What! the rogue and the wizard at the top? this cant be!
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faceplantmikeMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 26Arc User
edited April 2013
Great Weapon Fighter will be my main probably or at least till I can make a Battle Cleric.
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lunarlegend86Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited April 2013
I have always played the DPS / Tank class in all of my MMO's.
I think its time to try out something new and fresh.
So, I will go with the Cleric as my main!
none of the above, my favorite classes aren't in yet
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hargeoMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 12Arc User
edited April 2013
Great Weapon Fighter. Fun to play, good DPS and blends well with the cleric companion. Although playing the GF I felt like a beast and in total control of all battles. Still... heh. I vote GWF for now!
zovyaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited April 2013
It's interesting that classes represent a player mindset/personality. I looked at the vote results. Most of the user's comments I agree with on this forum, also chose the same class as I.
cuba10Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited April 2013
Trickster Rogue......!!!!
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werealchemistMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited April 2013
I wish I had been able to play the last Beta weekend. So much has changed that i don't really know what i want to play, at first i was going to go with the TR but all the nerf herders around here got them beat to death, then i was going to play DC but then i found out they got hit with a nerf bat too, so then i was going to try a GWF but after doing some research they seem to be the worst class because they are supposed to be a hybrid tank/dps and it's not going well for them... so it looks like i'll be playing a CW
man GWF is getting the <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> end of the stick eh?
Wonder if they plan on upping the damage output of this class. As I am seeing it, they are not a very effective class and no one will play feel gimped.
man GWF is getting the <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> end of the stick eh?
Wonder if they plan on upping the damage output of this class. As I am seeing it, they are not a very effective class and no one will play feel gimped.
Part of the problem is that it is hard to find a balance in the class. If you go offense in your build you can do decent damage, mainly because of all the AoE in the game, but you will not hold up well with threat. If you go defense so you can actually hold up to some adds and keep your cleric or wizard clean then you lose a lot of damage and threat generation. They need to put in more talents that add to both aspects of the character, along with some threat ones.
For example there is a feat to convert 20% of your defense into power. That is a great option. It helps the defender types do a little more damage. Add in the Con giving armor pen and you think oh nice, there is some options there. But once you go to con you realize you just lost all your threat and deflection and the GWF does not get any mitigation like the GF does off con. So the one feat just falls a bit short of helping the defender types out, and they really missed the mark on Con. Dex is superior in every way for the class. They may as well not even list Con as a class ability score. It just don't hold up.
Then you look at the threat. There are two feats in the sentinel line that help with threat. One is single target and gives you 5% crit and 25% threat on crits for sure strike. Great, more Dex love... Then there is the other threat feat, an AoE one. It gives Come and Get it (AoE pull mobs in) and Daring Shout (marking) 5% of power as damage and 25% more threat. Great sounds awesome. But you go through the numbers, and realize at level 50 that you will get 128 damage and 160 threat. That sounds neat until you realize that Roar does 900+ damage and generates determination. Even Mighty Leap and Not So Fast do way more damage, so by virtue of that, it is a dead and useless talent. They need to upgrade it to a minimum of 25% of power as damage and 50% threat and then it might be useful to AoE gather and pick up mobs to tank.
Honestly they should give the GWF the same 0.5 mitigation from con that a GF gets. They are still going to be well short of the guard mechanic and more AC form a shield in overall mitigation. Not to mention that a GWF loses a lot of threat in mitigation because they must stop attacking and run out of attacks rather than block and attack through them. Then there is the extremely limited amount of self healing. I had 20.5k HP at level 50 and the restoring strike would heal me for about 600 damage, fully speced into. With a 40 second cool down on the extra heal from feats off of it, it is just not enough. Maybe taking that Sure Strike talent and instead of adding threat on just one critical hit make it mark the target on critical hit, and you generate 25% more threat on marked targets, also break it off of just sure strike and make it effect all critical hits from any power. They are just a few tweeks off of it being workable IMO on the defender end.
For the offensive builds they need to somehow add in defense based off of an offensive stat. Maybe replace Ubiquitous shield with a 5 point feat to do that. Give 20% of your Power as life steal or something to help more offensive builds self heal and not be so squishy. Something along those lines. They also need to put the Strength bonus back to 15% and have it effect all aspects of strength, not just damage.
If they made those adjustments I think it would go a long way to letting those that want to gather and tank adds do it or those that want to deal damage hold up a little better when they get threat. Right now the class is not a true hybrid. If you are a defender you lose your ability to do damage, if you are offensive you lose your ability to defend. A class that is a 2nd tank and 2nd or 3rd damage is valuable but not one that cannot hold threat. A class that can do 2nd in damage is valuable but not when they are the 3rd or 4th survivable. Right now they need to make it so if they are first in nothing then they are at least second in everything else they do. They fall a bit short of that currently.
I think the poll lack an answer : "Swiss", "neutral" or "don't know yet" (something in this spirit).
More class will come and I imagine some people honestly do not know.
As I much loved the Guardian Fighter's blocking and its skill set I will be mainly playing GF but I hesitate between this and Control Wizard ( which I didn't tried during BWs)
Part of the problem is that it is hard to find a balance in the class. If you go offense in your build you can do decent damage, mainly because of all the AoE in the game, but you will not hold up well with threat. If you go defense so you can actually hold up to some adds and keep your cleric or wizard clean then you lose a lot of damage and threat generation. They need to put in more talents that add to both aspects of the character, along with some threat ones.
For example there is a feat to convert 20% of your defense into power. That is a great option. It helps the defender types do a little more damage. Add in the Con giving armor pen and you think oh nice, there is some options there. But once you go to con you realize you just lost all your threat and deflection and the GWF does not get any mitigation like the GF does off con. So the one feat just falls a bit short of helping the defender types out, and they really missed the mark on Con. Dex is superior in every way for the class. They may as well not even list Con as a class ability score. It just don't hold up.
Then you look at the threat. There are two feats in the sentinel line that help with threat. One is single target and gives you 5% crit and 25% threat on crits for sure strike. Great, more Dex love... Then there is the other threat feat, an AoE one. It gives Come and Get it (AoE pull mobs in) and Daring Shout (marking) 5% of power as damage and 25% more threat. Great sounds awesome. But you go through the numbers, and realize at level 50 that you will get 128 damage and 160 threat. That sounds neat until you realize that Roar does 900+ damage and generates determination. Even Mighty Leap and Not So Fast do way more damage, so by virtue of that, it is a dead and useless talent. They need to upgrade it to a minimum of 25% of power as damage and 50% threat and then it might be useful to AoE gather and pick up mobs to tank.
Honestly they should give the GWF the same 0.5 mitigation from con that a GF gets. They are still going to be well short of the guard mechanic and more AC form a shield in overall mitigation. Not to mention that a GWF loses a lot of threat in mitigation because they must stop attacking and run out of attacks rather than block and attack through them. Then there is the extremely limited amount of self healing. I had 20.5k HP at level 50 and the restoring strike would heal me for about 600 damage, fully speced into. With a 40 second cool down on the extra heal from feats off of it, it is just not enough. Maybe taking that Sure Strike talent and instead of adding threat on just one critical hit make it mark the target on critical hit, and you generate 25% more threat on marked targets, also break it off of just sure strike and make it effect all critical hits from any power. They are just a few tweeks off of it being workable IMO on the defender end.
For the offensive builds they need to somehow add in defense based off of an offensive stat. Maybe replace Ubiquitous shield with a 5 point feat to do that. Give 20% of your Power as life steal or something to help more offensive builds self heal and not be so squishy. Something along those lines. They also need to put the Strength bonus back to 15% and have it effect all aspects of strength, not just damage.
If they made those adjustments I think it would go a long way to letting those that want to gather and tank adds do it or those that want to deal damage hold up a little better when they get threat. Right now the class is not a true hybrid. If you are a defender you lose your ability to do damage, if you are offensive you lose your ability to defend. A class that is a 2nd tank and 2nd or 3rd damage is valuable but not one that cannot hold threat. A class that can do 2nd in damage is valuable but not when they are the 3rd or 4th survivable. Right now they need to make it so if they are first in nothing then they are at least second in everything else they do. They fall a bit short of that currently.
Looks like someone was paying attention. Yeah I will be playing the GWF also, I like a challenge. Plus I like to work numbers, being able to make this class do good damage or tank well will be something fun for me to do and I should be able to get the most out of playing this way.
Maybe taking that Sure Strike talent and instead of adding threat on just one critical hit make it mark the target on critical hit, and you generate 25% more threat on marked targets, also break it off of just sure strike and make it effect all critical hits from any power. They are just a few tweeks off of it being workable IMO on the defender end.
Sure strike talent isn't bad. If you have a 30% crit chance, which shouldn't be hard at all with DEX focus and weapon master, even if you don't have any critical strike gear, and you have 90% crit severity (3/3 heroic feat), then:
1) Increasing crit on Sure Strike by 5% increases your dps (and threat) with it by ~3.5% [(1.9 * 0.35 + 0.65) / (1.9 * 0.3 + 0.7)]
2) At which point your damage from critical sure strike is ~50.6% of total damage you deal [(1.9 * 0.35) / (1.9 * 0.35 + 0.65)].
3) Thus increasing threat on crits with sure strike will increase your threat with sure strike in general by ~12.6%.
4) if you consider both 1 and 3, then the total threat gain from sure strike by taking the talent is ~16.7%. This goes up the higher crit or crit severity base you have (5% extra severity from Half-Orc would change it to 18.9% extra threat, all things considered).
If the crit chance alone was buffed to 10% it would go up to ~7% extra dps and ~22.0% extra threat in total (dps included).
If the extra threat on crits was buffed to 35%, then the extra dps remains the same but you get ~24.4% extra threat.
I don't think the feat needs to be redesigned at all. If anything - like Intimidation - it could use some fine-tuning.
I plan on playing the Control Wizard as my main when the game goes live....but I will be patiently waiting for the Scourge Warlock and (hopefully) Archery Ranger to be released a few months from now.
Comments
Grace, Tiefling Devoted Cleric
"Do what you can, with what you have, where you are. Then leave the rest to Batman."
YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Emrendil
Btw, im surprised GWF is the last one on the poll.
Rogue being first was obvious trough.
I think its time to try out something new and fresh.
So, I will go with the Cleric as my main!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxXHNigHfnw
Wonder if they plan on upping the damage output of this class. As I am seeing it, they are not a very effective class and no one will play feel gimped.
Part of the problem is that it is hard to find a balance in the class. If you go offense in your build you can do decent damage, mainly because of all the AoE in the game, but you will not hold up well with threat. If you go defense so you can actually hold up to some adds and keep your cleric or wizard clean then you lose a lot of damage and threat generation. They need to put in more talents that add to both aspects of the character, along with some threat ones.
For example there is a feat to convert 20% of your defense into power. That is a great option. It helps the defender types do a little more damage. Add in the Con giving armor pen and you think oh nice, there is some options there. But once you go to con you realize you just lost all your threat and deflection and the GWF does not get any mitigation like the GF does off con. So the one feat just falls a bit short of helping the defender types out, and they really missed the mark on Con. Dex is superior in every way for the class. They may as well not even list Con as a class ability score. It just don't hold up.
Then you look at the threat. There are two feats in the sentinel line that help with threat. One is single target and gives you 5% crit and 25% threat on crits for sure strike. Great, more Dex love... Then there is the other threat feat, an AoE one. It gives Come and Get it (AoE pull mobs in) and Daring Shout (marking) 5% of power as damage and 25% more threat. Great sounds awesome. But you go through the numbers, and realize at level 50 that you will get 128 damage and 160 threat. That sounds neat until you realize that Roar does 900+ damage and generates determination. Even Mighty Leap and Not So Fast do way more damage, so by virtue of that, it is a dead and useless talent. They need to upgrade it to a minimum of 25% of power as damage and 50% threat and then it might be useful to AoE gather and pick up mobs to tank.
Honestly they should give the GWF the same 0.5 mitigation from con that a GF gets. They are still going to be well short of the guard mechanic and more AC form a shield in overall mitigation. Not to mention that a GWF loses a lot of threat in mitigation because they must stop attacking and run out of attacks rather than block and attack through them. Then there is the extremely limited amount of self healing. I had 20.5k HP at level 50 and the restoring strike would heal me for about 600 damage, fully speced into. With a 40 second cool down on the extra heal from feats off of it, it is just not enough. Maybe taking that Sure Strike talent and instead of adding threat on just one critical hit make it mark the target on critical hit, and you generate 25% more threat on marked targets, also break it off of just sure strike and make it effect all critical hits from any power. They are just a few tweeks off of it being workable IMO on the defender end.
For the offensive builds they need to somehow add in defense based off of an offensive stat. Maybe replace Ubiquitous shield with a 5 point feat to do that. Give 20% of your Power as life steal or something to help more offensive builds self heal and not be so squishy. Something along those lines. They also need to put the Strength bonus back to 15% and have it effect all aspects of strength, not just damage.
If they made those adjustments I think it would go a long way to letting those that want to gather and tank adds do it or those that want to deal damage hold up a little better when they get threat. Right now the class is not a true hybrid. If you are a defender you lose your ability to do damage, if you are offensive you lose your ability to defend. A class that is a 2nd tank and 2nd or 3rd damage is valuable but not one that cannot hold threat. A class that can do 2nd in damage is valuable but not when they are the 3rd or 4th survivable. Right now they need to make it so if they are first in nothing then they are at least second in everything else they do. They fall a bit short of that currently.
More class will come and I imagine some people honestly do not know.
The Retribution of Kel'thalun: NW-DJ46U5NZG
The Conquering of Ymir: NW-D12TWV3K3
Looks like someone was paying attention. Yeah I will be playing the GWF also, I like a challenge. Plus I like to work numbers, being able to make this class do good damage or tank well will be something fun for me to do and I should be able to get the most out of playing this way.
Sure strike talent isn't bad. If you have a 30% crit chance, which shouldn't be hard at all with DEX focus and weapon master, even if you don't have any critical strike gear, and you have 90% crit severity (3/3 heroic feat), then:
1) Increasing crit on Sure Strike by 5% increases your dps (and threat) with it by ~3.5% [(1.9 * 0.35 + 0.65) / (1.9 * 0.3 + 0.7)]
2) At which point your damage from critical sure strike is ~50.6% of total damage you deal [(1.9 * 0.35) / (1.9 * 0.35 + 0.65)].
3) Thus increasing threat on crits with sure strike will increase your threat with sure strike in general by ~12.6%.
4) if you consider both 1 and 3, then the total threat gain from sure strike by taking the talent is ~16.7%. This goes up the higher crit or crit severity base you have (5% extra severity from Half-Orc would change it to 18.9% extra threat, all things considered).
If the crit chance alone was buffed to 10% it would go up to ~7% extra dps and ~22.0% extra threat in total (dps included).
If the extra threat on crits was buffed to 35%, then the extra dps remains the same but you get ~24.4% extra threat.
I don't think the feat needs to be redesigned at all. If anything - like Intimidation - it could use some fine-tuning.
...and then the Avenging Paladin....
...and then...