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Forums > Home› Neverwinter Discussion › Player Feedback (PC)

Mane of the Manticore and Chitters Fangs are not fun in PvP

cilginordekcilginordek Member Posts: 459 Arc User
in Player Feedback (PC)
Mane of the Manticore can easily deal 100k damage to a person pretty much out of nowhere. Some dailies are almost instant. It is not fun to get hit 100k instantly without any warning beforehand whatsoever. They also trigger multiple times from one daily sometimes. A well timed daily will kill 3 people at once without any warning or time to react.

Comments

  • cilginordekcilginordek Member Posts: 459 Arc User

  • jonkocajonkoca Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,586 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    I ran a few acts after I got mine, it comes out as an average 7% of my total damage in a match. Compared with aimed shot doing about 44%. The 30 second icd stops it from getting any higher I think.

    I have about 180k HP when full, in a perfect storm - mane off cd, and someone just love-taps me with weak at will or something then yes, boom pow thump they get hit for 90k. Mainly for me it's TR insurance, guarrenteeing me at least one good hit on those invisble sod-spammers. ☺
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak
    gromovnipljesak#8234
         Member Posts: 1,053 Arc User
    Yeah, it's not as bad as OP claims, but there should be some additional mitigation for PvP. It can be right nasty against pallies and GFs, they can borderline one-shot some players if not sufficiently geared.
  • marnivalmarnival Member Posts: 1,432 Arc User
    gromovnipljesak#8234 said:

    Yeah, it's not as bad as OP claims, but there should be some additional mitigation for PvP. It can be right nasty against pallies and GFs, they can borderline one-shot some players if not sufficiently geared.

    Eum they can and there is not borderline for bis gfs/pals with or without that helm....... but then again so can hr and tr more or less also not that I in ANY way compare ANY class with todays godmode Trs......
  • menofvalourmenofvalour Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    As the target "Laeriun" shown in the example, I would have to agree with Tony in the original post. He was able to, repeatedly, proc it multiple times on me, killing me instantly in <1sec. The above procs all occurred in a split-second, 6x procs instantly for 161,796 dmg, that's with it being reduced by 69% (519,654 otherwise), and NOT including any other dmg going on at the time.

    Tony so far has been the only one to proc it that my times, repeatedly, on me in a match, but it is commonly proccing 2-3x in a single instant.

    And so far as 'gear' goes, I play a tank GF with 90%+ deflection (in pvp), and am regularly on page #1 of the leaderboard...
  • jonkocajonkoca Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,586 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    Which class's daily is it..? Not HRs for sure, it procs just like it says on the tooltip for me. It's not the daily that procs it btw. it's getting hit by someone after you've hit a daily. You sure it isn't whatever you're hitting him with that's causing the multiproc..? Or some weird combo of deflect, reflect, and damage on deflect boons..?
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • cilginordekcilginordek Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    Daily used in that instance was Crescendo. I've had the same happen to me with Villians Menace too I think. It may be the deflect boons as I run them too.
  • jonkocajonkoca Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,586 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    Hmm. Probably though the daily in question has multiple hits, and you're deflecting and/or reflecting most of them separately... to the manticore bite's cooldown it counts as one daily/one hit... so it procs each time the daily user takes damage from you during that period. I dunno, but that sounds sufficiently cryptic-like, coding wise.

    My build has rubbishy deflect because I want the stealth from shadowclad to proc, and I don't bother with the damage on deflect boons for the same reason. So hopefully those crescendo hits won't destroy me. ☺
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • demolitioninc#2453 demolitioninc
    demolitioninc#2453
         Member Posts: 108 Arc User
    @jonkoca your manticore procc'ed 3 times on me yesterday from one daily (3x 71K). Maybe the roots applied by a daily multiprocced it. For sure it was a painful experience. :'(

    I think I have to go back using my manticore as well again.
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  • jonkocajonkoca Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,586 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    Hmm. I very rarely use roots tbh. My usual rotation is ambush (no roots), commanding (no roots), longstriders (no roots), disruptive (daily, but no roots) and aimed shot (no roots).

    If there is a helluva lot of cc flying about I sometimes use binding, which does have roots, and if lots of TRs then thornward - a dot, but no roots.

    And again, manicore procs off your damage encounters, not mine, so the whole root-thing is not really thing.

    The other daily I use is forest ghost, that does have a few seconds' duration. I wonder if manticore bite multi-procs if a toon gets hit multiple times within the duration of a single daily..?

    If so then yes, manticore bite needs a fix to limit it to one proc per daily, per 30 seconds.
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • menofvalourmenofvalour Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    https://imgur.com/a/fnLOxa0



    Cant get the image to display correctly, but here this SW was proccing it x12 on me, instantly... 30sec cooldown, sure...
  • jonkocajonkoca Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,586 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    What weapon enchant was he using..? I have heard things about feytouched. My archer uses U. Vorp, so I can't confirm.
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • menofvalourmenofvalour Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    well, aint this fun:

    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Your Life Steal gives 464 (1510) Hit Points to you.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Your Life Steal gives 67 (218) Hit Points to you.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Your Life Steal gives 510 (1658) Hit Points to you.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.

    If you count them, that's 11 procs; occurring in <1sec..

    I don't know what daily they were using, but the class was a SW, and this occurred just 18min now.
  • vickvega82#4490 vickvega82
    vickvega82#4490
         Member Posts: 33 Arc User
    If it is multi proc'ing, that deserves a fix. A nerf, certainly not. I use it on my TR and its having a decent effect on occasion but even with almost 200k HP, maybe two or three times I've seen it really smoke someone. It Definetly doesn't seem hands down BiS, I've contemplated changing it out for rex corona or wolf clan several times thinking that the stay gain in the end would be better damage.

    And when I get smoked by someone's manticore mane, I play around it the rest of the time. In my experience the ppl who get burned repeatedly by manticore mane are the same ppl who die 10 or 12 times in a cradle. Play smart and avoid the damage.
    Limitless is L33t AF
  • wintersmokewintersmoke Member Posts: 1,641 Arc User
    menofvalour said:

    well, aint this fun:

    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Your Life Steal gives 464 (1510) Hit Points to you.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Your Life Steal gives 67 (218) Hit Points to you.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Your Life Steal gives 510 (1658) Hit Points to you.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.
    [12:15] [Combat (Self)] Michero deals 10874 (95557) Lightning Damage to you with Manticore's Mane Bite.

    If you count them, that's 11 procs; occurring in <1sec..

    I don't know what daily they were using, but the class was a SW, and this occurred just 18min now.</p>

    As far as I know the only way for a SW to deal lightning damage is with an enchantment.
  • menofvalourmenofvalour Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    @wintersmoke: If you would note the damage type in the original post is 'lightning' from a GF, and the damage type is 'lightning' from the SW; the damage done by the helm is considered lightning and has nothing to do with the person's class.


    We could also talk about chitters proccing upwards of 41 (seen by me) and 50+ times (seen by others) in a single sec....

    I would suggest that both pieces need a 'cooldown' (chitters) or a tying of it to the initial use of the encounter (ignoring secondary procs of that encounter, such as with lightning enchant now) or an actual enforcement of their cooldown (manticore mane); otherwise things will continue as they are now, with a single 'broken' piece of equipment defeating and clearing teams/people vs. skill/effort.

    @vickvega82: there are multiple classes that cannot 'avoid' damage, but must either mitigate or simply take it on the nose.
  • marnivalmarnival Member Posts: 1,432 Arc User
    Yet more broken items in pvp after sandys now these they must be fixed things like this just add to to how broken pvp is in NW,,,,
  • jonkocajonkoca Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,586 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    Yeah. That's broke alright.

    There must be another variable, either a power or an enchant involved. It's never done that with my HR. In testing with a friend the other day manticore bite managed to proc twice off forest ghost, both times from frozen reflected damage boon from storm campaign.

    I notice it's mitigated also. Reduced from 95k down to 10k. Hmm. That's disappointing lol. Time to look for another hat I guess.
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • heraldfayez#8520 heraldfayez
    heraldfayez#8520
         Member Posts: 227 Arc User
    lol this isn't as bad as chitters procing 54 times on me ...also yes mane and chitters need to be fixed same with curse ring (best if this is removed all together )
  • marnivalmarnival Member Posts: 1,432 Arc User
    Tbh Items that proc damage when you get hit is something that ALWAYS should be hardcapped in pvp.

    First it makes for skill less pvp as you do damage when you get hit something that never should contribute as major source of damage.

    Second to many sources of damage, weapon enchats, encounters etc use dott based or multi proc damage which can and will put up resonance feilds when damage just multiply endlessly like aura of courage when pal use sanctuary among others.

    Tbh it is frankly dam sloppy coding that allows these items to multiproc on different powers/enchants etc.

    If you are to implement these kind of no skill damage when hit items as a coder you should make very certain they don not create game breaking effects it is pure lazyness not to......
  • vickvega82#4490 vickvega82
    vickvega82#4490
         Member Posts: 33 Arc User
    > @jonkoca said:
    > Yeah. That's broke alright.
    >
    > There must be another variable, either a power or an enchant involved. It's never done that with my HR. In testing with a friend the other day manticore bite managed to proc twice off forest ghost, both times from frozen reflected damage boon from storm campaign.
    >
    > I notice it's mitigated also. Reduced from 95k down to 10k. Hmm. That's disappointing lol. Time to look for another hat I guess.

    You know I hadn't had issues with the brokenness of the mane til yesterday. I was in a Domiation against you Jon and you hit a daily and I know you wear the mane, so I went to back off when you shot me and the SKT boon proc'd and the mane killed me. So in return, I played around that the rest of the match........I didn't go to the forums and cry endlessly about how broken it is LOL

    QQ more ppl
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  • jonkocajonkoca Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,586 Arc User
    All power to you vick. A little stoicism is always refreshing. ☺
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • marnivalmarnival Member Posts: 1,432 Arc User
    edited April 2018
    vickvega82#4490 said:

    > @jonkoca said:

    > Yeah. That's broke alright.

    >

    > There must be another variable, either a power or an enchant involved. It's never done that with my HR. In testing with a friend the other day manticore bite managed to proc twice off forest ghost, both times from frozen reflected damage boon from storm campaign.

    >

    > I notice it's mitigated also. Reduced from 95k down to 10k. Hmm. That's disappointing lol. Time to look for another hat I guess.



    You know I hadn't had issues with the brokenness of the mane til yesterday. I was in a Domiation against you Jon and you hit a daily and I know you wear the mane, so I went to back off when you shot me and the SKT boon proc'd and the mane killed me. So in return, I played around that the rest of the match........I didn't go to the forums and cry endlessly about how broken it is LOL



    QQ more ppl


    Do you play a Tr perhaps ?

    The issue are there weather you can handle it or not. Pal-Sw-Hr dubble mark aura of courage has plagued pvp for years now. Orcus set one shoted people with millions of damage when it first came out.
    Dragon enchants coused havoc in pvp when they came the list are long with broken items/feats/powers and a good deal of those broken things derive from damage caused by retaliation damage.

    Look I play Gf among others in pvp using manticorn you set up ITC use templars with offhand bonus charge with bull followed by daily and griffon in any order and some of the reflective boons will most likely hit you back and give the target another 90k+ damage from nowhere(yes with arpen150+ and power 35+ that is the lucky case).

    Facing a pal that proc 5% of the total hp using arpen with way way higher power that procs 10-30 times is not the best for the pvp community either imo.

    You might find these things funny but I think we all can agree that it will not increase the population in NW pvp.....
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