Yeah, but the thing about pvp is that every class (except for SW right now) can be "broken". HR can have almost perma-daze, combined with 100% encounter uptime as trapper. TR can be permanently invisible and do massive burst damage with SE, LB, and all the piercing. CW can be insanely tanky with shield and a negation, or they can permanently control you. GWF can reach massive damage with stacks of everything, and they can gain 75k to 150k THP with unstoppable. GF can block and be incredibly annoying to kill, while unleashing huge burst and autotargetting (bullcharge, sort of flourish). OP can become impossible to kill, and just sit on points. DC can either be impossible to kill, or do amazing ongoing damage. Because of this, as annoying as OPs are, anybody else can be just as annoying, and therefore it actually becomes balanced. Except for SWs of co urse. They just have it awful. Personally, I think fury is weak right now and needs more necrotic damage (basically piercing) while temptation needs some kind of built-in lifesteal chance increase, and damnation just needs bug fixes and then a smarter puppet. So get off the whining threads about all other classes, and go help those warlocks!
Yeah, but the thing about pvp is that every class (except for SW right now) can be "broken". HR can have almost perma-daze, combined with 100% encounter uptime as trapper. TR can be permanently invisible and do massive burst damage with SE, LB, and all the piercing. CW can be insanely tanky with shield and a negation, or they can permanently control you. GWF can reach massive damage with stacks of everything, and they can gain 75k to 150k THP with unstoppable. GF can block and be incredibly annoying to kill, while unleashing huge burst and autotargetting (bullcharge, sort of flourish). OP can become impossible to kill, and just sit on points. DC can either be impossible to kill, or do amazing ongoing damage. Because of this, as annoying as OPs are, anybody else can be just as annoying, and therefore it actually becomes balanced. Except for SWs of co urse. They just have it awful. Personally, I think fury is weak right now and needs more necrotic damage (basically piercing) while temptation needs some kind of built-in lifesteal chance increase, and damnation just needs bug fixes and then a smarter puppet. So get off the whining threads about all other classes, and go help those warlocks!
So which of them can't be killed?
Better yet, I've stated multiple times that being unkillable in 1v1 isn't much of a problem. But a 2v1? 3v1? 4v1? 5v1? Lord knows it happens in Domination at almost all level ranges after basics of the build becomes rounded out. Extremely difficult, yes, but I've killed the mighty Sabos. Also difficult to certain classes like my CW, but I've managed to defeat Trapper HRs. If some adversary is too much for me then a 2v1, 3v1, teamwork also works in all of the cases...
...except on Palys. Now that I've made a specific anti-Paly/anti-DC build, a single enchantment removes their only weakness -- CCs -- and throws it out of the game and that's like an official statement of invincibility. No weaknesses at all when Elven Battle comes into the picture.
Every class can be "broken", some more than others. And currently, nothing is at the level of broken, as Palys are. Everything about their design, I can see that the devs specifically crafted them Palys to be tanks under mod6 standards of mob damage, but the way they made it handle in PvP...
It's disgusting. Not even immortal tank-DCs are that disgusting. (unless they start wearing T.Elven Battle as well, in which case they become as disgusting as all the Paly-roaches infesting Domination nodes.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Yeah, but the thing about pvp is that every class (except for SW right now) can be "broken". HR can have almost perma-daze, combined with 100% encounter uptime as trapper. TR can be permanently invisible and do massive burst damage with SE, LB, and all the piercing. CW can be insanely tanky with shield and a negation, or they can permanently control you. GWF can reach massive damage with stacks of everything, and they can gain 75k to 150k THP with unstoppable. GF can block and be incredibly annoying to kill, while unleashing huge burst and autotargetting (bullcharge, sort of flourish). OP can become impossible to kill, and just sit on points. DC can either be impossible to kill, or do amazing ongoing damage. Because of this, as annoying as OPs are, anybody else can be just as annoying, and therefore it actually becomes balanced. Except for SWs of co urse. They just have it awful. Personally, I think fury is weak right now and needs more necrotic damage (basically piercing) while temptation needs some kind of built-in lifesteal chance increase, and damnation just needs bug fixes and then a smarter puppet. So get off the whining threads about all other classes, and go help those warlocks!
So which of them can't be killed?
Better yet, I've stated multiple times that being unkillable in 1v1 isn't much of a problem. But a 2v1? 3v1? 4v1? 5v1? Lord knows it happens in Domination at almost all level ranges after basics of the build becomes rounded out. Extremely difficult, yes, but I've killed the mighty Sabos. Also difficult to certain classes like my CW, but I've managed to defeat Trapper HRs. If some adversary is too much for me then a 2v1, 3v1, teamwork also works in all of the cases...
...except on Palys. Now that I've made a specific anti-Paly/anti-DC build, a single enchantment removes their only weakness -- CCs -- and throws it out of the game and that's like an official statement of invincibility. No weaknesses at all when Elven Battle comes into the picture.
Every class can be "broken", some more than others. And currently, nothing is at the level of broken, as Palys are. Everything about their design, I can see that the devs specifically crafted them Palys to be tanks under mod6 standards of mob damage, but the way they made it handle in PvP...
It's disgusting. Not even immortal tank-DCs are that disgusting. (unless they start wearing T.Elven Battle as well, in which case they become as disgusting as all the Paly-roaches infesting Domination nodes.
And that is the sad truth of Neverwinter right now. But if you remember the introduction of HRs and SWs, you should know that this happens every time a new class is introduced, to make everybody make a brand new OP, so they spend money on new gear, enchants, mounts, companions...and then that class is nerfed back down to earth. I think we just need to wait this one out, let them have their fun, and if they aren't nerfed...I think a pre-made of EoA or Synergy or Exodus players could beat even 5 protection bulwark OPs, it would just be annoying. I firmly believe the nerf is coming, and until then will probably level Alta or play PvE.
Also, the ones that wear T elven battle give up their T negation, making them easy prey for high power, high arpen sm conqueror GFs; I can attest to that. I've defeated many T elven battle OPs in 1v1, simply due to the fact that they cannot damage me enough to even hurt me, and all I need is for them to run out of stamina, run out of buffs, use their daily up, and I can slaughter them. Bullcharge, crescendo, flourish, ending with anvil of doom, and without a T negation (and a lot of luck, one of those critting would make it even worse), almost nobody will survive. And if this is some crazy totally BiS protection bulwark OP, then I will leave him there, probably with another OP or a DC to keep him occupied, and go kill his team and win the match because he didn't think about killing as well. Or I'll go grab a CW or trapper HR and come back and end him. You can't have both negation and elven battle, and until you can, I will never be afraid of any OP, and I will never consider them too broken.
...except on Palys. Now that I've made a specific anti-Paly/anti-DC build, a single enchantment removes their only weakness -- CCs -- and throws it out of the game and that's like an official statement of invincibility. No weaknesses at all when Elven Battle comes into the picture.
The problem with making a build to kill a Paladin is there are a variety of builds out there. However, there are a few things that are very important to note. For most builds, survivability scales very poorly with item level. Being BiS for damage adds a tremendous amount of damage. Being BiS for Paladin going survivability is a much more marginal increase. That said, the baseline survivability for a Paladin is MUCH higher than baseline damage.
Armor Penetration is very effective... if you stack it enough, on most Paladins. It is of much more marginal effectiveness against me. I have 75% mitigation before Tenacity. You must have greater than 95% armor penetration to get me below the damage resistance cap. This is an anomaly. Most Paladins out there rely on Tenacity damage resistance to make it to cap. If you had 100% Armor Penetration, you would likely see somewhere around a 150% increase in damage against most Paladins.
Contrary to your assumption, CC is not the one weakness of a Paladin. The weakness of a Paladin is damage. We have very poor damage. Even without TEB, we have Cleansing Touch which removes CC, heals, provides Temporary Hit points, and lets us get Sanctuary (which is CC immunity) up, use another ability, or both. We are arguably less susceptible to CC than most classes. If we want to go damage, we must give up a tremendous amount of survivability to gain very, very mediocre damage.
In my experience, I'm significantly harder to kill than most other Paladins. I base this on the fact that a lot of people I've played against tell me I'm much harder to kill than other Paladins. I also watch "immortal" Paladins get melted in 1v1 scenarios fairly regularly. I can be killed. I "am" frequently killed. Feytouched and other significant damage bonuses are very difficult to deal with on a high DPS class. First Strike TRs can be very difficult to deal with, they will almost always kill in conjunction with another class. There are some Warlocks who deal abhorrent amounts of damage. There are GF and GWF who deal lots of damage as well.
Legion is correct in his assessment, for the most part. I'd disagree that Bulwark meaningfully contributes to survival. Light, in my experience, is by far the best for survivability.
...except on Palys. Now that I've made a specific anti-Paly/anti-DC build, a single enchantment removes their only weakness -- CCs -- and throws it out of the game and that's like an official statement of invincibility. No weaknesses at all when Elven Battle comes into the picture.
The problem with making a build to kill a Paladin is there are a variety of builds out there. However, there are a few things that are very important to note. For most builds, survivability scales very poorly with item level. Being BiS for damage adds a tremendous amount of damage. Being BiS for Paladin going survivability is a much more marginal increase. That said, the baseline survivability for a Paladin is MUCH higher than baseline damage.
Armor Penetration is very effective... if you stack it enough, on most Paladins. It is of much more marginal effectiveness against me. I have 75% mitigation before Tenacity. You must have greater than 95% armor penetration to get me below the damage resistance cap. This is an anomaly. Most Paladins out there rely on Tenacity damage resistance to make it to cap. If you had 100% Armor Penetration, you would likely see somewhere around a 150% increase in damage against most Paladins.
Contrary to your assumption, CC is not the one weakness of a Paladin. The weakness of a Paladin is damage. We have very poor damage. Even without TEB, we have Cleansing Touch which removes CC, heals, provides Temporary Hit points, and lets us get Sanctuary (which is CC immunity) up, use another ability, or both. We are arguably less susceptible to CC than most classes. If we want to go damage, we must give up a tremendous amount of survivability to gain very, very mediocre damage.
In my experience, I'm significantly harder to kill than most other Paladins. I base this on the fact that a lot of people I've played against tell me I'm much harder to kill than other Paladins. I also watch "immortal" Paladins get melted in 1v1 scenarios fairly regularly. I can be killed. I "am" frequently killed. Feytouched and other significant damage bonuses are very difficult to deal with on a high DPS class. First Strike TRs can be very difficult to deal with, they will almost always kill in conjunction with another class. There are some Warlocks who deal abhorrent amounts of damage. There are GF and GWF who deal lots of damage as well.
Legion is correct in his assessment, for the most part. I'd disagree that Bulwark meaningfully contributes to survival. Light, in my experience, is by far the best for survivability.
I get that. I just picked the defensive path for OPs, because I don't have enough experience with them. When I leveled mine for the sigil, I just went Justice and after I got it, I deleted the character, because I don't like the playstyle. So I only know what I have gathered from fighting them (and of course what the Justice path offers).
Obsydian i want you to troll another GWF like this Would laugh a lot watching the video.
BTW, if the CW is good he should be able to repel the pally out of node, so if a mate drops on the node, cap together and then go, when the pally is pushed far far away from the node, you get points, slowly.
The real problem is not a paladin alone, or a tank DC alone. It's when you are 2v2 against healer class+other class, and you are just 2xDPS. You lose 99% of the times cause often just 2 players are not enough to take down current DCs/Paladins, and they make the other dude immortal too, while he slowly takes you both down.
7
The real problem is not a paladin alone, or a tank DC alone. It's when you are 2v2 against healer class+other class, and you are just 2xDPS. You lose 99% of the times cause often just 2 players are not enough to take down current DCs/Paladins, and they make the other dude immortal too, while he slowly takes you both down.
you probably havent seen how fast 2 cws can blow up a paladin
Obsydian i want you to troll another GWF like this Would laugh a lot watching the video.
BTW, if the CW is good he should be able to repel the pally out of node, so if a mate drops on the node, cap together and then go, when the pally is pushed far far away from the node, you get points, slowly.
The real problem is not a paladin alone, or a tank DC alone. It's when you are 2v2 against healer class+other class, and you are just 2xDPS. You lose 99% of the times cause often just 2 players are not enough to take down current DCs/Paladins, and they make the other dude immortal too, while he slowly takes you both down.
I love this video... I especially love how you trolled a known.... well.... you know...
Easy Answer CC him down its quick and easy, or just cc him off the node, Any Paly of any IL can be CCed down in seconds aTR, HR can lock a Paly down down indefinitely, with Crushing Roots and Smoke Bomb, TR dazing in between, SE when its up. and if they are with a healer, well then your other two nodes are free, or grab a CW and take both down in CC train.
Comments
So which of them can't be killed?
Better yet, I've stated multiple times that being unkillable in 1v1 isn't much of a problem. But a 2v1? 3v1? 4v1? 5v1? Lord knows it happens in Domination at almost all level ranges after basics of the build becomes rounded out. Extremely difficult, yes, but I've killed the mighty Sabos. Also difficult to certain classes like my CW, but I've managed to defeat Trapper HRs. If some adversary is too much for me then a 2v1, 3v1, teamwork also works in all of the cases...
...except on Palys. Now that I've made a specific anti-Paly/anti-DC build, a single enchantment removes their only weakness -- CCs -- and throws it out of the game and that's like an official statement of invincibility. No weaknesses at all when Elven Battle comes into the picture.
Every class can be "broken", some more than others. And currently, nothing is at the level of broken, as Palys are. Everything about their design, I can see that the devs specifically crafted them Palys to be tanks under mod6 standards of mob damage, but the way they made it handle in PvP...
It's disgusting. Not even immortal tank-DCs are that disgusting. (unless they start wearing T.Elven Battle as well, in which case they become as disgusting as all the Paly-roaches infesting Domination nodes.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
And that is the sad truth of Neverwinter right now. But if you remember the introduction of HRs and SWs, you should know that this happens every time a new class is introduced, to make everybody make a brand new OP, so they spend money on new gear, enchants, mounts, companions...and then that class is nerfed back down to earth. I think we just need to wait this one out, let them have their fun, and if they aren't nerfed...I think a pre-made of EoA or Synergy or Exodus players could beat even 5 protection bulwark OPs, it would just be annoying. I firmly believe the nerf is coming, and until then will probably level Alta or play PvE.
The problem with making a build to kill a Paladin is there are a variety of builds out there. However, there are a few things that are very important to note. For most builds, survivability scales very poorly with item level. Being BiS for damage adds a tremendous amount of damage. Being BiS for Paladin going survivability is a much more marginal increase. That said, the baseline survivability for a Paladin is MUCH higher than baseline damage.
Armor Penetration is very effective... if you stack it enough, on most Paladins. It is of much more marginal effectiveness against me. I have 75% mitigation before Tenacity. You must have greater than 95% armor penetration to get me below the damage resistance cap. This is an anomaly. Most Paladins out there rely on Tenacity damage resistance to make it to cap. If you had 100% Armor Penetration, you would likely see somewhere around a 150% increase in damage against most Paladins.
Contrary to your assumption, CC is not the one weakness of a Paladin. The weakness of a Paladin is damage. We have very poor damage. Even without TEB, we have Cleansing Touch which removes CC, heals, provides Temporary Hit points, and lets us get Sanctuary (which is CC immunity) up, use another ability, or both. We are arguably less susceptible to CC than most classes. If we want to go damage, we must give up a tremendous amount of survivability to gain very, very mediocre damage.
In my experience, I'm significantly harder to kill than most other Paladins. I base this on the fact that a lot of people I've played against tell me I'm much harder to kill than other Paladins. I also watch "immortal" Paladins get melted in 1v1 scenarios fairly regularly. I can be killed. I "am" frequently killed. Feytouched and other significant damage bonuses are very difficult to deal with on a high DPS class. First Strike TRs can be very difficult to deal with, they will almost always kill in conjunction with another class. There are some Warlocks who deal abhorrent amounts of damage. There are GF and GWF who deal lots of damage as well.
Legion is correct in his assessment, for the most part. I'd disagree that Bulwark meaningfully contributes to survival. Light, in my experience, is by far the best for survivability.
I get that. I just picked the defensive path for OPs, because I don't have enough experience with them. When I leveled mine for the sigil, I just went Justice and after I got it, I deleted the character, because I don't like the playstyle. So I only know what I have gathered from fighting them (and of course what the Justice path offers).
" ok stop i will never kill you, HAMSTER class"
I answered :
" i can't kill you too,
hahha
very good answer.....
Obsydian i want you to troll another GWF like this
BTW, if the CW is good he should be able to repel the pally out of node, so if a mate drops on the node, cap together and then go, when the pally is pushed far far away from the node, you get points, slowly.
The real problem is not a paladin alone, or a tank DC alone. It's when you are 2v2 against healer class+other class, and you are just 2xDPS. You lose 99% of the times cause often just 2 players are not enough to take down current DCs/Paladins, and they make the other dude immortal too, while he slowly takes you both down.
you probably havent seen how fast 2 cws can blow up a paladin
I love this video... I especially love how you trolled a known.... well.... you know...