ToNG Impossible - Dev Attention Required

rhyse625

Since the combat changes every group I have been in has yet to be able to finish ToNG because of that last boss, the Souls take too long to kill and the insta death meter just goes up and kills everyone. Also all the extra mobs take too long to kill and they just continue to add up until, yup, you guessed it...Death.

Has anyone been able to complete it? Pugs are one thing, but I been in well geared Alliance groups and the same thing happens.

denialwolf

The problem with this combat rework is the fact that many dps doesn't have the optimal offensive rating, Accuracy is highly underestimated by most, many dps I've seen goes straight to crit severity or combat advantage with only 30%+ accuracy rating. Many people who asks for tips also get told to increase the crit and CA, this is quite problematic tbh.
The other problem with ToNG is yes, the soul is harder to kill. Though I've cleared it with good dps, it was a queue group made in PE, they know to stop hitting the boss and attack the souls immediately (literally keep their artis+mount power for this as well). Yes, many many dps still doesn't know that they need to kill soul fast . Many doesn't even respond to you when they just keep hitting the boss. Many dps are too used to power through every dungeon mechanic, this is a bad habit that won't go away anytime soon.

arazith07

rhyse625 said:

Since the combat changes every group I have been in has yet to be able to finish ToNG because of that last boss, the Souls take too long to kill and the insta death meter just goes up and kills everyone. Also all the extra mobs take too long to kill and they just continue to add up until, yup, you guessed it...Death.

Has anyone been able to complete it? Pugs are one thing, but I been in well geared Alliance groups and the same thing happens.

I've completed this in a pug, had no issues, was able to skip the soul phase of the last boss entirely.

nukaze

it is pretty annoying, almost impossible with 3 45k+ dps, 3 souls spawn for like 5 seconds and 1 dps each aint enough and yes as a tank i poured my mount power/daily on it with halaster debuff + armor break and dealt about 20% damage or something, the number of mobs is threatening and dangerous but the souls mechanic is freaking stupid

rev

I've completed this in a pug, first time it bugged adn kiled us when the bar was at half, but the second time, it went smooth after i told them what to do, and they weren't that well geared.

The problem is:
1 - most people don't have optimal stats...
2 - most people don't know the mechanics and when you should save cooldowns/dailies to kill the souls
3 - my advice, if you are a tank either learn how to position the mobs, so they fall out of the platform, or 2 make one of the dps go in with a AOE rotation

liadan1984

Ran a ToNG yesterday with an alliance group. Should have been able to just wipe the floor. Took 3 or 4 goes of Ras Nsi before we eventually managed to *JUST* scrape through.
We weren't undergeared, no idea about the stats of the rest of the group, mine were fine for healing, but here's the thing, with ToNG, we shouldn't NEED to be "optimal", we should only need to be "yep, this'll do"

The issue we faced, was killing the souls. We didn't have too many issues with the adds, or with Ras Nsi himself, it was with taking down the souls in the time required, they have too many HP and not enough time to kill them.

*edit for spelling*

kaliasta

The problem here is, WHY is it necessary to have "optimal" stats? AD&D was never based on that as a whole. Why is it a necessity now?

tgwolf

Souls are a non-factor with any mount that has Minion Consume. Remaining souls are easily focused as a group.

I've cleared it multiple times since the changes, on both PC and Console without issues.

The main issue since the changes seems to be that people haven't learned anything about how to actually play their classes in the past near 8 years. They relied on everything but class knowledge to get by.

xenocide

It seems like when the combat rework happened all of the mobs had their hp adjusted to match the lower DMG output and they forgot to make the same adjustments to the souls

nukaze

i take back what i said, it is possible but it was pointed out to us that the person who gets the yellow bar/temp hp should still have it up until the final boss and when the soul charged is full, all other players can die and be resurrected, i finished tong more than a few times now and as a tank, im the one who takes the 8m hp bonus, i make sure not to fall and the final boss is manageable, also amazing how i can use up all of those temp hp

wintersmoke

tgwolf said:

Souls are a non-factor with any mount that has Minion Consume. Remaining souls are easily focused as a group.

I've cleared it multiple times since the changes, on both PC and Console without issues.

The main issue since the changes seems to be that people haven't learned anything about how to actually play their classes in the past near 8 years. They relied on everything but class knowledge to get by.

Which mount would that be?

Unknown

This content has been removed.

highlyunstable

tgwolf said:

Souls are a non-factor with any mount that has Minion Consume. Remaining souls are easily focused as a group.

I've cleared it multiple times since the changes, on both PC and Console without issues.

The main issue since the changes seems to be that people haven't learned anything about how to actually play their classes in the past near 8 years. They relied on everything but class knowledge to get by.

I disagree, for the shear fact that.. if you can run most content, and even get to the end boss, you have to know SOMETHING about your character. The fact that the souls are very hard to kill has very little to do with how one plays his/her own character.

I am an end gamer, I have run TIC....ToMM and ZCM Deathless prior to the update. My IL is 51k with P=90% Crit 90% Crit Serv 90% CA 88% and I struggle to kill the ICE in ToMM....so does that mean I do not know how to play my character? Of course not, it means the Ice truly has to much HP.

Bottom line line is.... this game is still a train wreck and I strongly urge all players to STOP telling Cryptic how to fix this mess, and let them actually figure it out for themselves, after all, this is THEIR product, they should know what is wrong with it.

Imagine a chef putting out food that was horrible, and waiting on the customers to tell them how bad it is. That restaurant would be out of business in a few weeks, if not sooner. Do we blame the customer for this...or the Chef??

If you were able to run ToNG prior to the update, there should be no reason why you cannot after the update, and this is truly the problem.

liadan1984

tgwolf said:

Souls are a non-factor with any mount that has Minion Consume. Remaining souls are easily focused as a group.

I've cleared it multiple times since the changes, on both PC and Console without issues.

The main issue since the changes seems to be that people haven't learned anything about how to actually play their classes in the past near 8 years. They relied on everything but class knowledge to get by.

Needing specific mounts/mount powers in order to complete a dungeon that is *YEARS* old shouldn't be a requirement.

I'm absolutely all for needing to know the mechanics for needing to pass the dungeon, but I object to old dungeons being so difficult that average groups, who can manage to get through most other REDQ dungeons without any difficulties, struggle with it.

admiralwarlord

Souls like the mimic's in LoMM are both fragile as to combat advantage's damage. Another tip would be what I learned in this Dungeon and that helped me overcome myself in LoMM when my main character's class was rubbish, save the Daily Powers and Encounters Powers for these occasions, since just see that they appear with the boss in amount X hp or after he performs some of his mechanics. I just didn't complete this dungeon in the HC version because I had a player with 35k item level that died from carelessness in the last Boss, so I quote that I did not see difficulty in this content.

durugudesu

I disagree. If you were able to run Tomb prior to the update, and now you are failing - you have to come to a realization. Was I only able to finish Tomb because the group was bypassing the mechanics because of having too much damage? Are we failing now because we STILL cling to the idea that we can just brute force and not bother with the souls mechanics? Are we failing because previously this was easy to do, but now i can't do it alone?

Here maybe give this a try in tomb if ever you still find it hard to finish, destroy at least 1 soul ASAP, if the other souls are far, then dont bother trying to kill those if your encounters/dailies/mounts are on cooldown - just proceed to continue damaging the boss. the meter wont get filled in 3 spawns of souls as long as you destroy one (from my experience at least), and you should have enough time to bring down boss HP to trigger the last phase, even with just 1 dps.

tom

ToMM is very easily beatable as of right now.

admiralwarlord

durugudesu said:

I disagree. If you were able to run Tomb prior to the update, and now you are failing - you have to come to a realization. Was I only able to finish Tomb because the group was bypassing the mechanics because of having too much damage? Are we failing now because we STILL cling to the idea that we can just brute force and not bother with the souls mechanics? Are we failing because previously this was easy to do, but now i can't do it alone?

Here maybe give this a try in tomb if ever you still find it hard to finish, destroy at least 1 soul ASAP, if the other souls are far, then dont bother trying to kill those if your encounters/dailies/mounts are on cooldown - just proceed to continue damaging the boss. the meter wont get filled in 3 spawns of souls as long as you destroy one (from my experience at least), and you should have enough time to bring down boss HP to trigger the last phase, even with just 1 dps.

This option is feasible when you have at least 1 good DPS and 2 others who fulfill their role with some dignity, and not for most REDQ groups

admiralwarlord

https://ibb.co/RgjkfZc

Group formed for a REDQ and composed of 2 CW (50 and 44k), I of GWF (50k), OP Tank (25k, a very skilled alt) and a SW (24k, alt or a beginner it seems and without guild). I have not seen the difficulty mentioned by the creator of the topic, as I have not seen in other content. I'm not saying these don't exist, but are the players getting the best of their characters?

xenocide

Looks like the problem with the souls has been fixed in todays patch

Groups should no longer need 3 dps with item levels of 44k-50k to finish the dungeon

b33lz3bubba

wintersmoke said:

tgwolf said:

Souls are a non-factor with any mount that has Minion Consume. Remaining souls are easily focused as a group.

I've cleared it multiple times since the changes, on both PC and Console without issues.

The main issue since the changes seems to be that people haven't learned anything about how to actually play their classes in the past near 8 years. They relied on everything but class knowledge to get by.

Which mount would that be?

The t-rex