Cleric Dps

mekanical

Why Cleric Dps is on the botton of all other Dps out there, my main characters is a Cleric Healer, but i also use it as Dps, the problems is when i use it as Dps most of the time my Damage is lower then other Dps, even if i´m at 89k item level with power 80% acuracy at 50% Combat advantaje at 72% Critical Strike at 75% and Critical Severity at 85% my damage is low even a Wizzard 45k Dps better damage tha my Cleric

so far i think Some Encounters of Cleric Dps have to much Cooldown, 18s and 16s is to much, also the Daunting Light Encounter AOE the area of impact is EXTREMLY REDUCE, the mobs need to be together to hit multiple enemys, i really think that the area of impact should be just like Bastion

other thing about Cleric Dps are Feats, Perfect Balance it 1 in a 100 times that pop out, i have in RARE times get to active it and the other Feat Angel of Death to active it you need the ridiculus amount of 26 stacks to active it, that´s to much, it should be like 15 stacks

i really hope that we can get a change in this power of Cleric Dps to be as good as other Dps Clases

plasticbat

1. My Cleric is set to do DPS and does not know how to heal (i.e. I don't know how to heal).
2. I don't expect my Cleric to out dps other dps class.
3. My cleric usually is in the middle of paingiver chart although I do not really care about its ranking. Even if he is the last is no big deal to me as long as the mission is completed.
4. My encounters do not depend on cooldown. They depend on Divinity.
5. I don't use Daunting Light. For AOE, I position myself and use Javelin.
6. I don't use perfect balance. Yes, 26 stacks for Angel of Death is too much. It usually got activated after the battle is finished.

unq

I've been playing as a dd cleric for a very long time. I have a wizard, but I like playing as a arbiter mach more. Dealing damage with a wizard is too easy. There is no complexity and that's why it loses interest. I don't want arbiters to be recycled globally. i love this class. Let the mechanics remain as they are. You have succeeded in making it interesting. However, the fact that clerics are way down in DPS. Is a fact! Other players dont want to take us to a difficult encaunters. And it is very difficult to find a group because everyone thinks we have no damage. Which is what I as an old cleric player would like to see. Maybe it's add DOT damage to the main DPS skill Forgemaster's Flame. When we pause to gain divinity DOT damage will continue work and it'll keep us from falling too far behind the other classes. Magnitudes can be left the same, but only add DOT damage to bring us to the level of other classes. That way the mechanics would remain the same and the damage would be higher. Save mechanics pls but up damage with DOT. Make us useful as a complete DPS class!

unq

No change on Cleric Dps on the test server. We continue to suffering in module 27 as usual. Very sad((

zapline258

I recently built my arbiter as well (I main healer) and I find overall interesting mechanic wise to play but lacks the dps overall.
The issue I see if our damage is directly linked to our divinity. I've played with both Angel of Death and Perfect Balance. Right now I use Perfect Balance (previous meta).

My issue with perfect balance is the rotation with Prophecy of Doom takes too long to complete without any problems/interruptions. Very little situations allow you to finish the rotation before the boss phases or the mob is dead making POD useless. Other times I have to either choose to delay using POD to time it with artifact calls but that means I'm attacking with at-wills which barely do much dps.
The other issue with POD rotation is after your rotation your left with 0 divinity and have to use at-wills to charge up. This becomes an issue if you need to help with dps checks such as MTOS 2nd boss. So if I know I can't finish a POD rotation because we have enough dps then I use Break the Spirit instead to buff team.

Magnitude of our powers I think is lacking compared to other classes that have either DOTs to make up for it or faster speeds. At-will I find is too weak and slow if we are using it to regain stacks for divinity.
Historically Brand of Sun had DOT effect and was an issue pre-mod16 because it would generate divinity passively for as long as the DOT lasted making divinity basically a non-issue. I doubt they will revert back to this. If DOT didn't count towards divinity then DOTs would offset some of the dps difference.
Javelin and Dailies could use a magnitude buff as well to match overall dps with other dps classes. The last thing I want is for arbiter to turn into another HR encounter spam class.

Currently even for me 86k arbiter my dps is probably half of the top dps player. I could very much be playing it wrong as well. Just wondering how much damage do people do with their daily (Guardian of Faith), tunnel vision (or equivalent) and POD if you use?

lordmanik

I don't like the dps cleric. I don't like the divinity system. I prefer a cooldown. I'm probably just a noob, as I don't know how to use it well. I keep running out of divinity and have to wait to use encounters again. My at wills does very little damage, but my encounter powers do a lot of damage.

plasticbat

lordmanik said:

I don't like the dps cleric. I don't like the divinity system. I prefer a cooldown. I'm probably just a noob, as I don't know how to use it well. I keep running out of divinity and have to wait to use encounters again. My at wills does very little damage, but my encounter powers do a lot of damage.

1. At will gives you divinity. You keep on running out of divinity probably because you don't use at-will to add divinity.
2. At will boosts Encounter damage.
3. Cleric at-will damage is comparable with certain DPS class at-will. I am not saying better.

e.g. cleric's Lance of Faith has 0.6 sec cast time and 110 Magnitude
vs Rogue's Cloud of Steel which has 0.4s cast time and 40 Magnitude. (both at-will are range)

trinity706

Cleric "dps" complaining about not ranking higher on damage chart than pure dps classes?... Hmph.

Arguably classes that can fill two roles (tank/healer, tank/dps, healer/dps) "shouldn't" be outperforming classes that can fill only a dps role (especially with all things equal in regard to stats). There's something very imbalanced about that...

tornnomar

Rogues cloud of steel can be enhanced to start stacking damage, no cleric powers do that. At-Wills can enhance encounters, so theres a plus, but not really an advantage nor anything to write home about.

Most Clerics make an arbiter build to quest, not to go into dungeons as a DPS and expect to outperform dedicated DPS classes. Whats crippling to an arbiter is everything being linked to Divinity and its generation, or lack thereof. Feats can give a 25% chance to refill the meter. Nice when it happens but not to be relied upon. Spamming the '40 Year Wind up' that is conflagrate isn't viable either. At-Wills do generate divinity but a cleric cannot simply stand still spamming at-wills in hopes they live long enough to gain some divinity back, only to lose it with the next encounter use.

You can counter argue all you want, it is an assinine system and a return to cooldowns is seemingly what everyone is desiring for the arbiter build.
One reason is Cost V. Benefit. Divinity costs are absolutely too high for the return. Add in that most of the Arbiters Encounters are useless in a DPS build. Others are mostly single target, and do not perform as indicated on the tooltips making them useless to even slot. Geas, Break The Spirit, and Prohecy of Doom are jokes that your awkward Uncle has recycled too many times to count. Chains has no use or function as everything nowadays is CC immune.
That leaves you with Sunburst which is okay SOLO. Javelin, Forgemasters, and Daunting Light. The Latter needs its effective area increased as the circle is as small as a nano particle. I say Javelin and Daunting as these can feated to enhance from using at-wills.
One positive is the talk about making Javelin not need a target to use and fire off in the direction your facing. Also adding some damage back to Chains. They are not going to tear the cleric apart and do surgery, only do what fixes can be made quickly and without any major effort on their part.

trinity706

mekanical#3843 said:

Why Cleric Dps is on the botton of all other Dps out there, my main characters is a Cleric Healer, but i also use it as Dps, the problems is when i use it as Dps most of the time my Damage is lower then other Dps

mekanical#3843 said:

i really hope that we can get a change in this power of Cleric Dps to be as good as other Dps Clases

tornnomar said:

Most Clerics make an arbiter build to quest, not to go into dungeons as a DPS and expect to outperform dedicated DPS classes.

Nah, the OP CLEARLY wants Cleric DPS to be comparable to other DPS classes LoL

nymeria

> @trinity706#8838 said:
> Cleric "dps" complaining about not ranking higher on damage chart than pure dps classes?... Hmph.
>
> Arguably classes that can fill two roles (tank/healer, tank/dps, healer/dps) "shouldn't" be outperforming classes that can fill only a dps role (especially with all things equal in regard to stats). There's something very imbalanced about that...

It is no different than a warlock DPS/heal load out, yet warlocks cab DPS. If they make a DPS class for the arbiter, it should in no way affect viability because of the healer path. It should be just as effective as any other dps class. Or they should just eliminate calling it a DPS path and call it just to get healer through content class. Some people, such as myself actually enjoy playing an arbiter over any other overpowered, easy to do damage class. I have tried playing a wizard, rogue, barb, etc and really don't care for any of them. I prefer my arbiter and it's complexity over being at the top of the damage board.

nymeria

> @trinity706#8838 said:
> Nah, the OP CLEARLY wants Cleric DPS to be comparable to other DPS classes LoL

Absolutely. There should be no reason a cleric dps should place lower than any other dps class. The warlock also has a heal path, yet they still do damage as a DPS. So yes, dps, no matter what class should be able to do damage just like any other dps class, not simply to get heal path through content.

nymeria

> @trinity706#8838 said:
> Cleric "dps" complaining about not ranking higher on damage chart than pure dps classes?... Hmph.
>
> Arguably classes that can fill two roles (tank/healer, tank/dps, healer/dps) "shouldn't" be outperforming classes that can fill only a dps role (especially with all things equal in regard to stats). There's something very imbalanced about that...

And no arbiter is saying they want to out dps any other dps class, just be consistent across the board. Honestly, I would rather play a class that requires some sort of skill level to play instead a mindless, overpowered class that doesn't require much skill to play.

trinity706

Arbiter's can DPS, currently just not as high/comparable as other non-pure DPS classes (for the most part). The Arbiter paragon path outputs more damage than Devout which is why it is classified as a "DPS", not because it is simply "supposed" to be right up there with other "DPS" classes... Arguably as long as "DPS" classes are outputting a considerable amount of damage more than the tank/healer and the group is not struggling then they are effective. Arbiter's not being 1st or 2nd in damage on the scoreboard does not negate that... What is more important, getting 1st/2nd DPS ranking or completing the content?...

In Neverwinter tanking is not "consistent" across the board... For Arbiter DPS to be "comparable" to say that of a Wizard, it would require their damage to be on par with the AoE damage of a Wizard... What sense would that make?

Clerics becoming a considerable choice in endgame content over other DPS (pure DPS classes for the most part) would be quite the imbalance.

nymeria

> @trinity706#8838 said:
> Arbiter's can DPS, currently just not as high/comparable as other non-pure DPS classes (for the most part). The Arbiter paragon path outputs more damage than Devout which is why it is classified as a "DPS", not because it is simply "supposed" to be right up there with other "DPS" classes... Arguably as long as "DPS" classes are outputting a considerable amount of damage more than the tank/healer and the group is not struggling then they are effective. Arbiter's not being 1st or 2nd in damage on the scoreboard does not negate that... What is more important, getting 1st/2nd DPS ranking or completing the content?...
>
> In Neverwinter tanking is not "consistent" across the board... For Arbiter DPS to be "comparable" to say that of a Wizard, it would require their damage to be on par with the AoE damage of a Wizard... What sense would that make?
>
> Clerics becoming a considerable choice in endgame content over other DPS (pure DPS classes for the most part) would be quite the imbalance.

In my case, I really can care less if I am 3rd on the damage board, the scoreboard means nothing to me, but everything to most other people. I can do very good damage ST but not enough to catch up to say, wizards who use arcane singularity to scout up mobs and kill before an arbiter even gets a chance. The score board monitors in the team look at that and it looks like 3rd place is a carry I responded yo your other reply, but I will say it again here. There are bards that have DPS and heal, they do quite a bit of damage, the same goes for the warlock, fighter, and barb. So are you saying that all of those classes shouldn't do damage? Why shouldn't they be able to damage? What causes the imbalance? If it is because there are enough straight DPS classes that there shouldn't be anymore, then the devs shouldn't have created them. Tell me why there are straight DPS classes when in the case of all 3, the wizard, ranger and roque is one path subpar to there counterparts. It makes absolutely no sense for those paths to be there and yet, not to be played as intended, as a DPS. These classes already exist, so in regards to there being "to many" dps choices, and causing an imbalance, your reasoning doesn't make sense. If someone prefers to play a certain roll because they enjoy playing it and play it as intended, that should be all that matters. Currently at least 80% of the Xbox player base are wizards, other dps choices makes the game more diverse. However, when you can't keep up or in many cases, advance through the game because the path you chose to build doesn't have viability in the game, what is the sense of playing it. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy playing heal as well, but I also very much enjoy playing the arbiter, I like the skill involved in playing it compared to other classes that don't require to much skill to be at the top of the board. I don't care where I place, I just want to play the game I have enjoyed playing for the last 8-9yrs without being kicked from a dungeon because I'm not at the top or at least be able to run the content I am built for. I know my char like the back of my hand, my rotation is done as intended, my stats cap, sometimes higher than other dps classes, yet other players put to much faith in the damage board and all of that time, effort and money spent goes out the window. People just don't care. Its those at the bottom that go first, hence my post about individualized damage scores instead of an all in one board that makes or breaks players that chose not to run another wizard. If we are talking about imbalance, the fact that most of the players that run are wizards, that's the imbalance. Devs should bring a bit more diversity to the game and make dps consistent across the board or completely eliminate the non viable paths all together.

trinity706

nymeria#5867 said:

In my case, I really can care less if I am 3rd on the damage board, the scoreboard means nothing to me, but everything to most other people. I can do very good damage ST but not enough to catch up to say, wizards who use arcane singularity to scout up mobs and kill before an arbiter even gets a chance. The score board monitors in the team look at that and it looks like 3rd place is a carry

Are you referring to Arbiter's in Master content?

If players are comparing strong AoE damage classes to less AoE damage capable classes then the problem starts there. Essentially anyone that simply uses the DPS scoreboard as some kind of end all determining factor without taking into consideration ilvl, stats, actual damage done to bosses, etc. is goofy as hell LoL. If players want to be like that they can run premades with others who think the same and quarrel amongst themselves. RDQ's are hardly difficult to complete so Arbiter DPS shouldn't be an issue, arguably the same goes for ADQ's. Master content is probably a different story depending on the content.

nymeria#5867 said:

There are bards that have DPS and heal, they do quite a bit of damage, the same goes for the warlock, fighter, and barb. So are you saying that all of those classes shouldn't do damage?

Not at all. The subject is essentially Arbiters that are comparing their DPS to classes like the Wizard where they excel in AoE and Arbiters do not.

nymeria#5867 said:

Tell me why there are straight DPS classes when in the case of all 3, the wizard, ranger and roque is one path subpar to there counterparts. It makes absolutely no sense for those paths to be there and yet, not to be played as intended, as a DPS. These classes already exist, so in regards to there being "to many" dps choices, and causing an imbalance, your reasoning doesn't make sense.

In regard to the Ranger, Warden is melee damage focused and Hunter is ranged damage focused and being that Mod 27 is heavy against melee classes, Rangers can opt for ranged damage. There being multiple DPS classes does not simply cause imbalance, personally did not state that.

When a class steps out of their "base" role, of course their effectiveness will be reflected in a different role (in regard to multi-class DPS, some classes are more effective at damage than others). Picture a triangle and the corners are "Tank", "Healer", "DPS". Essentially no class is dead center and effective at all 3 roles while some are somewhere between Healer/DPS or Tank/DPS.

Aragon did a video on the various classes, their roles and how they rank in regard to those roles in regard to end game content NEW TIER LIST: All Classes Ranked in Neverwinter! (module 27) EASIEST to HARDEST Class for ENDGAME!

nymeria#5867 said:

Currently at least 80% of the Xbox player base are wizards, other dps choices makes the game more diverse.

If we are talking about imbalance, the fact that most of the players that run are wizards, that's the imbalance. Devs should bring a bit more diversity to the game and make dps consistent across the board or completely eliminate the non viable paths all together.

If that is indeed the case, those players are seemingly playing a class not because they enjoy it, but because it has high damage output. Making DPS classes "consistent across the board" would essentially mean all DPS would need AoE and single target damage, that alone would cause imbalance between the classes and would require Cryptic to "balance" things and the record has shown balance isn't necessarily a strong point...

AoE classes should be compared to other AoE classes and single target classes should be compared to other single target classes. An AoE powerhouse will excel in group enemy content in regard to damage output compared to a single target focused class, that is where the disparity lies and is in part why it was suggested that the scoreboard show boss fight damage separate from overall damage so that the bigger picture will be shown and players can't simply be like "the bottom DPS isn't pulling their weight".

trinity706#8838 said:

Arguably as long as "DPS" classes are outputting a considerable amount of damage more than the tank/healer and the group is not struggling then they are effective.

If content can be completed comfortably with an Arbiter as DPS what's the problem?

unq

trinity706#8838 said:

If content can be completed comfortably with an Arbiter as DPS what's the problem?

That's a very interesting inference)
"Arbiter is only needed for quests and medium content." lol
Tell me then what is it for? For what? ))
For what to complete the content and build a character, to max him, and then you are not taken anywhere in endgame?
what a bizarre logic...

unq

Checked the changes on the test server by cleric. The main changes were AOE damage, but on the solo target clerics are still much behind.
I've been doing logging tests
I've got two identically equipped characters Cleric and Wizard
all mounts companions and insignias 1 to 1
Just move all equip from wizard to cleric and just tested the damage in the training room.
Both characters around 90k.

Cleric srveral tests with any skills and feats (DPS per minute)


Wizard Thaumaturge


So after that I decided to go Master Demon Web with two average wizards near 85k gear and my cleric 92k gear


Please note that in the first screenshot I was hitting just a static target and in this one the second boss in a demon web master where you have too much move and the cleric has almost no control to mobs.

You can certainly have questions about my cleric gameplay, but the result on the screenshot clearly shows why we are not taken in the endgame content

You can run these tests yourself and I'm sure you'll get similar results

jana

How do you do those type of tests, do you get a schematic from somewhere and let it run in the background when you are playing?

unq

jana#2651 said:

How do you do those type of tests, do you get a schematic from somewhere and let it run in the background when you are playing?

The command "/CombatLog 1" in game chat
enables recording of combat logs.
And after this logs can then be analyzed by various programs. Such as ACT or NCLA

silente07

I don’t want to be top DPS, that’s for sweats. I do however want to be able to get through the grind at a reasonable rate. The dps from Arbiter is HAMSTER poor. ST or AOE. (We have one AOE granted lol, we were never an AOE class) BUT It’s a slog compared to before. Whatever the current class best of rotation is, I just want to be able to do the content as I did previously. Now I can’t and it’s not fun. Hell, in PE they don’t even want Clerics to even heal anymore, they want Paladins and Bards. Poor Templocke is on the swing alone in the rain because they don’t have the 25% boost Paladins do for shields.
This constant Jenga with the classes is crazy.
Divinity management is HAMSTER poor as the AT wills plink plink and you’re mobbed.
At 77k I out healed a 95k by almost 10 mil on Spelljam ship, but I’m getting denied or kicked because they want a shield healer.
Flavor of the Day I guess.
Just have to wait a year or so for the next “rebalance”