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2 Things needed to stop the game from dying.
mostrandomist
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 75
I love this game, I really do. But as it is right now the game won't last. There's nothing to do at max level aside from epic dungeons...which are no different in any real manner compared to their non-epic counterparts. There's just no sense of progression or areas to explore anymore in the game. As such, I see 2 changes that must be made in order for this game to survive TESO and any other upcoming mmos.
1) You must allow players to create persistent zones.
This solves the problem of not having more than 1 quest path and starting area for every single character made. I can't tell you how bored I was leveling up my third character. I didn't want to play the main missions but I didn't have a choice because the foundry limits on exp and rewards are too restrictive to ignore.
The foundry needs to be less restrictive. If ppl want to play exp grinding maps because they lack all self control...let them. That's their prerogative. The reason any game with a creation tool (skyrim, fallout, NWN1-2) are so popular and give their respective games long lifespans is because it allows players to play the game as they see fit. You can't add a toolset laden with restrictions and expect the same benefits.
2) Add a rebirth system.
This would address the issue of quick progression in the game, as well as offer a nearly unlimited sense of progression. Just give a small stat boost or something as incentive to relevel, so that ppl can continue progressing on their favorite character.
Just so you know, I no longer play this game. There's simply no reason to. I have max level characters with the gear I want. There are no new areas to explore, and no reason to play the foundry since you wont get anything sellable on the AH from them. I want to play this game more in the future, but as it is right now, I can't justify spending time on it.
Please make these changes. Your game's selling point depends on having player created content. Either you make it powerful enough that players get the enjoyment of using the content to play how they prefer (hence why other games with toolsets succeeded so much) or your game dies. You just have to accept that players will always love to play games they can customize. Neverwinter has the power to do this in an online setting, you just need to allow the players to take advantage of it.
1) You must allow players to create persistent zones.
This solves the problem of not having more than 1 quest path and starting area for every single character made. I can't tell you how bored I was leveling up my third character. I didn't want to play the main missions but I didn't have a choice because the foundry limits on exp and rewards are too restrictive to ignore.
The foundry needs to be less restrictive. If ppl want to play exp grinding maps because they lack all self control...let them. That's their prerogative. The reason any game with a creation tool (skyrim, fallout, NWN1-2) are so popular and give their respective games long lifespans is because it allows players to play the game as they see fit. You can't add a toolset laden with restrictions and expect the same benefits.
2) Add a rebirth system.
This would address the issue of quick progression in the game, as well as offer a nearly unlimited sense of progression. Just give a small stat boost or something as incentive to relevel, so that ppl can continue progressing on their favorite character.
Just so you know, I no longer play this game. There's simply no reason to. I have max level characters with the gear I want. There are no new areas to explore, and no reason to play the foundry since you wont get anything sellable on the AH from them. I want to play this game more in the future, but as it is right now, I can't justify spending time on it.
Please make these changes. Your game's selling point depends on having player created content. Either you make it powerful enough that players get the enjoyment of using the content to play how they prefer (hence why other games with toolsets succeeded so much) or your game dies. You just have to accept that players will always love to play games they can customize. Neverwinter has the power to do this in an online setting, you just need to allow the players to take advantage of it.
Post edited by mostrandomist on
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PART of the issue is the game went open beta with SO many glitches gear FLOODED the market way faster than it should have making it MUCH easier to get gear than intended.
That said, I am hoping the gaunt and future expansion alleviate the issue of nothing to do at 60.. I find myself somewhat in this scenario but love to PVP (broken or not) and will keep doing that for fun!
Overall:
1) Agree 100%, they need to just put some type of cap to avoid players lvling to 60 in an hour... But they also need to give incentive to run foundry... Right now there is NONE.
2) I like this idea... IMO, they should just have a +1 to all roll stats and you can ONLY rebirth 1 time... This gives incentive to relevel again... Its not a big enough difference for most people and its not small enough to be meaningless either...
Just a Thought...(Make it somewhere deep in the ocean or on another Plane. ROFL)
People would complain about nothing to do at cap, Then others will tell em to Reincarnate and run the same stuff over again and again and again, for some tiny stat bonus. In my opinion Reincarnation just hides the fact the game does not have enough end game content. The problem never really gets solved unless we have more content. No 2 ways about it.
Reincarnation would have to be done differently obviously in Neverwinter, But i feel with this type of system it can have a snowball effect and cause the devs to come out with actual content updates at a slower pace. It is like they have a elbow to lean on. When players get bored they can just tell em to shut it and reincarnate, Instead of addressing the lack of content issue. This can be bad.
Personally would rather them just add more content then any type of grindy TR system. I am on my third toon and to be honest there is not really that much content to begin with. Can fly by it pretty fast. I could not imagine running this same stuff forever even if the bonus was good for any type of rebirth. That type of grind could backfire and just get you fed up in general with the game.
Personally i think ,They need to lower the xp. Add around 24 more dungeons to low, mid and high level range. Add 2 or 3 more actual adventure zones to the map and call it a day.. Then when we get bored, add more.
Just my 2 cents, I am all for new content, Just kinda leery about Reincarnation after experiencing 3 years of it with barely minimal content added from Turbine. It literally became a excuse not release new end game stuff. Even now there trying new ways to keep people playing by adding new grindy options for epic true reincarnation and slacking on the new maps. Most of the players just want new missions to run. Not recycled down stuff with the option to TR. It can get quite frustrating with a true reincarnation system in place. It can become to grindy, especially if the devs start making content that requires those past lives and bonus to complete.
So not signed for Reincarnation, Signed for more original content though!
Game was supposed to be a single-player co-op game, but they made it into an MMO where you go to a quest giver and then go off to some instanced dungeon. They were better off keeping 'singe player' type of gameplay where you could go and explore huge world and find random enemies and dungeons on your way to quests.
They should do something like what TESO is doing with dungeons in the open world.
Why not add a few selected foundry quests to this list each day with difficulty of levels 59 through 65 for a group of 5. Allow us to PUG for these from this list?
You need alternate grinds, like setting up a viable way to get rank10 enchantments past opening boxes or microtransactions. You need true tier sets for content when it's released, that you can purchase with currency (like drake seals, but vastly more time consuming) etc. The *True* grinds in the long-term successful mmo's are gear and alternate character advancement based, not content based.
Something like in other games where you're required to do your daily for 3-4 weeks for a current best in tier weapon, etc. This not only means you *CAN* raid if you want, but you can also get the best group stuff if you're willing to put the time in...and also makes it actually worth investing time. As it stands you could run dungeon delves forever and not complete your set, which is not only frustrating, but makes actual adventuring pointless when you could Broker dive or do Tradeskills as a more viable path to just buy adventure gear.
Definitely worth thinking about for future development.But for now priority should go into getting the game as a whole into release standard on the content available.
The problem is, there's lack of reason to do it. Players spend 40-50 min on a foundry to get 1 GREEN ITEM? even worse sometime the items are unusable. The reward should at least be blue
I'm sorry but 1000 Astral Diamond for 40 min foundry is just not worth the effort. Player will just pick the same quick 15 min foundry again and again grinding over it.
Foundry Reward require significant improvement to motivate player doing it. They should scale on length of time it take to complete it. 15 min foundry 1500 AD, 30 min foundry 3000 AD, 50 min foundry should reward 5000 Astral Diamond, see the pattern?
Otherwise people it will just pick the same 15 min foundry doing 4 same one over and over for just 4000 AD.
Other than that, I don't see how this game would survive in long term, there is no world roam, you just instant teleport from city to forest to cave. Reaching max level is just too easy, yet there is not much to do at high level other than grind same end-game dungeon.
Actually DDO's TR system is a very good system and it does not require you to TR to find stuff to do. There are plenty of things to do at end game some of which requires parties some of which you can do alone. I have played DDO for over 3 years now and have just recently TR'd my main into her fourth life, not because I am bored at end game but because I have a vision of what I want my toon to be and to make her stronger. They add plenty of content all the time which lessens the grind on a first life or 3rd+ life toon. I like playing solo or with my husband unless I need to raid DDO allows that however Neverwinter does not...There is nothing in DDO that requires you have past lifes, or certain classes except for traps which actually require disarming unlike neverwinters where you can see most the traps as a non rogue before you even get to them and just avoid them, it's not even necessary to disarm em.
There are several things neverwinter should do and what the OP listed are two of the good ideas including the rebirth system. There is no need to make the amount of xp needed to be doubled but who wouldn't like to be able to tr and choose a different class with an added benefit of the first life they had, and get those couple extra stats that makes them slightly more powerful than someone who has never tr'd.
Neverwinter really needs more soloable/duo content than they currently have, you can do this in foundrys but as stated there is no incentive at all to do a foundry it's not worth it the rewards suck.
I got to 60 and pretty much quit, I do not like pvp and having nothing to do but pvp or dungeon delves in hopes that something I need might drop and then praying it doesn't get ninja'd is not my idea of fun. The fact that all dungeons are pretty much the same at the end where you have a boss that spawns tons and tons of adds is also not my idea of fun.
Like all MMO's there are several good things and several bad things about them. The person who one day takes and combines all the good stuff into one MMO will be the most successful MMO out there. Neverwinter could be that game but they need to do a lot of stuff first, two of which the OP listed, others would be that end game gear needs to be BOP, take some of the restrictions off foundry allow people to actually freely create and give incentives to run them.
I like a good story.
I would indicate that they do have long term incentives to play the game, the crafting system (still basic) has the capacity to grow rich and provide many attributes that one seeks in a long term hobby. The ah/exchange system is a tycoon bonanza. A nod at events, which will play a major part in keeping things spiced up.
Bottom line is this;
People will devour content faster than you can successfully implement.
- Rumblings of a scruffy human
The after 60 grind bores me. 4 foundry quests for AD? That's an hour IF you only pick 15 minute quests. Most of my guild simply does Bill's Tavern repeatedly to grind for the AD.
I had never reached end game in any game prior to this. I find repeatedly having to run through dungeons to be tedious. The obsession with gear score and the sometimes elitist attitude people have regarding them is a turn off.
One thing that has helped me stay interested in other games is a good crafting system. Neverwinter's is tedious and boring. For me, the re-birthing idea is a good one and I would like to see a re-vamped crafting system that is more engaging and interactive for when I get bored of fighting.
This, along with the other responses about the lack of content, is why I say that opening up the foundry so that players can make persistent zones and improve foundry rewards (through more AD, foundry tokens with a shop, ect.) should be a priority for the game developers. They don't actually need to make much content at all if they gave players the ability to make zones like the tower district and attach dungeons and whole campaigns to those districts. It would solve most of the content issues for the devs (aside from making new classes, monsters, ect.) while giving players a huge number of options for where and how to level up their characters. This = No repetition.
They have a similar set up for guilds to get guild perks and what not, yet another something to do at max level. I'm actually sort of surprised this wasn't implemented right off the bat.
1. 1-10 tokens of your current level tier would ALWAYS drop out of the final chest
2. Bonus 500 astral diamonds the first time you do a foundry quest you have never done before, must be atleast an average of 15min long. This promotes people actually playing other content than just the top 5-10.
Also an overhaul of the daily system.
1. Normal daily stays the same
2. Add a weekly that requires you to play 5-10 DIFFERENT foundry quests to be eligible. Larger AD reward
3. Add a monthly that requires you to play 25 different foundry quests to be eligible. Larder AD reward
all those would require 15min minimum foundries.
And another idea is achievements for finishing foundries you have never done before.
10 unique foundries = Achievement + Common Dye Pack
25 Unique foundries = Achievement + Common Dye Pack + Special Cloak Skin
50 Unique foundries = Achievement + Common Dye Pack + Special Weapon skin
100 Unique Foundries = Achievement + Rare Dye Pack + Purple Lesser Enhancement + Title
150 Unique Foundries = Achievement + Rare Dye Pack + Special Armor Set Skin
200 Unique Foundries = Achievement + Rare Dye Pack + Special Companion Skins for all default companions
All these items would be Character Bound, Destroyable and reclaimable from the NPC for all characters on your account.
Thats just the start, many tweaks to control of the foundry will be needed as well.
Dreamscapes Campaign
I. Darkly Dreaming / NW-DPSH505XY +Daily Foundry!!
II. Shattered Dreams / NW-DGARDHDR7
1. exit and receive your loot.
2. Go to the next section.
The more sections you finish in one session the better the loot reward when you exit.
Random foundry quests could also be tossed in to give authors some exposure.
Was feeling jaded about the game at end of May, went on a two-week holiday and no longer have the incentive to log back in.
I've got 2 lvl 60 chars with varying degrees of epic gear but don't feel the 'need' to have to finish them off.