I came in first healing @ 220,000 ish.. the second Cleric @ 190,000. And still the GW dropped 4 times. This is really not fun.
I'll admit, I could be a crappy healer. But 2 clerics healing close to the same amount, and the GW still drops 4 times? Heck, much of the fight, the GW was running from the Boss while We were hitting him with our Ghostbuster beam heal.
Sounds like the actual problem be the GF failed to tank properly & that both clerics done goofed.
It's rare when the entire team needs constant healing.
Don't overheat, that just ends up blowing your cooldowns & eating away at your damage output.
If the that single GF is really dying that much it might be better to leave him dead & focus both clerics on attacking. (Unless he's playing like a rogue and putting out massive damage.)
I know that it sucks to no longer get gear to sell from the Dungeon Delve chest but it was truly overpowered.
0
sirglenoMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 75
edited March 2013
The two problems imo, specific to cleric, is the awkwardness of the UI and the lack of a method to res without AD/Zen.
I know there are a few others who somehow feel that the inability to reliably target party members is a good "feature", so I think it would be fun to extend this to a pretend PnP example.
Fighter: I run in and hack at the orc!
DM: You do damage, but also sustain some damage.
Cleric: I cast cure serious wounds on the Fighter.
DM: Sorry, you misclick and instead heal the Wizard.
Cleric: Really!?!
DM: Yes, really. Now your Fighter is dead.
Fighter: Res me dude.
Cleric: Ok, I cast raise dead.
DM: That will be $4.95 please.
Cleric/Fighter/Wizard: ...
The two problems imo, specific to cleric, is the awkwardness of the UI and the lack of a method to res without AD/Zen.
I know there are a few others who somehow feel that the inability to reliably target party members is a good "feature", so I think it would be fun to extend this to a pretend PnP example.
Fighter: I run in and hack at the orc!
DM: You do damage, but also sustain some damage.
Cleric: I cast cure serious wounds on the Fighter.
DM: Sorry, you misclick and instead heal the Wizard.
Cleric: Really!?!
DM: Yes, really. Now your Fighter is dead.
Fighter: Res me dude.
Cleric: Ok, I cast raise dead.
DM: That will be $4.95 please.
Cleric/Fighter/Wizard: ...
DM: Ow! Stop punching me!
Everything has a point of view. To me, it played like this:
Fighter: I shield slam to get his attention, and block, waiting for an opportunity to unload my encounter power.
DM: You slightly debuff the foe, do some damage. The orc attacks you, doing 14 damage to your shield.
Cleric: I cast astral seal., and searing light.
DM: Mob is debuffed by 15%.
Fighter: Use my encounter power.
DM: You do 15 damage and reduce his armor by 3 points. However, the orc retaliates with an encounter of his own. You fail your save as your shield was down. Take 45 damage. You're down.
Cleric: Cast chains of light.
Rogue: Rezz the fighter by kneeling by his side.
DM: Fighter's back up. The chains are just wearing off now.
Cleric: Cast Bastion of Health.
Fighter: I block.
DM: You are all healed for 30.
Seeing as anyone can rezz, just by cliking on the downed party member, I don't see why you need a $4.95 rezz scroll unless it's a total wipe.
And let me tell you, for any of the content we've played so far, a total wipe takes REAL effort on the level of a Darwin Award.
That is exactly what I'm seeing. It's weird honestly. I've never seen a game where you had to pay to rez in battle even GW2 didn't do that with their terrible concept of an economy....
The targeting definitely needs fixing. Either they are going to have to make an exception and allow people to toggle the targeting or they are going to have to recode the heal spells to go to the person in the party that has the lowest hitpoints. WoW had to do that with some of the paladin heals because they would just randomly choose the wrong people. Albeit they could click heal on that game but on this one you can't you actually have to move your camera around and hope for the best.
It's completely unrealistic this targeting system. I can forgive not firing a big spell at that ranged character in the background but saying that my character targeted the wrong player while trying to heal is just unforgivable entirely.
0
ahkronnemesisMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited March 2013
I wish that I had only one "concern" about the Cleric.
I've always played healers and tanks on mmos. This beta I decided to get into the Cleric, as I actually like the "point&heal" and the "Get close and personal" healing style. I must say I missed the other beta weekends, so my review is based on BW#3 only. Also, I've not get pass the level 16, so bare with my review limitations hehe.
I'm also going to ignore the clunky UI targeting system for this post, as that, as good or bad as it can be, is not where my main concerns come from.
Solo: Up to level 10, I found it an interesting and rather easy class to play. I did use potions up to that point, but mostly because I missed dodges or simply "fat-fingered" on my movement. I wasn't expecting that my heals would solve that by itself at that level.
When I found my first group of orcs, that's when I started to feel worried.
I was using every healing and damaging spell I could. I tried all ability combos I could think of, and I was using potion after potion to keep myself alive. Orcs were falling but to the expense of a couple of potions per group. Well, maybe not always a couple, but at least one pot per group was necessary. At some point I found myself spending a lot of silver in potions, since the drops would be less than my need. That says something about the self healing capabilities. But again, all that can be due to my lack of knowledge of stats and gameplay.
Group: That's where I got really worried. I did a few squirmish (is that the name for the fast 5men group instances, right?) and I felt at least useless in there. I actually felt like a runaway tank.
First tries, I started shooting the lance and as soon as I cast that "heal on mob" spell (sorry about not remembering the names) all mobs would run towards me so, next time I did let all group attack first. I let the tank get some hits and wait for life to go down and sent a single heal. Bang. I'm now the tank, except I don't have the HP or survival skills to do it. I used 10+ pots in the Orc squirmish just because I sent a couple of heals and one direct heal seems to heal for less than most low damage attacks from mobs.
My opinion on all this is that I'm not going to play an healer on this game if the healing is kept like this. Why should I? Being an healer atm feels like being a potion support. I cast a couple of heals so others avoid using one more pot in the all fight. Actually, I avoid them using pots at all, since all mobs will be on me. I'll spend 20 or more silver worth in pots per squirmish so others can kill the mobs while I kite them around.
Things like that drive me completely away from that class. It's awful at solo, it's awkward at groups. I picked up other classes just to feel how they play. DPS classes seem to be way better at everything. I use half of the pots as a rogue while killing 3x faster. As things are, people would be better with another damage dealer in a group than with an healer.
Self healing is ridiculous. Group healing is not that noticeable. Damage is not balanced to the lack of survival.
As I said, a group would be better taking an extra 10 pots into a dungeon than taking an healer that won't actually do much difference in group survival or group damage output.
[Campaign] Into the Heart of Time (NWS-DLSK763NH) by @ahkronnemesis
Chapter I - The Cult of Kairos (NW-DJFINX9KB)
Chapter II - The Halls of Mortality (NW-DOE3ZC671)
Chapter III - Paradox ( Soon )
0
ranncoreMember, Moderators, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 2,508
Seeing as anyone can rezz, just by cliking on the downed party member, I don't see why you need a $4.95 rezz scroll unless it's a total wipe.
And let me tell you, for any of the content we've played so far, a total wipe takes REAL effort on the level of a Darwin Award.
What are you, level 20? In any dungeon delve 35+, trying to help up a fallen team mate in a boss fight with 30 adds just results in 2 deaths instead of 1. Once a party member goes down, unless he wants to pay 5 dollars to resurrect, the rest of the team might as well follow suite, because it's not going to get easier with less than 5 people.
Every cleric in every DnD game and iteration can resurrect except this one. In fact I'm hard pressed to think of a single video game besides this one that you have to PAY to resurrect in. This is some SWTOR level money-grubbing bull****.
I think the cleric is due for more tuning. Solo play, she felt weaker since beta 2. I think the self heal reduction is a little too much.
At the same time, boyfriend and I ran a dungeon at 40, (he's a GF and I am a wizard). We had a couple of times where groups seemed to be aggro'd out of no where. I think if you have a group of decent players that try to avoid damage, then it's a playable class. That said, I've played a lot of dungeon MMOs and players come from all shapes and sizes.
What are you, level 20? In any dungeon delve 35+, trying to help up a fallen team mate in a boss fight with 30 adds just results in 2 deaths instead of 1. Once a party member goes down, unless he wants to pay 5 dollars to resurrect, the rest of the team might as well follow suite, because it's not going to get easier with less than 5 people.
Every cleric in every DnD game and iteration can resurrect except this one. In fact I'm hard pressed to think of a single video game besides this one that you have to PAY to resurrect in. This is some SWTOR level money-grubbing bull****.
Man i totally agree with you, SWTOR went off the charts charging for anything and everything and we see it here and not only are some basic necassities for sale but the ratio that the cash you use to buy the items is way off. Spending 50 dollars for enuff to buy 1 items and barely have anything left over is a joke. they really need to work on the cash store, either lower the amounts or increase the amount you get for the dollar, i would be happy with 10k zen for 50 dollars but 5k plus the o i am going to be nice and just give you 300 is an insult. when 1 item costs you 4500 that is too much plus the rez scrolls are 300 a pop that will add up very fast.
I dont mind paying in the cash shop from time to time but i think after my initial purchase that will be all they will get from me if the exchange rate stays the same.
I think the cleric is due for more tuning. Solo play, she felt weaker since beta 2. I think the self heal reduction is a little too much.
At the same time, boyfriend and I ran a dungeon at 40, (he's a GF and I am a wizard). We had a couple of times where groups seemed to be aggro'd out of no where. I think if you have a group of decent players that try to avoid damage, then it's a playable class. That said, I've played a lot of dungeon MMOs and players come from all shapes and sizes.
Hopefully they'll tune the cleric a bit more.
Cleric was a lot more enjoyable last weekend for sure.
0
mewbreyMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 517Bounty Hunter
edited March 2013
I'd like to see the clerics "daily" skill Hallowed Ground, Res dead targets, not just fallen. However once resed via the skill you have a 5 minute debuff meaning you cannot be resed again for 5 minutes with any skills.
Healing word should get incapacitated players that have the few seconds to get picked back up again to be revived with 20% health. It should also retain its current effects when used on active players.
the healing is really awful on the devoted cleric, you are really wasting your time healing especially in group play because the devoted cleric oddly enough does tons of aoe damage, more than the wizard does, and can avoid so much more damage by simply sloting his aoe powers like daunting light and sunburst instead of sloting healing spells, enemies cant damage you when they are already dead from your aoe, and just relying on potions to keep everyone healed
if you really want to support people as a devoted cleric, use concecrated ground during boss fights, you will get way more effect out of that than any crappy heal on your bar ever would
This was the most helpful comment I read so far in this thread. My problem in the big battles is 2 things: Instant aggro as soon as I do my healers job and enemy spawns triggering behind me as soon as battle is joined.
Even alt to grab the potion is a poison pill at that point.
I'd prefer the Hallowed Ground and do what he was doing best: Lance and AOEs for effect, which were awesome.
vulpecusMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 8Arc User
edited March 2013
Have to agree with the sentiments of the people here, the Devoted Cleric is an aggro magnet with lousy heals. 3 stacks of divinity and I can't heal myself fully let alone the tank with much higher HP. It was completely messy on Boss fights with adds and companions running around, how to target properly? Just halfway around the Boss fights, you'll feel like the evasion tank. Literally running around throwing seals , sunburst and guess what : drinking potions lol. Worst of all, people die on your watch.Now that's a major downer for anybody who likes to play healers.
0
shaudraMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited March 2013
I've only been playing this past beta and I always play a healer of some sort. At first I was pretty comfortable, levels 1-10 were pretty much what I expected, little heals, nice damage. Then at 11-17 I thought I was the worst cleric EVER. I couldn't keep myself alive, couldn't keep my friend healed, went searching the net for info on how to play this cleric. I found the other thread where people were talking about nerfs so I thought, okay it's not just me. Then I got the quest/mission to get a companion and I know this is going to sound silly but I chose the Cleric Disciple. What a major difference! I stopped dieing, we stayed healed ALL the time, I got more comfortable with the attacks that do damage and heal or add hps and the other skills. I did some solo'g later with just me and the companion and had no issues at all; well except for the game crashing but I think that's something on my end ... anyway, yeah I had to break myself of the single target/single heal habit.
Comments
Sounds like the actual problem be the GF failed to tank properly & that both clerics done goofed.
It's rare when the entire team needs constant healing.
Don't overheat, that just ends up blowing your cooldowns & eating away at your damage output.
If the that single GF is really dying that much it might be better to leave him dead & focus both clerics on attacking. (Unless he's playing like a rogue and putting out massive damage.)
Technically ~60 but currently ~40.
I know there are a few others who somehow feel that the inability to reliably target party members is a good "feature", so I think it would be fun to extend this to a pretend PnP example.
Fighter: I run in and hack at the orc!
DM: You do damage, but also sustain some damage.
Cleric: I cast cure serious wounds on the Fighter.
DM: Sorry, you misclick and instead heal the Wizard.
Cleric: Really!?!
DM: Yes, really. Now your Fighter is dead.
Fighter: Res me dude.
Cleric: Ok, I cast raise dead.
DM: That will be $4.95 please.
Cleric/Fighter/Wizard: ...
DM: Ow! Stop punching me!
Nyx - Divine Cleric
Medusa - Brush Wizard
Spinnerella - Combat Wizard
Don't forget to update the Wiki!
Everything has a point of view. To me, it played like this:
Fighter: I shield slam to get his attention, and block, waiting for an opportunity to unload my encounter power.
DM: You slightly debuff the foe, do some damage. The orc attacks you, doing 14 damage to your shield.
Cleric: I cast astral seal., and searing light.
DM: Mob is debuffed by 15%.
Fighter: Use my encounter power.
DM: You do 15 damage and reduce his armor by 3 points. However, the orc retaliates with an encounter of his own. You fail your save as your shield was down. Take 45 damage. You're down.
Cleric: Cast chains of light.
Rogue: Rezz the fighter by kneeling by his side.
DM: Fighter's back up. The chains are just wearing off now.
Cleric: Cast Bastion of Health.
Fighter: I block.
DM: You are all healed for 30.
Seeing as anyone can rezz, just by cliking on the downed party member, I don't see why you need a $4.95 rezz scroll unless it's a total wipe.
And let me tell you, for any of the content we've played so far, a total wipe takes REAL effort on the level of a Darwin Award.
The targeting definitely needs fixing. Either they are going to have to make an exception and allow people to toggle the targeting or they are going to have to recode the heal spells to go to the person in the party that has the lowest hitpoints. WoW had to do that with some of the paladin heals because they would just randomly choose the wrong people. Albeit they could click heal on that game but on this one you can't you actually have to move your camera around and hope for the best.
It's completely unrealistic this targeting system. I can forgive not firing a big spell at that ranged character in the background but saying that my character targeted the wrong player while trying to heal is just unforgivable entirely.
I've always played healers and tanks on mmos. This beta I decided to get into the Cleric, as I actually like the "point&heal" and the "Get close and personal" healing style. I must say I missed the other beta weekends, so my review is based on BW#3 only. Also, I've not get pass the level 16, so bare with my review limitations hehe.
I'm also going to ignore the clunky UI targeting system for this post, as that, as good or bad as it can be, is not where my main concerns come from.
Solo: Up to level 10, I found it an interesting and rather easy class to play. I did use potions up to that point, but mostly because I missed dodges or simply "fat-fingered" on my movement. I wasn't expecting that my heals would solve that by itself at that level.
When I found my first group of orcs, that's when I started to feel worried.
I was using every healing and damaging spell I could. I tried all ability combos I could think of, and I was using potion after potion to keep myself alive. Orcs were falling but to the expense of a couple of potions per group. Well, maybe not always a couple, but at least one pot per group was necessary. At some point I found myself spending a lot of silver in potions, since the drops would be less than my need. That says something about the self healing capabilities. But again, all that can be due to my lack of knowledge of stats and gameplay.
Group: That's where I got really worried. I did a few squirmish (is that the name for the fast 5men group instances, right?) and I felt at least useless in there. I actually felt like a runaway tank.
First tries, I started shooting the lance and as soon as I cast that "heal on mob" spell (sorry about not remembering the names) all mobs would run towards me so, next time I did let all group attack first. I let the tank get some hits and wait for life to go down and sent a single heal. Bang. I'm now the tank, except I don't have the HP or survival skills to do it. I used 10+ pots in the Orc squirmish just because I sent a couple of heals and one direct heal seems to heal for less than most low damage attacks from mobs.
My opinion on all this is that I'm not going to play an healer on this game if the healing is kept like this. Why should I? Being an healer atm feels like being a potion support. I cast a couple of heals so others avoid using one more pot in the all fight. Actually, I avoid them using pots at all, since all mobs will be on me. I'll spend 20 or more silver worth in pots per squirmish so others can kill the mobs while I kite them around.
Things like that drive me completely away from that class. It's awful at solo, it's awkward at groups. I picked up other classes just to feel how they play. DPS classes seem to be way better at everything. I use half of the pots as a rogue while killing 3x faster. As things are, people would be better with another damage dealer in a group than with an healer.
Self healing is ridiculous. Group healing is not that noticeable. Damage is not balanced to the lack of survival.
As I said, a group would be better taking an extra 10 pots into a dungeon than taking an healer that won't actually do much difference in group survival or group damage output.
Chapter I - The Cult of Kairos (NW-DJFINX9KB)
Chapter II - The Halls of Mortality (NW-DOE3ZC671)
Chapter III - Paradox ( Soon )
What are you, level 20? In any dungeon delve 35+, trying to help up a fallen team mate in a boss fight with 30 adds just results in 2 deaths instead of 1. Once a party member goes down, unless he wants to pay 5 dollars to resurrect, the rest of the team might as well follow suite, because it's not going to get easier with less than 5 people.
Every cleric in every DnD game and iteration can resurrect except this one. In fact I'm hard pressed to think of a single video game besides this one that you have to PAY to resurrect in. This is some SWTOR level money-grubbing bull****.
At the same time, boyfriend and I ran a dungeon at 40, (he's a GF and I am a wizard). We had a couple of times where groups seemed to be aggro'd out of no where. I think if you have a group of decent players that try to avoid damage, then it's a playable class. That said, I've played a lot of dungeon MMOs and players come from all shapes and sizes.
Hopefully they'll tune the cleric a bit more.
Man i totally agree with you, SWTOR went off the charts charging for anything and everything and we see it here and not only are some basic necassities for sale but the ratio that the cash you use to buy the items is way off. Spending 50 dollars for enuff to buy 1 items and barely have anything left over is a joke. they really need to work on the cash store, either lower the amounts or increase the amount you get for the dollar, i would be happy with 10k zen for 50 dollars but 5k plus the o i am going to be nice and just give you 300 is an insult. when 1 item costs you 4500 that is too much plus the rez scrolls are 300 a pop that will add up very fast.
I dont mind paying in the cash shop from time to time but i think after my initial purchase that will be all they will get from me if the exchange rate stays the same.
Cleric was a lot more enjoyable last weekend for sure.
Healing word should get incapacitated players that have the few seconds to get picked back up again to be revived with 20% health. It should also retain its current effects when used on active players.
This was the most helpful comment I read so far in this thread. My problem in the big battles is 2 things: Instant aggro as soon as I do my healers job and enemy spawns triggering behind me as soon as battle is joined.
Even alt to grab the potion is a poison pill at that point.
I'd prefer the Hallowed Ground and do what he was doing best: Lance and AOEs for effect, which were awesome.
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