Any PvP Warlocks there left? Need some guidance.

lerdocix

So, I've got my SW alt to 60 some time ago, got some gear, still got low GS, about 13k, but the thing is, pretty much everything mops the floor with me.

Currently specced for temptation soulbinder.

Could anyone give me tips for pvp? Should I respec to previous paragon and go fury? Figured out that my current spec works great for pve survivability, but in PvP I feel like free kill at times when fighting equally geared people and GWFs are pretty much the only ones that give me no problems.

So, what spec, paragon and encounters do you use and how successful are you with it?

joocycuzzzzzz

Warlock is the worst class in PVP right now, no matter what you do, each class will defeat you, unfortunately.

But here's what you can do: Create a cleric, level it to 60, do 3 boons, get Sigil of the Devoted. then claim it on your warlock.

Refine the devoted to at least epic, then use this rotation. Harrow Storm -> Bargain -> Dread Theft -> Brood of Hadar. (If your AP is full cast Brood of Hadar sooner)

or... if you want to be a "Mobile" warlock, a warlock that doesn't stay still due to dreadtheft, then use these powers: Killing Flames, Soul Scorch, Fiery Bolt. You have more mobility and no powers that pin you down (Harrowstorm, Dread Theft). And these powers are "somewhat" fast to cast, so you can sprint around after casting them.

At-Wills are obviously Essence Defiler (As a main at-will) and Hand of Blight (Secondary)

Yes, go Fury and use the SoulBinder paragon passives. (Borrowed Time, Dust to Dust). If you're using the "Mobile" warlock style then swap Dust to Dust for Shadow Walk.

lerdocix

Cleric is my main since open beta, so that I already have covered, artifact is already on the lock.

So that leaves me to respecing into fury.
Will miss mobility of temptation really much, but figured out that I can't outlast anyone anyway.

vasdamas

Nevermind.

darylhaz

Use Fury/Soulbinder. Get the artifact off hand and choose borrowed time bonus. When pvping don't use soulscorch because you will need your soulsparks to get high deflect. This way you will have good dps and good defense.

animalust

You should set a goal of raising your HP up to at the very least 35k.

I think saying that SW will lose to every class is a Joke of a reply, if your diligent, streategic, and have the defenses, you can, and will, kill people just fine.

There are TR's that can and will 1 or 2 shot you with ease, but if the TR uses the smoke bomb its very easy to "hear it" and run out of the way and be immune to that stun, same with the other thrown object stun (the one that refills stealth)

In dominations you cannot just stand around on the cap point.. you need to be more careful and selective, otherwise you will be cannon fodder no matter how defensive you are.

when your at 46k HP, 36 % damage resistance, 16% life steal, as close to 1k regen as possible, 35-40% crit rate with as much crit severity as you can, you can still 2 shot average players that you will find up to the rank 300th pages, if you have a vantage point, those TR's cant survive a 2 hit combo or a Bargain+rebuke (Fury spec)

when you use harrowstorm, be very selective of when you proc the prone, make sure they dont roll/ dodge and waste it (also helps remove pesky Barkshield)

Even against the hardest groups, i dont ever, and i mean, EVER, come out with more deaths than kills. im currently hovering around the low 300's to high 200's right now, but nearing my standard goal of 6 to 1 kill death ratio.

hell just last night I jumped 2 CW's 16k and 18k GS, took out the 16k wih harrowstorm+ killing flames, before the other CW could hit me with anything, got him with Bargain and rebuke, he nearly killed himself attacking me, and then i just leisurely killed him with Killing flames. since he was a single target.

an almost 20k DC who was DPS specced also had an unfortunate run in with me, as I hit him with a Killing flames for 43k + Murderous Flames feat procced another 40k non crit.


So, its not that we are the worst class in PVP, and definitely not that we will lose to EVERY other class (that's just absurd) its that we cant pretend to be a GWF and run in head first.. Its hard to survive if your not packing the right stats, even harder to survive if you are not staying mobile. the trade off is that we can randomly kill anything in one or 2 big hits.

The only thing you need to be careful of is Ice Wind Dale PVP, if you are not a Wallet Warrior, the difference between a 25k GS Best in Slot + top end Companions is Very Very big vs the average guy who made it to a couple legendaries thanks to double RP weekends.

in Domination and GG its not so bad, it just becomes annoying with the influx of TR's lately.

lerdocix

Cheers joocycuzzzzzz and others, respecced from tempt, instantly felt the difference, I can take on 1k higher GS people while before I struggled or just lost.

Spec plays fun, don't know why I hesitated with fury so much before.

Miss perma sprint thou.

caexar

Huh... Don't know why everyone is knocking the Templock for PvP when it boasts the best survivability. I run Temp and the only classes I find extremely troubling fighting solo are the OP TR's and the apparently OP DPS DC. The first because they are broken OP and the latter I haven't decided if it is because they are OP or I just haven't fought enough of them and figured them out yet.
If you plan on relying heavily on team mates then fury is nice, just dont try holding a node on your own much. Otherwise fury is great for hiding behind a GF and bringing da pain.

animalust

caexar wrote: »

Huh... Don't know why everyone is knocking the Templock for PvP when it boasts the best survivability. I run Temp and the only classes I find extremely troubling fighting solo are the OP TR's and the apparently OP DPS DC. The first because they are broken OP and the latter I haven't decided if it is because they are OP or I just haven't fought enough of them and figured them out yet.
If you plan on relying heavily on team mates then fury is nice, just don't try holding a node on your own much. Otherwise fury is great for hiding behind a GF and bringing da pain.

well temptation is a support spec, the damage debuffs and the temp HP deal really isnt going to make a difference.

spar with one of us Fury specs (the ones who don't complain about sucking) and you will see

Vs someone like myself, you wont have the damage out put to break past my own personal healing. and instead, I will put out much more dps than your feats can protect you from.

caexar

Somehow I doubt that with healing depression you will be out healing anyone with a 20k character's DPS. Even optimally speccd your life steal would be a scant 10%... that is bravado plain and simple.
I've come to find that many Fury locks crumble once they've used up their stamina and they also make the mistake of relying on DT and WB when they fight against an enemy who can essentially guard while being struck...

Not saying this is you but every fury lock I've fought including the ones in the top 20 pages of the leaderboards where I am (or was two days ago when I last logged lol), are pretty similar in tactics.
The ones that do survive usually are the ones that ran to and/or had team mates come to their aid.

animalust

its unfortunate the number of SW's out there that are using DT on anything but Clerics, even then its too easy for a cleric or someone else to disrupt you.

but hey, il take your word on the rest of it, but I would rather build survivable stats, and spec in DPS any day over the other options.

overdriver13

animalust wrote: »

Even against the hardest groups, i dont ever, and i mean, EVER, come out with more deaths than kills. im currently hovering around the low 300's to high 200's right now, but nearing my standard goal of 6 to 1 kill death ratio.

Its a little sad to read this, knowing on my 13k tr I just cracked high 200 within about a week and a half of hitting level 60 on it. Going from sw to tr...it is awesome survival training. Wish there was more parity between the classes, I love my sw and the clas is a blast to play regardless of win/loss or kill/death ratio.

denvald

lerdocix wrote: »

So, I've got my SW alt to 60 some time ago, got some gear, still got low GS, about 13k, but the thing is, pretty much everything mops the floor with me.

Currently specced for temptation soulbinder.

Could anyone give me tips for pvp? Should I respec to previous paragon and go fury? Figured out that my current spec works great for pve survivability, but in PvP I feel like free kill at times when fighting equally geared people and GWFs are pretty much the only ones that give me no problems.

So, what spec, paragon and encounters do you use and how successful are you with it?

Hello Lerdocix, expect that you will have alot of frustrations with your warlock in pvp, even when you get to very high GS scores. THe shift invincibility frames are buggy, you get CC'd occasionally while shifting, or take 100% damage, as if not shifting at all. You won't be able to dodge big hits at all, like Wizards Ice knife or rogue lashing blades / shocking execution. No matter how good you are, you will always take them in the face. People know that, so you are always the first target to get hit when people see a warlock on the battlefield. If knowing that you will want to play SW in pvp, then here is your best option IMO

denvald wrote: »

So if some of you are still intent on playing pvp despite SW being the worst pvp class right now, this is what I would recommend, it is truely the most effective pvp setup IMO, I was able to rip trough most enemies before they realize they were dead. The only good tree in pvp is Fury. I tried every tree even damnation toroughly, and the only one that works is fury.

I played Soulbinder a long time and in pvp, it just doesn't cut it, you don't benefit from soul sparks if your fight is over in 5 seconds (you're dead) or in most cases the match lasts 1 rotation so you get such little benefits from them. It doesn't offset the gains, as soon as you leave combat for a split second (rogue went to stealth... GG soul sparks). But when I was soulbinder the most effective setup I used was a High DPS corrupt black ice with overloads using soul scorch, warlock's bargain and dreadtheft.

Soul Scorch has high damage, you can chain it, and procs creeping death. Warlock's bargain has a risk factor in it, but it's one of the best casts available regardless, high damage, instant cast and necrotic damage. Dreadtheft you may ask? I keep this slotted for as long as rogues will be OP, it follows them in stealth, and I cannot tell you how pissed off it makes some rogues to lose half their hp while my dreadtheft is hitting them in stealth. Quite hilarious really. Also, don't be afraid to cancel your dreadtheft if you're anticipating a stun, you can go back to building sparks or w/e. Although I'm no fan of soulbinders sparks because of the rate you lose them, I would still say hellbringer beats soulbinders in pvp. PvP is about burst damage and quick fights 95% of the time, soulbinder will be useful over hellbringer the other 5%.

My current and favorite build, No pity no mercy, flames of empowerment + dc artifact. Only pop your daily brood of hadar if you need a really big burst dps to take down someone really tough like a DC (wait what, not GF?...) anyways. The goal is to abuse your combat advantage damage, so run high crit (40% if you are geared up is completely do able even with constitution belt). And then do your rotation. I use vampiric embrace, dreadtheft and warlock's bargain. Curse -> Hellish Rebuke, if you crit start your rotation otherwise use a couple hand of blights to proc it. Then roll bargain's and vampiric embrace, VE will make up for the hp you sacrificed, and on High DPS builds this power will deal decent damage +100% more damage from necrotic damage not to mention temp hp and a bit of healing. Then finish off with dreatheft, at this point you will have so much creeping death stacked on them the player will simply melt up like chocolate in the sun. I've had a rogue try to finish me at 15% hp with throwing knives. He wasn't able to, I had healed from life steal and VE + bargain enough to make up for his knives damage and his HP was simply evaporating in the meanwhile, he burned down in one rotation after going to stealth my dreadtheft was already his death sentence.

This is in my opinion, the MOST effective pvp build for a SW. Fury hellbringer with high dps using VE/Life steal/bargain as defensive hp restoration options (instead of sparks) due to the short nature of fights, I find this works much more reliably than sparks. You're still going to get burned by good players because it's easy to dodge the first two casts and cancel my dreadtheft then I dont have much left. But most of the SW abilities are so easily gimped that we don't have much choice.

Thanks for reading

hadestemplar

animalust wrote: »

You should set a goal of raising your HP up to at the very least 35k.

I think saying that SW will lose to every class is a Joke of a reply, if your diligent, streategic, and have the defenses, you can, and will, kill people just fine.

defences are good and HP too. But warlock is not tank. So dodging and avoiding head 2 head fight is gold rule. And I have seen warlocks come in dominion 5vs5 fights with tank build, i mean really tank build, because they focused on HP and def, and power where last thing in head. And they where <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. Simple thing is warlock is pve build not for pvp.

There are TR's that can and will 1 or 2 shot you with ease, but if the TR uses the smoke bomb its very easy to "hear it" and run out of the way and be immune to that stun, same with the other thrown object stun (the one that refills stealth)

I don't want to insult but, dafq. U can hear smoke bomb before it start work.?. Ghem. I where in dominion fight about 10 min ago. There where as usually full of TR and 1 CW and me as SW. And when you hear up smoke bomb u are already in its effect area. and you can't use shadow slip to move away.

So probably you didn't avoid but resist it via gear bonuses nothing else. Only via shadow slip you can try run away from rogue, otherwise he catch you due its class speed.

In dominations you cannot just stand around on the cap point.. you need to be more careful and selective, otherwise you will be cannon fodder no matter how defensive you are.

100% correct. And as I written in the start of post, with warlock you have to be sneaky *******, and avoid head 2 head fights.

when your at 46k HP, 36 % damage resistance, 16% life steal, as close to 1k regen as possible, 35-40% crit rate with as much crit severity as you can, you can still 2 shot average players that you will find up to the rank 300th pages, if you have a vantage point, those TR's cant survive a 2 hit combo or a Bargain+rebuke (Fury spec)

In simple words when you get almost top end gear for warlock, you can try fight back,
Bargain + rebuke.. Ghem. I use rebuke sometimes, but bargain is for boss fights not for pvp.
You lose Hp in order to use skill, and then you drain from enemy to restore own HP. If all went good, you maybe restore same amount HP which you spent for casting skill. If you hit crit, then yea its nice. But also if target get killed you lose chance to get HP back. And its actually same as playing with grenade, it can kill enemy or you can kill yourself.
I rather use wraith of shadow, you draining targets HP away, and if you use skill again you immobilize him. Good for rogue hunting. Also good for enemy group locking while you use DT.

when you use harrowstorm, be very selective of when you proc the prone, make sure they dont roll/ dodge and waste it (also helps remove pesky Barkshield)

Timing is key in game. Not matter if it's pve or pvp. But yea you can go as you say, or as most of warlocks do,
curse > harrowstorm and hit curse button to make sure that you prone target, because they can resist it too and you can lose chance to kill him. After all warlock is not CW, and have only 1 skill with CC effect (harrowstorm)
Wraith of shadow have CC effect but it last 1 second and its like to blink eye.

Even against the hardest groups, i dont ever, and i mean, EVER, come out with more deaths than kills. im currently hovering around the low 300's to high 200's right now, but nearing my standard goal of 6 to 1 kill death ratio.

Record you dominions fights, and share.. It sounds interesting. I seen warlocks even with 15 kGS++ get in dominion and all get in bottom with ration ~7 kills 15+++++ death and ~19 assist. I mean the last ones who where actually good ones.. I don't speak as normal usual ones who get in dominion and end with ration ~10 kill 35++ deaths 15 assist.
This type scenario goes if other team have 2 rogues, 1 CW and DC.

hell just last night I jumped 2 CW's 16k and 18k GS, took out the 16k wih harrowstorm+ killing flames, before the other CW could hit me with anything, got him with Bargain and rebuke, he nearly killed himself attacking me, and then i just leisurely killed him with Killing flames. since he was a single target.

With epic geared players are interesting thing. In one moment you can take any class with 2 hits, in other moment you do almost no damage at all.

an almost 20k DC who was DPS specced also had an unfortunate run in with me, as I hit him with a Killing flames for 43k + Murderous Flames feat procced another 40k non crit.

Show us in forum video. I would like to watch your warlock in action.

So, its not that we are the worst class in PVP, and definitely not that we will lose to EVERY other class (that's just absurd) its that we cant pretend to be a GWF and run in head first.. Its hard to survive if your not packing the right stats, even harder to survive if you are not staying mobile. the trade off is that we can randomly kill anything in one or 2 big hits.

Here members of NW community calculate warlocks chance win in pvp when you get head 2 head 1 vs 1. Or even 2vs2. And compared what can warlock offer and what can you do with other classes. Its clear that warlock was not developed for pvp, all where focused for pve.
you can kill in 1 or 2 big hits, if target is bad geared and have small resist stats, + player is not even looking in your side and you cast skill as ******* by hiding from prey. And most important thing if player is green in pvp.
Otherwise, not so much you can do.
I fight in dominions day by day, and make sure that anyone who want score from my warlock, they have to fight hard. But also I am not dreamer, even by looking in other classes gear sets bonuses already you can see warlocks weakness..
CW get extra power from gear set warlock get only recovery or action point gain.

The only thing you need to be careful of is Ice Wind Dale PVP, if you are not a Wallet Warrior, the difference between a 25k GS Best in Slot + top end Companions is Very Very big vs the average guy who made it to a couple legendaries thanks to double RP weekends.

Even I can get there, I don't bother go there. I prefer wait for better ages for warlock class.

in Domination and GG its not so bad, it just becomes annoying with the influx of TR's lately.

All current pvp stuffs are for rogue + CW. For me its usual thing to have matches in dominion where I am the only 1 as SW while all other ones are rogues.. And then its just fight between GHOSTS.

schietindebux

@bloodyspammer
thats more or less the same experience i get with my warlock, going tanky as i can
fighting on knotes , can´t care about K/D ration and be "carefull" hide behind corners etc. because u gonna lose behind corners and up on bridges, leaving the spot toth enemy

since i allways play random , i can´t relay on my mates
in generall i play against two TR´s + 1 DC/CW/GFW/GF
being one of three visible targets , i am target No 1 since DC is anoying hard normally, and CW can´fight back if played correct

i see a lot of CW playing with PVE gear, even don´t have any tenacity bursting everything down--> i don´t even can think about this

against GF and GWF i can compete more or less,

DC faithful skilled, if not a nub - no chance to kill,

DC rightous - burnes me away with DOTS (that should have been my privilege as Warlock?)

TR normally no chance cause of broken class mechanics, except one of these hundreds of nub TR´s who just shifted to this class, only to have once the feeling of getting anything done

vasdamas

Got to 6th page on my SW. Can't stand that stupid <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> of broken cc and daze any more.

GWFs, not usually a problem but intimidation sometimes hit so badly that I don't even know, had 22k deflected strike from daring shout today on me while fighting a GWF, got him to 50% and then POOOOF multiple procs from Ferocious Reaction. Roll a GWF when one broken thing is not enough.

GF, not usually having a problem unless one is skilled or using ferocious reaction.

CWs ooooh these guys, do they ever get nerfed? The mediocre CW won't be any problem but there are some CWs that are just so monstrously tanky and moreover hit for like 30k damage with just icy rays. How is that...how is that even fair? Don't even get me started on cast time. Typical situation, good CW sees me, we both hit at the same time, he entaggles me, I used daily on him > he dodges. Yeap, just like that, I eat his burst and he/she just controls and dodges everything.

HR Trappers are annoying, do they have anything but root/daze/stealth? Not to mention they can attack from stealth ohhh yeah. Not usually experiencing any troubles with HRs but with this type of HRs.
DC Another monstricity. Tank cleric Gift of faith, does it proc like thrice in a minute? How are we supposed to kill that thing without good CW? What if that DC got some other overbuffed monstricity that can kill you before you even try to do anything? I fail to realize how is DC not overpowered now, even a tanky one. Before the buffs tanky DC was challenging, not it's just mindless spamm.
As for DPS DCs, I haven't seen any yet. I did see some Scourge Clerics though.

TR A wondrous TR onehit/permadaze wonderland. And yeah, in fact permastealth still does exist. The best shocking execution I had on myself is 60k+ from exe spec. Permadaze rogues aren't as annoying, I can even manage to kill an equally geared...once. And if one has got no 1-2 bloodbaths up But once they figured my rotation I am so flipping dead and just a cereal on a plate despite some broken reflecting build I have now. And even if I outplay one of them all they do is just: Daze rogue - "PULL A GRAND TURISMO ON THAT SW! SW can't catch me because I run as fast as SW shadowslips with class feature", Executioners - "Lashing blades > ITC > some hits > Shadow stike > stealth > run away > come back > repeat till CW dies from SD and piercing damage. Or just Shocking execution/bloodbath one...just in case"

I am not running around with pve builds in pvp, my fury/soulbinder warlock has 46k in domination and 52k in open pvp and capable of doing some miracles but comparing to equally geared/skilled (or not so ha) players of the other classes...I am just done, in most scenarios.

animalust

im not so certain that my PC can handle running FRAPS for a video to be honest here, but il check it out as ive been wanting to video some duo dungeon run with my buddy.

vasdamas wrote: »

Got to 6th page on my SW. Can't stand that stupid <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> of broken cc and daze any more.

GWFs, not usually a problem but intimidation sometimes hit so badly that I don't even know, had 22k deflected strike from daring shout today on me while fighting a GWF, got him to 50% and then POOOOF multiple procs from Ferocious Reaction. Roll a GWF when one broken thing is not enough.

GF, not usually having a problem unless one is skilled or using ferocious reaction.

CWs ooooh these guys, do they ever get nerfed? The mediocre CW won't be any problem but there are some CWs that are just so monstrously tanky and moreover hit for like 30k damage with just icy rays. How is that...how is that even fair? Don't even get me started on cast time. Typical situation, good CW sees me, we both hit at the same time, he entaggles me, I used daily on him > he dodges. Yeap, just like that, I eat his burst and he/she just controls and dodges everything.

HR Trappers are annoying, do they have anything but root/daze/stealth? Not to mention they can attack from stealth ohhh yeah. Not usually experiencing any troubles with HRs but with this type of HRs.
DC Another monstricity. Tank cleric Gift of faith, does it proc like thrice in a minute? How are we supposed to kill that thing without good CW? What if that DC got some other overbuffed monstricity that can kill you before you even try to do anything? I fail to realize how is DC not overpowered now, even a tanky one. Before the buffs tanky DC was challenging, not it's just mindless spamm.
As for DPS DCs, I haven't seen any yet. I did see some Scourge Clerics though.

TR A wondrous TR onehit/permadaze wonderland. And yeah, in fact permastealth still does exist. The best shocking execution I had on myself is 60k+ from exe spec. Permadaze rogues aren't as annoying, I can even manage to kill an equally geared...once. And if one has got no 1-2 bloodbaths up But once they figured my rotation I am so flipping dead and just a cereal on a plate despite some broken reflecting build I have now. And even if I outplay one of them all they do is just: Daze rogue - "PULL A GRAND TURISMO ON THAT SW! SW can't catch me because I run as fast as SW shadowslips with class feature", Executioners - "Lashing blades > ITC > some hits > Shadow stike > stealth > run away > come back > repeat till CW dies from SD and piercing damage. Or just Shocking execution/bloodbath one...just in case"

I am not running around with pve builds in pvp, my fury/soulbinder warlock has 46k in domination and 52k in open pvp and capable of doing some miracles but comparing to equally geared/skilled (or not so ha) players of the other classes...I am just done, in most scenarios.

Yahhh its not very fair for now, but that's just the way it is ^^

unfortunately, as more and more people get up to those upper limits of Gear Score, getting harder and harder for me to hang out in IWD. Dom is still cool since I win and lose fairly the same amount (solo queue, not much to do about that) so im not usually stuck in low paged for long haha - but i can tell very easily, that since the stat wipes been muuuuuch muuuuuch harder to do what i do.

vasdamas

animalust wrote: »

Yahhh its not very fair for now, but that's just the way it is ^^

Yes, it's very true and yet noone got a courage to come out of this subforum and get bashed by swarm of stupid arguments like "shadow slip is a friggin cheat, you can shift half of the map" or "OMG HARROW STORM LEAVE ME PRONE SW OP HOW CAN YOU ARGUE!"
Honestly we should really get out of the nine hells and go to those main sections and start QQing (yeah, I mean that) the same way CWs once did to nerf rogues and get the buffs they currently have. Because @%@% it, I am so tired of this. And if you ask me, the problem is not just shadow slip, lack of cc immunity/resistance and VERY SLOW (a person can revive an ally while I cast harrow and try curse one LOL) cast animation but also our class mechanics. I mean, take away our TT and MC set and what is left? hahah. Before I spec'd for pvp I tried Accursed Souls on a rogue in IWD, do you know how much damage it did? 2k! 70% of our skills literally got very near to no use.

animalust

just not in my nature, they will fix it or they wont, bottm line, il still have fun.

and If I really cant enjoy PVP anymroe in this game, well... Warhammer Online is available for free and the open PvP is always kicking

vasdamas

animalust wrote: »

just not in my nature, they will fix it or they wont, bottm line, il still have fun.

and If I really cant enjoy PVP anymroe in this game, well... Warhammer Online is available for free and the open PvP is always kicking

Exactly...........

caexar

Here's the thing about "going public" with demands for improvements for us. Several reasonable suggestions have been made already and I feel should be implemented with little to no effect in over powering the class. I'm perfectly OK with a casting time improvement, shadow slip response improvement and fixing BoVA. These are all reasonable and are needed I'm my opinion. Soul sparks draining instead of vanishing is another issue but I can see how it could be viewed as borderline OP

But you will eventually attract the other types. The ones who advocate shadow slip granting dodges or even stealth or changing powers effects completely even though most of them are fine. Or exceptions like life steal not suffering from healing depression for warlocks only. I see some of these suggestions and think I would be absolutely unkillable if they were implemented. These are the suggestions which cloud and tarnish reasonable ones. My fear is if you go too public with too many demands then you will get ridiculed to oblivion. Besides isn't there an advocate for just this thing?

animalust

caexar wrote: »

Here's the thing about "going public" with demands for improvements for us. Several reasonable suggestions have been made already and I feel should be implemented with little to no effect in over powering the class. I'm perfectly OK with a casting time improvement, shadow slip response improvement and fixing BoVA. These are all reasonable and are needed I'm my opinion. Soul sparks draining instead of vanishing is another issue but I can see how it could be viewed as borderline OP

But you will eventually attract the other types. The ones who advocate shadow slip granting dodges or even stealth or changing powers effects completely even though most of them are fine. Or exceptions like life steal not suffering from healing depression for warlocks only. I see some of these suggestions and think I would be absolutely unkillable if they were implemented. These are the suggestions which cloud and tarnish reasonable ones. My fear is if you go too public with too many demands then you will get ridiculed to oblivion. Besides isn't there an advocate for just this thing?

pretty sure the advocate quit.


The only complaint I have in the game is TR, Dazing Strike being nearly instant is super OP, and Shocking Execution seems to have some serious frikkin range to it lol

vasdamas

caexar wrote: »

Here's the thing about "going public" with demands for improvements for us. Several reasonable suggestions have been made already and I feel should be implemented with little to no effect in over powering the class. I'm perfectly OK with a casting time improvement, shadow slip response improvement and fixing BoVA. These are all reasonable and are needed I'm my opinion. Soul sparks draining instead of vanishing is another issue but I can see how it could be viewed as borderline OP

But you will eventually attract the other types. The ones who advocate shadow slip granting dodges or even stealth or changing powers effects completely even though most of them are fine. Or exceptions like life steal not suffering from healing depression for warlocks only. I see some of these suggestions and think I would be absolutely unkillable if they were implemented. These are the suggestions which cloud and tarnish reasonable ones. My fear is if you go too public with too many demands then you will get ridiculed to oblivion. Besides isn't there an advocate for just this thing?

You're probably right and that's what we see now happening to both rogues and clerics but still something needs to be done, everyone agrees SW is an underdog of PvP. People curse at SWs when they see them in their parties blaming them and calling a "****" class.

"Advocates"? I believe our already gave up and the others got depressed too from what I heard. One thing I learned from in this game and the forums, if something gets too much complaints - it gets nerfed or buffed (most of the times overbuffed). I was playing a rogue, mostly PvE because I felt like PvP is just too toxic for me but I did roll a permastealth build once and even managed to sneak on 1st page twice with my broken unchallenging build. Later respec'd for battle rogue, hoping they buff rogues for PvE so people stop saying things like "pet" or "useless class" when some friend CW or GWF takes me with them to CN or somewhere else. People used to instakick rogues just because they are rogues, nevermind they had the best enchantments/perfects, they just didn't want them in their parties. All I wanted is a few buffs/reworks for my TR's feats and they came out with that MONSTER following by desires of all those cries on the forums. At first I thought our dps would come with a price of permastealth but I was wrong, even know rogues can stay most of the time in stealth and run like a horse. Once people start asking for improvements they will listen.

hadestemplar

vasdamas wrote: »

Well warlock in start where destined to be range dps spellcaster. Thats how developer present it. Actually I would be Ok if current warlock lack of CC, but hell, dps scale is <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. I mean, CW now x2 outdps me, I seen how CW with ~3k power CW melt group of monsters x2 no x3 times faster than me with 5,7k power. I dont even speak about crit. The matter is that CW have class feature skills with does a lot of dps. Drop icy terrain and storm pillar and dps rain from sky, and in same time you can use CC skills.

Well you know, some players create warlock, look to skill power and say, OMG uber dps skill. But they do not look to warlock as class with all his good and bad sides.. Thats why no matter if you write in main discussion, thread get spam that warlocks are good enough..

Btw I wrote in one of threads my ideas for warlock class..

animalust

i felt bad for TR's for a long time, since i wasnt a perma build, my tr was only useful for tanking bosses, which I could do pretty easily and just spamm duelist flurry.

I too used to kick perma TR's though, cus honestly they didnt do a **** thing in a dungeon lol

as long as you use your TT intelligently you can keep up with CW dps. and I do so pretty well even though im hybrid tank

overdriver13

caexar wrote: »

Here's the thing about "going public" with demands for improvements for us. Several reasonable suggestions have been made already and I feel should be implemented with little to no effect in over powering the class. I'm perfectly OK with a casting time improvement, shadow slip response improvement and fixing BoVA. These are all reasonable and are needed I'm my opinion. Soul sparks draining instead of vanishing is another issue but I can see how it could be viewed as borderline OP

But you will eventually attract the other types. The ones who advocate shadow slip granting dodges or even stealth or changing powers effects completely even though most of them are fine. Or exceptions like life steal not suffering from healing depression for warlocks only. I see some of these suggestions and think I would be absolutely unkillable if they were implemented. These are the suggestions which cloud and tarnish reasonable ones. My fear is if you go too public with too many demands then you will get ridiculed to oblivion. Besides isn't there an advocate for just this thing?

I would like to know how shadow slip granting stealth (while stepping) would be op. I think it would be incredibly cool. My favorite two classes to play are sw and tr. Would love to see this class get much much faster casting times, shadow slip should be a dodge with true immunity frames, and would also love to see some deflection feats piled on. As it is now, the class is pure glass cannon.

Unknown

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animalust

macjae wrote: »

Shadow slip granting stealth would require a rework of Eldritch Momentum, presently one of the more useful SW feats around.

I do not think ShadowSlip shoudl change liek that..

I would be Unhappy with a Dodge ability

Stealth while Shadow SLip makes a small amount of sense but it stil a bad idea especially due to the nearly Infinite run builds.


WHat I think make sense = Both TR's and SW's should be simply allowed to see any and all stealthers at a greater distance than the other classes. TR's should be allowed to be Unseen when using Lurkers Assault daily.


Shadow Slip should otherwise stay the same, but the DR while running needs to be fixed and increased.

caexar

animalust wrote: »

Stealth while Shadow SLip makes a small amount of sense but it stil a bad idea especially due to the nearly Infinite run builds.

This. You hit me with a DoT and I enter shadow slip and can basically just run around undetectable with GF guarding like defense while my stealth and stamina refill thanks to enemey DoT's. I don't think those advocating this have thought things through. This would be god mode at the touch of a button plain and simple. Stealth on slip is a horrible idea.

schietindebux

but at least i think the warlock need any kind of damage mitigation...
shadow slip is too weak
when i go infight with my warlock, stats like a tank, there is no machannism i can withstand these amounts of peircing, DR ignoring damage
i hover around to not get cc´d and by this time get ripped in two halfes
CW is immune by slipping + shield
TR - no word about it,
GF has his shield,
Hunter - invisible and abnormal selfhealing buffs
DC immune, selfhealing, immortal AS etc
GWF- hard to play i think in these days, but even they can break cc and have their unstoppable (think this class need some rework too, but i am no prof player
Warlock... shadow slip , witch last short time and only prevents u from cc, DR 30% - don´t feel it in PVP, sure u can buff it but have to sacrifice too much imo

seeing these TR who can run from one side to the other with 4-5 rolls - redicules - even if u get them near death, they are gone in a second, no need to even think about following them

caexar

I think shadow slip just needs its reaction timing fixed to be more responsive. Maybe a slight DR and Deflect increase but mainly just fix its responsiveness