GWF feels like a Barb

kimonagi

First i have to admit that i only played early levels but i have also watched alot of streams of the GWF class and from what i have played and seen it captures more the spirit of the barbarian class in D&D then the fighter class. Many of the abilities have a primal feel to them and the class seems to focus on mobility (Sprint and Evasion) which has always been a trademark of the Barb class.

Fighters are a defender role class, i think a great weapon fighter would be more of a parry type class with a weapon block instead of a shield block. Renaming it barbarian would also give cryptic/pwe more room to eventually add more customization to the fighter class. Would also give the impression of more diversity in the initial class selection then having two classe coming from the same base.

Thats my opinion anyway and i intend to play it whatever its name is

galvayra

Sprint and Evasion trademarks of the barbarian? i thought the trademarks were being illiterate and having strong muscular arms

kimonagi

3.X Barbarian abilities

Rage, Uncanny Dodge, Fast Movement (Sprint)

4th Edition Barbarian abilities

Roar, Swift Charge, Restoring strike

Maybe you just dont like the name?

pbuckleyhero

I agree wholeheartedly with the OP the barbarian is a trademark of D&D and while I haven't yet had the pleasure to play the game I feel leaving him out is just a wast. As the GWF it feels lackluster and flavorless but the Barbarian has flavor and character.

kimonagi

People have been complaining, including this player, about the lack of customization. Just by renaming this class into something that it already is could benefit everyone. After release cryptic could work with the already existing guardian fighter class and eventually make animations of them blocking with a 2 hander or two weapons. Same mechanic but they would parry attacks instead of blocking them with a shield. You use what is already in place instead of making whole new classes.

This could be applied to wizards in the same way by eventually making more implements instead of whole new wizard classes.

gorlotwoaxe

pbuckleyhero wrote: »

I agree wholeheartedly with the OP the barbarian is a trademark of D&D and while I haven't yet had the pleasure to play the game I feel leaving him out is just a wast. As the GWF it feels lackluster and flavorless but the Barbarian has flavor and character.

Barbarian is a trademark of D&D? Someone better exhume Robert E. Howard and the Western Roman Empire and get to suing.

kimonagi

gorlotwoaxe wrote: »

Barbarian is a trademark of D&D? Someone better exhume Robert E. Howard and the Western Roman Empire and get to suing.

Sigh... I really doubt he was refering to Wisigoths, Ostrogoths or Vandals.

darkgeardesigns

kimonagi wrote: »

First i have to admit that i only played early levels but i have also watched alot of streams of the GWF class and from what i have played and seen it captures more the spirit of the barbarian class in D&D then the fighter class. Many of the abilities have a primal feel to them and the class seems to focus on mobility (Sprint and Evasion) which has always been a trademark of the Barb class.

Fighters are a defender role class, i think a great weapon fighter would be more of a parry type class with a weapon block instead of a shield block. Renaming it barbarian would also give cryptic/pwe more room to eventually add more customization to the fighter class. Would also give the impression of more diversity in the initial class selection then having two classe coming from the same base.

Thats my opinion anyway and i intend to play it whatever its name is

However much I do agree with you. By now it is too far into development for this to be applicable. Were nearing launch and renaming a class, possibly retweeking it (for the long run of course) and such to allow the chance for more customization would be a possibly tremendous amount of work.

I do agree however that the GWF feels like a barbarian more than a fighter however I'm feeling something like this might be too late

kimonagi

darkgeardesigns wrote: »

However much I do agree with you. By now it is too far into development for this to be applicable. Were nearing launch and renaming a class, possibly retweeking it (for the long run of course) and such to allow the chance for more customization would be a possibly tremendous amount of work.

I do agree however that the GWF feels like a barbarian more than a fighter however I'm feeling something like this might be too late

They would only need to change the name of the class, the rest could be done after launch.

darkgeardesigns

kimonagi wrote: »

They would only need to change the name of the class, the rest could be done after launch.

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/000_Playtest_Barbarian.pdf

This is a barbarian. Note the whole primal thing.

I'm regretting my comment about how it felt more like a barbarian.

ALSO big thing. Barbarians don't wear heavy armor.

ofkathria

GWFs use scale armor. Isn't that considered medium? Also, there is at least one armor piece out there for them (and I'm hoping to see more) that looks very barbaric.

Anyway, whatever it's called, I'm perfectly happy with the class as it stands now. I thought I was going to have to wait for an actual Barbarian class in order to make a particular character I had in mind, but the Great Weapon Fighter turned out to have exactly the feel I wanted for her.

kimonagi

Aye, i like them too and it will be my first/main character at launch. Still feel that they capture more of a Barb feel. They are a leaping, sprinting, rage roaring warrior. We would have 5 distinct class at launch and the ability to work and eventually add more to those.

Anyway, thanks for the replies.

skeletun

I'm glad that I came across this post. I wanted to start one along the same lines. Everything about the GWF screams Barbarian. I had a female half-orc GWF that I played as a barbarian. She got the Blue weapon drop from the Cloak Tower that looked like a Barbaric club (Club with Blades in it), I equipped her with the Barbaric looking armor and gave her the Fur Boots. I really wish I had a picture because she looked and played like a Barbarian.

kimonagi

skeletun wrote: »

I'm glad that I came across this post. I wanted to start one along the same lines. Everything about the GWF screams Barbarian. I had a female half-orc GWF that I played as a barbarian. She got the Blue weapon drop from the Cloak Tower that looked like a Barbaric club (Club with Blades in it), I equipped her with the Barbaric looking armor and gave her the Fur Boots. I really wish I had a picture because she looked and played like a Barbarian.

Its what i will be doing too. Working on my character biography/background right now and i'll try to gear her with the most barbarian like gear i can find.

cerek2

kimonagi wrote: »

Its what i will be doing too. Working on my character biography/background right now and i'll try to gear her with the most barbarian like gear i can find.

I could be mistaken, but from what I can tell you'll be looking like a knight in shinning armor later on in the game. I think the progression takes you in that direction from all the videos / pictures I've seen. I also think it looks kinda funny seeing a horc in nice shinny armor, lol.

kimonagi

Its possible, i didnt really play with dyes and see how you can change armor appearance in the beta weekends.

nemesis788450

well i assume they wanted to do a mix between the two? i dont think we will see a barbarian class soon as it is too similar to the gwf...maybe a separate barbarian race?

llelowyn13

Every class has a sprint/dodge ability, every fighting class has a charge ability. The only thing that feels somewhat akin to Barbarian is the two handed weapon. I don't see the similarity as easily as you, my guess because I am not trying to make the fighter into a barbarian. Of course, fighter is a broad term used for many melee types. What happens when they release a great axe fighter, will that be 'barbarian #2' class?

bringthenoise001

I can kind of see similarities between a GWF and a Barbarian, but like in 4e the Barbarian is a striker doing predominately single target damage with a huge two handed weapon and rage strikes while soaking up damage through feeling no pain. I believe their is room for both GWFs and Barbarians as their is room for various melee warriors.

memorythought

I think the GWF really just does double duty and you'll be changing around your looks in the cosmetic pain to be either more of a barb or a more soldiery type of GWF.

darkgeardesigns

Big fan of Actual table top DnD (I actually play two Chars one being a Barb.)

Being a DnD based game however there is likely no issue with you identifying your char as a Barbarian if your into rp and such. There are plenty of armor sets (orcs in the cloak tower drop them) that would look great for a Barb look. So you can technically build yourself with Barb like skills and look just like one.

Not what your looking for but that should make it bearable

bringthenoise001

darkgeardesigns wrote: »

Big fan of Actual table top DnD (I actually play two Chars one being a Barb.)

Being a DnD based game however there is likely no issue with you identifying your char as a Barbarian if your into rp and such. There are plenty of armor sets (orcs in the cloak tower drop them) that would look great for a Barb look. So you can technically build yourself with Barb like skills and look just like one.

Not what your looking for but that should make it bearable

OR they will release a Barbarian Class that will rock!(I'm looking at you Cryptic)

skeletun

llelowyn13 wrote: »

Every class has a sprint/dodge ability, every fighting class has a charge ability. The only thing that feels somewhat akin to Barbarian is the two handed weapon. I don't see the similarity as easily as you, my guess because I am not trying to make the fighter into a barbarian. Of course, fighter is a broad term used for many melee types. What happens when they release a great axe fighter, will that be 'barbarian #2' class?

How do you sprint? I was trying to figure that out, but could only do the dodge on the other classes.
Dodge for the GWF was like a 3 second sprint. It was great for getting around town and faster than all the other classes for this purpose.
As far as "Great Axe Figher"? you gotta be kidding right? Great WEAPON = ALL large weapons (Swords, Clubs, AXEs) that require two hands.

kotli

ofkathria wrote: »

GWFs use scale armor. Isn't that considered medium? Also, there is at least one armor piece out there for them (and I'm hoping to see more) that looks very barbaric.

Anyway, whatever it's called, I'm perfectly happy with the class as it stands now. I thought I was going to have to wait for an actual Barbarian class in order to make a particular character I had in mind, but the Great Weapon Fighter turned out to have exactly the feel I wanted for her.

In 3.5 Scale mail is medium armour that comes between Hide and Chainmail in terms of stats. The best medium armour for fighters assuming minimum DEX is the Breastplate in 3.5.
3.5 Heavy armour are Splint mail, Banded mail, Half-Plate and Full Plate.

Cant remember what the GWF wears armour wise.

BOT: Well the Roar feels more like a Barb than a Fighter dunno about the rest though I always thought Barbarians and 2 Handed Fighters seemed similar with the biggest difference being that Barbs get Damage resist and Rage mode and THF get extra weapon feats.

llelowyn13

Here is an example of our idea of a barbarian being skewed by interpretation:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guts_(Berserk)#Guts

Here is hte definition of a Barbarian:
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Barbarian

The main ability of a barbarian is to increase strength and ignore pain. His abilities would literally be to reduce damage and/or ignore pain. I played the GWF and was gulping down potions left and right. I think I had ONE ability to reduce damage (or gain HP), the rest was just to inflict damage. IMO the GWF was not the same as wiki describes.

nemesis788450

even if a barbarian class or additional paragorn path for the gwf will be introduced, it wont be so soon - there are a lot of different classes that have a much higher divergence and will be certainly introduced first...

kimonagi

kotli wrote: »

In 3.5 Scale mail is medium armour that comes between Hide and Chainmail in terms of stats. The best medium armour for fighters assuming minimum DEX is the Breastplate in 3.5.
3.5 Heavy armour are Splint mail, Banded mail, Half-Plate and Full Plate.

Cant remember what the GWF wears armour wise.

BOT: Well the Roar feels more like a Barb than a Fighter dunno about the rest though I always thought Barbarians and 2 Handed Fighters seemed similar with the biggest difference being that Barbs get Damage resist and Rage mode and THF get extra weapon feats.

GWF use GWF armor since its restricted, they can make it whatever they want. Some have reported getting Orcish hides but most of what i have seen was scale mail.

Unstoppable i see as some sort of rage mode. Mark target (in 4th edition) is a fighter class feature, fighters get that ability regardless of the weapon they are using.

the shift ability is also more then a dodge like the rogue and cleric, it is fast movement/sprint. (It simulates two Barb abilities Fast Mov. and Uncanny dodge/Evasion)

Edit: I will add that it would be alot easier to develop on existing classes instead of making a horde of new builds. You want your guardian fighter to use a great weapon? Possible you just use block with your weapon instead of a shield. You want your control wizard to be more a damage dealer? Use a wand instead of an Orb. All the structures are there already.

boondocksmike

i think you are all being stereotypical of what things are and arent and what you think they should be. my barbarians have purple mullets, wear loincloths and wifebeaters, and dual wield halflings and their niche barbarian abilities are being angry, hitting stuff, and drinking fine wines. this movement and armor specific-ness is just making no sense to me. that is what a barbarian is to me, but i guess i will have to deal with whatever they make the classes in this game be.

roninthehood

Barbarian = uses great weapons* moves fast* high survivability* uses roars/shout* great leaps?* restoreing strikes?* great AOE* DPS* some CC* check check check check and check and oh ya check. and they named this GWF. ONLY thing that is not normal for barb is the plate armor. I wont even start on the moronic other thread calling the GWF a tank/defender. lolol They even tried to label it a mobil tank defender. what a dumb joke that is.
Anyhow all you people trying to quote other posts and what who said and blah blah.. the GWF fits a barb even as it reflect DnD4E almost to the letter. You people are trying to debate 2+2 doesn't =4

adozu

they totally feel barbaric to me as well, i mean... they build determination then they get mad and get a bonus to damage/attack speed/damage resistance after which they are too tired to rage again for a while, how's that different from barbarian rage?

(aside from rage generally not building up with damage)

pbuckleyhero

Yah its a barb... And no its not stereotypical the GF should also have Two-Handed Weapons. Barbs should be able to duel wield too (Two two-handed weapons that is MUHAHAHAHA) It all reeks of laziness to me. But that might just be me. It would also help a little in letting their be a class with nature skill at launch.