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Draconic set or Artifact Weapon for CW and SW.

mconosrepmconosrep Member Posts: 0 Arc User
edited October 2014 in PvE Discussion
I was lucky enough to get the artifact weapon on my first try for my GWF.

However I was wondering what people thoughts were about grinding the Draconic Main-hand / Off-hand set rather than the Artifact Weapon for CW and SW, assuming I can ever find the time to grind the dailies for them? From what I can tell the Draconic MH/OH set is as good as a blue artifact weapon damage wise and the stats boost for a complete set makes it superior to an artifact weapon at anything less than purple.

So is the Draconic set easy to get and the extra (potential) of the artifact weapon at purple or beyond simply not needed?
Post edited by mconosrep on

Comments

  • aulduronaulduron Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,351 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    Once it's purple, the damage is much better than Draconic. Yeah, you'll lose the HP the 2/2 gives you, but damage is the only stat that counts on a MH. The artis also have an extra enchant slot.
  • kieranmtornkieranmtorn Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 382 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    Use the Draconic while you work on enchanting the Artifact weapon. I used that approach with my artifact, I had Formorian, and used that till I got the artifact to purple. Now I'm using the BI off-hand & the Artifact.
  • diogene0diogene0 Member Posts: 2,894 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    If you can't make it orange, go for the set. Artifact weapons are useless until it's orange.
  • pointsmanpointsman Member Posts: 2,327 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    diogene0 wrote: »
    If you can't make it orange, go for the set. Artifact weapons are useless until it's orange.

    They're not "useless". Purple artifact weapons have higher weapon damage than any other non-artifact weapon.
  • colonelwingcolonelwing Member Posts: 1,448 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    pointsman wrote: »
    They're not "useless". Purple artifact weapons have higher weapon damage than any other non-artifact weapon.

    Don't bother, this kid is pretty much clueless, but apparently likes seing himself type on forum threads.

  • diogene0diogene0 Member Posts: 2,894 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    pointsman wrote: »
    They're not "useless". Purple artifact weapons have higher weapon damage than any other non-artifact weapon.

    And damage doesn't make a difference when you lose the set bonus, which may be power for SWs. You're losing stats/power if it's not orange, that's a fact.
  • pointsmanpointsman Member Posts: 2,327 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    For CW:
    Fomorian Fabled Orb (previously BiS):
    686-838 Weapon Dmg, 1727 Power, 289 Recovery, 133 Deflection, 133 Regeneration
    Set bonus with Talisman, +450 Recovery

    Chilling Eye of the Golden Dragon (at Lvl 35):
    701-857 Weapon Dmg, 1796 Power, 335 Critical Strike, 335 Recovery
    No set bonus with Talisman

    So on going from Fomorian Fabled to Epic Chilling Eye, you lose useless 133 Deflection, mostly useless 133 Regeneration, and 289+450-335 = 404 Recovery, which most CW's are overstacked on anyway. You gain +69 Power, +335 Critical Strike (which is useful especially for MoFs), and, most importantly, about 2.2% higher weapon damage. It is not "useless" at all.

    If you go with the Arcane Eye instead, you substitute 335 Armor Pen for 335 Recovery. Which for some builds might be an even better tradeoff.

    You can also partially compensate for the loss of the stats from the set bonus by using a T3 Talisman, either Corrupt/Purified BI or the Draconic Talisman, instead of being locked into the Fomorian Fabled Talisman (which has more useless Deflect).

    Yes a CW's GS will go down by losing the set bonus. But if the only reason to avoid the artifact weapon is due to a loss of GS, then that's an idiotic move.

    For SW's I don't know. But the OP asked about both CW's and SW's.
  • rashylewizzrashylewizz Member Posts: 4,265 Bounty Hunter
    edited September 2014
    Go for the artifact weapon for your CW (ray of frost one for pvp, chilling cloud for pve).

    Remember that they will be releasing artifact armor and accessories in the future.

    If you don't have the funds, then stick with the draconic set for now or even a fomorian.
  • chrcorechrcore Member Posts: 329 Bounty Hunter
    edited September 2014
    Go for the artifact weapon for your CW (ray of frost one for pvp, chilling cloud for pve).

    Remember that they will be releasing artifact armor and accessories in the future.

    If you don't have the funds, then stick with the draconic set for now or even a fomorian.

    The artifact armor will have to have some really good effects to make it better than HV or Accursed (and I don't see that happening).
  • iambecks1iambecks1 Member Posts: 4,044 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    chrcore wrote: »
    The artifact armor will have to have some really good effects to make it better than HV or Accursed (and I don't see that happening).

    Maybe they add overload slots to all pieces of artifact armor sets XD four glyphs FTW! XD

    Seriously though I'd imagine that they will keep the two overload slots and some underwhelming set bonus for encounter powers or dailies maybe? xD
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  • ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    diogene0 wrote: »
    And damage doesn't make a difference when you lose the set bonus, which may be power for SWs. You're losing stats/power if it's not orange, that's a fact.

    Weapon damage is far and away the biggest driver of your overall damage. There's no way you can be losing enough stats to make up for the difference in damage between a purple artifact weapon and another weapon.
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • diogene0diogene0 Member Posts: 2,894 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    pointsman wrote: »
    For CW:
    Fomorian Fabled Orb (previously BiS):
    686-838 Weapon Dmg, 1727 Power, 289 Recovery, 133 Deflection, 133 Regeneration
    Set bonus with Talisman, +450 Recovery

    Chilling Eye of the Golden Dragon (at Lvl 35):
    701-857 Weapon Dmg, 1796 Power, 335 Critical Strike, 335 Recovery
    No set bonus with Talisman

    So on going from Fomorian Fabled to Epic Chilling Eye, you lose useless 133 Deflection, mostly useless 133 Regeneration, and 289+450-335 = 404 Recovery, which most CW's are overstacked on anyway. You gain +69 Power, +335 Critical Strike (which is useful especially for MoFs), and, most importantly, about 2.2% higher weapon damage. It is not "useless" at all.

    If you go with the Arcane Eye instead, you substitute 335 Armor Pen for 335 Recovery. Which for some builds might be an even better tradeoff.

    You can also partially compensate for the loss of the stats from the set bonus by using a T3 Talisman, either Corrupt/Purified BI or the Draconic Talisman, instead of being locked into the Fomorian Fabled Talisman (which has more useless Deflect).

    Yes a CW's GS will go down by losing the set bonus. But if the only reason to avoid the artifact weapon is due to a loss of GS, then that's an idiotic move.

    For SW's I don't know. But the OP asked about both CW's and SW's.

    Okay more crit. Good. I'm way over the cap. If you aren't capped in crit there are more important upgrades than a 6M AD expense for a weapon artifact.

    HPs and deflection aren't "useless". I'd rather use the dread legion weaponry because lifesteal is better but that's just a matter of preference. Keep in mind that we're talking about a very small damage improvement costing several millions ADs. At level 35 it's barely equivalent to a weapon set.

    So yes i agree, artifact weapons are a nice improvement, at max level. Considering the extra chill effect is quite underwhelming on the pve artifact it's not even a good reason to get it. The design intent is clear, unlike belts, it's go orange or go home.
  • aulduronaulduron Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,351 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    On a CW, Deflect is pretty useless.
  • kolatmasterkolatmaster Member Posts: 3,111 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    ironzerg79 wrote: »
    Weapon damage is far and away the biggest driver of your overall damage. There's no way you can be losing enough stats to make up for the difference in damage between a purple artifact weapon and another weapon.
    !00% correct. :cool:
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  • magiquepursemagiquepurse Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    !00% correct. :cool:

    That's true; Weapon Damage makes a big difference.
  • kozi001kozi001 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 876 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    diogene0 wrote: »
    Okay more crit. Good. I'm way over the cap. If you aren't capped in crit there are more important upgrades than a 6M AD expense for a weapon artifact.

    HPs and deflection aren't "useless". I'd rather use the dread legion weaponry because lifesteal is better but that's just a matter of preference. Keep in mind that we're talking about a very small damage improvement costing several millions ADs. At level 35 it's barely equivalent to a weapon set.

    So yes i agree, artifact weapons are a nice improvement, at max level. Considering the extra chill effect is quite underwhelming on the pve artifact it's not even a good reason to get it. The design intent is clear, unlike belts, it's go orange or go home.

    Weapon dmg is pretty important on a CW. While I didn't properly tested but higher weapon dmg is giving more punch to CWs dots. And that +450 recovery loss isn't that big deal if we have plenty already.
  • mconosrepmconosrep Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    kozi001 wrote: »
    Weapon dmg is pretty important on a CW. While I didn't properly tested but higher weapon dmg is giving more punch to CWs dots. And that +450 recovery loss isn't that big deal if we have plenty already.

    Am I correct in assuming that at decent GS since we can assume everyone is soft-capped we can consider all stats as their power equivalent.

    So 1800 HP ~ 450 stats (say Power) ~ 2.7% damage increase?
  • frishterfrishter Member Posts: 3,522 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Lets not forget the set bonus is better much better than a stat bonus. Sure you can cry over the loss of epeen and if you want to artificially gimp your toon for that reason go ahead. The rest of us can actually improve our characters to be better rather than caring about a few stats.
  • wixxgs1chtwixxgs1cht Member Posts: 430 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Especially for SS/Thaum there's no stat that can make up for Weapon Damage [WD]. Reason being that a large part of our damage comes from WD-based procs. Furthermore, you'll be hitting the soft cap on recovery anyways so I see no point in holding on to sub-par weapons for a mere 450 increase in recovery. I'm currently running the MM Arti mainhand in combination with the draconic offhand and love the stats they grant.
  • mconosrepmconosrep Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    frishter wrote: »
    Lets not forget the set bonus is better much better than a stat bonus. Sure you can cry over the loss of epeen and if you want to artificially gimp your toon for that reason go ahead. The rest of us can actually improve our characters to be better rather than caring about a few stats.

    Is it that simple though?

    If the additional bonus are ~450 stats then IF we can reconfigure to move that to power then that is ~2.7% damage increase.
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