test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Zen Exchange glut problem
wisper2048
Member Posts: 187 Arc User
Considering recent and coming nerfs to AD income I'm feeling that wrong problem is addressed. Whales are not going anywhere, and they are getting fatter. IMHO the real reason is the combination of Zen Exchange cap and the ability to sell items bought for Zen to AH.
I believe this is not exploit, since every piece is working as intended separately, but they lead to vicious cycle when they put together. And this does not bring cryptic more money anyway. This just causes a permanent and unfixable glut for Zen exchange.
Almost all Zen comes from real money, there were free sources of Zen via Arc, but I think they are disabled now. Lets consider the current international server. Basing on AH situation, many people are doing the following. I think the most of them are legit whales, as the cycle does not require major efforts.
0. Start with some fixed sum of AD
1. Buy 85 Zen for 42500 AD on Zen Exchange.
2. Wait until Zen arrives
3. Wait for refinement item discount
4. Buy 10 green wards for 85 Zen (15% discount) equal
5. Put 10 green wards for 53.939 (current price on AH is 534000 for 99, but we will use amount of 10 to simplify calculation)
6. Wait until it is sold
7. Get 48545 from AH
8. Fork out 42500 and go to step 1.
9. Enjoy 6045 AD (it is possible to invest into the cycle again)
Just look at the ward section on AH to see that a lot of people are doing it. I'm not using this schema, but I feel pressured by those who use as they create inconveniences for me in the form of glut. The schema benefits from multiple accounts and it is easy to fork it to another account by just transferring ward stacks to it by email.
While the people are doing this they naturally move exchange to cap. And this cycle works only while exchange is at cap and step "
3. Wait until Zen arrives" takes too long for many people. Otherwise they would bought items on AH, they would have bought Zen directly and spent it in Zen store.
This cycle does not need any effort, just some start AD. Those who use the cycle do not create benefit for community, if they were not in the cycle, those who need item from Zen store would have just bought it directly by exchanging Zen. And the cycle and zen exchange glut naturally supports each other, the bigger the glut is, the more profitable schema. The more profitable schema is, the more reasons to invest into and thus creating additional Zen exchange glut.
I see the following options to solve it:
1. Make Zen exchange uncapped. This will cause instabilities in income and it will remove the reason to go through intermediates. People will just wait until acceptable price.
2. Make all Zen exchange items account bound (or at least universally needed ones like wards). This will remove ability to resell items in demand so the cycle will broke. If someone needs item from Zen store, one will exchange AD for Zen and buy it directly.
This will not completely remove ability of whales to make money, but it will force them to at least to contribute something to community. The easy ways are:
1. Buy lockbox keys and sell results
2. Buy wards on Zen store and components and use them to upgrade enchants and sell resulting enchants (this could be considered as form of crafting, and it is still a service to community considering streaky RNG)
The problem with the current schema is that they could use Zen exchange while contributing nothing and w/o any limiting factors except for ward demand (which by design unlimited as wards are major limiters to item level growth), like buying RP form AH in case of enchant upgrading.
I believe this is not exploit, since every piece is working as intended separately, but they lead to vicious cycle when they put together. And this does not bring cryptic more money anyway. This just causes a permanent and unfixable glut for Zen exchange.
Almost all Zen comes from real money, there were free sources of Zen via Arc, but I think they are disabled now. Lets consider the current international server. Basing on AH situation, many people are doing the following. I think the most of them are legit whales, as the cycle does not require major efforts.
0. Start with some fixed sum of AD
1. Buy 85 Zen for 42500 AD on Zen Exchange.
2. Wait until Zen arrives
3. Wait for refinement item discount
4. Buy 10 green wards for 85 Zen (15% discount) equal
5. Put 10 green wards for 53.939 (current price on AH is 534000 for 99, but we will use amount of 10 to simplify calculation)
6. Wait until it is sold
7. Get 48545 from AH
8. Fork out 42500 and go to step 1.
9. Enjoy 6045 AD (it is possible to invest into the cycle again)
Just look at the ward section on AH to see that a lot of people are doing it. I'm not using this schema, but I feel pressured by those who use as they create inconveniences for me in the form of glut. The schema benefits from multiple accounts and it is easy to fork it to another account by just transferring ward stacks to it by email.
While the people are doing this they naturally move exchange to cap. And this cycle works only while exchange is at cap and step "
3. Wait until Zen arrives" takes too long for many people. Otherwise they would bought items on AH, they would have bought Zen directly and spent it in Zen store.
This cycle does not need any effort, just some start AD. Those who use the cycle do not create benefit for community, if they were not in the cycle, those who need item from Zen store would have just bought it directly by exchanging Zen. And the cycle and zen exchange glut naturally supports each other, the bigger the glut is, the more profitable schema. The more profitable schema is, the more reasons to invest into and thus creating additional Zen exchange glut.
I see the following options to solve it:
1. Make Zen exchange uncapped. This will cause instabilities in income and it will remove the reason to go through intermediates. People will just wait until acceptable price.
2. Make all Zen exchange items account bound (or at least universally needed ones like wards). This will remove ability to resell items in demand so the cycle will broke. If someone needs item from Zen store, one will exchange AD for Zen and buy it directly.
This will not completely remove ability of whales to make money, but it will force them to at least to contribute something to community. The easy ways are:
1. Buy lockbox keys and sell results
2. Buy wards on Zen store and components and use them to upgrade enchants and sell resulting enchants (this could be considered as form of crafting, and it is still a service to community considering streaky RNG)
The problem with the current schema is that they could use Zen exchange while contributing nothing and w/o any limiting factors except for ward demand (which by design unlimited as wards are major limiters to item level growth), like buying RP form AH in case of enchant upgrading.
1
Comments
While I do agree the zen-ah items cause part of the problems we have atm and have said so myself, I do not agree that the new changes introduced across the board are in the wrong direction. Out of order (My chronological preference and expectation) maybe but not in the wrong direction.
P.s I wouldn't expect them to touch this issue but if it happens it happens.
There are more expensive items for example SKT token:
1. Cost 1600 Zen (20% service or universal discount) = 800000 AD
2. Auction price 1,280,000
3. Received from AH 1,1520,000
4. Income 352,000
The problem is that the schema scales with accounts and that accounts do not need to do anything except buying and selling on each slot. And income is practically guaranteed eventually because Zen prices are relatively stable and the exchange price is capped. The exchange glut is also practically guaranteed, so sooner or later someone impatient will buy.
600k is still near 1 week worth of refining and as the snowball effect continues it becomes easier to spread this habit to other accs/players with just the profits alone, rinse and repeat and you have a self perpetuating problem until something is done.
In addition, patience is what people do not have. If they have patience, they won't pay extra to get stuff from AH (when Zen store is cheaper). This scheme relies on patience. i.e. the Zen buyer does the waiting and tolerate the dalay so that he can earn extra to sell the stuff to the person who cannot wait.
Wards give 14% income, but faster turnover
This income is significant if consider its exponential nature. And the biggest problem is that this process creates zen market glut and benefit from zen market glut. The process requires very little human involvement and low risks.
That works only if not many people are doing that though.
I mentioned RAD only to show the incentive it provides to players as well as the fact that its gained through natural play and can be re-invested into this method increasing the effectiveness of it until max capacity is reached per acc./player/turn over etc.
Right now in game 2,500,000 ad, is well the max you can get with 50 dollors worth of zen when you sell it for ad on ah. People need a lot more for other things, like legendary mounts, things. So basically 2,500,000 would be something well not worth buying zen for. But if they raised it to 1500 then with 50 dollars one would be able to buy 7,500,000 ad off zax, this might cause prices to raise on some things but I think it would help stabilize the economy and also be an incentive for more players to sell zen on the zax for the ad. If they are making 2x more ad from selling zen on zax then the backlog will be reduced. Also with reduced ad gains within the game. With the removal of salvage more players might be willing to buy ad with zen. To make up for the loss. by increasing the zax limit to 1500 players can get more ad then they do now and thus more might be willing to buy more and more zen. Like I said maybe this will cause prices to raise but at the same time I think it would be the best solution to the current situation and also more money for cryptic. I might be willing to put zen on the zax then I do now to buy up like 7.5 mill if they do so. So yes I think its vital they raise it. For the reasons I said.