Cryptic: Stop the Nerfing Madness, Please

myowmyow

I have only been active on the forum for a short time, but I keep seeing a lot of frustration about nerfing different classes all in the name of "balance." The nerfing is doing nothing more than making people angry who spent time developing a specific class that later gets nerfed.

If you want to attempt more balance between classes, stop nerfing classes and simply add a bit more power to other classes to achieve the perceived "balance." This way, no one feels frustrated and slighted by the changes - only positive effects occur.

If this makes pve too easy, beef up the creatures a little to compensate for the power increases.

This seems simple enough to me, and a lot less bad feelings, which might end up driving some away from the game . . .

cookiecrisp15

the main problem is that ppls that barely know their own game are trying to balance it,every freaking mod they change my class completly, its impossible to build a character in NW and just simply enjoy it.

akemnos

I laugh at these threads because everyone is basically complaining about the changes to CW and GWF. I dont have any experience playing a GWF but CW's are overpowered. I just got my CW to level 60 and no matter what group I run into unless it contains a boss mob, I dont have to use more than 2 encounter powers. Most of the time I only need one. It doesn't matter which of my 4 I use they will all kill an entire minion squad with one power.

Chill touch (mastery)
Shard
Steal time
Sudden Storm

This is with a guy who has ranodm rank 5's in all his slots and 2 purples. his gear score is only like 8k. There is a problem where 90% of the time I can walk up to a group of enemies and 1 shot them with very little difficulty. PVE with a CW is an absolute joke and there damage definately needed to be lowered.

ripyourlipsoff

myowmyow wrote: »

I have only been active on the forum for a short time, but I keep seeing a lot of frustration about nerfing different classes all in the name of "balance." The nerfing is doing nothing more than making people angry who spent time developing a specific class that later gets nerfed.

If you want to attempt more balance between classes, stop nerfing classes and simply add a bit more power to other classes to achieve the perceived "balance." This way, no one feels frustrated and slighted by the changes - only positive effects occur.

If this makes pve too easy, beef up the creatures a little to compensate for the power increases.

This seems simple enough to me, and a lot less bad feelings, which might end up driving some away from the game . . .

Can you be more specific? Some classes are out of control? You cannot expect a game of multiple classes to just have 2-3 super classes and the rest of us are peasants!

query523

akemnos wrote: »

I laugh at these threads because everyone is basically complaining about the changes to CW and GWF. I dont have any experience playing a GWF but CW's are overpowered. I just got my CW to level 60 and no matter what group I run into unless it contains a boss mob, I dont have to use more than 2 encounter powers. Most of the time I only need one. It doesn't matter which of my 4 I use they will all kill an entire minion squad with one power.

Chill touch (mastery)
Shard
Steal time
Sudden Storm

This is with a guy who has ranodm rank 5's in all his slots and 2 purples. his gear score is only like 8k. There is a problem where 90% of the time I can walk up to a group of enemies and 1 shot them with very little difficulty. PVE with a CW is an absolute joke and there damage definately needed to be lowered.

Had the exact same experience when I built my GWF. Hold down left-click, cycle encounters, dungeon over. So when they say, "just buff everything else!" I'm thinking all that would accomplish would be to make all the content boring for everyone.

sangrine

Chill strike (mastery) + steal time + shard + sudden storm

My 15.8k CW can solo most (not all) heroic encounters in icewind dale WITHOUT ANY BLACK ICE GEAR.
Before fighting the shamans, I buff up and put shield on tab.
Watch the shamans and immediately dodge as soon as their attack animation begins.

My HR and DC have no chance to defeat a mob of shamans (while solo and with no black ice gear).

After the nerf, my guess is my CW will still be able to solo heroic encounters except that more time will be needed to defeat mobs.

sangrine

myowmyow wrote: »

If this makes pve too easy, beef up the creatures a little to compensate for the power increases.

What practical difference is there between buffing all the enemy monsters and nerfing a few player classes?
Give more hitpoints to mob or reduce player damage. In terms of gameplay, what difference is there?

Seems to me, it's easier to nerf a few players player classes than buff all the other classes and buff tens or hundreds of monsters.

emilemo

magenubbie wrote: »

This is basically what any decent DM would do. Unfortunately, it's not that easy.

DMs don't have to take PvP crybabies into account:
"TR is OP! It can 1 shot me!!!" Duh..TRs are master in 1o1. Until they get nerfed. Now they are nothing more than an unwanted companion with awesome gameplay. In PvP they are only good for node contesting. Killing is not an option for them unless they fight newbies.

While in some cases -like the current GWF, probably the future HR and to some extend the CW- people have a point and they are too strong in general, most nerfing is done because of PvP. Kinda stupid since it's already a 3 class game, and will be for quite some time unless the Warlock turns out to be beastly good. If so it will get nerfed thanks to the same crybabies. But that's another story.

In PvE nobody minds more damage or more control. In PvE you have only 1 problem: Kill everything that moves. And every class is good at that, or good at supporting the killers. People who don't want TRs with them choose so because 5x AoE works better than 4x AoE and 1 single target class. It makes things slower than the minimum time required to finish the dungeon, but by no means is it impossible with a TR around. Which is a silly notion to judge people by, as the game is meant to be played, not raced through. Unfortunately to a lot of people this game means life or death. 5 minutes wasted is a crime to some people. I, for one, choose not to bother with these people.

In short, the PvE balance isn't that bad. No-lifers who threaten to kick people if they can't do a run within 15 minutes is what's ruining this game. Imagine, people playing the game normally are forced to hide within their own chat channel to find other people actually playing the game. If that's not a sign there's too many no-lifers around, I don't know what is. Note that those people are perfectly capable of doing any dungeon with any class makeup. They simply don't care if it takes 20 or 40 minutes as long as they had fun running it.

This is why both my toons have seen almost zero dungeons post 60 with the exception of a few guild runs. I want normal runs, I have a 17K toon that doesnt need to cheat or use buggy shortcuts, I want to play a nice dungeon while interacting with my team, even stop to have a chat once in a while while we wait for a guy on a bio/smoke break. Its like everyone post 60 turns into elitist demanding the best results in the shortest time possible. This aint my job, its my game after all

emilemo

query523 wrote: »

Had the exact same experience when I built my GWF. Hold down left-click, cycle encounters, dungeon over. So when they say, "just buff everything else!" I'm thinking all that would accomplish would be to make all the content boring for everyone.

Playing a multiplayer game is mostly about your interactions with other people. People that you enjoy spending some time with in an imaginary world. Its not about beating the high scores and having the most kills or am I alone in this ?

emilemo

sangrine wrote: »

What practical difference is there between buffing all the enemy monsters and nerfing a few player classes?
Give more hitpoints to mob or reduce player damage. In terms of gameplay, what difference is there?

Seems to me, it's easier to nerf a few players player classes than buff all the other classes and buff tens or hundreds of monsters.

A very big difference. Monsters wont come to the forums if you nerf or buff them.. but people do

zacazu

emilemo wrote: »

Playing a multiplayer game is mostly about your interactions with other people. People that you enjoy spending some time with in an imaginary world. Its not about beating the high scores and having the most kills or am I alone in this ?

you are not alone. the difference is: nwo is not ddo (or any generic overrated).


It's like having Batman in the dbz world . or he learns to use ki, or it builds an android to fight for himself. you can not nerf the power level of charaters to make a "batman viable".

cw created a pattern in pve: I like the pattern, and I think it lawful that all classes have the same pattern.

sentinel / rogue created a pattern in pvp ... I do not care, I hope all the pvp players ******, but, that is it.

ps:my mistake; Batman defeat anyone.

rayrdan1

magenubbie wrote: »

This is basically what any decent DM would do. Unfortunately, it's not that easy.

DMs don't have to take PvP crybabies into account:
"TR is OP! It can 1 shot me!!!" Duh..TRs are master in 1o1. Until they get nerfed. Now they are nothing more than an unwanted companion with awesome gameplay. In PvP they are only good for node contesting. Killing is not an option for them unless they fight newbies.

While in some cases -like the current GWF, probably the future HR and to some extend the CW- people have a point and they are too strong in general, most nerfing is done because of PvP. Kinda stupid since it's already a 3 class game, and will be for quite some time unless the Warlock turns out to be beastly good. If so it will get nerfed thanks to the same crybabies. But that's another story.

In PvE nobody minds more damage or more control. In PvE you have only 1 problem: Kill everything that moves. And every class is good at that, or good at supporting the killers. People who don't want TRs with them choose so because 5x AoE works better than 4x AoE and 1 single target class. It makes things slower than the minimum time required to finish the dungeon, but by no means is it impossible with a TR around.
snip

is not about finishing the dungeon as fast as possible or what so ever.
As TR you should be more concerned about your feeling while playing. Before going full pvp i was rank 9 7500 power perfect vorpal and all the other best thing around here...but still...i was feeling awful in the party. Like if i wasnt present there nothing would have changed