test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Upcoming TR Changes
group5e
Member Posts: 294 Arc User
While I agree that there needs to be certain aspects of the TR looked at, the stealth changes will negate the TR's ability to fight multiple attackers.
Also, if you are going to implement this change please consider removing the ability for classes to hard targeting us as this because as it stands now... if you aren't a master infiltrator with impossible to catch... well... you are dead. I would consider this exploitive and should have been removed in Mod 2.
Another option I've heard is to remove the hard targeting option once the target is a certain distance away. I would be ok with this too.
With all this said, the Whisperknife TR in pvp may be dead after this change.
Also, if you are going to implement this change please consider removing the ability for classes to hard targeting us as this because as it stands now... if you aren't a master infiltrator with impossible to catch... well... you are dead. I would consider this exploitive and should have been removed in Mod 2.
Another option I've heard is to remove the hard targeting option once the target is a certain distance away. I would be ok with this too.
With all this said, the Whisperknife TR in pvp may be dead after this change.
Post edited by Unknown User on
0
Comments
I guess it is ok for DC's to heal to full and require several people to kill right?
Yes, because they are unkillable due to superior stats/buffs/gear, not due to inability to fight back.
I agree its a poor way to judge balance, however its the game we are currently playing. DC's are similar as well... it takes multiple people to kill them. I wish we didn't have to judge balance this way as well. Some classes unfortunately have been designed this way.
So just to be clear though... IF this goes live...
There will be only one viable path to play as TR in pvp and do well against strong opponents. This is a HUGE FAILURE in the big TR revamp of mod 5. Maybe a solution would be to give whisperknives access to a similar power like impossible to catch. This would at least give us the ability of getting away while we are visible. As it stands now we really only have Vengeance Pursuit or Lurkers Assault to do this and both aren't very ideal.
Just make sure to test it thoroughly when preview is provided. Remember the amount of doom&gloom drama queens when the "stealth depletion on at-wills" was first announced? The doomsayers and naysayers that used to preach the whole TR changes weren't a buff, but a nerf, and its gonna kill every TR, blah blah blah...? Where are they now? Busy enjoying the changes, I'm sure.
Besides, even with the new changes, the whiners and QQrs are still gonna be creamed since most of the whines and QQs are from L2P issues, not balance issues. So nothing really changes. LoL, those turds think they can win after permastealth is removed? Let them dream on. Most of them aren't even killed by real permas in the field anyway.
Just let's makes sure to point out the incessant whines and complaints that will come AFTER the changes, since I'm 100% sure these whiners are gonna keep on going, "TR still OP! remove X next time...! then remove Y next time...!" and on and on and on
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Obviously the complaints against DCs are against Faithfuls, in which case they have a tendency to neuter not only TRs, but virtually everything else, as the amount of people, DPS, and coordination/effort required to kill two of those standing at a node is intense, even when those two DCs aren't very much coordinated themselves.
But of course, that's subject to debate in another thread, another day.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
TR's on the other hand can be countered in there current state just fine. CW's can pull em out of stealth they have the tools to do it. Happens all the time. DC can get lucky and hit a TR as well from time to time depending on the load out the DC is using. Matter of fact a good DC and CW sent to a node a TR is holding is a very viable tactic.
Two people. Two people for one TR people say is insane. Well what about 4 or 5 it takes to kill one DC? A well geared DC can hold a node against an entire pug team (I have done it many times). Just running around healing LOLING.
So to recap. What is broken? Two people to handle one TR or a whole team to take out and FAIL to take out one DC?
Leave TR's alone
/thread
It's time to make those who cried cry harder.
It's time to show those who assumed we won due to exploits see our true skill.
Stealth reveal does not mean we are toast..
The reveal only works on certain attacks.
Know what these attacks are before the changes go live.
Know that we have two very viable options still.
One shot....
Perma daze..
Let our enemies look into our eyes as they fall before us.
Haha, yes, this.
A DC + a naked lvl 5 is enough to counter me on a point. That ****er never dies unless you abandon permastealth for a while. In which case you'd have to coordinate your Dazes, yes, all 3 of them, and hope for a lucky string of DF crits. Then you might get them if you pop a Daily before they heal up to full.
Like I said in various other threads, DC's are more broken than TRs now but people whine about TR more. It's easy to see why the second-choice pick got the nerf-bat first.
Go Cryptic!
PS - I quit.
If what you say is right then simple more nerf gonna come as dev saying this was not fixed yet that's is double edge sword
TR damage being nerf you know? Get a grip more to come
Nope.
It simply means whiners are whiners, and they'll be whining until everything and anything that beats them are destroyed. They don't know what 'balance' means. They simply think its another way of saying "something that makes me win".
But everyone knows whiners never win. They just whine. Why else would they hang out in a class forum they don't play, and whine about stuff without even knowing how the class works? (...much less expect to defeat a class without knowing how they work in the first place... the gall... *feh*)
Their excuse is that being invisible is impossible to fight back. OK, so now the developers make us TRs visible. They'll be able to fight back.
...and if they still lose?
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Exactly this.
This is why TRs were in a pretty pitiful state before Mod 5.
People whined about Lashing Blade before. They whined about Shoxecution. They whined about Stealth. What we got left with was an invisible squishy excuse for a DPS. This is why most Pugs and most premades were always wary to recruit a TR to the group. This is why TR was a scarcely played class. It wasn't until TR was nerfed into the ground that all the whining stopped. Then it, barely, focused towards CW.
People won't be happy until they nerf TR into the ground, yet again.
EDIT: Just to add to this, blanket nerfs to TR almost always hit WK the hardest. To put this into perspective, WK was always the second-best choice since it came out. Each and every nerf to TR is almost always directed towards MI. MI related nerfs hit WK the hardest. 2-second reveal on attack? Good thing I have ITC.
Oh wait, I'm a WK with no such skill. Not even a comparable skill. Glad to know the nerf directed towards MI hits WK twice as hard. Thanks for your consideration.
To put this into even more perspective, and as much as I hate to say it, the people who have played WK since its inception and devoted a lot of effort into it, such as kweassa, will continue to play a relevant role in PvP. Whether it's single target assassination or node camping, we'll still have a purpose that you'll continue to whine about.
Can't count the amount of times I've had people whine about my "immortality" on a point in Mod 3/4.
Go Cryptic!
PS - I quit.
why many feedback about GWF in mod 3? because GWF become OP
why many feedback about HR in mod 4? because HR become OP
why many feedback about TR in mod 5? because TR???
in Prev server TR still OP big time so there will be come next nerf maybe daze,roll,75% deflc sev who knows?
i think i don't need to do debate because you not give fact about why TR is not OP just talk about whiners or L2P that is useless
you can hate every one who give feedback all you want.. because personaly i don't care
i already give my feedback and i think dev response is good to nerf TR and the more important is not wait until next mod and i thankfully for that
it's also a fact that it was in that sorry state because of the many people complaining to nerf them, module after module.
now we finally get good DPS in PVE, and people are already complaining again, also a fact.
what will happen now? TRs will probably continue being nerfed again and again till we're once again useless in PVE once again.
It's really not perspective when you have TRs who are providing feedback that's relevant and non-TRs who are just complaining.
There are TRs who identify the problem - the damage, and provide feedback for toning it down while still preserving the point and utility of the class.
Then you have people complaining about everything and wanting nerfs on every aspect of the class because they're getting wrecked by 9k TRs in Domination who 1-shot their 0 defense 20k HP builds.
Go Cryptic!
PS - I quit.
Read prev dev tracker Dev want the damage the way it's work now so Dev nerf stealth instead
with this reveal combat advan and 100% crit is fine
but long roll or 75% deflc sev still need to be nerf
WK is back to its old glory useless PARAgon.
You're a person who argued certain aspects of the TR need to be nerfed -- since then through the course of discussion it was revealed such a thing was simply a figment of your own imagination and didn't even exist, BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T KNOW HOW EVEN THE MOST BASIC OF TR MECHANICS WORKED. A normal person with even the slightest concept of decency and shame would be too embarassed to even show up here.
You're in no position to offer any perspective. You've proven with your own mistakes that your 'perspectives' are warped, twisted by your lack of knowledge. So GTFO of the TR forums when you're not even a TR, nor would you offer constructive criticism. You simply show up to mock and goad.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
daaammmnn buuurrrnnn!!!
Many TR's have been using stealth as a crutch for so long, including many "leet" posters in this very thread, some from "top" PvP guilds, it will be funny yet sad to see them running for their lives.
I imagine the fallout from this will be a plethora of Scoundrel and one shot TR's flooding PvP until the inevitable stun nerf occurs and further "balance" changes happen.
I will say this is a boost for the GF and GWF in PvP as they are now somewhat the natural predators of the TR
Gloom level 60 Control Wizard
Dusk level 60 Trickster Rogue
Dawn level 60 Devoted Cleric
Eclipse level 60 Hunter Ranger
Wrath level 60 Great Weapon Fighter
Jinx level 60 Scourge Warlock
-the damage
-the cc
-the mobility
-the stealth
so basically they're complaining about EVERYTHING that the TR has. before mod 5 we were in a horrible place, lots of people had a lot of trouble to get into dungeons, and I fear that if those who keep complaining get what they want, we'll be in that very same place once again.
I remember when playing in Icewind dale in mod 3-4, each mob group was hard to do for me, I had to plan my strategy and a simple mistake could mean death. Then I would see another class like a GWF or a HR just zerg to a mob group and anihilate them in less than 10 secs with almost no health lost. I really felt like things weren't fair back then.
Gloom level 60 Control Wizard
Dusk level 60 Trickster Rogue
Dawn level 60 Devoted Cleric
Eclipse level 60 Hunter Ranger
Wrath level 60 Great Weapon Fighter
Jinx level 60 Scourge Warlock
A bit too much? That is amusing. I have CW and i know it's way better in pve than TR even now. And for these past few days i'm saboteur to test some thing but it's temporary. Still it doesn't change the fact that CW is way better in pve, crushes armies of mobs noticeably faster-same goes with bosses. TR is better than before but it's still inferior to CW in pve. Anyway after taking away stealth from TR it is inferior to CW as well. You just have to wait a little bit until more CW who hide as new ,,op'' classes will go play their CW once more. Control all time, freeze, stun and attack all time, we will see to it.
Asha-DC(Faithful-Anointed Champion)
Vilgefortz-CW(Thaumaturge-balance)
This forum 100% reflects what i m saying. They are an army, you will never be able to nerf them by just spamming posts about the problem.
For clarity, I would consider the CW to be way beyond 'a bit much' in PvE. Like WAY beyond.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder