and under-geared HR Archer defeat enemies 2 levels above them at level 30 not even losing half their HPs, but my fights with level 71-73s (in supposedly "solo-able" areas) end up with a loss of... well, all my HPs and then some (from potions), while I can't even shave off a 20th of one enemy's health. Yes, my IL is low (1.5k+) and I wouldn't call myself an amazing player, but this game gave me the impression that it was not just for pro players willing to pay thousands of dollars/spend hundreds of hours PVPing/do hundreds of hours worth of dungeon grinding with other players; just to be able to do "solo-able" areas.
I do love this game, I've had a lot of fun with it pre-60 but now it gives me literal anxiety because every time I try to progress in any way, the game just wants to keep reminding me how weak and useless I am compared to enemies my own level. I've spent actual money on this game because I wanted to support it and was hoping they were on the road to improvement, and now it is forever edged in my memory as the game that made me cry from not bugs or awful player experiences, but from intentional, "functional" (according to the PWE/Cryptic at least) game mechanics.
At this point it can't get any worse for me since I barely do quests/campaigns anymore, and I'm carrying a sliver of hope that things will actually get better, at which point I will, as you put it,"chill out" and just enjoy the game again.
So yeah, TL;DR I don't enjoy a game that makes me anxious just from its standard difficulty - those are my complaints as a relatively new, casual player. If you have completely different experiences with the game, I won't argue with you or anyone else about it (we all play and enjoy games differently, after all), but show me where it says "game is not meant for the paying casual, averagely skilled players" before you (or the devs) dismiss complaints from me and similar-minded people.
Well they did not use words they used deeds to show us,and they called it mod6. Or as it should of been named "Mod end of Fun and Enjoyment".
When solo quests in WoD require a duo or trio to complete, then they're no longer solo. Duh.
I'm all for one-shotting. Us heroes should be doing it to trash mobs, not the other way around. I also believe the dragons pre-mod 6 were too easy. Dragons should one-shot with a bite or claw. If you stand in front and can't shield it, you should die, yes. But sometimes I see a dragon just flap its wings and five or six well-geared players go flying off with green +s over their bodies. Insane.
Mod 6 is simply insane. Mod 5 at max level I felt like a hero. Now I feel like I need to group up just to heal in the rez circle. Some players won't be happy until NW requires a full 200-man raid to get out of the tutorial. These are the kind of players who whine for a group just to kill a level 2 mob. That isn't a challenge, it's a cop-out on player skill.
for some it IS too easy - there is only 1 somewhat challenging fight in the solo content and thats prison warden(mostly because these 2 drakes knockback so often i feel like running PK and it takes a while to kill with so low dmg
you felt like a hero in mod5, i felt like Lord Ao is my *****. even now i feel like some demigod just murdering on a whim - the only place that feels like a heroic challenge is t2, everything else is a meh
Yup those who come here and support this mod are those who are trying to make their E_peens bigger, or are really employee's of the company.
Problem is, they're making broad assumptions for the rest of us. I had decent gear, not top end. Decent as in everything was purple. Enchants were what I could afford without going total wallet-warrior - meaning rank 6s and 7s. I was able to solo the solo quests in the end zones with a fair amount of certainty.
But what we have now is not what the e-peeners are claiming, unless we all assume what they assume - we all have the best top-end gear. I've read e-peeners saying just blue gear is good enough to be able to solo all the content that should be soloable (while they're wearing purple). When mentioning enchants, the e-peeners automatically assume everyone should wallet-warrior to enchant 9s. Sorry buds, many of us don't have that kind of money, or if we do, we're spending it on something else.
Mod 6 as it stands, is thus P2W if you want to solo the solo content. Certainly, pre Mod 6 was P2Faster, but not P2W.
Why must we assume that the solo content requires a group if we only have average gear (purple pre Mod 6, blue post-mod 6 and mediocre enchants)? And then they rip the nutsacks off of regular players by gutting the Hoard Enchants. There's no way for us to be able to solo solo content via enchant refining without resorting to the wallet. Let's be realistic.