I use Tab COI and its more effective then me slotting ROE on tab simply because COI 15% + ROE 15% is enough to debuff anything , what Tab COI gives you is constant chill (aoe)slow especially against GF and the rest of the classes after their immunity is on cd.
Did the same thing. Tabbed CoI helps add chill, which means my Ray of Frost can break a Fighter's block faster. Plus it gives me the mitigation debuff (Assailing Force -- thaums only). Also dropped Icy Rays for Chill Strike, because Chill Strike does roughly the same damage (a little less, but not so much less that you'd notice), and it has a momentary stun attached. And AFAIK it has a slightly shorter cooldown.
Icy Rays is nice, but after using it for a good long while, I find it doesn't suit my playstyle as well as the above.
You should get roughly around 26k+ HP if you wanna play around with Tene build. I have 3 sets of armor though and still have 2 tene in my armor, if you want to try that (CS) build, the GG set is reccommended as you do not have to rely on cs+ef to get 3hv debuff on your opponent. I've played around with 4 kinds of build before settling to my HV + COI chill build.
HV + CoI for debuff and icy on tab is what I'm using now. I was just hoping for a little more survivability with the extra burst. I haven't really looked at what I would be giving up.
32k and I am certain it is possible. If I see another in that ballpark ill SS it for those of you who believe you've seen everything that is possible.
Pretty sure it's possible. Whether it's something a solo CW can produce with any kind of regularity is another question. I'm leaning towards no (chilling cloud exploit notwithstanding), but I don't doubt that you saw what you say you saw.
32k and I am certain it is possible. If I see another in that ballpark ill SS it for those of you who believe you've seen everything that is possible.
Wait a minute are you talking about PVE? and on bosses? LoL. I am not sure where you are coming from maybe it is the same thing when I did 220k IceKnife damage on the CN Spider and Beholder. But for PVP you will not ever be able to do 30k Icy Rays. Frozen Power Transfer + Chilling Pressence is Broken when they are in unity. =p
Wait a minute are you talking about PVE? and on bosses? LoL. I am not sure where you are coming from maybe the same thing I did 220k IceKnife damage on the CN Spider and Beholder. But for PVP you will not ever be able to do 30k Icy Rays. Frozen Power Transfer + Chilling Pressence is Broken when they are in unity. =p
You should really read the whole thread rather than post out of context.
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paradoxie01Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 24Arc User
You should really read the whole thread rather than post out of context.
LoL, my bad if I miss anything , just browsing through the 1v1 thread to see what blasphemy is going on.. anyway stay true to the OP and not ridiculous pvp damages. Peace.. 8D
Fair criticism. I didn't intend to derail the hell out of the op. A more useful discussion point would be to use an average crit of 10k. I honestly don't know the upper end of the first icy so say 6k to be conservative (these numbers are post CoI and HV debuff). Most pugs have less than 25k HP. So on a double crit it **** near kills soft targets by itself. And since I use it last that's exactly what it does.
The point is, two very common thaum based PvE builds can solo 1 soft target in 1 round of encounters most if the time if you use the right powers. And there are even a couple different ways to do it. If you don't crit or get a tough target a round of mm should finish it. People saying CW is terrible are wildly exaggerating or are talking about the very top end of premades which stack our bad match ups and run 38k HP with 1500 regen gwfs synergizing Tenebs and GFs that can start their extremely high damage knockdown of doom cycle on you from 20 ft away seemingly. No place in that game for any class but fighter IMO.
But for the common pug, you should be doing very well.
Fair criticism. I didn't intend to derail the hell out of the op. A more useful discussion point would be to use an average crit of 10k. I honestly don't know the upper end of the first icy so say 6k to be conservative (these numbers are post CoI and HV debuff). Most pugs have less than 25k HP. So on a double crit it **** near kills soft targets by itself. And since I use it last that's exactly what it does.
The point is, two very common thaum based PvE builds can solo 1 soft target in 1 round of encounters most if the time if you use the right powers. And there are even a couple different ways to do it. If you don't crit or get a tough target a round of mm should finish it. People saying CW is terrible are wildly exaggerating or are talking about the very top end of premades which stack our bad match ups and run 38k HP with 1500 regen gwfs synergizing Tenebs and GFs that can start their extremely high damage knockdown of doom cycle on you from 20 ft away seemingly. No place in that game for any class but fighter IMO.
But for the common pug, you should be doing very well.
Now onto the reality of geared premades vs geared premades. There is no place for a CW. Ask Llantis about it and why he changed.
I get sick and tired of seeing inexperienced CWs posting about PVP when they dont really have a clue. One thing i can tell you is i never ever lost 1v1 CW vs CW when they threw COI on me. Thats also taking into account 300 ping.
Never. When they threw that they were gone and i laughed . IR tabbed CS EF and ROE SW tene gear. Stun stun stun and a debuff. COI vs a stun GG
Go gear right up and invest then go take on that Rogue, GWF,GF and see how far you really get.
I will say it again. After the ROE nerf combined with broken feats the class is only good on a winning team.
He's also talking about rogues and DCs ang GS 12k+.... So he's not talking about the optimal PvP group of nothing but GF and GWF if the best PvP specs. Not only because that would exclude some of the classes he mentioned, but also because an optimized PvP GWF has a much lower GS from optimizing HP and Regen. Not all premades are created equal. If he's running up against groups with DCs and especially rogues he can be effective.
If they're mostly pvp specced fighters, I don't think anyone would disagree he's not going to be effective. And ya regardless of group comp, he's going to be everyone's first target every time. Which means hell spend all his time running until his team gets an advantage.
But he asked about 1v1 and the fact is - GS does not always mean optimal for PvP. But if he's talking about every class at its best he has no chance against GF, very little chance against GWF, and a good chance against every other class.
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paradoxie01Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 24Arc User
One thing i can tell you is i never ever lost 1v1 CW vs CW when they threw COI on me. Thats also taking into account 300 ping.
I Kill whatever CW I threw my COI on never had a problem especially those that shoots me with IR first as combo starter and still allowing me to cast when 1v1, I laugh when they melt away.
I Kill whatever CW I threw my COI on never had a problem especially those that shoots me with IR first as combo starter and still allowing me to cast when 1v1, I laugh when they melt away.
Nah dont see it happening. I think you are kidding yourself like so many of the CWs in this post.
He's also talking about rogues and DCs ang GS 12k+.... So he's not talking about the optimal PvP group of nothing but GF and GWF if the best PvP specs. Not only because that would exclude some of the classes he mentioned, but also because an optimized PvP GWF has a much lower GS from optimizing HP and Regen. Not all premades are created equal. If he's running up against groups with DCs and especially rogues he can be effective.
If they're mostly pvp specced fighters, I don't think anyone would disagree he's not going to be effective. And ya regardless of group comp, he's going to be everyone's first target every time. Which means hell spend all his time running until his team gets an advantage.
But he asked about 1v1 and the fact is - GS does not always mean optimal for PvP. But if he's talking about every class at its best he has no chance against GF, very little chance against GWF, and a good chance against every other class.
He only has a chance against the rogue if he sees him first. A good rogue wont let you do that. As good teams know CW are gimping their team most will not run with one.
And the most fun part is what you mentioned. Generally you are target no:1 so enjoy all that melee running straight for you. Fun times i can tell ya just lots of fun.
Most of the teams I see on beholder are guild teams. They bring whatever. Only twice in probably a couple hundred matches have I seen a melee team. Are you really seeing them that often on your server? I see 10 pugs to every premade and of the premades maybe a quarter made any attempt to optimize the classes they bring (in other words fighter heavy).
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paradoxie01Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 24Arc User
Nah dont see it happening. I think you are kidding yourself like so many of the CWs in this post.
Try harder and stay delusional if you think (Tab)Icy Rays out damages (Tab)COI. These thread will never provide valuable information with big headed ego posters like you, I rest my case.
Try harder and stay delusional if you think (Tab)Icy Rays out damages (Tab)COI. These thread will never provide valuable information with big headed ego posters like you, I rest my case.
No one leads with icy rays man. Your post made no sense. And you criticize his ego while doing the same thing. Pointless.
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paradoxie01Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 24Arc User
No one leads with icy rays man. Your post made no sense. And you criticize his ego while doing the same thing. Pointless.
No one? I think you should check back what was posted before because you just missed something and I was agitated into replying with the same style, case close.
I looked again and still don't see it. Your statement above is the only instance I see of someone starting a combo with IR. I can't imagine why anyone would ever start a rotation with it or how that could possibly be a good strategy.
IR is good finishing or burst-initiating ability, cause it can't be dodged. I use it at begining of fight, If i sure that I can finish my target via all-in burst. IR->CoI->Chill Strike->EF/RoE->Ice Knife or RoF, if target is already very low.
IR is good finishing or burst-initiating ability, cause it can't be dodged. I use it at begining of fight, If i sure that I can finish my target via all-in burst. IR->CoI->Chill Strike->EF/RoE->Ice Knife or RoF, if target is already very low.
If you have "Snap Freeze" feat IR wouldn't benefit from it because of some bug, if you don't believe, try Rof a dummy chill it and cast IR then do the same for CS you will know IR combo starter losses out some damage unless you anticipate a dodge/runaway. Immobilized CW will just choke you while trading hits and other melee's will just Immune out of it.
Comments
32k and I am certain it is possible. If I see another in that ballpark ill SS it for those of you who believe you've seen everything that is possible.
Did the same thing. Tabbed CoI helps add chill, which means my Ray of Frost can break a Fighter's block faster. Plus it gives me the mitigation debuff (Assailing Force -- thaums only). Also dropped Icy Rays for Chill Strike, because Chill Strike does roughly the same damage (a little less, but not so much less that you'd notice), and it has a momentary stun attached. And AFAIK it has a slightly shorter cooldown.
Icy Rays is nice, but after using it for a good long while, I find it doesn't suit my playstyle as well as the above.
HV + CoI for debuff and icy on tab is what I'm using now. I was just hoping for a little more survivability with the extra burst. I haven't really looked at what I would be giving up.
Pretty sure it's possible. Whether it's something a solo CW can produce with any kind of regularity is another question. I'm leaning towards no (chilling cloud exploit notwithstanding), but I don't doubt that you saw what you say you saw.
You should really read the whole thread rather than post out of context.
The point is, two very common thaum based PvE builds can solo 1 soft target in 1 round of encounters most if the time if you use the right powers. And there are even a couple different ways to do it. If you don't crit or get a tough target a round of mm should finish it. People saying CW is terrible are wildly exaggerating or are talking about the very top end of premades which stack our bad match ups and run 38k HP with 1500 regen gwfs synergizing Tenebs and GFs that can start their extremely high damage knockdown of doom cycle on you from 20 ft away seemingly. No place in that game for any class but fighter IMO.
But for the common pug, you should be doing very well.
Now onto the reality of geared premades vs geared premades. There is no place for a CW. Ask Llantis about it and why he changed.
I get sick and tired of seeing inexperienced CWs posting about PVP when they dont really have a clue. One thing i can tell you is i never ever lost 1v1 CW vs CW when they threw COI on me. Thats also taking into account 300 ping.
Never. When they threw that they were gone and i laughed . IR tabbed CS EF and ROE SW tene gear. Stun stun stun and a debuff. COI vs a stun GG
Go gear right up and invest then go take on that Rogue, GWF,GF and see how far you really get.
I will say it again. After the ROE nerf combined with broken feats the class is only good on a winning team.
If they're mostly pvp specced fighters, I don't think anyone would disagree he's not going to be effective. And ya regardless of group comp, he's going to be everyone's first target every time. Which means hell spend all his time running until his team gets an advantage.
But he asked about 1v1 and the fact is - GS does not always mean optimal for PvP. But if he's talking about every class at its best he has no chance against GF, very little chance against GWF, and a good chance against every other class.
Nah dont see it happening. I think you are kidding yourself like so many of the CWs in this post.
He only has a chance against the rogue if he sees him first. A good rogue wont let you do that. As good teams know CW are gimping their team most will not run with one.
And the most fun part is what you mentioned. Generally you are target no:1 so enjoy all that melee running straight for you. Fun times i can tell ya just lots of fun.
No one leads with icy rays man. Your post made no sense. And you criticize his ego while doing the same thing. Pointless.