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M21 Mythic Insignias Update

oswind#3081 oswind Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 7 Arc User
edited June 2021 in Player Feedback (PC)
I'm gonna focus on the mythic insignias update and voice my concerns.

The upgrade from legendary to mythic quality is 2500 powder (in total 37 500 powder for 15 insignias) and that is way, way too much and here's why. With the current prices and sources of insignia powder this is how much it's gonna cost to get 15 mythic insignias, just from legendary:

1. If you use trade bars (without trade bar event active) and buy epic insignias you will need 750 insignias (each gives 50 insignia powder) and that's gonna cost you 75 000 trade bars
2. If you decide to use ad you will need 3750 blue insignias (each gives 10 powder) and they are 12k ad on ah so that comes out to 45mil AD, if you buy epic insignias you need 750 of them (each gives 50 powder) and they are around 100k and that comes out as 75mil ad, if you buy legendary insignias you need 150 (each gives 250 powder) and they are around 480k-500k and that comes out as 72-75mil AD

Now I don't need to point out that this pricing is ridiculous, especially for anyone who isn't a whale, to have 75k trade bars or 40-70mil ad just collecting dust in your inventory is unreal. And on top of that just spending all of it on insignias, a small update and be broke? I don't think so, this ad sink is way too much. To add more to this you actually want to upgrade all of them, why? Well because in total you will gain 4.5k IL, 13 500 more raw stats and 3600 combined rating and that's a huge boost for any class and role. First collars and now insignias, each update we get is insanely costly and only the top 0.1% can afford to get them, it wasn't as bad with collars because you didn't NEED to get it since the boost isn't that huge, but now with this it's just insane. I for example am a player that has pretty much everything but I sure don't have this much money sitting around just to be spent in 1 day on insignia powder and then be broke.

Please look into either lowering the powder cost and or adding more sources with significant insignia powder drops
Post edited by oswind#3081 on
«13

Comments

  • fritz#8093 fritz Member Posts: 279 Arc User
    I don't mind stuff being hard to obtain as long as you have a reasonable shot at getting there eventually. People complain about the drop rates with Sharandar Bounties, but doing them with a couple alts per day and knowing how to efficiently farm I've gotten a decent amount of purple gear so far and have little doubt I'll eventually get the pieces I need. It'll take a couple weeks or even months, but that's fine. Again, as long as you get the stuff when you put work in I'm mostly fine.

    Collars however... Has anybody actually farmed five Mythic Collars or can we assume those with the AD just bought themselves out of the mess? Yeah sure you do not need Mythic Collars to complete all endgame content, but the difference in item level is still significant. Same goes for Mythic Insignias. Legendary to Mythic is a 4,500 item level difference and you have absolutely no shot arriving there ever with the drop rates of green Insignias from content. At least replace some of the RP drops with Insignias so we can get a sense of progression towards Mythic Insignias. Or give Well of Dragon Lairs a guaranteed blue Insignia in the end chest so we can farm them just like Dread Ring.
  • rikitakirikitaki Member Posts: 872 Arc User
    Do not worry that collar/insignia upgrade costs are unreasonable now - from the perspective of M26 it will surely make sense.

    That is how the devs always did the things - they know that there is a certain change coming within a few years and from the future perspective all the numbers make sense. No need to adjust some values for only a few mods or make everything work at the same time...
  • admiralwarlord#3792 admiralwarlord Member Posts: 559 Arc User
    P2W!
  • fritz#8093 fritz Member Posts: 279 Arc User
    > @xavior44 said:
    > I disagree people are always complaining they have nothing to do or grind for.. well guess what now you do. Big + for this insignia change. Collars were gross but to actually see an upgrade via insignias when your finished upgrading is nice, and dont forget they are always tradable so its not like your even losing the a/d.

    I'm not against grind, but Powder is nothing you can specifically go for other than spending premium currency or collect the few that mobs or end chests drop. I think there should be a location for Insignias, like Dread Ring is for Enchanting Stones.
  • xavior44xavior44 Member Posts: 153 Arc User

    > @xavior44 said:
    > I disagree people are always complaining they have nothing to do or grind for.. well guess what now you do. Big + for this insignia change. Collars were gross but to actually see an upgrade via insignias when your finished upgrading is nice, and dont forget they are always tradable so its not like your even losing the a/d.

    I'm not against grind, but Powder is nothing you can specifically go for other than spending premium currency or collect the few that mobs or end chests drop. I think there should be a location for Insignias, like Dread Ring is for Enchanting Stones.

    Absolutely agree !
  • autumnwitchautumnwitch Member Posts: 1,018 Arc User

    > @xavior44 said:
    > I disagree people are always complaining they have nothing to do or grind for.. well guess what now you do. Big + for this insignia change. Collars were gross but to actually see an upgrade via insignias when your finished upgrading is nice, and dont forget they are always tradable so its not like your even losing the a/d.

    I'm not against grind, but Powder is nothing you can specifically go for other than spending premium currency or collect the few that mobs or end chests drop. I think there should be a location for Insignias, like Dread Ring is for Enchanting Stones.

    Insignia drop quite often from mobs, random chests, skill nodes and Lock Boxes. I can get a dozen or more just doing dailies quite often. The problem is they are low level green usually and even if you get tons of those they won't make a dent. My hunch is, this is get people to open more lock boxes as they can contain insignia, insignia dust and TB which look like they will now be playing a bigger role in NW.
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  • kyjle6akakyjle6aka Member Posts: 33 Arc User
    I still don't have any collars, and now I have to improve the insignias...
  • jules#6770 jules Member Posts: 709 Arc User
    kyjle6aka said:

    I still don't have any collars, and now I have to improve the insignias...

    If you want to inflate your IL
    - bye bye -
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 6,608 Arc User


    I don't want it NOW. I want it to be affordable and somehow possible to farm. I spend last 2 days for farming "powder". Dungeons, nodes, chests, mobs, whatever I could do. What I got? 96 powder in total. For basically 12 hours playing straight for 2 days. With that amount of "droprate" (50 average per day) it's going to take me 2 years to upgrade one page of insignias. One. Page which I can use only on one toon. Can't swap it around from my healer to dps alt because most of them is going to be totally useless.

    See our point now?

    I don't mind farming or grinding, but after those 2 days I am totally exhausted. And my life is too short to farm insignias every day for 12 hours for the next 2 years.

    Buy it.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,965 Arc User
    edited June 2021

    greywynd said:

    Lack of patience. People want it NOW. In the old days any RP you got wasn't enough to bother picking stuff up off the floor. "Don't slow us down!" was the dungeon rallying cry. And all those little things end up turning into something big. Take the time. Loot the nodes. Loot the chests. Take what you can get when you can get it.

    I don't want it NOW. I want it to be affordable and somehow possible to farm. I spend last 2 days for farming "powder". Dungeons, nodes, chests, mobs, whatever I could do. What I got? 96 powder in total. For basically 12 hours playing straight for 2 days. With that amount of "droprate" (50 average per day) it's going to take me 2 years to upgrade one page of insignias. One. Page which I can use only on one toon. Can't swap it around from my healer to dps alt because most of them is going to be totally useless.

    See our point now?

    I don't mind farming or grinding, but after those 2 days I am totally exhausted. And my life is too short to farm insignias every day for 12 hours for the next 2 years.

    May be because you are really looking for that instead of enjoying the game. I'm not actively looking for that but I do open skill node when I happen to come across one during regular questing. I don't even do dungeon or spend hours per day. I probably get 40 powder for one day among 6 characters doing nothing special. Yeah, may be I was lucky. It seems Sharander skill node has 'more than usual' insignia drop for me. By the way, I don't even see the point of upgrading insignia. They increase item level and increase number stat only. They just mess up the cap balance. I am more exhaust balancing (move stuff around) whenever I change the number stat/item level.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    greywynd said:


    I don't want it NOW. I want it to be affordable and somehow possible to farm. I spend last 2 days for farming "powder". Dungeons, nodes, chests, mobs, whatever I could do. What I got? 96 powder in total. For basically 12 hours playing straight for 2 days. With that amount of "droprate" (50 average per day) it's going to take me 2 years to upgrade one page of insignias. One. Page which I can use only on one toon. Can't swap it around from my healer to dps alt because most of them is going to be totally useless.

    See our point now?

    I don't mind farming or grinding, but after those 2 days I am totally exhausted. And my life is too short to farm insignias every day for 12 hours for the next 2 years.

    Buy it.
    you can buy powder?
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  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,965 Arc User
    armadeonx said:

    greywynd said:


    I don't want it NOW. I want it to be affordable and somehow possible to farm. I spend last 2 days for farming "powder". Dungeons, nodes, chests, mobs, whatever I could do. What I got? 96 powder in total. For basically 12 hours playing straight for 2 days. With that amount of "droprate" (50 average per day) it's going to take me 2 years to upgrade one page of insignias. One. Page which I can use only on one toon. Can't swap it around from my healer to dps alt because most of them is going to be totally useless.

    See our point now?

    I don't mind farming or grinding, but after those 2 days I am totally exhausted. And my life is too short to farm insignias every day for 12 hours for the next 2 years.

    Buy it.
    you can buy powder?
    You can buy insignia using AD.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • plushleaf#2109 plushleaf Member Posts: 4 Arc User

    greywynd said:

    Lack of patience. People want it NOW. In the old days any RP you got wasn't enough to bother picking stuff up off the floor. "Don't slow us down!" was the dungeon rallying cry. And all those little things end up turning into something big. Take the time. Loot the nodes. Loot the chests. Take what you can get when you can get it.

    I don't want it NOW. I want it to be affordable and somehow possible to farm. I spend last 2 days for farming "powder". Dungeons, nodes, chests, mobs, whatever I could do. What I got? 96 powder in total. For basically 12 hours playing straight for 2 days. With that amount of "droprate" (50 average per day) it's going to take me 2 years to upgrade one page of insignias. One. Page which I can use only on one toon. Can't swap it around from my healer to dps alt because most of them is going to be totally useless.

    See our point now?

    I don't mind farming or grinding, but after those 2 days I am totally exhausted. And my life is too short to farm insignias every day for 12 hours for the next 2 years.

    May be because you are really looking for that instead of enjoying the game. I'm not actively looking for that but I do open skill node when I happen to come across one during regular questing. I don't even do dungeon or spend hours per day. I probably get 40 powder for one day among 6 characters doing nothing special. Yeah, may be I was lucky. It seems Sharander skill node has 'more than usual' insignia drop for me. By the way, I don't even see the point of upgrading insignia. They increase item level and increase number stat only. They just mess up the cap balance.
    I only calculated amount of powder I got from days I could play longer. I did usual things. Nothing beside that.

    And as I said - I don't mind farming those, but for now it doesn't even look reasonable to do that.
  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,425 Arc User
    I've not played much on preview since the patch but have you looked for additional sources of insignias in the new patch? Maybe they've made changes that just aren't noticed yet!
  • rockster#6227 rockster Member Posts: 821 Arc User
    edited June 2021
    I get a good amount of blues from Castle Never, sometimes 2, but often one, mostly from Talgarth the Undying boss and I've been able to slowly build to the 500 consistently to upgrade all the purple insignias I had (I've got one left to do) to leg ones, I'm now at about 630 powder and I need I think it was 750 for a collar upgrade from epic to leg. I'm [email protected] with numbers I could be wrong but I think that's right. But it is painfully slow. I do think the drop rate for insignias is still too low considering how little they give you when you refine them (being they're almost always BtC or BtA they're to me obviously meant to refine with, I sometimes get an unbound blue but not often and I sell that on the AH if I get it) and I also definitely think that we should be seeing purples drop routinely as well but I have never seen one of those happen. They probably don't, but they definitely should.
  • sagakaiyume#0847 sagakaiyume Member Posts: 402 Arc User
    Tbh, the amount it takes to make mythic is expected as green to blue is 20, blue to purple is 100, purple to leg is 500..it follows the same amount.

    Think it'd be better though if amount were changed, 500 to make leg, 200 for epic, 80 for blue leaving 1,250 to make mythic which with insignias giving half those amounts of powder to break down, it'd be more reasonable. Most don't bother upgrading insignias to epic anyways, so it won't really effect people negatively.

    Have green insignias be 10 dust, they're common but atm don't give much. I use to farm temple of the spider leveling dungeon to open the chests, sometimes get 20 dust a run off just greens.
  • rockster#6227 rockster Member Posts: 821 Arc User
    Greens are 2 aren't they? That's kind of a ridiculous number. If they dropped like candy it might be a different story but the drop rate doesn't reflect the value.
  • shugenshashugensha Member Posts: 191 Arc User
    This things will always happen and that is sad. On the bright side, if you are desperate to get your hands on one of those insignias, all you gotta do is save enough AD and just buy it from someone. Tho, until you get the gear and enchs you want, having blue/purple insignias is more than enough (imo).
    When you last expect it, you will have a set of mythic ones.
    The meta it's just a guideline. And guidelines are boring.

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  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    They should put a dust pack in the zen store. If they had 1000 dust for 500-1000 zen it'd probably be worth it.
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  • fritz#8093 fritz Member Posts: 279 Arc User
    > @greywynd said:
    > Lack of patience. People want it NOW. In the old days any RP you got wasn't enough to bother picking stuff up off the floor. "Don't slow us down!" was the dungeon rallying cry. And all those little things end up turning into something big. Take the time. Loot the nodes. Loot the chests. Take what you can get when you can get it.

    I would generally agree. I brought up the example of Sharandar Bountys, where most complains are unwarranted in my eyes. You can actually progress at a slow but steady pace. Powder however is a different story. You literally need years to complete the grind.
  • fritz#8093 fritz Member Posts: 279 Arc User
    > @armadeonx said:
    > They should put a dust pack in the zen store. If they had 1000 dust for 500-1000 zen it'd probably be worth it.

    There are already Lockboxes, Insignia Packs, and the Trade Bar Store. I think it would be a better decision to add a specific resource of Powder to the game. Think of what Dread Ring Lairs are for Enchanting Stones.
  • horizonxaelhorizonxael Member Posts: 111 Arc User

    > @armadeonx said:
    > They should put a dust pack in the zen store. If they had 1000 dust for 500-1000 zen it'd probably be worth it.

    There are already Lockboxes, Insignia Packs, and the Trade Bar Store. I think it would be a better decision to add a specific resource of Powder to the game. Think of what Dread Ring Lairs are for Enchanting Stones.

    so you can auction them for real millions so you take advantage of it i say they have to put 50 stak powder in sibella missions
  • plushleaf#2109 plushleaf Member Posts: 4 Arc User

    > @armadeonx said:
    > They should put a dust pack in the zen store. If they had 1000 dust for 500-1000 zen it'd probably be worth it.

    There are already Lockboxes, Insignia Packs, and the Trade Bar Store. I think it would be a better decision to add a specific resource of Powder to the game. Think of what Dread Ring Lairs are for Enchanting Stones.

    Well, Lockboxes, Insignia packs and Tradebars - all of those are basically Zen based. It's not really definition of grinding or farming.

    And yes, I know we have Astral Lockboxes, and you can buy them for AD, but it's still NOT farming powder.
    And yes, I know we can have some amount of Tradebars from dungeons chests, but amount is ridiculous.

    Some places like DR Liars where you can farm powder, would be really cool. Or even higher droprate of green ones from mobs would be fine.
    Also - blue insignia from VoS bosses and chests (potentially hardest dungeon in game) is imho a joke. There should be at least epics.

    Usually I have 1 blue insignia per VoS run (sometimes none, but I found it consistent to have that one single blue). So it means I need 3750 runs (!) to get enough powder. 3750 runs, 30min average. 1875h of farming.

    I really hope devs will take a look on that and make powder/insignias farming more reasonable.

  • admiralwarlord#3792 admiralwarlord Member Posts: 559 Arc User
    My vip ended in December of the year I released mod 16 (in October I think) since then for different reasons I didn't renew it, and since then I'm an f2p, and I can say it's impossible for a player who doesn't have vip to have any One day a character with mythical necklaces and insignia. The best loots are hidden behind scrolls in chests, nerfed insignia drops that used to fall from bosses, among others. I don't even remember when I got an item that I could sell and give me something with 300 or 400k AD. And I only stay with a decent level item because unlike those who started recently, I know ways to gain AD without having to rely on luck in loots. Who owns and likes the alt's as they are? At least with the game mostly scaled, you can still feel useful on some content.
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    sakhsft said:

    armadeonx said:

    They should put a dust pack in the zen store. If they had 1000 dust for 500-1000 zen it'd probably be worth it.

    great make the game more pay to win
    Think about the knock-on effect. Currently, ppl with lots of money/AD are buying up insignias from the AH and this is driving up prices. If they buy from the zen store instead, demand will drop on the AH and will be cheaper for everyone else.

    Cryptic get a win by making $$$, those that have no problem paying get a win by buying large amounts of dust easily, ftp players win by getting cheaper salvageables from the AH...
    Please Do Not Feed The Trolls

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