So, lets call it like it is. Barbies are officially worst class to play

ravenkkin

If someone pls can correct me. Iv put millions in testing new gear, arty sets, weapons, enchantments, builds..
And the results are as follows.
I can somewhat tank. But not as close as paly's can.Groups will take you ONLY as last option. And yeah, who made barbie to tank??
I can somewhat DPS. But not nearly as good as other classes can. Stats caped, power around 188k, almost all orange insignias, all bis orange companions, rank 15 empowered, almost all rads 15. Still 20% behind next dps class. (of same level,play skills...)
Now i feel sorry i didnt invest in other class at start of mod 16.
So if anyone have any playable build or idea how to keep up with other classes pls share.
Just a warning for all new players thinking of making barbie not to invest too much in your toon cause i guess it will be few mods before we
get playable role in end game.

namelesshero347

You probably haven't played GF (goofy fighter) where you have to drop a deuce to do decent dps,

frogwalloper

The barbarian, rogue, and wizard are my favorite characters to play at the moment. My warlock can't keep up with any of them even though it's much farther along and has better equipment. Maybe my barbarian can't outtank my paladin, but my paladin uses up a lot more consumables since it can't finish fights anywhere near as fast. It's almost less that my paladin outtanks my barbarian as my paladin takes a bigger beating.

I don't particularly like that the second path for barbarians is tanking. I kind of wish they had merged barbarian and fighter into the same class - two separate paths.

juan

I think that here are two circumstances, namely, the first of them, both for barbarian and for fighter, is the barrage of complaints from all players in other classes about the supposed massive damage that the two classes did, barbarian in multifocus and monofocus , and fighter in monofocus, which led the devs to be influenced and reduce both classes to the minimum in dps. The second circumstance, referred to the barbarian, is the commitment of some deluded with resources, to use that class for something that is anathema: a two-handed weapon and tank. Until the devs do not see these circumstances, both classes will continue like this and the rest will be satiated their desire to look over their shoulder

xphenom03

If u guys need help with ur build, just hit me up. Im about to put my build in mmominds but i cant confirm my account, still waiting.

However, my main gripe is.

1. Why is the barbie’s stamina deplete a lot
2. Of all classes that does dps, y does a barbie have 1 offensive slots while freaking cleric have 3
3. Why does all our daily animations last a long fckn time

ravenkkin

Thank you all for your replies.
And yeah, apologies to all you fighters and warlocks out there. Guess we are all in a same place now.
I have been playing and maining GWF from day one. And im not that sad that we are not top dps now.
Circle goes around and its time for next class to be on top. I get that. And tbh it is kinda fun to be underdog again.
My main problem is that difference is so big! At 188k power i get eaten by classes that have 120k power.
So when others get to 180k power we will be so far behind that getting groups will be impossible for us. (mod 1-6 anyone?)
Tank OR dps.
And i honestly think that there is maybe 5 GWF's in whole game that started a GWF to be a tank. No one wanted it, no one asked for it, and im not really sure where that idea come from. If they want us to tank they could easy take dps path away from us too cause its worth nothing. Its there just to make things look better.
And cant wait to see your build xphenom3, but forgive me for not holding my breath, cause i think i did them all and results were 5% difference at best and to get close to "pure" dps class u need at least 30-35% dps boost, that i dont think we can get no matter what we do.
Wish u all gl and happy hunting.

xphenom03

I posted it here

xphenom03

I do around 80-100m dmg in 27 min lomm run

kiraskytower

ravenkkin said:

And i honestly think that there is maybe 5 GWF's in whole game that started a GWF to be a tank. No one wanted it, no one asked for it, and im not really sure where that idea come from. If they want us to tank they could easy take dps path away from us too cause its worth nothing. Its there just to make things look better.

The idea for a Barbarian tank came from the old Sentinel feat path - which was always kind of intended as an "off-Tank" which could soak up punishment at the expense of some DPS. The path never really caught on and I can say I have known only a handful of Sentinel GWFs in NW.

Their translation to Mod 16 "tank" from Sentinel I'd have to say didn't really turn out well either .... while it does make sense for a barbarian to be able to soak up alot of damage and protect his party by doing so, They chose to make the Barbarian tank really just a variant of the fighter tank - blocking with his sword - and in the process gave the entire class a more defensive slant than it had before. In many ways it's like the way they transitioned the Warlock's Temptation Path into the Warlock healer. Many people wanted warlocks to be able to queue as healers, but nobody really wanted the total transformation of the class they did in order to make it happen.

treentbail21

They need to let us have at least two strictly offensive and a utility\offense companion if your specced as a blademaster.

-2 offense/ 2 defense and utlity/offense for blademaster

-1 offense/ 3 defense and 1 utility for sentinel.

ravenkkin

treentbail21#9864 said:

They need to let us have at least two strictly offensive and a utility\offense companion if your specced as a blademaster.



-2 offense/ 2 defense and utlity/offense for blademaster



-1 offense/ 3 defense and 1 utility for sentinel.

At this point i dont even think that would help. Or what would help tbh.
I run LOMM daily with my guildies. I have some BIS/near BIS hr's and cw's in my guild, and only time i can keep up with them is
if i pull GWF sprint on them and leave whole group far behind and get that few first hits to up my dmg.
And we all know how disrespectful that is to tanks and how cheesy move that is. Tho iv seen more than few CW's do it lately.
Worst defeat was LOMM with bis CW that doubled my dps. Dont really think any changes to build or power loadout or equipment can compensate for that.
I still hope someone smarter than me can find a way to make us playable again.

ravenkkin

kiraskytower said:

ravenkkin said:

And i honestly think that there is maybe 5 GWF's in whole game that started a GWF to be a tank. No one wanted it, no one asked for it, and im not really sure where that idea come from. If they want us to tank they could easy take dps path away from us too cause its worth nothing. Its there just to make things look better.

The idea for a Barbarian tank came from the old Sentinel feat path - which was always kind of intended as an "off-Tank" which could soak up punishment at the expense of some DPS. The path never really caught on and I can say I have known only a handful of Sentinel GWFs in NW.

Their translation to Mod 16 "tank" from Sentinel I'd have to say didn't really turn out well either .... while it does make sense for a barbarian to be able to soak up alot of damage and protect his party by doing so, They chose to make the Barbarian tank really just a variant of the fighter tank - blocking with his sword - and in the process gave the entire class a more defensive slant than it had before. In many ways it's like the way they transitioned the Warlock's Temptation Path into the Warlock healer. Many people wanted warlocks to be able to queue as healers, but nobody really wanted the total transformation of the class they did in order to make it happen.

I remember Senti path, and iirc there was time when CAGI build was best for gwf's cause it was brokenly good ( around mod 6?) sorry if i messed up, that was long time ago and maybe i remember wrong.
But still doesnt change the fact that no one wanted that change specially cause it messed up our (primary) role as dps.
If they wanted for gwf to have two playable paths they they failed miserably at it, and in a process destroyed both paths leaving us with non.

ravenkkin

xphenom03#4498 said:

I do around 80-100m dmg in 27 min lomm run

Thank you for your hard work! i tested it before. tbh with few changes made here and there, but difference is still very small to any other builds. (compared to true dps classes)
Was a worthy try and i appreciate your work xphenom

treentbail21

Were even worse then before in pvp. This update was really bad for me since thats all I really like to do. Dps dcs like 3 hit me lol and we have like no stamina anymore.

stark760

I run with a nasty HR/SW combo on my barb a lot. Lately, HR does around 90 mil, SW 70-75ish, and my barb around 55-60 mil in under 25 min runs. You can't get upset if they get all the DPS on the trash, or on phases in CODG like the tentacles. You'll never keep up with them. On the bosses though, the DPS is there. On final boss, should easily do 15+ mil, usually closer to 25. Yeah, it would be nice for everyone to travel in a nice 5 man pack to get the next groups, but let's be realistic...never happen. Was running CODG's on Barb yesterday, and was consistently 3rd, behind a TR and CW, who crushed me after elevator phase, on the tentacles(I hit 2), and the boss(usually theyd have the 1/4 chuck off within 1-2 encounters for me), but even with that, I do around 60-70% of the top person and 3rd overall. Tried the escalating feat as well. Can be a higher dps, but situational, like the final boss in LOMM. Everywhere else, hard to build the 10 crit stacks and get use of the longer unstoppable. If the HR in our group isn't there, usually the SW is top DPS with around 100 and im at 80 in 28-30 min runs.

stark760

And don't listen when they say to leave golems alone on second boss after second pull phase, or when someone cocooned, they go HAM, you should too. 2 things that can help some, get a doohickey and 1 tenebrous(give a couple mil over LOMM).

xphenom03

Np man. But yea, when they do a patch, hopefully they gve us more than 1 more offense comp, cut down casting for our daily, fix our stamina. But not holding my breath on it tho. GG to whoever “fixed” gwf for mod 16

ravenkkin

stark760 said:

And don't listen when they say to leave golems alone on second boss after second pull phase, or when someone cocooned, they go HAM, you should too. 2 things that can help some, get a doohickey and 1 tenebrous(give a couple mil over LOMM).

I do have a doohickey and i do use 1 Tene rank 14.Tbh im somewhat below 300k hp needed for max 24k hit per proc cause i use old % gear,
i have whole new armor set (ofc with all power kits on it) and venom and trobri set but were loosing dps with all of them so i went back to old % stuff and orcus.
Tried using trample build but keeping it up with not so fast was actually loosing me dps in LOMM cause for aoe it does way lower dps than axes hit on nice pack of mobs+blitz and barbed.
So far my best results were.
for aoe: blitz, barbed for passives,than decanter pop IBS and frenzy for that big chunk of rage(rage is around 60% by then) and axes for multy hit+relentless to clear whats left of mobs.
in ST i swap exes for punishing charge (specially works well for mimics in lomm).
It all works well at the start of combat. i pop it all i get 60-70% rage go unstopable and give them hell.
But after that i just go to slow hacking, flying all over from cc or geting freezed and waiting for cooldowns or rage to get to 50% cause waiting for it to get to 100% would take forever and is a waste of time.

PS
got beaten last night by 130k power cw.
my 188k power means nothing, till last boss she had me for 10mil

I am sorry for rant guys
But im totaly out of ideas
ty for all your replys

mordekai

The only reason barbarian has a Tank paragon is that people had gone on and on for ages about making Warlock a viable Healer for Dungeon Queues. They did that and needed to either remove Healing from Paladin or Cleric to balance support, or add a third Tank class.

stark760

@ravenkkin,
Can go 3 encounters for dps, IBS, Frenzy, axes, but once you do your 3 moves, like you said, you slow. The not so fast over the frenzy or axes, will keep you 5-15% dps the entire time. It also builds around 20% of the rage bar, and when you get the free proc from the relentless swings, you can go unstoppable a lot more than normal. Also the trample feat will give you more dps if the cw is controlling, you just have to make sure you've used a control encounter every 10 secs. Sometimes for trash, ill use the axes, but ive gotten used to a NSF, relentless, IBS, artifact(using artificers persuasion as mount insignia helps, tried 2 of them, but didn't notice it jump from 2 sec cooldown), relentless a few, maybe a free NSF, unstoppable, frenzy, IBS, and more relentless to proc free NSF for 20% more rage when unstoppable ends. About the only time I use the axes now is the elevator on CODG. They are cool, but with good dps around, by the time I get to throwing them, 1/2 the time, I don't get much from it, and I got annoyed by the both arms flex after the move to be honest, costs a valuable sec imo. Also running, NSF w/ roar, ibs, is a nice way to generate a lot of rage.

mebengalsfan

xphenom03#4498 said:

If u guys need help with ur build, just hit me up. Im about to put my build in mmominds but i cant confirm my account, still waiting.



However, my main gripe is.



1. Why is the barbie’s stamina deplete a lot

2. Of all classes that does dps, y does a barbie have 1 offensive slots while freaking cleric have 3

3. Why does all our daily animations last a long fckn time

Cleric has 2 offensive and 2 utility; not 3 offensive.

The reason that Barbarians have 3 defensive over 3 offensive is that Barbarian are tanks as well as damage dealer. The devs even admitted that they lack the resources needed to create the code that would give damage dealer classes like a barbarian, cleric, and fighter 3 offensive that the pure damage dealer classes have. Maybe mod 17 will resolve this or a later mod. It is something that should happen in the future and that won't make that much of a big difference in your overall damage. Even taking the two two companions for offensive stat you may end up with around 8-10K more power and if you have 180K that is less than 10% boost.

I laugh because I hear how stronger wizards and hunters are but I find my cleric is really strong on single targets hitting for 1M+ regularly and my cleric is using mostly R8 enchantments.

ravenkkin

mebengalsfan#9264 said:

xphenom03#4498 said:

If u guys need help with ur build, just hit me up. Im about to put my build in mmominds but i cant confirm my account, still waiting.



However, my main gripe is.



1. Why is the barbie’s stamina deplete a lot

2. Of all classes that does dps, y does a barbie have 1 offensive slots while freaking cleric have 3

3. Why does all our daily animations last a long fckn time

Cleric has 2 offensive and 2 utility; not 3 offensive.

The reason that Barbarians have 3 defensive over 3 offensive is that Barbarian are tanks as well as damage dealer. The devs even admitted that they lack the resources needed to create the code that would give damage dealer classes like a barbarian, cleric, and fighter 3 offensive that the pure damage dealer classes have. Maybe mod 17 will resolve this or a later mod. It is something that should happen in the future and that won't make that much of a big difference in your overall damage. Even taking the two two companions for offensive stat you may end up with around 8-10K more power and if you have 180K that is less than 10% boost.

I laugh because I hear how stronger wizards and hunters are but I find my cleric is really strong on single targets hitting for 1M+ regularly and my cleric is using mostly R8 enchantments.

agreed. my biggest hit so far was fully buffed 600k. so even if they make a offense companion only barbarian can use
that gives 50k power i still wouldnt be able to hit for 1 milion.
In my opinion barbarian class needs yet another rework, but i fear that would just screw us even more.
Guess there is not much to do but wait for better days.

midnightita

Unless they heavily buff us for next mod, barbarian will be garbage useless deadweight in the new trial. Be ready.
Adding offensive slot is not gonna make big differences by the way.

rafamarques

2x

rafamarques

In my opinion barbarian class needs yet another rework, but i fear that would just screw us even more.

in fact, that is easy. what we do today? use encounters to got rage fast to use battle rage and then improve speed/damage for atwills

how change that? 1 - improve the main atwills speed+rage gain (3x or more than now) and battle rage improve only our encounters by 25%-30% instead of 10-15%.

the biggest problem of gwfs now are: devs dont adapted our tab to that "dailys>encounters>atwills" philosophy.

ravenkkin

midnightita said:

Unless they heavily buff us for next mod, barbarian will be garbage useless deadweight in the new trial. Be ready.
Adding offensive slot is not gonna make big differences by the way.

we can only hope we all have enough guildies/good friends too pity run us through the new trial.

some1stolemynickname

OK...I have no idea what all the complaints are about. I have 1 of each class and barb is not bad at all. SW and OP are actually the worst...go try one of those.

So a barb isn't the best at DPS? It never was, but can still up there on the leader board. Each class has a role to play. Barb is a mix of single target removal (IBS for necros etc), and crowd clearing AoE. On top of that they CAN tank. Both DPS and tanking mode need practice to build skill. I have no issues holding agro when I use mine to tank.

Bottom line is learn to use the class, or try something else. Try using different skills and feats perhaps. I like Not So Fast (it's still good), Axe Throw, and IBS.

I do have 3 complaints about a barb though:

1. AoE dailies need more damage to match the cast times, or cast times reduced a lot
   
2. only 1 offensive companion slot...DPS should have 3 and tank left with 1
   
3. feats need a major rework...most are pretty much useless or force you to use junk skills
   

I guess it's the barb's job to rage more anyway

betepok

the feats are awful at all. Daylies cast are awful. Make full determintaion very hard. 1 offensive slot. People started to writting in the chat things like this ( looking for 3 dps for lomm no barbie ) Idk what to say. As a tank people just kicking tank barbie from the que even before the dungeons started. A lot of people left the class and made hr or wizards, some1 left the game

methuselas

What's the HAMSTER point of playing a GWF (Barbarian) now? They're HAMSTER atrocious!!! I get the whole they're no longer top dog whiny HAMSTER everyone has to play when their class isn't "the best", but whoever designed the "Barbarians" "mechanics" 1. never played a GWF and 2. has absolutely *NO* idea how to actually create game mechanics.

I started on rebuilding my GWF today after the atrocious Mod 16. I've already lost my Cleric, due to HAMSTER design and my Paladin isn't much better, so I'm down 2 characters to grind for my weekly AD as I have zero intentions of playing a character I no longer enjoy.

But what they did to GWFs......I can't believe it. I really can't HAMSTER believe it. Battle Fury is pretty much HAMSTER now. Trample is useless. An entire feat is wasted forcing you to pick between the two of the SHITTIEST Dailies imaginable or forego gaining anything from said feat. (I can do more DPS using Crescendo and Sure Strike in the time it takes to cast Avalanche of HAMSTER and Spinning Strike has ALWAYS sucked.) Another feat forces you to pick between IBS or "Bloodletter." Finally the very first feat you get, you have to pick between picking Not So Fast (which I don't particularly like for my own reasons) or HAMSTER MIGHTY LEAP. I've been playing a GWF since beta and I don't know a SINGLE player worth their weight in salt that used Mighty Leap longer than they had to. It was the first Encounter power replaced, as it was completely useless when other powers came along.

But yeah, let's devote a HAMSTER FEAT to it.

Then, I went and did my abilities and realized the only worthwhile place to put points into was CHARISMA, due to "Recharge Speed" and "Companion Influence." I love how being charismatic in some way makes my powers reset faster.

I *GET* they're losing money on this game. I'm not the one that made bad business decisions for YEARS. That's on them. I worked in the industry, so I know how it is. Player base is down, sales are down, it's not hard to figure out. That's why we get ninja nerfs like upping the ZaX cap to 750 to 1, cookie cutter builds and HAMSTER like Acquisitions Incorporated.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

tom

> @ravenkkin said:
> Unless they heavily buff us for next mod, barbarian will be garbage useless deadweight in the new trial. Be ready.
> Adding offensive slot is not gonna make big differences by the way.
>
> we can only hope we all have enough guildies/good friends too pity run us through the new trial.

We acutally did it on Pre with a barb tank, the dps path needs work but the tank doenst look that bad imo.