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Cleric just not fun! No reason to put money into them.
herbie1347
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 11 Arc User
The Devoted Cleric wasn't the funnest class to start with in this game. Now that the newest patch all but ruined it. There is very little reason to keep playing. They gimp our self heals so that we have to use potions. They say they don't want us to have the "gold" advantage over other characters. (Really like gold is the most valuable currency in the game) We can't really heal for a lot compared to damage output. We are squishy (can't take a few good hits) Our damage is bottom of the barrel. The damage loss doesn't make up for the HAMSTER heals. You remove the stacking of Astral Shield. Why, you don't want healing from two or more things? But I can take damage from multiple things? This really limits the survivability.
Bottom line the class is not fun to play. So there is no reason to put money into a class that is not fun. We are here for that reason. Perfect World doesn't want to provide fun, someone else will.
Bottom line the class is not fun to play. So there is no reason to put money into a class that is not fun. We are here for that reason. Perfect World doesn't want to provide fun, someone else will.
Post edited by herbie1347 on
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First, I don't believe the patch ruined the class, I just believe it's core mechanics aren't engaging at all. Now that we are heal turrets, it's especially glaring. I think the class heals well on the whole but it does not have many options on a heal-on-demand lifesaver option that practically every MMO has given each healer version one of. An Oh Sh-- Card, if you will. Double Astral stacking was boring, and I'm glad it's dead. I used to be a potion-holic, but now with the new aggro changes I simply do not get hit unless someone in the party dies. Or drops all the mobs on my head, very funny CW's. And I only really feel squishy in PvP (Which is just a whole barrel of laughable brokenness anyways), although before I was able to start upping my defense awhile ago I did take some nasty hits.
Our lack of offense is especially troubling to me. I've enjoyed healers in every MMO I have played, and although I never mained a shadow/damage healer, I always enjoyed the option to slide into that role for a change of pace. We don't have that option currently (although Paragon Path's do open up the possibility sometime in the future), right now we are basically the kings of slap-fighting.
Yea we do need a sort of oh **** skill to help with any sudden bursts of healing as atm there isnt that great amount of thought behind healing, just spam skills as and when they come off cd. But i dont really agree with our lack of offense? Im specced deep healer and if im finding it a little to easy on the healing i swap in a couple dps skills and can easily come up only 300-400k dps shorter of a TR at the end of the instance. 10-16k crits are pretty nice when you have 35% crit chance.
Total healing output, however, seems problematic and as so many have mentioned, I think we're seeing how lopsided total HPS was toward Astral Shield right now. Without having it as a fire and forget cure-all for having to actively heal, we're finding that the other heal options are either badly underpowered or clunky.
Those of you looking for a more "pure" healing experience have a pretty understandable point, though. In my opinion, talented heals need a large bump to make them worthwhile. As an example, Prophecy of Doom can be talented to heal at the end of its cycle, but the heal is pretty small compared to cooldown of the ability. If this was bigger, it'd create a large heal that would make a "bursty" healing build, rather than a small blip in total output. Stinkers like Bastion of Health need to be much larger, or much lower cooldowns for a more "pure" healing spell. Heal on critical hits from offensive abilities could be bigger, etc.
One recent dungeon I had the tank keep screaming at me (literally screaming, he was using a mic), to 'keep the circle (aka, Astral shield) up'. I tried explaining to him that with the new patch the duration was only 10 secs and the CD about 15 so there was 5 secs of downtime, but he just didn't get it.
I have never played Cleric class, but I've seen a cleric who deals sooooo much damage in PvP it only took 5 secs to kill me with 23k hp and 20% dmg resist(Im a TR) and then that cleric switches to heal build in PvE.
And cleric can solo pretty well, just have a tank companion.
A cleric can not solo! There are some quest bosses that a cleric simply can't kill alone. If anybody says differently, then I'd like to see video proof of it, so I can study how the heck they did it.
I think I did every quest boss but the last one solo before the AS nerf and all that I have tried on another Cleric alt that I just got to 60. Admittedly I hit 60 in both cases before I got to the last boss on Whispering Caverns so have not tried that on my Clerics, but am pretty sure I have done every other boss solo.
It just occurred to me that I do have the rank 30 Dire Wolf companion though, as opposed to rather than the rank 15 Guardian, maybe that helps.....
That Rogue was either new to instances or not at the top of his game. Our TR usually demolishes the meters, I'm talking just flat-out ridiculous numbers that would take so many of me to match I can't even think of a proper number without drifting into the realm of fantasy. Perhaps it's the full swash and CN items, perhaps I just don't try to DPS as hard as I should, but I have a 40% crit chance on my cleric (39.6 IIRC) before group buffs, capped recovery, and high power, and if I ever ended up within spitting distance of a TR in damage I would not think highly of that Rogue.
You need to play Cleric and see our damage numbers. I'm not trying to be rude, but I think you would be shocked at how pathetically low our damage is outside of a tri-crit Hammer of Fate. I'm not sure exactly when my CW alt surpassed my level 60, very nicely geared Cleric in single-target damage output, but it wouldn't shock me if you said late 30s/early 40s. I made a TR to get to 11 just to pray and earn coins, but I bet at 60 it would be like comparing tee ball to the Olympics.
Well, it's more of a support class, isn't it. It is pretty hard to support things to death, and as levels get higher the companions susceptible to death fall more quickly. This places the cleric in the position of supporting nothing, while lacking the personal damage to do the job solo effectively.
It may be, especially with the changes, that DCs can't effectively be a lone wolf, and will have to pair up with at least one other player to sail reasonably smoothly to the top. I don't think that would be all that strange or unexpected for a support class, really.
I did everything solo 1-60. Difficulty varies with levels, there is no constant balance. Also if you do anything else besides quests - foundry, pvp, dungeons, skirmishes etc. you will outlevel the quests and they will be easier then (mobs don't scale to your level like in foundry).
Daunting light is pretty much the only skill we got for burst dmg. Should aoe one-shot all weak mobs. (at lower levels chains of blazing light is awesome aoe)
AS is bad for solo play, FF is good for staying alive. (at low levels healing word)
Sunburst for quick divinity and AP gain, small heal.
foresight gives another 10 % resistance to damage and holy fervor to faster regain AP
Flame strike for daily at low level... when you get hallowed ground feated helps you remain alive at bosses. Hammer of fate at high levels does nice dmg, but usually I still prefered flame strike aoe/small stun.
For at wills I ran with lance till I got sacred flame then with that. And most of the time with astral seal, brand of the sun sometimes at high level.
Cleric companion, there really is no other choice... yea welcome to perfect world.
Gear... recovery, critical, defense, power.
It gets hard as you near 60 but its' doable.
that is why the developers did it! they just basically hate the cleric and everyone who rolls that char.
Soloed my way to 60 with cleric and switched between tank companion and cleric companion, ressed them when ever they died. I will admit that it wasn't completely easy compared to the others.
I use Rank 15 tank companion. I start by throwing down Astral Shield, and toss an Astral Seal on several of the mobs I am fighting, spam Sacred Flame, Sun Burst on cooldown, then rotate Astral Shield and Forgemaster's Flame (only use both of these in divine mode) when needed. I have Hallowed Ground and Divine armor as my dailies, I normaly use Hallowed Ground when I use a daily, mostly when I am fighting a boss or a large group. I have yet to have any issues. And that really isn't a special strategy, I consider myself to still be learning. So how is it my cluseless self can have such an easy time of it? *boggle*
I am few levels behind your lvl38 cleric and for some reason, I find it almost more entertaining to level up than my GF. I am in AWE when I clear a group of minions with one single divine Daunting Light (Frikking 2k crits already at my lvl :O )
Also the normal dungeons seems to be quite funny, though had some problems in skirmishes when ppl was too stubborn to stay in the red circles. Oh ye, I also cleared the Mad Dragon lair on first try when on my GF we wiped several times and leaving the dungeon unfinished eventually.
True, mad dragon was nerfed a bit, but only the health pool.
All in all, I find DC quite enjoying to level atleast at this moment.
Uhm. I just hit lvl 60 today. I've solo-ed everything, and I mean EVERYTHING that I could solo.
It was rather easy to be honest.. I haven't bought ANY potions ( just the ones from looting I used).. compared to my GWF leveling experience, it was VERY easy.
I have had no problems with either.
GWF is only a bit "hard" before your cleric companion and before you learn how to manage the class.
I think I might have lvled a bit slower and ended up on harder stuff before I got 50 skills but now I'm 50 its easy as anything takes a bit longer to kill then a rogue say but still easy
Greater tenebrous works just as good for clerics as they do for any other class. You can destroy a target very quickly. Even without tenes, you can still stack your 3 dots and nuke. It kills fairly fast if you are using the high prophet set.
Then you dont play your cleric well enough. I soloed everything from 1-60, I had issues with 1 single boss that actually killed me, the rimewolf or whatever it's called in the frost zone. But then again, I see people screaming for 2x clerics for dungeons as simple as epic Idris and so on.
Forgemaster's Flame, Sunburst and Healing Word is enough to get you to 50, at 50 you pick up astral shield. Then you are set for dungeons with FMF, SB and AS. Just remember to bring coffee so you dont fall asleep now that tanks hold aggro.
So far I've had zero issues since patch, sure I havent tried CN yet, but most other things are just easy now with the aggro changes, even though AS was "nerfed". PvP is harder, atleast CWs are too much still.
You also have to remember, dont bring more than AS as a pure healing skill and FMF as a backup, cos if you bring to many healing skills, you will be divinity starved unless you slot the class feature, a slot that is better saved for foresight and +15% healing. With the aggro changes, sooth is a waste.
It helps if you try to actually understand how your powers work and the importance of mobility. People not wanting to dodge or even just MOVE seems to be a majority of the problem with a lot of players (not just clerics) When I went through, I used chains of blazing light, searing light and prophecies of doom. And I'm pretty sure that would be considered less than ideal by the more adept/hardcore players out there. And remember, just because you're a cleric doesn't mean you shouldn't use potions.
--Part 1: Spells and Coin (NW-DHM3XQVQK)
--Part 2: A Blind Eye (NW-DI3QTHZGJ)
--Part 3: Dodo's Dinner (NW-DHPA8O253)
-One Shots
--The Wizard of Eldeur (NW-DRKQNE4S7)
chains of blazing light + sunburst and all of the trash mobs are dead in a solo fight.
then you just have the tough guy or two left to deal with. cant really see the problem.
OMG you made my day ^_^. btw I still play DC and still agree that nerfing AS badly like that is hurting the class.
We simply co-ordinate our skills together to give us that 4 second delay. For Example, Cws can use Steal Time or smokescreen from rogues, to give us vital seconds (Or simply just DODGE AND RUN AROUND). To everyone who complains about DC, its not hard to play. Just learn how to play.
side note: DCs have no right to complain, considering CWs have been bugged to hell. so yeh consider DCs lucky
- Kris@KayDotEl - Dragon
I have a cleric, and right now i use him with all offensive skills less astral shield, and you are right, if we take you with our hammer, we make a lot of damage, more daunting and stirling pierce or ff, i can take you by surprise and kill you, but, that is not the point.
The point is the AS coold down and that we have not sustitute. Now the skill heal less, his cd is high and we have 5 secs without it, about stacks 2 shields, thats seems me right.
And in other games maybe one skill not be a trouble, but in this game the main skill of the healer is AD, we dont have nothing to put in his place, nothing, and that is the truly problem. Bastion is a HAMSTER, restauration is a HAMSTER...
Maybe in pve we can do our job of the same way, but in pvp we had been completly nerfed. Now i cant hold like before healing the team, now i have to play other rol, and the best rol for me in pvp now is forget about heal people, just AD and hit like the others. Obviously we are not the best doing that, but neither we are so bad like people believes. Im really surprised about the damage of one of our dailys, is awesome, more than 10ks of damage, for a DC, not bad at all.