mod 15

xmarik69x

just returned to game after close to a year hiatus, so was wondering with mod 15 what was changed for the HR? I tried to find any mod 15 builds. Someone in my guild's alliance told me that after mod 15 ranged HRs are now in a better place, but can't find any builds to support this. I don't play HR to be melee, if I wanted to play melee I'd make a GWF, GF, or TR

eliybeats

We're one of the highest buffing classes now after the changes. Our damage increased dramatically on aoe where blade storm and twin blade storm is viable. Blade storm isn't as good as people say but in situations where it's useful it does do great damage. Read the tbs vs bs post for more. Our single target is good but not like cw's and gwf's however with enough recovery we can keep up. This is all about combat though. Trapper sucks damage wise and they pretty much only made it viable for buff Hopefully they'll fix it. Archery is... Archery.. Maybe good for buff build but honestly trapper out performs. It does well in pvp however.

jonkoca

Yup, buff builds or combat builds for pve, archery or (if you are a troll) trapper stunbot builds for pvp. Despite the stillness nerf, the capstone change for archery means our damage is up in pvp and combat is very strong in pve, I've been main dps in Castle ravenloft and it's been fine even though I'm mainly a pvp build.

There are combat builds, buff builds and archer pvp builds in the threads below.

artifleur

There's no range DPS build in PVE Neverwinter, HR or not. So if that's what you are looking for I'm afraid you had better try some other game.

Flavourwise, I don't get what's wrong about the melee HR. In fact, the ranger has always been a melee class in D&D specializing in using 2 weapons and light armor. Using a bow never was required. And its style is quite different from that of the fighter or rogue.

vorphied

artifleur said:

There's no range DPS build in PVE Neverwinter, HR or not. So if that's what you are looking for I'm afraid you had better try some other game.

^^
This, x10. Even the players who insist on building Archer-spec HR cannot maintain range due to enemy AI, and if they are trying to stay at range, they are missing crucial buffs.

CW, SW, DC are all melee just as much as Combat HR, GWF, TR, OP, GF. Not even the classes that appear to be ranged on paper are able to play that way, nor should they.

thefiresidecat

vorphied said:

artifleur said:

There's no range DPS build in PVE Neverwinter, HR or not. So if that's what you are looking for I'm afraid you had better try some other game.

^^
This, x10. Even the players who insist on building Archer-spec HR cannot maintain range due to enemy AI, and if they are trying to stay at range, they are missing crucial buffs.

CW, SW, DC are all melee just as much as Combat HR, GWF, TR, OP, GF. Not even the classes that appear to be ranged on paper are able to play that way, nor should they.

how are those other classes melee? I run dc a lot and I can't recall a single melee power that we use? may not need to be far away from target and infact choose to be in melee range for the melee classes to be near you but powers work the same at 20 feet as they do at 3. theoretically for the lols it should be possible for a ranged team to go in together and stay at range together and kite the boss collectively (because the tank can't be ranged and wouldn't get buffed you'd probably have to go sans tank) but theoretically it should be possible.. and that wouldn't be if sw cw and dc were also all melee as much as a combat hr.

vorphied

> @thefiresidecat said:
> There's no range DPS build in PVE Neverwinter, HR or not. So if that's what you are looking for I'm afraid you had better try some other game.
>
>
>
> ^^
> This, x10. Even the players who insist on building Archer-spec HR cannot maintain range due to enemy AI, and if they are trying to stay at range, they are missing crucial buffs.
>
> CW, SW, DC are all melee just as much as Combat HR, GWF, TR, OP, GF. Not even the classes that appear to be ranged on paper are able to play that way, nor should they.
>
>
>
>
> how are those other classes melee? I run dc a lot and I can't recall a single melee power that we use? may not need to be far away from target and infact choose to be in melee range for the melee classes to be near you but powers work the same at 20 feet as they do at 3. theoretically for the lols it should be possible for a ranged team to go in together and stay at range together and kite the boss collectively (because the tank can't be ranged and wouldn't get buffed you'd probably have to go sans tank) but theoretically it should be possible.. and that wouldn't be if sw cw and dc were also all melee as much as a combat hr.

You’re taking my point a little bit too literally. Melee range is optimal for everyone; it has nothing to do with their powers being restricted to melee range.

thefiresidecat

vorphied said:

> @thefiresidecat said:

> There's no range DPS build in PVE Neverwinter, HR or not. So if that's what you are looking for I'm afraid you had better try some other game.

>

>

>

> ^^

> This, x10. Even the players who insist on building Archer-spec HR cannot maintain range due to enemy AI, and if they are trying to stay at range, they are missing crucial buffs.

>

> CW, SW, DC are all melee just as much as Combat HR, GWF, TR, OP, GF. Not even the classes that appear to be ranged on paper are able to play that way, nor should they.

>

>

>

>

> how are those other classes melee? I run dc a lot and I can't recall a single melee power that we use? may not need to be far away from target and infact choose to be in melee range for the melee classes to be near you but powers work the same at 20 feet as they do at 3. theoretically for the lols it should be possible for a ranged team to go in together and stay at range together and kite the boss collectively (because the tank can't be ranged and wouldn't get buffed you'd probably have to go sans tank) but theoretically it should be possible.. and that wouldn't be if sw cw and dc were also all melee as much as a combat hr.



You’re taking my point a little bit too literally. Melee range is optimal for everyone; it has nothing to do with their powers being restricted to melee range.

I'd posit that it's your phraseology that is to blame not my interpretation they ARE ranged classes. they COULD choose to stay at range with the ranged classes.. but they choose to stay melee range because of the melee only classes. it could go either way. it just is best for the group to stay close instead of far.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

vorphied

> @thefiresidecat said:
> > @thefiresidecat said:
>
> > There's no range DPS build in PVE Neverwinter, HR or not. So if that's what you are looking for I'm afraid you had better try some other game.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > ^^
>
> > This, x10. Even the players who insist on building Archer-spec HR cannot maintain range due to enemy AI, and if they are trying to stay at range, they are missing crucial buffs.
>
> >
>
> > CW, SW, DC are all melee just as much as Combat HR, GWF, TR, OP, GF. Not even the classes that appear to be ranged on paper are able to play that way, nor should they.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > how are those other classes melee? I run dc a lot and I can't recall a single melee power that we use? may not need to be far away from target and infact choose to be in melee range for the melee classes to be near you but powers work the same at 20 feet as they do at 3. theoretically for the lols it should be possible for a ranged team to go in together and stay at range together and kite the boss collectively (because the tank can't be ranged and wouldn't get buffed you'd probably have to go sans tank) but theoretically it should be possible.. and that wouldn't be if sw cw and dc were also all melee as much as a combat hr.
>
>
>
> You’re taking my point a little bit too literally. Melee range is optimal for everyone; it has nothing to do with their powers being restricted to melee range.
>
> I'd posit that it's your phraseology that is to blame not my interpretation they ARE ranged classes. they COULD choose to stay at range with the ranged classes.. but they choose to stay melee range because of the melee only classes. it could go either way. it just is best for the group to stay close instead of far.

That’s a little like saying that TR can be played at range, which is technically true, but not an observation that is useful in any practical sense

Classes with ranged abilities prefer melee range for a variety of reasons: mobs close the gap, buff range is limited, melee is preferable for maximizing damage on PBAoE, conal, and line attacks, Shadowstalker bonus works at close range, etc.

I hammer this point home because many players come into NW with the misapprehension that ranged powers = ranged play style and have difficulty accepting that their best PvE gameplay is in melee range, regardless of class.

thefiresidecat

vorphied said:

> @thefiresidecat said:

> > @thefiresidecat said:

>

> > There's no range DPS build in PVE Neverwinter, HR or not. So if that's what you are looking for I'm afraid you had better try some other game.

>

> >

>

> >

>

> >

>

> > ^^

>

> > This, x10. Even the players who insist on building Archer-spec HR cannot maintain range due to enemy AI, and if they are trying to stay at range, they are missing crucial buffs.

>

> >

>

> > CW, SW, DC are all melee just as much as Combat HR, GWF, TR, OP, GF. Not even the classes that appear to be ranged on paper are able to play that way, nor should they.

>

> >

>

> >

>

> >

>

> >

>

> > how are those other classes melee? I run dc a lot and I can't recall a single melee power that we use? may not need to be far away from target and infact choose to be in melee range for the melee classes to be near you but powers work the same at 20 feet as they do at 3. theoretically for the lols it should be possible for a ranged team to go in together and stay at range together and kite the boss collectively (because the tank can't be ranged and wouldn't get buffed you'd probably have to go sans tank) but theoretically it should be possible.. and that wouldn't be if sw cw and dc were also all melee as much as a combat hr.

>

>

>

> You’re taking my point a little bit too literally. Melee range is optimal for everyone; it has nothing to do with their powers being restricted to melee range.

>

> I'd posit that it's your phraseology that is to blame not my interpretation they ARE ranged classes. they COULD choose to stay at range with the ranged classes.. but they choose to stay melee range because of the melee only classes. it could go either way. it just is best for the group to stay close instead of far.



That’s a little like saying that TR can be played at range, which is technically true, but not an observation that is useful in any practical sense



Classes with ranged abilities prefer melee range for a variety of reasons: mobs close the gap, buff range is limited, melee is preferable for maximizing damage on PBAoE, conal, and line attacks, Shadowstalker bonus works at close range, etc.



I hammer this point home because many players come into NW with the misapprehension that ranged powers = ranged play style and have difficulty accepting that their best PvE gameplay is in melee range, regardless of class.

tr was never in this discussion. it's not like saying that at all. a cw, sw and dc do NOT need to be close to get significant damage and buffs and debuffs in. you COULD do a match with those classes and play at range and still get your damage in. tr only has one encounter that does anything at range as I recall.

vorphied

thefiresidecat said:

a cw, sw and dc do NOT need to be close to get significant damage and buffs and debuffs in.

Yes, they very much do need to be close.


- Attacking from range promotes inefficient gameplay; some mobs will stagger their approach as they stop to use abilities or will simply have ranged behavior of their own.
- CW has powerful PBAoE abilities that are useless at range.
- SW HB depends on Pillar of Power for buffing, debuffing, damage, and passive application of Lesser Curse. This power loses half of its function at range.
- DC benefits from hitting itself (and teammates when applicable, obviously) with Divine Glow and generally depends on splat AoEs when it comes to damage. The best way to keep mobs close together is to run up to them before they have the chance to scatter.

And that's not even going into the group dynamics of remaining in range to keep up Aura Gifts and to make sure the player and their pet are both regularly buffed by Anointed Army.

No, ranged combat is really not a thing. Even when it comes to daily content that is designed to be easily soloable, it's much more effective for all classes to fight in melee range.

artifleur

thefiresidecat said:

a cw, sw and dc do NOT need to be close to get significant damage and buffs and debuffs in.

They certainly do, and I'm surprised to see you arguing about that. You understand we are talking about PVE here, right?