I am usually pretty happy when players knock away mass amounts of mobs from my Cleric! The front line strikers who have never played a cleric or cw do not know the amount of adds we attract. Both classes get serious agro! It is our only hope to stay alive a lot of the time.
I am usually pretty happy when players knock away mass amounts of mobs from my Cleric! The front line strikers who have never played a cleric or cw do not know the amount of adds we attract. Both classes get serious agro! It is our only hope to stay alive a lot of the time.
Indeed, the broken aggro system is just...broken. As a TR, when my other party members are off fighting adds and the second I touch the boss all 20 or so of the adds suddenly descend upon me, then it's immediately apparent to me that there's something really wrong with this system.
When I play with my GF and I'm partied with my CW friend, sometimes it seems no matter how much I'm taunting and doing damage, the mobs will just suddenly lose interest in me and run straight for the CW for no apparent reason.
I'm glad the game went away from the "holy trinity" system and isn't trying to be a copy of WoW (the main reason I picked it over other MMOs), but a sensible aggro mechanic is the core of a good group play system and I would dare say that improving this should be among their top priorities right now.
DO NOT EVER , I MEAN EVER ..................USE KNOCK BACK IN DUNGEONS
I MEAN YOU GUYS CANT BE THAT STUPID .......
I REPEAT , NEVER USE KNOCK BACK IN DUNGEONS , EVER
sick of seeing mage noobs using knock back cuase they think they know how to play , only thing they do is get themselves and there party killed
end of rant .....party on
this right here folks. this is how you make a fail thread.
0
elthiruilMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
In almost eery single epic dungeon, knockbacks of some kind and timed well are essentially too survival - for not just the CW, for other party members, sure the melee guys might lose agro for a second, but remember there are 5 people in the party and sometimes as a ranged character CW see what is going on better than melee guys, someone might go down we go in rez them and throw off a shield or singularity then shield to move or push mobs so that the person who went down actually has a chance to pot and get into a better position.
From what I have seen as a CW - there is no way that a GF/GWF can manage this... sorry - but just no.
As for knocking mobs off - designed too make things quicker and easier, however its not always easy to get the timing exactly right, sometimes targets move, and the auto-targeting follows, it happens .. deal with it - move on.
In the end, unless the CW is very new to epic they will know how their skills work and they are trying their best to use them effectively, I can say I've on the receiving end of blablabla l2p etc rants, sometimes because of timing, sometimes because someone wants/thinks that they can manage it all themselves, and everytime I said - ok I won't, party wipe ... wipe ... wipe, group disband, so .. let's see, I think I will use my skills, accept that I'm not a perfectionist and can't always get things right, but a high percentage of the time I do - and that's what matters.
So ... don't give CW a hard time, they are only trying to perform their role - just like you.
It's the bad CW's who slot Repel in Spell Mastery and try to use it as a form of DPS. You can use Shield Repulse anytime you want in a dungeon, as long as you know where to position yourself to push mobs. Love fights where I can chain AS. Haven't had the experience with playing with a great GF yet, but I'll keep in mind to drop AS on them to build their daily.
I couldnt imagine there would be many if any who use repel in tab as dps. It is great on a number of epic runs to get that extra push to clear faster.
Indeed, the broken aggro system is just...broken. As a TR, when my other party members are off fighting adds and the second I touch the boss all 20 or so of the adds suddenly descend upon me, then it's immediately apparent to me that there's something really wrong with this system.
When I play with my GF and I'm partied with my CW friend, sometimes it seems no matter how much I'm taunting and doing damage, the mobs will just suddenly lose interest in me and run straight for the CW for no apparent reason.
I'm glad the game went away from the "holy trinity" system and isn't trying to be a copy of WoW (the main reason I picked it over other MMOs), but a sensible aggro mechanic is the core of a good group play system and I would dare say that improving this should be among their top priorities right now.
I cant say ive found this at all, my main is a TR and i almost feel left out the adds pay me so little attention.
Im constantly either unleashing on the boss or zipping over to the cleric to wipe adds while others are going for DPS winner on the score chart...
As far as the OP statement goes i can fully understand what a lot of people are saying and it is needed (well kind of) in later dungeons but only if your stickng to that formula..
Lower level epics its just a pain in the behind with mugs bouncing mobs around making every fight last 5 mins longer than it should..
ok I should have gone into a bit more detail, my bad.it was a late night and after a lot of red bull , I play a tank , I go in grab aggro , the rest of the team kills the mob ....simple right .....well about 20% of the time , im talking about the when idiot mages and whoever use knockback into another mob , so they end pulling 2 mobs and it just snowballs from there
the other thing is , how do I build aggro on a mob when its bouncing around the room
and too me having no xp , when you been playing these sort of games for 25 years come see me , but its a learning curve for everyone and this is a foum , so every is entitled to opinion .
ya my bad for not putting in more datails , I should have edited that
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] "SWEET JESUS ITS TAKING LONG ENUFF"
I once did a knockback over a cliff, only to watch one of the melees follow him over the edge with some kind of teleport ability.
Hilarious.
That would have been a TR. We have an ability that stealths us and puts us behind the enemy for attack. We also have a lunging strike. I'm thinking the TR wasn't following the plan or there wasn't a plan in place to begin with if he/she was using his stealthy strike on the edge of a cliff . Now I've gone over the edge using my lunging strike before but honestly I consider that my own fault LOL
In some cases repel and shield KB are great, but far from something to use 100% of the time.
When needed I slot repel in tab instead of Chill Strike, but only when needed, just like the shield takes my Steal Time spot when needed. For trash it's mostly not needed, just when you wanna skip through masses of mobs with cliff knocks. Repel works great on bosses where you dont want or need to kill the adds. If you are well placed you will dps boss and KB the trash.
For building AP, chill strike and steal time does a wonderful job already and controls mobs aswell. Both are AoE and deal significant damage.
That would have been a TR. We have an ability that stealths us and puts us behind the enemy for attack. We also have a lunging strike. I'm thinking the TR wasn't following the plan or there wasn't a plan in place to begin with if he/she was using his stealthy strike on the edge of a cliff . Now I've gone over the edge using my lunging strike before but honestly I consider that my own fault LOL
I've also seen TR go over the edge with duelist's flurry though never done that one myself (yet...)
sigh... from your first sentence, I can tell that you are trolling.
No, he's probably just someone who got out of an excruciating CT or CC run, with a new Control Wizard who's just learned the wonder and amazement of Tab Repel..... and uses it constantly, to scatter all the mobs people are fighting all over the room.
Completely understandable why he'd react that way, I know I did the first few times it happened to me.
I'm going to side with the OP's point, if not his abuse of capslock.
I've played tanks across several mmos, and from what I've seen most players are idiots in their use of knockbacks. As was frequently described in what I read of this thread, poorly timed knockbacks make tanking more difficult, reduce the effectiveness of aoe, increase the likelihood of one or more deaths or even a full wipe, and generally make a run take longer.
I opted to play a CW instead of a tank in this game, and I'll be wary about how I use any knockback.
"Tolerance and apathy are the last virtues of a dying society." - Aristotle
0
wolfisMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 2Arc User
edited June 2013
LOLOLOL what a **** poster.
Any half decent CW will save your group an enormous amount of time by throwing mobs off cliffs.
No, he's probably just someone who got out of an excruciating CT or CC run, with a new Control Wizard who's just learned the wonder and amazement of Tab Repel..... and uses it constantly, to scatter all the mobs people are fighting all over the room.
Completely understandable why he'd react that way, I know I did the first few times it happened to me.
I'll second that. Been there done that.
Tactical knockbacks? A-Ok.
Gratuitous knockbacks that serve no purpose? Most frustrating thing ever, especially for the melees in your party.
Look pal, I'm not trying to sound like a jerk, but it'll end up coming out like that. The presence of a CW in a dungeon, especially a good one that knows how to generate AP fast , makes your GF irrelevant. Literally, in spellplague, I wouldn't care if you were afk the whole time until the last boss. Personally I'd rather take another TR to burn the boss faster, but since we also have GFs and GWFs in the guild, we fit them.
Tl;dr If you like 2 hour dungeons, by all means complain about what the CW does to generate AP. If you want to do more than 1 in a DD, you let them work.
As an aside, anyone else troll guild Melee with repel on cliffs, waiting until the charge/shadow strike points in the rotation to knock stuff off? :P
0
oakbenderMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited July 2013
MY kung fu knock back beats your drunken chicken fist rant!
DO NOT EVER , I MEAN EVER ..................USE KNOCK BACK IN DUNGEONS
I REPEAT , NEVER USE KNOCK BACK IN DUNGEONS , EVER
sick of seeing mage using knock back cuase they think they know how to play , only thing they do is get themselves and there party killed
end of rant .....party on
Try doing epic spell plague without a CW using knock back spells...I bet you'll be the 1st person screaming in your party for it. given your little "rant" i suspect spell plague epic is a long way off for you.
Maybe learn to play the game before handing out half ar*sed advice. Thats my "pro" tip for you
A good CW who knows how to use their knockbacks to properly control mobs is the best thing you can have in a dungeon.
A too-high percentage of CWs who just use knockbacks because there are a lot of mobs in one place are a real annoyance.
Terrible, terrible CWs who single-target Repel melee focus targets in enclosed dungeons (i.e. no cliffs or bridges) and apparently don't even slot AS should be flayed.
Comments
Indeed, the broken aggro system is just...broken. As a TR, when my other party members are off fighting adds and the second I touch the boss all 20 or so of the adds suddenly descend upon me, then it's immediately apparent to me that there's something really wrong with this system.
When I play with my GF and I'm partied with my CW friend, sometimes it seems no matter how much I'm taunting and doing damage, the mobs will just suddenly lose interest in me and run straight for the CW for no apparent reason.
I'm glad the game went away from the "holy trinity" system and isn't trying to be a copy of WoW (the main reason I picked it over other MMOs), but a sensible aggro mechanic is the core of a good group play system and I would dare say that improving this should be among their top priorities right now.
this right here folks. this is how you make a fail thread.
From what I have seen as a CW - there is no way that a GF/GWF can manage this... sorry - but just no.
As for knocking mobs off - designed too make things quicker and easier, however its not always easy to get the timing exactly right, sometimes targets move, and the auto-targeting follows, it happens .. deal with it - move on.
In the end, unless the CW is very new to epic they will know how their skills work and they are trying their best to use them effectively, I can say I've on the receiving end of blablabla l2p etc rants, sometimes because of timing, sometimes because someone wants/thinks that they can manage it all themselves, and everytime I said - ok I won't, party wipe ... wipe ... wipe, group disband, so .. let's see, I think I will use my skills, accept that I'm not a perfectionist and can't always get things right, but a high percentage of the time I do - and that's what matters.
So ... don't give CW a hard time, they are only trying to perform their role - just like you.
I couldnt imagine there would be many if any who use repel in tab as dps. It is great on a number of epic runs to get that extra push to clear faster.
I cant say ive found this at all, my main is a TR and i almost feel left out the adds pay me so little attention.
Im constantly either unleashing on the boss or zipping over to the cleric to wipe adds while others are going for DPS winner on the score chart...
As far as the OP statement goes i can fully understand what a lot of people are saying and it is needed (well kind of) in later dungeons but only if your stickng to that formula..
Lower level epics its just a pain in the behind with mugs bouncing mobs around making every fight last 5 mins longer than it should..
Hilarious.
sigh... from your first sentence, I can tell that you are trolling.
the other thing is , how do I build aggro on a mob when its bouncing around the room
and too me having no xp , when you been playing these sort of games for 25 years come see me , but its a learning curve for everyone and this is a foum , so every is entitled to opinion .
ya my bad for not putting in more datails , I should have edited that
"SWEET JESUS ITS TAKING LONG ENUFF"
That would have been a TR. We have an ability that stealths us and puts us behind the enemy for attack. We also have a lunging strike. I'm thinking the TR wasn't following the plan or there wasn't a plan in place to begin with if he/she was using his stealthy strike on the edge of a cliff
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium
When needed I slot repel in tab instead of Chill Strike, but only when needed, just like the shield takes my Steal Time spot when needed. For trash it's mostly not needed, just when you wanna skip through masses of mobs with cliff knocks. Repel works great on bosses where you dont want or need to kill the adds. If you are well placed you will dps boss and KB the trash.
For building AP, chill strike and steal time does a wonderful job already and controls mobs aswell. Both are AoE and deal significant damage.
Not sure if trolling or just someone that plays since yesterday
Probably a Champions player. Just try to use knock in a "Dockside Dustup". I dare ya! The rage and anger that often follows is, impressive.
I've also seen TR go over the edge with duelist's flurry though never done that one myself (yet...)
No, he's probably just someone who got out of an excruciating CT or CC run, with a new Control Wizard who's just learned the wonder and amazement of Tab Repel..... and uses it constantly, to scatter all the mobs people are fighting all over the room.
Completely understandable why he'd react that way, I know I did the first few times it happened to me.
I've played tanks across several mmos, and from what I've seen most players are idiots in their use of knockbacks. As was frequently described in what I read of this thread, poorly timed knockbacks make tanking more difficult, reduce the effectiveness of aoe, increase the likelihood of one or more deaths or even a full wipe, and generally make a run take longer.
I opted to play a CW instead of a tank in this game, and I'll be wary about how I use any knockback.
Any half decent CW will save your group an enormous amount of time by throwing mobs off cliffs.
PRO tip: uninstall now.
I'll second that. Been there done that.
Tactical knockbacks? A-Ok.
Gratuitous knockbacks that serve no purpose? Most frustrating thing ever, especially for the melees in your party.
Tl;dr If you like 2 hour dungeons, by all means complain about what the CW does to generate AP. If you want to do more than 1 in a DD, you let them work.
As an aside, anyone else troll guild Melee with repel on cliffs, waiting until the charge/shadow strike points in the rotation to knock stuff off? :P
All YAR Rant ARE BELONG TWO US!
Try doing epic spell plague without a CW using knock back spells...I bet you'll be the 1st person screaming in your party for it. given your little "rant" i suspect spell plague epic is a long way off for you.
Maybe learn to play the game before handing out half ar*sed advice. Thats my "pro" tip for you
A too-high percentage of CWs who just use knockbacks because there are a lot of mobs in one place are a real annoyance.
Terrible, terrible CWs who single-target Repel melee focus targets in enclosed dungeons (i.e. no cliffs or bridges) and apparently don't even slot AS should be flayed.
need moor elf
We need more elves like we need more adds.
Dude, you cant be more wrong, please see my thread to see why:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?381161-What-this-game-needs