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You are limiting your player base! This is why
chikar
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
This thread should really be seen by whoever has the power to make big decisions. I think this one change could greatly enhance your player base.
So I must say, that I truly enjoy this game. It has many aspects and features that I really like and I have yet to hit End Game. The combat is interesting and fairly fast paced. The questing is fun and super simplistic to follow. The PVP feels much more diverse than I originally thought with only 5 classes. Since everyone can play their classes much differently than the next person.
BUT
You are severely limiting your player base from one specific group of gamers. The Theorycrafters.
NOW WAIT!
Please understand I do not mean that you have eliminated the ability for people to Theorycraft.
Not at all..
BUT! (Here it goes again)
You have narrowed it down to only the people willing to dish out 3 dollars per character respec. When the SERIOUS Theorycraft pool of players is not willing to do so.
A hardcore Theorycrafter will sometimes respec as much as multiple times per day tweaking for best damage/mitigation/etc...
THIS IS AN MMO - IT IS EVER EVOLVING! <-- This statement means, that everytime you balance classes, people will usually respec if skills have been affected in such a manner that it no longer interests their playstyle. Powers and Feats are tweaked, adjusted, buffed or .... *shiver* Nerfed!!!! Dun dun dunnnnn! When that happens, the Theorycrafters change things around. They fiddle with this, tweak that, swap points, test on dummies.
But how are we to do this??? If it costs $3.00(previously $6.00) each time?
It's not economically sound, and creating a 2nd character JUST to try a different playstyle? What if I wanna PVE for a few weeks for some gear? Then come back and PVP for a few more? What if I want to try a tanky build on my GF? But I dont really like it, so I go back to the Hybrid build?
Now, let's not scream "Its F2P, they have to make money somehow" because I've bought Zen multiple times and I'd gladly pay for this game monthly. I do not believe respec'ing ones character should cost real cash. Make it Gold, something farmable in game. This ONE aspect, that truly eliminates any serious theorycrafter.
Eliminates the serious, hardcore players that keep a game alive.
I ask, Cryptic, that this ONE aspect be changed. I believe that, in doing so, the player base will boom with new life! Life from a much more hardcore group of players. These players can do many things for a game. Such as helping bring the casual players more information that is currently still a mystery to a lot of people.
Give us freedom to play our characters as we would see fit. Not have to commit to ONE build. That loses interest quickly for some.
/end
So I must say, that I truly enjoy this game. It has many aspects and features that I really like and I have yet to hit End Game. The combat is interesting and fairly fast paced. The questing is fun and super simplistic to follow. The PVP feels much more diverse than I originally thought with only 5 classes. Since everyone can play their classes much differently than the next person.
BUT
You are severely limiting your player base from one specific group of gamers. The Theorycrafters.
NOW WAIT!
Please understand I do not mean that you have eliminated the ability for people to Theorycraft.
Not at all..
BUT! (Here it goes again)
You have narrowed it down to only the people willing to dish out 3 dollars per character respec. When the SERIOUS Theorycraft pool of players is not willing to do so.
A hardcore Theorycrafter will sometimes respec as much as multiple times per day tweaking for best damage/mitigation/etc...
THIS IS AN MMO - IT IS EVER EVOLVING! <-- This statement means, that everytime you balance classes, people will usually respec if skills have been affected in such a manner that it no longer interests their playstyle. Powers and Feats are tweaked, adjusted, buffed or .... *shiver* Nerfed!!!! Dun dun dunnnnn! When that happens, the Theorycrafters change things around. They fiddle with this, tweak that, swap points, test on dummies.
But how are we to do this??? If it costs $3.00(previously $6.00) each time?
It's not economically sound, and creating a 2nd character JUST to try a different playstyle? What if I wanna PVE for a few weeks for some gear? Then come back and PVP for a few more? What if I want to try a tanky build on my GF? But I dont really like it, so I go back to the Hybrid build?
Now, let's not scream "Its F2P, they have to make money somehow" because I've bought Zen multiple times and I'd gladly pay for this game monthly. I do not believe respec'ing ones character should cost real cash. Make it Gold, something farmable in game. This ONE aspect, that truly eliminates any serious theorycrafter.
Eliminates the serious, hardcore players that keep a game alive.
I ask, Cryptic, that this ONE aspect be changed. I believe that, in doing so, the player base will boom with new life! Life from a much more hardcore group of players. These players can do many things for a game. Such as helping bring the casual players more information that is currently still a mystery to a lot of people.
Give us freedom to play our characters as we would see fit. Not have to commit to ONE build. That loses interest quickly for some.
/end
Post edited by chikar on
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You're a narb. Fixed for accuracy.
Preview Server. /Thread.
That may be true, but lets remember that anything prior to the 20th we spent was in "Beta" anyways. So we knew this. It was our own conscious decision to spend money on a game in Beta. You can't expect polished, launch worthy material when its blatantly labeled "Beta". Although, even in launch in ANY game, you are going to have bugged abilities this early. I just think the cost to respec should be in-game currency. Asking real cash for something like this is a bit ridiculous.
Edited:Gah, ninja'd by the Healhamsta.
So having a preview server means I can play PVP today, PVE tomorrow, switch up to my hybrid spec, all that on the live server? Free of charge, huh? ..... Your argument is invalid. I'm only speaking of having freedom with our toons on the live server, read the entire post.
Your argument here is also invalid. You started your post off on cryptic leaving out theorycrafters then switched into the PVP/PVE switching later. Theorycrafters like to test and figure out the best builds. That can be done on preview.
Also you said switch it to a farmable currency. It already is. AD can be farmed and then turned into Zen. You might not like how much of it you have to farm or how long it takes. But that's a different argument. They obviously don't want you changing feats every time you switch between pvp and pve. Find a balance between your specs for both. Or have separate characters dedicated to one or the other.
1) You're obviously not a true theorycrafter. Just an enthusiast.
2) Respecs in Preview server are free. Can respec a billion times if you want. Playing in live server is free. Makes it easy to acquire metrics & apply theoretical scenarios (as this entire game is simply metrics & not that complex a system).
Simply copy over your character & theory craft to your heart's content then simply port over what appears to be the most viable build with your free respec in the live server....unless you were rich/dim enough to waste the free respec on the live server already.
There is the issue of initial ability rolls not reseting. But whatever, characters are easy to level to 60.
Let me preface the rest of my comments with the fact I really didn't even know NW had a test server yet. So my post wasn't written with that in mind.
First, theorycrafting is not limited to just PVE. Next, yes min/maxing can quite easily be done on the preview server, I have not disputed this. This still doesn't account for on the fly changes alot of us like to make during odd situations. Something I would like to point out is, theorycrafters come in all sorts of varying levels of skill and knowledge. We are not all pro's, and some of us are more casual. Some of us work a 9-5 through the week, spend time with our kids and wives at night, and mainly game on the weekends or randomly throughout the week when we can spare an hour or so. I will admit that I am a casual theorycrafter, but do what I have time for. Preview server? Ain't nobody got time fo dat!
Why limit our abilities to work it out strictly on the preview server? The fact still remains that something that changes so often in MMO's (the talent/skill/power tree's) shouldn't cost $3.00 to alter in-game. I am pleading for the freedom to customize based on the situation also. It is a combined post, so what?
Really? ... *sigh*
Do tell? Cause I know of no magic secret to getting free respecs. Everytime I've pressed the button it's asked me to buy a token. I am not speaking of feats, I am speaking of powers.
You know as well as I do, that these statements aren't logical. First things first, the time it would take to farm enough AD to get 300 zen would take more time than its worth. We aren't all zen market traders, or auction house jockeys. Let's please remember there are all different types that play MMO's. We aren't all cast from the same mold.
Second, why would they NOT want us to be able to explore every aspect of their fine game? Why limit us to sticking with ONE specific build? What if I mainly enjoy PVP, but like to raid a day or two a week. I can understand having reasons to spend Zen on. I am not trying to degrade the cash shop. I understand its purpose and value to the future of the game. Respec'ing to me just is not what I consider a cash shop item. If they have long term goals for this game, why not build for the whole crowd?
Say what you will, call me a whiner. People with voices are how things get done in MMO's. Speak loud enough, someone hears you. It doesn't always work, but sometimes it does.
Unless you are saying the preview server not only let's you test current builds, but also tunnels into the future so you can tweak the skills for each and every future update they do that would change the data of today.
If he hadn't mentioned:
then everyone naysaying him might have had a point. But since their solutions don't address this main point above at all, they don't. Since it does show how people would have to keep respending for respec when they do balance updates, new classes, new gear sets, etc.
I think you are exaggerating a bit here. At current rates we are only taking just under 100k AD for 300 Zen. Thats 4 days if you reach refine cap on a single character. That is 1 or 2 T1 parts sold. A little over a weeks work if you really want to take your time.
I hardly see this as ridiculous, unobtainable, or even unreasonably hard to attain.
Making it cost-free would mean that I could respec just before a boss, before minion fights etc etc, just to tweak little things. There wouldn't have any important on powers chosen either.
Here for the build+guide
Edit: I'm with OP. I am running solo in this game, dungeon groups, though mostly successful are unreliable. Not to mention that I MAY have an hour a day to play (making "farming" near impossible.) I can run a single dungeon in that time. So I am denied even this, one of the most basic and needed functions of learning a class as a whole. I may one day be able to farm dungeons if I stick with it long enough, but honestly, I'm getting bored quickly with not being allowed even the basics.
Fixed it for you. In case you didn't guess from his post the OP wanted to do things honestly, hence his concern with what is fair......
Honestly the f2p model stinks.
I have never understood why people support it or call it the future of online gaming when it splits the player base in half.
you have the one group of players who either A) have loads of money to blow on imaginary items, or
then the second group of people with lives and budgets who basically become the scrubs of the in-game world, and usually get fed up and leave.
there is a reason that casual friendly games with monthly fees tend to have the highest populations, they are accessible to everyone.
however, as long as there are whales out there willing to spend hundreds to thousands a month on imaginary video game items, there are always going to be companies willing to take their money.
Well regardless, it's fairly easy to make 100k AD doing 1-3 legit dungeons during DD.
DD is never happening when I play.
There's a reason why you have enough power picks to diversify - plan ahead and change what's on your hotbar to suit the task at hand.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
It's the paragon that i am talking about. Kinda hard to do that there, ya think? Kinda hard to know much about how they all work without playing them.
There should be a way to earn them with minimal effort in game. Also we need a trial time, like 24 hours or so to test it out before we confirm our hard earned choices.
It is faster for me to download another F2P game then it is to grind AD for a respec.
Also there is the type who can spend on the game, but won't flat out buy their way through the game. Kind of takes the fun out of it, so while I was fine paying 200 to get more profit from the info in closed betas, the only effect in game is really 2 extra character slots, drow race, and the spider. None of which boost your power in actual fighting in PvP, which would be my main concern.
I would love to see a high quality game that charged anywhere from 20 to 50 dollars a month in subscription. Would keep out the worst portions of the player base, and would make the focus about quality content. With luck someone will come out with it when people get sick of F2P.
As to respecs - pick one. Or find a way to balance both. Like many things in life, you can't have everything you want; you need to make a choice, and sometimes give something up to get something else.
Pick a spec. Stick with it. Make it work. Yes, Cryptic *could* lower the price / offer dual-specs. Why bother having classes at all, though if people just want to change what they have on a whim? Should we also be allowed to change classes, too? I mean, if I wasn't happy with my feats, my power selection, my starting rolls... Why not just follow this down the slope and let me keep all my gear and coin, but let me change every single thing about my character?
Mistakes happen. I get that. That's why there are respec tokens in the first place. But if you can't find one build that works for you, maybe you should level an alt instead....
just how long did it take b4 DDO had all of those things you posted "right"?
was it the 1st second of beta?
was it the 1st second of live?
or was it several months down the road?
im saying it was 3rd choice.
tearing apart every single detail that you dont like isnt productive.
just look at the launch of vanilla WoW. there were quite a lot of game breaking bugs and glitches and they werent even begun to get addressed untill a few months after discovery. yah there were those, like u, that raged at every little thing wrong with the game, but after they all left, things started to get done more quickly. vanilla WoW was not even in top 15 best online games at the time of release. but after forum ragers left, blizz could devote mor time and money into the game instead of customer service, which skyrocketed WoW's popularity. it's the reason WoW was the most sucessfull mmo for almost a decade. their decline came when they started to see an influx of the ragers again.
now, with that said....
if you want NW to do well then stop the excessive QQ'ing and be more productive and more patient. cryptic is one of the smallest companies to attempt the mmo genre, which means more productivity and patience from playerbase = more time that can be allotted for game improvements
1) Tis understandable, quite a few humans are annoying enough to do that. Doesn't excuse your lack of searching as me presume you have a competent enough mind to do so.
2) Me have not made a distinction between PvE & PvP theorycrafting. It's easy to optimize for either. (Burst for PvP, sustained for PvE. Same as virtually any other MMO.)
3) Of course not everyone's a pro. But me has seen a significant number of highly skilled casual players. Work, kids, spouses. Welcome to life. There are a significant number of "hardcore" players who also deal with it. Ever try dealing with dissertations, grant proposals, & committees on top of that.
4) If you really want to avoid the preview server completely...Make a ton of alts. I can easily change "on the fly" to entirely different classes if I want even swapping from TR and DC. Neverwinter is extremely easy & casual to level for. Heck leadership will let you afk level as well. Just be prepared to wait...oh...about a year or so for it to level you up decently at that rate.
5) What's wrong with testing on the preview server. Unless there are massive balance changes every week or something for the vast majority of time, the preview server will carry over exactly the same to the live server.
6) It be F2P, quit feeling this false sense of entitlement. They have to make monies somehow & I'd rather they charge for respecs than stuff adds into the game. If you really are casual, then go ahead and pay for convenience items such as respecs. Otherwise, huge balance changes will simply rewards you with a free one.
7) Me will be honest, people like you make MMO's worse. And while people with "voices" do influence a game, people with MONEY are how things get done in MMO's. Me do not has anything against posting your opinions however me do have something against people posting hot air without any substantial backings. Exhibit A: Star Wars Galaxy. Loud voices from the vocal minority, effectively killed the game as those with money were pissed off & spoke with their money...by leaving.
Me suggest that you try putting some actual thought before you post/talk. It can only improve your life.
50 dollars would be worth it, when you consider the features that would basically be necessary for such a high cost. That would be multiple in game GMs always online per server, multiple PvP maps and types, consistent updates with a good amount of testing done by a decent size tester base, a large employee roster to keep the updates going, etc. And likely a storyline with strong mythos which would have changes on the game itself throughout the subscription (which again, would warrant a large amount of teseter; even if just players logging so many test hours for a reduction in subscription price)
It's not mindlessly tossing money for similar quality we get today. That's why I said after people got sick of the cheapy F2P that is going around, some company would get the idea for a high end, quality game that would justify they price. Add in in game monitoring to shut down abuses when noticed, instead of people maybe reading enough forum posts that someone might eventually stop it when they manage to make it in after the weekend. Who knows, with that amount of funding they could even find a threshold that prevents gold farmers from killing the economy, they'd have enough to work on. Would even be willing to pay more, but again it would need to justify the price at the same time. I'd get more enjoyment from such a game, than the people spending hundreds a month on their stupid mocchachinos, at any rate. And for less money at that.