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Discussion about DPS fighter
fsf4live
Member Posts: 29 Arc User
Hey guys.
I want to open a discussion about to build the dps fighter and the playstyle with this class.
Maybe we can help each other to improve our performance.
How have you build your dps fighter?
I use Weight of Vengeance, Prepared Slam, Roiling Hatred, Strikers Mark and Executinors Cut. I use this loadout for ST and AoE, because my other loadout is a Vanguard with Integritys DPS build. I think I perform quite good with that build and my 21k IL, also in LoMM. The class features I prefer are Momentum and Combat Superiority. I use for trash mobs Bullcharge, Onslaught and Anvil or Tremor. For boss fights I use Anvil, Bullcharge and CS or GW. At wills are Heavy Slash for the buff and Reave for AoE or Brazen Slash for ST.
Let's discuss about our class to find the best way to play it.
I want to open a discussion about to build the dps fighter and the playstyle with this class.
Maybe we can help each other to improve our performance.
How have you build your dps fighter?
I use Weight of Vengeance, Prepared Slam, Roiling Hatred, Strikers Mark and Executinors Cut. I use this loadout for ST and AoE, because my other loadout is a Vanguard with Integritys DPS build. I think I perform quite good with that build and my 21k IL, also in LoMM. The class features I prefer are Momentum and Combat Superiority. I use for trash mobs Bullcharge, Onslaught and Anvil or Tremor. For boss fights I use Anvil, Bullcharge and CS or GW. At wills are Heavy Slash for the buff and Reave for AoE or Brazen Slash for ST.
Let's discuss about our class to find the best way to play it.
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Comments
I find I need to wait for Heavy Slash to show up to really get good damage out of my fighter as I use the other feat that boost AoE encounters damage magnitude by 200. It suppose to consume heavy slash but it doesn't so I have 2 or 3 AoE encounters slotted and once I see heavy slash show up I use them and 90% of the time two usually clear groups of mobs around me, it is why I keep ITF on my character. Though there are times where I do need that third encounter but rarely does that happen.
Usually I am the offtank in LoMM. We also go with 4 dps (including me) and a healer. And I am the tankiest one because of my shield. It works quite good.
I don't use ITF. With the movement speed of Momentum I am really fast. And I want another slot for a damage dealing encounter. Because that is the source of our damage. Our at Wills aren't really good.
How have you build your fighters? What powers do you use? How is your playstyle / rotation?
The higher your Crit Severity and CA Bonus, the greater the DPS increase you get from fixed self buffs. I don't count Enduring Vengeance due to most fights being too short to make use of it, but if you count its bonus up 24/7, then you are looking at a greater DPS increase. If you like to spam At-wills and use Combat Superiority, you're also looking at a slightly higher DPS increase.
Getting things that should have worked to begin with totally makes up for having terrible mechanics, amirite?
Do you prefer Weight of Vengeance or Heavier Slash as our T1 feat?
If the rate was 100% of the time without any stat ratio garbage (or could triggered on a condition that you can replicate, such as "after using Commander's Strike" or something like that), I'd use it, even if it means that you are constantly at risk of running out of Vengeance.
I didn't confirm any formula on the feat, but I didn't notice any difference in proc rate until the difference of Power vs. ArmorPen went to something like 30,000 to 40,000 (it was a ~8% reduction in proc chance when the difference was ~35,0000 from the limited test I did. Not going to bother trying to check if it was within the Standard Deviation or other statistical junk).
So it seems that this feat is pretty useless.
Main: Nidara Devilspawn- Ranger
Alt: Aradin Coldblood- Fighter
Alt: Lucrezia Vileborn- Warlock
What are your feats, and which powers you use on aoe/st? Is there any guide out there you know of?
Thanks in advance!
> In my guild I'm top dps. But my dps is just slightly higher than our CW or HR and I have the slightly better equip. But it shows, that we can compete with other classes. But HR or CW have a advantage in terms of dps.
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> Usually I am the offtank in LoMM. We also go with 4 dps (including me) and a healer. And I am the tankiest one because of my shield. It works quite good.
>
>
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> I don't use ITF. With the movement speed of Momentum I am really fast. And I want another slot for a damage dealing encounter. Because that is the source of our damage. Our at Wills aren't really good.
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> How have you build your fighters? What powers do you use? How is your playstyle / rotation?
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> I can't find a good dps build for Fighter, the most I find are focused on tank. Most of times, I do tank, but I'd like to give it a try to Vanguard.
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> What are your feats, and which powers you use on aoe/st? Is there any guide out there you know of?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Just build one and try it out. You need to test out what works for you as a player. I find guides as a way to help me refine my build but not a way to create a build. I play around with feats, encounters, etc.. until I find a setup that works for me and my play style.
I don’t want to waste retraining tokens/AD on an alt character to check what feats are the best for a DPS Fighter. I’d rather experienced people let me know which work best and why, since I’m aware, too, on Fighter some feats are not working as intended, and it’s been reported.
Obviously I would take that as a start, and I might or not then tweak some things here and there
That’s why I asked out Fsf4live, since he was saying he was top DPS on his guild, and I was curious.
In LoMM I am top dps in my guild, but I have 10k more power than the others and more CA. But I think I can play my fighter pretty good.
At-wills:
Heavy Slash for buffing. Brazen Slash for ST dps und Reave for AoE dps.
Encounters:
Bull Charge, Anvil of Doom and Commanders Strike/ Griffons Wrath for ST. And Bull Charge, Onslaught and Tremor/ Anvil for AoE.
Class Features:
Momentum and Enduring Vengeance.
Feats:
Very important are Prepared Slam and Roiling Hatred (because the alternatives are really bad). The rest depends on playstyle and situation (AoE or ST). I run Weight of Vengeance because I love the big 500k hits with Anvil. Also the cooldown is reduced, that is very important. But maybe sb likes Heavier Slash more. The Advantage is that you don't have to care about your Vengeance. But if you can control your Vengeance, Weight of Vangeance probably has a higher damage potential. The 4th and 5th feat depends on the situation. For AoE I would take Landwasher und Bloody Reprise. For ST I would recommend the other two options. I personally have no extra AoE loadout, because I have only two loadouts and the other one is for tanking. Personally I only use the ST loadout. It also works.
Fighter does hit hard with the right setup and everything stacked (50%+ vengeance, enduring vengeance and heavy slash at least in aoe) the problem imo are the cooldowns.
I've been playing different classes this mod and if you check for example ranger, wizard they have ways to reduce their encounter cooldowns, when the fighter only has a cd reduction on Anvil of Doom by selecting a feat if i'm not mistaken.
So if you don't melt something, when you get to your 2nd rotation as a fighter, the other classes are already done with theirs and half way into the 3rd one wich leads to a bigger difference in dps.
But then again what do i know, some classes are buged and the devs said they were gonna analise stuff this mod and maybe do some changes if needed around mod 18.
> Why would you guys want to play Fighter as DPS? The real reason.
Because tanks are useless in mod 16. You don't need a tank to clear a dungeon (except of CR maybe). And tanking is really boring for me.
DPSing is quite funny.
* DPS loadout on the Fighters is there for to help with campagain tasks, but in general he is a TANK class.* Nah, you just pus out, thats whats happening here, playing a tank is never boring. Yup, its not ment to be super good since he is TANK.
p.s. Fighter tank is boring!(for me)
In theory, the Conqueror actually had a unique design with clear strengths (burst damage single target), weaknesses (lengthy cooldowns, KC turning you into glass while it was active, meh AoE), and player involvement (needed to know how to tank in order to see your opportunities to deal damage, long cooldowns and 10 seconds of KC forced you to pick your damage opportinuty wisely, KC double damage penalty forced you to pay attention to the enemies or die midswing).
In practice, Conqueror ended stupidly good because its weaknesses were covered by the other broken things of previous mods (uncapped buffs, Survivor's Wraps, Shepherd's, powershare, Hastening Light/Artificer's, and lifesteal).
With the busted stuff killed off in Mod 16, you'd think the replacement would inherit the fun and depth of Conqueror, right?
Too bad that the only thing inherited from Conqueror was a tenuous design goal (counter attack) and not much of the fun or depth that was put into Conqueror.
There is a recorded LoMM run from me as DPS fighter. Well, our class has a small disadvantage against other DPS classes like rogue, mage or ranger. For me reducing our cooldowns would solve that issue.
BUT you can still be top DPS in LoMM. Generally I am top dps in LoMM as a fighter. So don't give up!
Again, my personal experience should not be taken as an actual metric to measure how well a class performs compared to other classes because there are many variables that should be taken into consideration. Also, other players personal experience should be taken lightly as we, you, or others do not know the conditions in which that players GF was in. Meaning, did they play with an HR, TR, CW? What was their gear loadout? Power? Etc... as a GF if I have 200k power with BiS gear, you would expect my GF to outperform a TR with 130k power with suboptimal gear. For me stating that my GF is a good metric for other DPS GF’s to compare to would give some players false hope (maybe not the right word) when consider DPS GF a viable DPS. When players like RJC9000 who have tested these toons and give a detailed analysis of the how they perform state that the GF DPS suck and play like <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>...... well based on the numbers and thorough analysis then you would also conclude that they play like dookie.
With that out of the way, here is my take on how the class as a DPS is performing, and compared to another class (GWF) with the same problems (that are WAI.... I guess).
Movement and fluidity in combat:
The GF appears to be slow and clunky/cumbersome. Looking at his GWF brother, which compared to previous mods is also slower and more cumbersome now, the GWF plays smoother and doesnt feel like a chore to move in combat. The GF moves, animations, and attacks are slow and in my opinion are perceived to long winded (which may or may not be the case depending on the encounter/at-will).
Attacks:
Encounters have good mag but some are slow to fire off like onslaught. I cant count the amount of times I get into the fight first and go to fire off onslaught only for most of the enemies to be dead already due to the HR melting them. Onslaught by the way is one of my favorite attacks in the game. Super cool. Moves like tremor with 250 mag and 15.6 second cd suck as an aoe compared to GWF’s not so fast attack. Not so fast can have an immediate cooldown, proccs a “buff”, and gives decent rage and has a base cd of 11ish seconds, seems way better to me. Tremor.... does some damage... Atwills are pretty bad as well. Cleave does 25 mag as an aoe attack and reave does 30.. again compared to the GWF aoe attack of WMS (renamed relentless) is not even close. Single target attack heavy slash has 80 mag (tooltip is wrong stating 100) with a 1 sec cast time compared to GWF’s brash strike with 85 mag and .8 cast time doesnt do as good either.
Feats/Class mechanics/etc...
Vengeance..... 20% “buff” is nice, but, is a chore to manage and leads to more clunky and slow movement issues. I actually jump and tap my right bumper (seethe button) and release before touching down to power it up and maintain it between fights. Combat superiority seems ok but I dont know if ill ever notice it doing much for me than just being something I have to pick for my second class feature. Momentum is nice and since it was reworked to make bull-charge do more damage independently of the movement is super cool. It never leaves my bar for a gap closer and decent mag attack. But thats it.... bosses never seem to live long enough to consider slotting enduring vengeance. I never use the speed boost one because I run 4x gladiators guiles (the other insignia bonuses are garbage, except artificiers persuasion). While GWF’s only get a 10% (or 15%) boost in damage from rage, its quicker to get to rage depending on what you run and I can go ham with WMS in a “target rich” aoe situation. With GF DPS I guess cleave is ok but slow and weak (25 vs GWF 45 wms) or I can run around and line up my reave aoe attack and hope the HR, GWF, whatever other DPS havent already deleted the enemies from the equation we call life. GWF has a crit severity increase, steel blitz, and trample the fallen. All of those feats for the GWF effect every or most attacks they have.
This is already long winded and makes the point I think. I know comparing these 2 classes isnt end all be all. Like I said it is my PERSONAL opinion and experience by maining these 2 classes. GF suffer from poor aoe at wills, slow and clunky moves/attacks with long cd’s ( is this why you call him GOOFY FIGHTER? because he feels clunky and goofy to play?) and poor class features. My endgame GWF can hang with and beat most end game TR’s that I have played with. Well gear and well played HR’s are a different story. My DPS GF doesnt cut the mustard when compared to another class that suffers from some of the same issues as DPS GF does. DPS GF needs a little bit of love. Maybe bring back WMS for the GF? Speed up some animations and reduce some cd by a second or two? Or make the encounter worth the wait by making them hit harder like the DPS GF of old? Like RJC9000 mentioned, the old DPS GF was a beast when used right. A 10 second window to dump an absurd amount of damage or get 1 shotted was fun.
Both GF AND GWF are not performing as well compared to the other DPS classes but at least my GWF can do decent damage and is competitive with some of the other DPS classes. I personally would never ask for nerfs and think that the weaker classes should get a buff. Especially SW, poor <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. Anyways, just my .02 cents.