How classes could have been better

malakhglitch

I am a long time tabletop role-player, a self-proclaimed OSR player and have never touched D&D 4e, and vowed never to touch it even with a 10-foot pole. As a matter of fact a friend of mine is gloating that I am playing Neverwinter because of that, but I digress. The fact is I am playing Neverwinter and the game is growing on me like a fungus (icky thought I know).

I took a look at the D&D 4e Player's Handbook (the shame!) and immediately saw a missed opportunity when it came to classes.

The current Classes in Neverwinter are actually Builds instead of the actual Classes. Take for example the Paladin. The D&D 4e Paladin Class had 2 basic builds available in the Player's Handbook: Protecting Paladin and Avenging Paladin. With the release of a few more Powers another build comes up; Virtuous Paladin.

What Cryptic could have done, but chose not to, was have the Paladin Class with its Paragon Paths. Instead they made Builds = Classes, which, in my opinion, limits expansion of the Class by the simple addition of more Powers.

madbiskit

malakhglitch wrote: »

As a matter of fact a friend of mine is gloating that I am playing Neverwinter because of that, but I digress. The fact is I am playing Neverwinter and the game is growing on me like a fungus (icky thought I know).

Muahahahahaha

evilkinglarry

The classes themselves in 4E kind of direct you towards the builds themselves with certain powers having special effects if you have the matching class feature. So more often than not you stick to what gives you more benefit. Warlock is a big example of this. the decision to just use the build options may have been the better path because it let them work on in class synergy better. As for expansion of class there is always the epic paths they could add seeing as how level 60 in Neverwinter seems to translate as level 20 in 4E

Just to throw in some extra info, between just the three players handbooks, the power source supplement books and the Forgotten Realm's player's guide there are 24 base classes with roughly 3-4 build options per class that Cryptic could add down the line.

malakhglitch

There are 22, not 24, base classes. Twenty-five (25) if you count the non-core classes in EPG, FRPG and Dragon.

The classes in the PH are more than enough to go on since each of them has 2 builds and more were added in later supplements. In my opinion Cryptic needlessly limited themselves by going the "build = class" route. If we take your example of 24 classses with 3-4 builds each then we would wind up with 72 classes for Neverwinter due to the "class=build" route they took. A little too much methinks.

evilkinglarry

malakhglitch wrote: »

There are 22, not 24, base classes. Twenty-five (25) if you count the non-core classes in EPG, FRPG and Dragon.

The classes in the PH are more than enough to go on since each of them has 2 builds and more were added in later supplements. In my opinion Cryptic needlessly limited themselves by going the "build = class" route. If we take your example of 24 classses with 3-4 builds each then we would wind up with 72 classes for Neverwinter due to the "class=build" route they took. A little too much methinks.

You are right I did count wrong. There was 23 not 24 between the books I mentioned. Cleric, Fighter, Paladin, Ranger, Rogue, Warlord, Warlock, Wizard, Avenger, Barbarian, Bard, Druid, Invoker, Shaman, Sorcerer, Warden, Ardent, Battlemind, Monk, Psion, Runepriest, Seeker, Swordmage. Swordmage I counted because it was added within this games setting book. I didn't bother to include Assassin and Vampire mostly due to I don't have access to their info. Unsure if there are any other official classes besides those. And yeah, the idea of 72 classes is a touch on the absurd side. And realistically is most likely not going to happen. But until they do state that they will not be including any of the other build-classes I don't quite see how they limited themselves. Every option that just using the base classes can still be used by using the builds. But now by sacrificing greater powers selection they added in better in class synergy.

Using Build-classes vs Open-class creation also allows non-min/max and more casual players to be able to not mess up their characters. While that may come across as heresy to those who have a firm understanding of the games rules and min/max'ers, it really isn't a good idea socially, and definitely not financially, to make a system that will lead to players being put down and ostracized for unplayable builds. And with how MMOs work you'd have to interact with severely gimped characters more often than not.