It is an example of fight mechanic not involving throwing adds and more adds.
The best encounter are the one which need coordination, and a DPS race against rage mechanics. THe cracking the wall above to lower fire DOT is an example of good mechanic. The fire DOT growing stronger over time is the DPS race.
The inconvenience in my experience is that often PUG are left out to hang dry, or people get filtered by GS, better leaving such mechanic for higher level dungeon.
At the moment all the dungeon i went thru had a mechanic of jsut throwing more adds. Which is very cheap.
I had that tonight...problem is I'm the cleric.
I couldn't dodge anything. No dodging leads to no healing. No healing leads to no survivors. No survivors leads to...suffering.
We quit out. Changing shadows and lighting to low quality and then high quality improved the floor but it was still seemed off, almost like there was 3 layers of warning lights and it just messed me up hard.
I had that issue too can't see those little red circles that telegraph his super move.
Meh all these people saying 2 DC and other certain class comps are the only ways to win these fights are beyond wrong. We have done them all easily with me being a GF 1 DC 1 Wiz as the regulars I run with and the other 2 we fill with any class it doesn't even matter what. We have also done all of them with NO rogue btw at least once.
Out of the 3 Mad Dragon, Frozen Heart, Karrundax - We found Mad Dragon to be the easiest, in fact at the end the first time we were saying "um I thought this was supposed to be hard", though the PUG Rogue we had said most groups don't normally do it so well. The only real trick here was to target the healer adds first.
Karrundax, the biggest thing for us was to target the Wyrmlings first as soon as they spawned and to make sure we all focused fired one of them at a time. Also, our Rogue on the boss was directed to aim the boss away from the group so we didn't have to deal with it's 1 shot breath AOE. As a GF in this fight I slot enforced threat and Bull Charge and Frontline Surge so I can keep the pressure off our Cleric better while we deal with the Wyrmlings.
Frozen Heart is the hardest imo. This one is a pain because it's just impossible to kill the adds. Several Golems at once is a very dangerous thing and all the adds (except archers) have a ton of HP and use lots of CC. The only real way we manage to finish this without doing some stupid perching of the Cleric. Is for the Cleric to kite the big adds around while someone runs around killing archers.
The last time we did Frozen Heart we had 2 rogues, 1 wiz, 1 DC , me(GF) and it was the hardest run we've done. The Rogues failed on the boss because one of them had graphics glitch where the ground was black and he couldn't see the small circles from the boss AOE. The other Rogue just wasn't very good at dodging them. We ended up having me (GF) tank the boss with the one Rogue without the graphics glitch (who died twice halfway through and couldn't be ressed). The other Rogue worked on archers near the DC while the CW both targeted archers and helped me with the boss a bit.
One major thing with this boss is to have whoever is tanking it keep him turned away from the rest of the party. That way his aoe's aren't a danger to them. If your Rogue or whoever is tanking the boss has issues with the aoe that has tons of little circles. Tell them not to try dodging it, but to just take a couple steps into a spot without a circle. This aoe is literally ridiculously easy to just walk away from with only 1-3 steps of movement. (you can even be partially standing in the little circles and not get hit). He also telegraphs the move before hand with his arms/hands so you make sure not to be stuck in a long animation skill when it hits because you do have to react quickly once the circles show up.
The biggest thing I want to get across here is you can do these with any party composition. As long as you have 1 DC and 1 CW you are golden for the most part. Yes we have done all of them with GWF's and even double GF's..
WOW 1 person who doesn't use 2 clerics. can't believe people are saying they have hard runs when they go with 2clerics lol. i just hope the constant insane add spawning on most bosses is going to be fixed because doing frozen heart and then the 20minute fight afterwards clearing the adds because they haven't despawned because there fighting the stupid NPC and then still stay there if we all die. my normal group comp is 1DC 1TR 1GF 1CW and then any last spot because the 4main are me and my mates, although we do cheese castle never with 2DC because it's boring.
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ausdoerrtMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
My group usually focuses down the additional adds like imps and legion devils. We never touch the Hellfire Magi since they are continuous spawns. We just try out best to dodge. We clear the first wave and come second wave all single target DPS focuses down the Stormdevil. We never touch the Erineyes, as they cast an AoE heal at 2 pegs while doing very little damage.
In Frozen Heart I also had the floor that looked like the night sky rather than a white ice sheet, I had did the instance a couple of times before I realised it was to do with my graphics settings I fluked it once as a DC kiting the adds, then saw a post on one of the forums that I had to lower my shader to low then I could see faint red circles which was enough to get me by.
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shamuzaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 2Arc User
I see your Frozen Heart and raise you Caverns of Karrundax, it's like a 30 min fight at least.
Mad Dragon is harder then both of them on Epic because the 3 Erinyes that spawn at 30% are dumb. If you change the Erinyes heal to have a cast time, have a much larger cooldown, not heal for over 70k, or not be a stupidly large AoE the fight will be fine and much more doable.
The dragons have a lot of health, a LOT of health. We have lowered their health internally and that change should go out with the major content patch mentioned in the state of the game.
That fight, like many in Neverwinter, is about add control. Take them down first prioritizing the minions and maguseseses since they go down faster, leaving someone poking the dragon and making him angry while everyone else focuses on adds and the dragon secondarily. Its pretty brutal at the moment.
Dragons should be tough and have boatloads of health, but this constant add spam HAMSTER is quite frankly lazy cookie cutter design. Why on earth would that dragon have or even want the minions he spawn? Dragons needing "help" with adventurers is silly.
I did the normal Lair of the Mad Dragon twice this weekend. Once with my 60 GF while helping a level 31 cleric friend with it. The 2 of us got to the last dragon without him dying but that fight he died pretty quick and it took me 25 minutes just beating on the dragon and adds to finish it. He got some GWF gear for his alt at least.
Then I went back through with my 32 cleric and a full group of guildies. One of them was a 60 GF and the rest of us lived to the end except for 1 TR and 1 CW. That was much faster than a GF beating on it by himself.
I see your Frozen Heart and raise you Caverns of Karrundax, it's like a 30 min fight at least.
I'm sorry, epic Karrundax is more a ~5 mins fight. Get your team behind the bosses feets, dps it, have the CW permastunning adds and it's done. Epic Frozen heart is really tougher, since golems can't be controlled, but it's more a 10 mins fight.
Really, Karrundax is already super easy, if you dumb it down even more it'll be completely stupid. I haven't seen a wipe with zone chat "premade" teams in a week at least.
The lvl 36 or so dungeon (that's the level I got it at) is a well made dungeon. We started off with a 5 man party, and by the time we got to the foundry mini-boss one party member had dc'd so I kicked him (gone over 15 min) and I think the rogue dropped the dungeon. The first go at the foundry resulted in a wipe (2 cw and 1 DC). I swapped out one of my powers for my push (swap it out for dungeons since it is mostly rudely used). The next go we organized a lot better and started pulling small groups of mob off the gems (the first go we kind of played like we still had the 2 melees yet - oops) and by the time the boss rolled around, he went down quick.
The final boss took 30-45 minutes to beat. We got wiped once since at some point something agro'd two groups which was way too much for us to handle so it ended badly. At that point we all swapped to our gf companions and tried it again and were able to manage the groups a lot better. We broke it down into 6 sections and took out the lower 3 groups, then the central 2. Then we got the boss witch aggro'd and did a retreating fight down to the lower level.
At that point it was keep the companions alive, dodge the 1k dmg stun balls, mitigate the ad's with anything that froze, or slowed them down while spamming the boss with AOE to damage her add spawns, spamming her with single target spells, and generally keeping each other alive.
Easier to fight than the dragon. At most the ad-hoc I was in got it down to 50% before the add's took over. A GF is not the best weapon of choice against a magus due to the unblock-able circle of knock-down for 1.5k damage and no dodge ability.
Out leveled it, never completed it, probably won't even bother to ever try it again.
i did same o.o. But now i hit level 60 and have no experienc with dungeons and how to do them. it's preety hard to learn it now.
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trickyflokiMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 28Arc User
edited June 2013
I'm going to present a very foreign concept to most mmo players out there: if you are being overwhelmed by adds on mad dragon, slow down or stop dpsing the boss to clear out the adds. This is very very important to do before the dragon hits 30% and spawns the large add wave with the erinyes. Once that spawn happens I have noticed most people go for the largest demon... do not!, focus one erinye with all dps and have the cw constantly cc the other 2 erinyes. They cast massive AoE heals which can make the last 30% of the fight absolutely miserable.
Comments
It is an example of fight mechanic not involving throwing adds and more adds.
The best encounter are the one which need coordination, and a DPS race against rage mechanics. THe cracking the wall above to lower fire DOT is an example of good mechanic. The fire DOT growing stronger over time is the DPS race.
The inconvenience in my experience is that often PUG are left out to hang dry, or people get filtered by GS, better leaving such mechanic for higher level dungeon.
At the moment all the dungeon i went thru had a mechanic of jsut throwing more adds. Which is very cheap.
BLOOD neverwinter wiki - http://neverwinteronline.wikia.com/wiki/NeverwinterOnline_Wiki
I had that issue too can't see those little red circles that telegraph his super move.
WOW 1 person who doesn't use 2 clerics. can't believe people are saying they have hard runs when they go with 2clerics lol. i just hope the constant insane add spawning on most bosses is going to be fixed because doing frozen heart and then the 20minute fight afterwards clearing the adds because they haven't despawned because there fighting the stupid NPC and then still stay there if we all die. my normal group comp is 1DC 1TR 1GF 1CW and then any last spot because the 4main are me and my mates, although we do cheese castle never with 2DC because it's boring.
Not really. For example, Gray Wolf endboss is all about boss control, mobs are comparatively weak.
Comes back as an epic dungeon at 60. There is no escape.
Mad Dragon is harder then both of them on Epic because the 3 Erinyes that spawn at 30% are dumb. If you change the Erinyes heal to have a cast time, have a much larger cooldown, not heal for over 70k, or not be a stupidly large AoE the fight will be fine and much more doable.
Dragons should be tough and have boatloads of health, but this constant add spam HAMSTER is quite frankly lazy cookie cutter design. Why on earth would that dragon have or even want the minions he spawn? Dragons needing "help" with adventurers is silly.
Then I went back through with my 32 cleric and a full group of guildies. One of them was a 60 GF and the rest of us lived to the end except for 1 TR and 1 CW. That was much faster than a GF beating on it by himself.
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I'm sorry, epic Karrundax is more a ~5 mins fight. Get your team behind the bosses feets, dps it, have the CW permastunning adds and it's done. Epic Frozen heart is really tougher, since golems can't be controlled, but it's more a 10 mins fight.
Really, Karrundax is already super easy, if you dumb it down even more it'll be completely stupid. I haven't seen a wipe with zone chat "premade" teams in a week at least.
The final boss took 30-45 minutes to beat. We got wiped once since at some point something agro'd two groups which was way too much for us to handle so it ended badly. At that point we all swapped to our gf companions and tried it again and were able to manage the groups a lot better. We broke it down into 6 sections and took out the lower 3 groups, then the central 2. Then we got the boss witch aggro'd and did a retreating fight down to the lower level.
At that point it was keep the companions alive, dodge the 1k dmg stun balls, mitigate the ad's with anything that froze, or slowed them down while spamming the boss with AOE to damage her add spawns, spamming her with single target spells, and generally keeping each other alive.
Easier to fight than the dragon. At most the ad-hoc I was in got it down to 50% before the add's took over. A GF is not the best weapon of choice against a magus due to the unblock-able circle of knock-down for 1.5k damage and no dodge ability.
i did same o.o. But now i hit level 60 and have no experienc with dungeons and how to do them. it's preety hard to learn it now.