people shouldnt talk about stuff they dont know anything about, then stupid threads like this one wouldnt even appear all the time
Ah well
-Desstzo
Because sometimes a skill is so often used by Tr, that i can't different between encounter or daily.
Daily Bloodbath 30' Burst Flash around the battlefield, jumping from target to target. You are untargetable and immune to damage for a few seconds while dealing damage to every nearby enemy.
This is one Daily, that grant immunity. But it's the same as i see? Tr stand in front of me and make in less than 2s more than 6hits. Until the end of that skill he is immun to any control or only to fronlinge surge/bull charge. @furion: It's not only 1 skill that is op in the case. If you have a skill with 1min CD, but a 100% granted killposibilty(immun+controlimmunity don't count for that skill, because it go through it), then the skill is alone Op. But the Tr has so many possibilites, that i stated, which gain him so ridiculous immunities! Dodge, Stealth(targetskills don't can hit), Daily(say what dailies are enable cc-immunity if i don't know the class) and that encounter.
This is one Daily, that grant immunity. But it's the same as i see? Tr stand in front of me and make in less than 2s more than 6hits. Until the end of that skill he is immun to any control or only to fronlinge surge/bull charge
that one is duelists flurry and is an at will with a long charge up time and when you get hit by it then its your own fault
my point still stands: dont talk about stuff you know nothing about...all powers are clearly identifyable (sp?) its just that you didnt put any effort into learning the differances...and that leads to stupid threads like this
Even if itc is used to block cc's, rogues shouldn't be allowed to use it when they ARE cc'd. That's like a cw being able to use repel or shield when a rogue have them dazed or in the purple cloud. Or a dc being able to use sun burst as a gf or gwf knocking them prone(takedown or bull charge) this need to be changed.
Too many times have I entangled(on tab) a rogue that's about to 1 hit one of my teammates and he go up and come back down then two sec's later if I can hit him before he stealth he'll use itc(turn black) and become immune to all cc's. Anybody with any common sense would know this is not what's supposed to happen.:)
Queen of Dragon Server
Goddess Uniique, lvl 60 DC.
PinkSugar, lvl 60 CW.
Baby Cakes, lvl 60 GWF.
*******, lvl 60 TR.
Premium Juicebox, lvl 60 CW.
Pink Exxxtacy, Ranger There is NO pvp in Neverwinter.
Hi, Arc here. My main is an 11.2k CW and all I got to say is op, L2P.
I have 0% problems with this skill in PvP and PvE alike. Why would I say that? because in order for a rouge to use this encounter (That only last 3-5 secs at MAX rank and has a hefty cooldown on top of that) they're going to have to give something up. Weather it be the almighty Lashing blade (The one shot ability), Impact shot (The heavy 3 shotting daggers), or Dazing strike.
If a rouge wants to sacrifice some of his DPS for survival, than by all means let him. It may take a little longer to kill the squirmy *******, but he won't kill me as fast either.
On top of that ItC is an EXTREMELY vital skill in boss fights during DDs. It's the only skill that allows TRs to stay "Nose to Nose" while being out of stealth. If this ability was nerfed than TRs will be 1-2 shot by the boss way more often. Sure the first time you can just pick him up, but not the second time, if he still has rev sickness.
The boss will kill the TR(s) and if there is no DPS left on the boss, and everyone else is occupied with the ads... than it's always just going to be game over. DDs will be left unfinished a much greater time, and in the end everyone loses, because of this nerf.
So, not only am I against any nerfs to this ability, I'm actually very grateful for it.
- Kri-Liaol, Level 60 CW, 11.2k GS, Mindflayer Server
Arc, proud officer of Novus Ordo
New to the game? Check out my build guide to give you an idea on how to set up your characters!
If a rouge wants to sacrifice some of his DPS for survival
Have you noticed ItC rogues do less damage? I did not. They have so extreme DPS on their at-wills and the great LB, they dont really need any other DPS encounters - just look at their skills, all but LB are basicly utility-focused.
It's the only skill that allows TRs to stay "Nose to Nose" while being out of stealth. If this ability was nerfed than TRs will be 1-2 shot by the boss way more often.
And whats exactly wrong with this? Tank should be "nose to nose", not DPSs. And I dont see any reason why should be strongest tank ability in the game given to rogues (especially when it requires 0 skill - press button to be immortal).
And whats exactly wrong with this? Tank should be "nose to nose", not DPSs. And I dont see any reason why should be strongest tank ability in the game given to rogues (especially when it requires 0 skill - press button to be immortal).
ITC is not a tank skill, rogues do not tank they avoid. Tanks take hits, rogues get hit they die. ITC is fine as it is they already nerfed it once.
You want to nerf something? Tell them to give rogues back the old lurkers assault cause the new version is just way to good in pvp. OLD version had potential but could be bumped off. New version has less damage but can not be bumped off, and to top it off teleports you to the poor sob you are going to gank.
ITC is not a tank skill, rogues do not tank they avoid. Tanks take hits, rogues get hit they die. ITC is fine as it is they already nerfed it once.
You want to nerf something? Tell them to give rogues back the old lurkers assault cause the new version is just way to good in pvp. OLD version had potential but could be bumped off. New version has less damage but can not be bumped off, and to top it off teleports you to the poor sob you are going to gank.
And what's the different? Tr able to tank with that. And the CD is high? You should remember, that's real CD is less then 12-15s! You have to subtract the own CD by its duration. THEN you have its CD between using it twice!
Lurker... don't mind it's bad now. The TR have to many skills that enable him CC-immunity and/or damage-immunity. That's the problem. If you have 4 skills with 20s CD but all grant you 3s cc and dd-immunity, then you have only 8s duration in that the Tr can real damaged. But with reduced CD because of skills/feats and/or gear and/or ability score, then you have less then this 8s... You statet it's only ONE with 20s to 3s... not bad. But if you have several skills that enable it, then you have to sum up these and then you have a little op version of immunity.
Or can you say how many skills other class have to enable dd- and/or cc-immunity?
And what's the different? Tr able to tank with that. And the CD is high? You should remember, that's real CD is less then 12-15s! You have to subtract the own CD by its duration. THEN you have its CD between using it twice!
Lurker... don't mind it's bad now. The TR have to many skills that enable him CC-immunity and/or damage-immunity. That's the problem. If you have 4 skills with 20s CD but all grant you 3s cc and dd-immunity, then you have only 8s duration in that the Tr can real damaged. But with reduced CD because of skills/feats and/or gear and/or ability score, then you have less then this 8s... You statet it's only ONE with 20s to 3s... not bad. But if you have several skills that enable it, then you have to sum up these and then you have a little op version of immunity.
Or can you say how many skills other class have to enable dd- and/or cc-immunity?
rogues only have 1 CC-immunity spell, i wonder where you get the other 3 from
Rogues, in any mmo will always find excuses in order for them to have better abilities than other classes. It may be because, all the "New" players choose to play Rogues since ninja are sooooo kewl... oh pewpew... and then they cannot compete with the really good players of other classes, then they start crying until they are the top of the foodchain, regardless of playerskill or equipment. And i think this has to stop, right now.
say no to, skillless - easy mode.
what you describe there fits more the CWs then TRs though
at least when you follow the threads on these boards
rogues only have 1 CC-immunity spell, i wonder where you get the other 3 from
maybe you should inform yourself abit better?
Ah well
-Desstzo
Bloodbath - daily, complete immunity to both damage and CC
ItC - complete immunity to CC and 75 or 100% incoming damage reduction
Shift - complete immunity to damage and CC
thats the three, and oh! there are more skills which could cause similar effects!
Smoke bomb can help you a lot disabling all enemies for long time
Stealth -mobs ignore you, stand still while you re slicing their throat
Bait and Swith gives you another stealth
So do Lurkers Assault
And what's the different? Tr able to tank with that. And the CD is high? You should remember, that's real CD is less then 12-15s! You have to subtract the own CD by its duration. THEN you have its CD between using it twice!
Lurker... don't mind it's bad now. The TR have to many skills that enable him CC-immunity and/or damage-immunity. That's the problem. If you have 4 skills with 20s CD but all grant you 3s cc and dd-immunity, then you have only 8s duration in that the Tr can real damaged. But with reduced CD because of skills/feats and/or gear and/or ability score, then you have less then this 8s... You statet it's only ONE with 20s to 3s... not bad. But if you have several skills that enable it, then you have to sum up these and then you have a little op version of immunity.
Or can you say how many skills other class have to enable dd- and/or cc-immunity?
First off I did not state anything... Other than ITC is fine the way it is, it's a shame it no longer removes dots the old nerf but it's fine.
Second rogues do not have that many immunities. They have ITC, and only if you want to count the daily bloodbath which would be absurd as it's a daily and rogues generate ap so slow it will not be used that often.
Third.. Lurkers may be total trash for PVE now, but in PVP it's more deadly than it was. Why? Because now it teleports to the target and can not be countered by AOE damage or anything else that used to bump it off before it gets used. I for one would rather rogues have the extra damage, and have the ways to counter it back, instead of the current (MR MIYAGI Voice) *IF done right, no can defend*, I win button it is now. (NOTE! My rogue is 12k+ the new LA is stupid OP in PVP!!! Also Note! My control wizard is 12k+ and would rather rogues get the old LA back, because at least the old one had counters to it!! Heck for that matter My DC GWF AND GF hate the new LA also!)
Also before you start thinking I am biased... I play all 5 classes and am not biased at all. I also realize the game was much more balanced then the whiners would make it appear.
Have you noticed ItC rogues do less damage? I did not. They have so extreme DPS on their at-wills and the great LB, they dont really need any other DPS encounters - just look at their skills, all but LB are basicly utility-focused.
Read what I posted closer. I was saying that if he is going to use this "Utility skill" he is going to have one less spot available for a DPS skill. Overall meaning one less encounter slot for DPS. Hence sacrificing any possible DPS ability that could go into this slot for this survival based skill.
And whats exactly wrong with this? Tank should be "nose to nose", not DPSs. And I dont see any reason why should be strongest tank ability in the game given to rogues (especially when it requires 0 skill - press button to be immortal).
1. Wrong, currently GFs have a very big problem with threat, meaning they're hardly going to be tanking anything until this gets fixed. GWFs are more suited fighting multiple non-boss mobs (ad duty) and are in pretty bad shape as far as tanking goes after the the recent nerfs.
How the game currently stands, with broken mechanics and serious nerfs, it'll be difficult to find a tank who can... well... actually tank.
2. TRs are a single target DPS class. They're pretty much useless in most DDs until the boss encounters. Bosses are where TRs can really shine and are more helpful in PvE than ever. A TR on ad duty is a complete joke, because a CW can mass AOE kill/push.
TRs are wanted in parties 99% of the time to fight bosses, and usually nothing else.
Edit: IMO it appears that rouges with this skill tank to well. That's because cryptic is so busy already killing all of the classes, and they haven't thought about actually fixing the GF class when it comes to tanking. I would say that the GF's protector tree could use some serious looking at, along with the terrible threat mechanics.
Arc, proud officer of Novus Ordo
New to the game? Check out my build guide to give you an idea on how to set up your characters!
Comments
Because sometimes a skill is so often used by Tr, that i can't different between encounter or daily.
Daily Bloodbath 30' Burst Flash around the battlefield, jumping from target to target. You are untargetable and immune to damage for a few seconds while dealing damage to every nearby enemy.
This is one Daily, that grant immunity. But it's the same as i see? Tr stand in front of me and make in less than 2s more than 6hits. Until the end of that skill he is immun to any control or only to fronlinge surge/bull charge.
@furion: It's not only 1 skill that is op in the case. If you have a skill with 1min CD, but a 100% granted killposibilty(immun+controlimmunity don't count for that skill, because it go through it), then the skill is alone Op. But the Tr has so many possibilites, that i stated, which gain him so ridiculous immunities! Dodge, Stealth(targetskills don't can hit), Daily(say what dailies are enable cc-immunity if i don't know the class) and that encounter.
that one is duelists flurry and is an at will with a long charge up time and when you get hit by it then its your own fault
my point still stands: dont talk about stuff you know nothing about...all powers are clearly identifyable (sp?) its just that you didnt put any effort into learning the differances...and that leads to stupid threads like this
Ah well
-Desstzo
Too many times have I entangled(on tab) a rogue that's about to 1 hit one of my teammates and he go up and come back down then two sec's later if I can hit him before he stealth he'll use itc(turn black) and become immune to all cc's. Anybody with any common sense would know this is not what's supposed to happen.:)
PinkSugar, lvl 60 CW.
Baby Cakes, lvl 60 GWF.
*******, lvl 60 TR.
Premium Juicebox, lvl 60 CW.
Pink Exxxtacy, Ranger
There is NO pvp in Neverwinter.
There is a great disturbance in the Force, @_@V.
I have 0% problems with this skill in PvP and PvE alike. Why would I say that? because in order for a rouge to use this encounter (That only last 3-5 secs at MAX rank and has a hefty cooldown on top of that) they're going to have to give something up. Weather it be the almighty Lashing blade (The one shot ability), Impact shot (The heavy 3 shotting daggers), or Dazing strike.
If a rouge wants to sacrifice some of his DPS for survival, than by all means let him. It may take a little longer to kill the squirmy *******, but he won't kill me as fast either.
On top of that ItC is an EXTREMELY vital skill in boss fights during DDs. It's the only skill that allows TRs to stay "Nose to Nose" while being out of stealth. If this ability was nerfed than TRs will be 1-2 shot by the boss way more often. Sure the first time you can just pick him up, but not the second time, if he still has rev sickness.
The boss will kill the TR(s) and if there is no DPS left on the boss, and everyone else is occupied with the ads... than it's always just going to be game over. DDs will be left unfinished a much greater time, and in the end everyone loses, because of this nerf.
So, not only am I against any nerfs to this ability, I'm actually very grateful for it.
- Kri-Liaol, Level 60 CW, 11.2k GS, Mindflayer Server
Have you noticed ItC rogues do less damage? I did not. They have so extreme DPS on their at-wills and the great LB, they dont really need any other DPS encounters - just look at their skills, all but LB are basicly utility-focused.
And whats exactly wrong with this? Tank should be "nose to nose", not DPSs. And I dont see any reason why should be strongest tank ability in the game given to rogues (especially when it requires 0 skill - press button to be immortal).
ITC is not a tank skill, rogues do not tank they avoid. Tanks take hits, rogues get hit they die. ITC is fine as it is they already nerfed it once.
You want to nerf something? Tell them to give rogues back the old lurkers assault cause the new version is just way to good in pvp. OLD version had potential but could be bumped off. New version has less damage but can not be bumped off, and to top it off teleports you to the poor sob you are going to gank.
And what's the different? Tr able to tank with that. And the CD is high? You should remember, that's real CD is less then 12-15s! You have to subtract the own CD by its duration. THEN you have its CD between using it twice!
Lurker... don't mind it's bad now. The TR have to many skills that enable him CC-immunity and/or damage-immunity. That's the problem. If you have 4 skills with 20s CD but all grant you 3s cc and dd-immunity, then you have only 8s duration in that the Tr can real damaged. But with reduced CD because of skills/feats and/or gear and/or ability score, then you have less then this 8s... You statet it's only ONE with 20s to 3s... not bad. But if you have several skills that enable it, then you have to sum up these and then you have a little op version of immunity.
Or can you say how many skills other class have to enable dd- and/or cc-immunity?
rogues only have 1 CC-immunity spell, i wonder where you get the other 3 from
maybe you should inform yourself abit better?
Ah well
-Desstzo
at least when you follow the threads on these boards
Ah well
-Desstzo
Bloodbath - daily, complete immunity to both damage and CC
ItC - complete immunity to CC and 75 or 100% incoming damage reduction
Shift - complete immunity to damage and CC
thats the three, and oh! there are more skills which could cause similar effects!
Smoke bomb can help you a lot disabling all enemies for long time
Stealth -mobs ignore you, stand still while you re slicing their throat
Bait and Swith gives you another stealth
So do Lurkers Assault
First off I did not state anything... Other than ITC is fine the way it is, it's a shame it no longer removes dots the old nerf but it's fine.
Second rogues do not have that many immunities. They have ITC, and only if you want to count the daily bloodbath which would be absurd as it's a daily and rogues generate ap so slow it will not be used that often.
Third.. Lurkers may be total trash for PVE now, but in PVP it's more deadly than it was. Why? Because now it teleports to the target and can not be countered by AOE damage or anything else that used to bump it off before it gets used. I for one would rather rogues have the extra damage, and have the ways to counter it back, instead of the current (MR MIYAGI Voice) *IF done right, no can defend*, I win button it is now. (NOTE! My rogue is 12k+ the new LA is stupid OP in PVP!!! Also Note! My control wizard is 12k+ and would rather rogues get the old LA back, because at least the old one had counters to it!! Heck for that matter My DC GWF AND GF hate the new LA also!)
Also before you start thinking I am biased... I play all 5 classes and am not biased at all. I also realize the game was much more balanced then the whiners would make it appear.
Read what I posted closer. I was saying that if he is going to use this "Utility skill" he is going to have one less spot available for a DPS skill. Overall meaning one less encounter slot for DPS. Hence sacrificing any possible DPS ability that could go into this slot for this survival based skill.
1. Wrong, currently GFs have a very big problem with threat, meaning they're hardly going to be tanking anything until this gets fixed. GWFs are more suited fighting multiple non-boss mobs (ad duty) and are in pretty bad shape as far as tanking goes after the the recent nerfs.
How the game currently stands, with broken mechanics and serious nerfs, it'll be difficult to find a tank who can... well... actually tank.
2. TRs are a single target DPS class. They're pretty much useless in most DDs until the boss encounters. Bosses are where TRs can really shine and are more helpful in PvE than ever. A TR on ad duty is a complete joke, because a CW can mass AOE kill/push.
TRs are wanted in parties 99% of the time to fight bosses, and usually nothing else.
Edit: IMO it appears that rouges with this skill tank to well. That's because cryptic is so busy already killing all of the classes, and they haven't thought about actually fixing the GF class when it comes to tanking. I would say that the GF's protector tree could use some serious looking at, along with the terrible threat mechanics.