Opinion

hadestemplar

Hello.

First of all, I appology in advance, english is not my prime/main language, so grammar/spelling mistakes may happens(or not).
Now this thread/post is primarily meant for @cwhitesidedev#9752 , but that's not mean other can't comment. Actually I prefer so, scaling dungeons is old toppic

So what this thread about, well with Chris Whiteside joining become part of Cryptic staff, and also, this new Collaborative Development Program, or CDP started. I decide to shot my opinions.

Now this whole thread is my opinion based on experience. I try keep it short, but there is a lot of things to write about, and share opinions.
I try keep it short, but I also want to make decent explanations and also share opinion how I would fix it.
So if it become wall of text.. Sorry.

So what this thread will be about.
Quick overview.
1) Reward and loot table - rewarding system(RNG stuffs) and how it affect game content accesibility.
2) Dungeons and content scaling and classese viability.
3) combat, class balance - Topic explain itself..
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1) Loot and reaward and and wallet.
The mother of all problems in this game.
The game emelement which affect, party builds, play style, class prefferences and even affect which dungeons will be popular and which ones will be left abandoned.

Rewards which drive players to complete dungeons, reward is what players seek after they complete tough battle, reward is what make players want to do dungeon runs.

Dungeons + reward:
Neverwinter have 13 dungeons, 6 skirmish, 5 trials. (correct if I am wrong).

But in reality there are only :
Dungeons: Lair of the Mad Mage, Castle Ravenloft and Tomb of the Nine Gods.
Skirmish: Manycoins Bank Heist.
Trials: Cradle of the Death God and Tower of mad mage.

The rest is just for view, to create fake illusion that this game have large world, and lot of content to do.
But in reality, when comes rewards and dungeons viability, all older than mod 12 dungeons are irrelevant.

It does not matter if you run Fangbreak islad, or Spellplague Caverns , or valindra tower, or any other dungeon. You have will have same reward table, and chance to get same mounts, artefacts and companions.

These old dungeons use same shared loot table for rewards. What's the point to run harder dungeon if I get same reward as I run easy skirmish? It's does not make any sense.

But that's not end of problems.
When you complete dungeon, you receive some sort reward. However main rewards are locked in chest, and you need key to open them. Some dungeons do not require them, but bigger part of game do require them. To open chest, you need key, and you can make via campaings. One key per 24h.
And when you open that chest, reward is RNG.

For new player, whom need get certain item so they could progress in campaings, and whole game become awkward experience.

You spent 1 key, and when you got in dungeon which require same type key, then you have two option.
1) complete dungeon and leave without reward
2) you purchase legendary dragon key, which unlock any content chests.
But one problem, reward is RNG. You spent it, and receive worthless item.
That's lead to really bad experience.

I knew dozen players who had and still do have problems to get Dwarven Spelunking. Which is need for unlocking Boon in underdark campaing..


You can get only from two skirmishes, and both of them use same key. Some players farmed that item for 4 months, and haven't obtain it.

I checked items prices in Auction house, 15 days ago, Dwarven Spelunking costed over 300k ad. For new player, such sum of Astral diamonds is out of reach, unless you bring wallet in to the game.

And if game is progression is locked behind wallet, then lost of players not only have bad experience. They quit.

Content accesibility

Now how do this RNG system affect content accesibility?

It's rather simply..
Players don't want sit in one dungeon for hours. They want do as fast many they can in shortest time.

So in certain dungeons, certain classes are not welcome. Cuz for them is needed more time to build up their max dmg. And no one want to wait. So these classes are not welcome.

You can't bring cetain items( mass ressurection srolls or specific artefacts)? = dismised.
You don't have legendary mounts? = dismissed
You don't have meta build? = DIsmissed.
You don't have certain stats( even you have reached minimal requirement) = dismissed.

Even when you enter dungeon, it's have other problem.. All game become rush . Thats mean, players rush forward in dungeon, leaving tank and healer behind, so it could build up as high dps score. Usually that's lead to quick death and complains about class balance or raging toward rest of party.

Also it's not new that due this rush, players got bootkick from groups.
You haven't reach certain dmg score in certain time = you got bootkick.
You have some lag spikes(even minimal) and cause some sort of delay in dungeon run = bootkick.
Your PC/laptop have slower loading scree = bootkick( rather offten case).

This rush to complete dungeons as fast it can, shape whole class balance and content accesibility.
And lot of players got frustrated if they are not welcome in certain dungeon runs only cuz they didn't meet certain plaers criterial. Even though that player done these content before...

Also due this consntant rush, will be no class balance. Cuz certain classes use powers which use Damage over time mechanics. And in fast fight, they are irrelevant, leaving them out of chance to get in certain dungeons.. And forcing players quit their classes.


Risks: Well that would require blow up current RNG system and build new one. And also, clean up items from loot table which are way outdated.. As example, elven armor it's mid rank of mod 6 gear part..
By any logic it should not be in loot table long time ago.. Even mod 10 gear sets are out of game loot table, yet this still there...

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hadestemplar

2) Dungeons and content scaling and classese viability.

Some would wondering how class viability realated to content?
Well, there is thing, is tha if game content is more about AoE, then classes who's best performance is only in single target case will be less viable there.
This lead to not needed them in such content, and forcing players pick specific classes/builds.

Best example is Tower of mad mage trial. It's single target trial, and class like barbarians dps path is less viable there.

This cause class dissbalance.


Now current situation is that, dungeons scale down players. Lot of us hate it.. But I rather be scaled down than we had choose alternative.. And alternative is cut dungeons out of game till they got balanced.
This case happened with mod 6 introduction, when all pre mod 6 dungeons where cut from game.. And we had x3 epic dungeons, 2 skirmish and 1 trial.


My thought is that, this scale down is temporal soluton, cuz that do not solve any problem.
Sscaling down is applied in same way to all players who have higher IL than dungeon require .

However, even after downscaling, your character is still way way way too tough in these dungeons/areas.
Which end's up as usually, tough high LV player run through dungeon, leaving behind rest of group. Wiping whole dungeon, before any others had chance to land any hit to any monster/boss..
Which make whole dungeon run become awkward as experience.

Similar case with certain campaing areas..
In Neverdeath, Icespire Peak, Rothé Valley, Ebon Downs, or Whispering Cavern are Dragon encounters. Where players fight dragons.

If high level player come to that area it got downscaled, yet he still way way to strong. So whole fight experience is like > one dude one shot dragon. And I was unabled to land any hit..

My opinion, any higher LV players should not be downscaled but blocked from entering in such dragon fights..
You want "dance" with dragon, there is well of dragons, or use feature in guild Stronghold: Dragon flgiht event. No need ruin new players chance to fight dragon and learn mechanics...



Solution: To dungeons, and make scaling decent. We need stop down/up scaling players. This is nonsense. Even player got upscaled in stronghold, he still die from one slap. Or if player downscaled yet still oneshot enemies.

The way to fix is actuall easy.
Players want easy content?
No problem, there is dungeon, and there is minimal Item level requirement.. You pass that, and here you have access to dungeon..
Now for ones who want hard mode?
Well to fix that,, we use Tarokka Cards from barovia.
https://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/Tarokka_Cards
With tarroka card and it's system, we do not downscale players, but buffing up enemies.

Players form private queue.
System evaluate average group's Item level, and by that apply certain tarroka cards effects.
As example - enemies will have 100% more health +enemies will regenerate health .5% every 10 seconds.
Even dungeon remain same tarroka cards effects make it more challanging.

Even if there is one high Item level player, tarroka cards buff enemies so it's become hard for easy/solo runs. No more simple rush through dungeons..

This also affect class balance.. You have one strong boss, and tarroka cards spawning extra enemies(adds) who have high hp or heav hitters.. You will need classes who are good at single target but also need someone with good aoe too. So classes who where not viabel in certain case now become more than viable.

And this over all system applied to all dungeons, would make old and new dungeons scaling depending on players Item level.

note: I prefer add extra feature in private group runs.. > Challange<
That's mean, system ignore average groups Item level and set up all to max difficulity. You want go with undergeared group, you are not afraid go through hell?
Why not let to do so? There are some players who willing take hard core fight without any doubts..

Risks: Taroka cards are ment to increase challange, but also increase chance to get good reward. No one would use them if there would be no rewards.
So tarroka cards must also boost up chance to get high end rewards in these dungeons.
Epic mounts, companions, enchantments, artefacts and their sets..

This mean, players will be encournaged to get higher challange, for sake to get better rewards.


Now biggest problem so far is to find decent cards affect and apply based on average group memebrs Item level.. But once done, whole system itself would balance old and new dungeons on it's self.

hadestemplar

empty

hadestemplar

pls delete post/thread