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Class Balancing Results
zeusom
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 810 Arc User
Now 2 months later, here are the results of the class balancing changes brought about in November 2014.
(Middle pages on lower graph, around page 1000 area, gives some idea of what portion of each class is being played).
(Middle pages on lower graph, around page 1000 area, gives some idea of what portion of each class is being played).
Post edited by zeusom on
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Edit: page 1000 is not doing pvp is doing daily for ad
Right, the Top 50 pages are almost entirely active pvp players who are trying to win pvp matches either solo or running premades. Successful premades employ the classes that are most successful this is reflected in the top 50 pages.
The middle 1000 pages are largely players not trying/caring or just doing pvp for dailies.
So these pages give more a sense what kind of numbers of each class simply being played.
Sopi SW Youtube channel pvp brickabrack
Or, they are PVP enthusiasts who are trying, who do care, who don't do PVP just for the dailies, but who aren't yet at the 20k+++ GS threshold.
Then they cant be trying very hard. I have an 8k gs alt account that i play with for fun to troll people with doing stupid things. And he is on page 45 or something at the moment.
That's because your 8k character is a TR. I don't think TRs are balanced even at low level and I did say "mostly" balanced. TRs are certainly the big exception, along with a couple of other small things IMO.
Rather than pages in a row, build a random number generator to select page and rank within the page. Build 4 samples, one within each quartile (ie. top 25% of pages, 2nd 25%, 3rd and last 25%). Have the generator select page and rank, and select enough in each quartile to build a statistically significant set. The sum of all samples will give you a result of overall representation of each class within pvp as a whole. Then plot each class's representation within each quartile. Balanced classes should maintain pretty similar representation. Imbalanced classes should show higher representation in the top quartile diminishing to the bottom, etc.
(edit) you could do it with pages in a row selected in each quartile without a random number generator. But the point to get across here is based on also Pointsmen's statement that its balanced in the middle. If there's, for example, twice as many TRs playing as GWFs, then there should be twice as many TRs as GWFs in the middle as well as the top to say its balanced.
However putting that much time in to show the results might be pointless since it seems the devs are busy with the next mod and porting to x-box. It'd be nice if they could make an effort to try something before the next mod though.
I know, right? It's insulting to claim that unless you're in the top 50 pages, that you're not a "real PVPer". I wonder if they even know how insulting they are being.
I would put the threshold at 17k GS when talking about the first 50 pages. So we are talking about epic artifacts, rank 7-8 enchantments minimum.
Now if you are using one of the overpowered PVP classes such as a TR or a DC, it could be even less.
I have pretty thick skin ;-) However by that logic I'm not a real much of anything :-) My standard evening play will be PVE dailies, 1 x Tiamat, PVP dailies (alas no more til issues addressed) and then any remaining time doing what is fun - usually more PVP or a dungeon run if I can convince enough to join. So if "just doing dailies" means a person is not "real", I'm not a real pve-er either. Now, the pvp is no longer enjoyable, Tiamat is boring, and dungeoning is difficult find groups since there's no reward in dungeons. Hence now after PVE dailies and a Tiamat if I can bring myself to do it, I log off and read a book.
I would rather work on arguments for the devs to bring back enjoyment. Balanced pvp (I can handle being cleaned up by those that overgear me, but being unable to fight back is not fun), and reasons to get people partying up in pve. I don't have the time to do the number crunching the OP has done, but would love to see a solid statistical argument to wake up the devs and give some enjoyment back at least to pvp before the next mod (which people are estimating April).
Don't feel bad, I'm a real gateway'er at the moment. Just too bored by tiamat and pvp hasn't interested me since mod3.
I wish this kind of data gathering would mean something in the end but it will not. Everything from cryptic concerning mod 6 shows absolutely zero attention given to class balance, and a priority being made of tweaking regen/lifesteal because the current regen/lifesteal system just didn't "feel right" to the devs. Thousands of pages of player feedback (of which hundreds are well reasoned/totally legit) stating class balance as a primary issue and it is entirely and completely ignored by the devs.
In short, sorry but they don't really care. If they did, there would at least be some acknowledgement of the issue. That is not forum griefing from a salty player, it s simply the only rational conclusion that can be reached on the matter.
Interesting to see that CWs dominate those after 50 pages. I really believe CW (PVP & PVE) is by far the most played class in Neverwinter.
For me that graph once again proved that CWs cry about TRs just because those don't let them completely dominate PvP field of the game. Not saying TRs are not overpowered though...
WTB Class Reroll please
Yes but those are after the first 50 pages. At that point, the biggest factor is just population and how many PVE CWs there are in the game and not how powerful that class is.
Mediocre players playing bad classes from bad PVP guilds get inside the top-50 pages.
In the first 50 pages, TRs are too dominant to not warrant any complaints from every single other class.
It would be really helpful if the Leaderboards provided some more information, such as team members of recently won matches, who they fought against, GS, feats/paragons, number of disconnects/kicks, and etc etc.. and that would provide a lot of insight to which TRs are indeed performing how, and how much of their wins are affected by which guild/teammates they run with.
My theory is almost all of the TRs in the first 20 pages or so can be tracked down to probably some 5~7 major PvP guilds, and the rest would be either former members of such guilds or very old, veteran players who did not join guilds. My theory is also that 50% of them would be Sabos, 40% or so Execs, and 10% or so Scoundrels.
It would be nice if there was a way to confirm these suspicions.
I'd say the contrary. I think its the non-TRs on the first 10 pages that could be tracked down to known PVP guilds. In the first few pages alone, you see some a lot of TRs with obscure guild names. I know the top CWs on the leaderboard only run with their overpowered guild.
I think that makes sense. This is the mod where you could safely pug using your TR.
Question one: Do they know, yes since before release. Question two: Do they care, no.
I think somewhere in the DC feedback a Dev even said, that faithful capstone feat needs to get toned down. Guess what happened, nothing.
I really think based on what they say, the devs work in some fantasy world of obscure and generally irrelevant perceptions they have of this game which forms their frame of reference for what needs done. So when the game is falling apart in the most fundamental of ways, they focus on some marginal component of the game that really doesn't need adjusting at all. It is like the house is burning down so lets focus on making the lampshades match the carpet.
You will be surprised but there are people on top pages that actually don't exploit kick :P
WTB Class Reroll please
The fact that kick system false classemnt doesn,t change the fact that it can be used by anyone and not only TR's mean it is probably really near the truth in term of class balance.