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A Dev Mentioned Some Upcoming TR and GF Changes For Mod 14

trgluestickztrgluestickz Posts: 808Member Arc User
edited April 2018 in The Thieves' Den
The devs are making some adjustments to the TR and GF in module 14. Dev noworries responded to a PVP thread from XBOX with the following comment:

I Haven't seen an Xbox one mod 12.5 PvP feedback thread yet so I'm making one. Here are my 2 cents regarding the new PvP changes. Feel free to add, agree, disagree with whatever:



1. TRs continue to be the class with the most burst damage (unavoidable) with shadow of demise, control, survivability and cc in PvP. The "Recovery" (30k plus recovery stat) or "perma cb" rogue can still drop smokebombs back to back while spamming encounter powers/dailies and controlling an entire node, while still being able to kill relatively fast. Also regarding smokebomb, having it add 1 stack per use means you will almost never become immune from one TR doing this. As a result smokebomb is and will continue to be the most overpowered cc effect in the game.



2. CC diminishing returns does not seem very uniform. Some control effects from items, enchants and boons do not seem to add stacks (thunderhead, curse ring, impenetrable jungle, etc), while others seem to add them too fast ( wizard control powers, trappers, etc). This either results in being CC immune really fast, or stunned for a solid 30 seconds unable to use a power. Initial CC is very strong which is fine, but imo system should be ironed out a little further.



3. Old school mod 5 feel returns with healing suppression and armor penetration suppression increases. Now you actually have to watch your health, use powers actively to survive, and make tactical retreats when needed. Overall a great job in this regard. Also removal of tenacity is a huge step forward in bringing new players to PvP.



4. Permanent solo q is great as well despite issues with players not playing and matchmaking issues with team balance. I'm not sure if anything can be done to fix this though because of low pvp player population.



5. Regarding solo q, certain classes are really strong when stacked on one side of a team, while others seem less so (not taking into account player skill). TRs, GFs, and OPs are tough to kill and can make a match lopsided when there are two on the same team. GWFs, SWs, CWs, and HRs have the opposite effect. DCs are kind of in the middle depending on what build they are (DPS or healing).



Overall though significantly better than last mod in regards to progress.

We are continuing to make small steps towards better PvP balance. Some of that is difficult because of imbalances in neverwinter as a whole that we are also working towards as balance in both PvE and PvP are concerns.

As far as TRs, for M14 we have a change in for Shadow of Demise where it will be 75% of MITIGATED damage. This should provide a reduction to the ability in PvP while giving it a boost in PvE. It now also has a small DoT applied to it when it first lands which is a bit of an experiment to see how that feels, allowing it to add some benefit to PvE when things are killed so fast the full proc can't go off, and to help people notice they have SoD on them in PvP.

Shadowborn got a slight boost to go with these changes.

To go with that Smoke Bomb will now respect CC reduction in PvP, meaning the daze will last a shorter duration as you get more stacks of CC reduction, even when you are still standing in the smoke cloud.

Guardian Fighter got a change to Bull Charge, where it will no longer make a PvP target go prone (no changes to PvE). It will still knock back.

We continue to explore with different PvP modifiers as well as look for changes we can make for any given module to bring a better sense of balance overall.
Here is the original thread for anyone who wants to respond:

https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/comment/13026277
--
PVP Rogue,
--[----- "Your friendly neighborhood spawn of Satan." -----]--
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Main Character: MarigoldsTheShredder (Rogue Assassin)
Ingame Handle: trgluestickz
Discord Name: Marigolds🔪Gluestickz#2563
Full Gaming Name: Gluestickz The Gap Closer
Guilds: She Looked LVL 18 & Essence of Aggression
Alliances: Imperium & Vermilion
Platform: PC

Comments

  • kalina311kalina311 Posts: 1,637Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited April 2018
    Amen
  • rjc9000rjc9000 Posts: 2,098Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    So, is this image accurate?



    Or is it completely wrong given how PvE TRs technically get a buff to SoD?

  • luddoprasvane1luddoprasvane1 Posts: 3Member Arc User
    75% dmg for SoD , yes pls
  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak Posts: 954Member Arc User
    Thank HAMSTER
  • jonkocajonkoca Posts: 2,586Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    I just saw this too. Thank god is pretty much my opinion also.
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak Posts: 954Member Arc User
    rjc9000 said:

    So, is this image accurate?



    Or is it completely wrong given how PvE TRs technically get a buff to SoD?

    tbh, SoD is in the hands of the right player one of the best capstone feats overall, just because it doesn't get reduced by mitigations. now that it does, while getting buffed, it still remains an amazing tool in PvE, and a much more balanced lil thing in PvP. just gotta learn how to maximize it and you're gonna kick HAMSTER with it.
  • leonidrexleonidrex Posts: 397Member Arc User
    the best dps players i have seen were, TR they dont need a buff in pve, but im not gonna complain, faster runs for me i like it.
    as for SoD change in pvp it doesnt matter some bugs going on and they can deal piercing dmg with their bloodbath so you dont even live to get hit by a SoD, and before you tell me that im squishy, i have 220k hp with 210% dmg reduction and temp hps.
    in the end good change but doesnt matter much
  • c1k4ml3kc3c1k4ml3kc3 Posts: 1,104Member Arc User
    edited April 2018
    leonidrex said:

    TR they dont need a buff in pve

    Well, if you going to switch dailies to gain abnormal amounts of power, it kind of is a buff in pve. Even though it would be characterized as an exploit when some margins are applied.

    Anyway, I'm happy that TRs are getting a buff for PvE oriented content. It's been loooooooooooooooooooooooong overdue.
    True Neutral
  • naoqueroforumnaoqueroforum Posts: 225Member Arc User
    Good thing Tr are getting buffed, DPS sw's were almost reaching them.
  • naoqueroforumnaoqueroforum Posts: 225Member Arc User
    Oh, right @jaime4312#3760 . Thanks. So, they really think TR aoe and burst damage wasn't good enough? So I'm guessing fiery bolt is gonna get +300% base damage, insta cast and no cooldown, right?
  • athena#9205 athena Posts: 575Member Arc User
    TR in endgame is awesome, TR in growing up to endgame is horrible. this should even things out allot and make TR what it was meant to be, a competitor DPS class. It may be squishy but it has some new awesome abilities. TY developers for putting in DF wep procing on all hits, that makes a single target TR class a mob masher with Trans lightning. This upgrade should make it much better. Only one thing i still don't like on TRs DF, it takes a step backward when in the sequence and that can cause a hit to miss.
  • naoqueroforumnaoqueroforum Posts: 225Member Arc User
    This buff was much needed

    That was a 650m hit. On live he was doing a lot of effort a lot to try to get a 400m hit. Max was ~300 or so.

    I can't help but wonder how the devs see the game.
  • vordaynvordayn Posts: 1,277Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited May 2018

    This buff was much needed

    That was a 650m hit. On live he was doing a lot of effort a lot to try to get a 400m hit. Max was ~300 or so.

    I can't help but wonder how the devs see the game.

    At 0:18, Orcus was there ... the next second, he was gone. 650 million hit indeed.

    On one hand, it makes me appreciate that players are able to get to this level; but on the other hand I look at the Dev's calculation of damage and understanding of that and I'm smh.
    Vordon CW        Vordayn DC        Axel Wolfric GWF        Logain SW        Gawyn GF        Galad OP        Aspen Darkfire HR        Min TR
  • veywiil#8685 veywiil Posts: 208Member Arc User
    Burst DPS 2 stronk. In all seriousness though TR are not popular enough in the current meta. I'm not saying I haven't seen one, but if I count the number of groups that have a TR in tong, or a gwf. Its 20 to 1. And to be fair the 1 TR (16k IL) did great damage, so no complaints. I'll be glad to see more dps get a fair shake in the meta (RIP Spellstorm CW). Now about those multiplicative buffs, haven't heard anything about that in mod 14 yet...
    I'm a theorycrafter, that means I can answer fairly deep questions with scientific theory, mathematical proof, and some guessing. Ask me stuff!
  • ltsmithnekoltsmithneko Posts: 1,538Member Arc User

    Burst DPS 2 stronk. In all seriousness though TR are not popular enough in the current meta. I'm not saying I haven't seen one, but if I count the number of groups that have a TR in tong, or a gwf. Its 20 to 1. And to be fair the 1 TR (16k IL) did great damage, so no complaints. I'll be glad to see more dps get a fair shake in the meta (RIP Spellstorm CW). Now about those multiplicative buffs, haven't heard anything about that in mod 14 yet...



    -w-
  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak Posts: 954Member Arc User

    Burst DPS 2 stronk. In all seriousness though TR are not popular enough in the current meta. I'm not saying I haven't seen one, but if I count the number of groups that have a TR in tong, or a gwf. Its 20 to 1. And to be fair the 1 TR (16k IL) did great damage, so no complaints. I'll be glad to see more dps get a fair shake in the meta (RIP Spellstorm CW). Now about those multiplicative buffs, haven't heard anything about that in mod 14 yet...



    -w-
    ARE YOU EVEN TRYING

  • vordaynvordayn Posts: 1,277Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited July 2018





    ARE YOU EVEN TRYING

    The first clip entered at 5 seconds, finishes at 19.5 seconds, so 14.5 seconds to down Orcus.

    The second clip entered at 5.5 seconds, finishes at 21 seconds, so 15.5 seconds to down Orcus.

    It's a close call, but we have a winner :D (the top one still wins).

    Sadly, Orcus just doesn't have enough life to justify a 1 bil hit ...
    Vordon CW        Vordayn DC        Axel Wolfric GWF        Logain SW        Gawyn GF        Galad OP        Aspen Darkfire HR        Min TR
  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak Posts: 954Member Arc User
    vordayn said:





    ARE YOU EVEN TRYING

    The first clip entered at 5 seconds, finishes at 19.5 seconds, so 14.5 seconds to down Orcus.

    The second clip entered at 5.5 seconds, finishes at 21 seconds, so 15.5 seconds to down Orcus.

    It's a close call, but we have a winner :D (the top one still wins).

    Sadly, Orcus just doesn't have enough life to justify a 1 bil hit ...
    He could prolly do it faster (I mean, its Tardli he could one shot it with a god damn twig), but the goal was a big hit, rather than getting it done quickly.
  • vordaynvordayn Posts: 1,277Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    edited July 2018

    vordayn said:





    ARE YOU EVEN TRYING

    The first clip entered at 5 seconds, finishes at 19.5 seconds, so 14.5 seconds to down Orcus.

    The second clip entered at 5.5 seconds, finishes at 21 seconds, so 15.5 seconds to down Orcus.

    It's a close call, but we have a winner :D (the top one still wins).

    Sadly, Orcus just doesn't have enough life to justify a 1 bil hit ...
    He could prolly do it faster (I mean, its Tardli he could one shot it with a god damn twig), but the goal was a big hit, rather than getting it done quickly.
    I wasn't being serious on the winner being a second difference in time. I was just poking fun at it.

    To me it just shows how ... um ... overtuned it is right now? Not just SoD, but the current end-game meta (although SoD takes advantage of this in a very good way, benefiting from buffs twice, and with a +25% increase in damage).

    Pointing out that a 1 billion hit is more than is needed at Orcus, emphasises that the Devs could not have planned something like this - and if Devs are looking at this and thinking about what to change, the answer is *not* to give Orcus more HP, lol.
    Vordon CW        Vordayn DC        Axel Wolfric GWF        Logain SW        Gawyn GF        Galad OP        Aspen Darkfire HR        Min TR
  • schietindebuxschietindebux Posts: 4,291Member Arc User
    edited July 2018
    322.166.000 SoD , that´s what I witnessed in short time doing my first codg in mod 14. I guess 1.000.000.000+ is definitely possible.
    I think the new standart/meta in codg setup should be 1 TR + 9 supporter, onseshotting that endboss.
    I am in for that, simply maximises the time/AD ratio, farming that dungeon.
    Poor GWF, IBS 70mio+ is not enough, sry.
    Well done cryptic :)
  • spidey#3367 spidey Posts: 399Member Arc User
    Srly? I like those changes. It showes how balancing should look like and it shows how well known our devs are about classes/synergies/buffs/debuffs. Great job, cryptic. Really great job.


    Tbh: No dev ever testing such things before this goes live?
  • exact0khan#1334 exact0khan Posts: 29Member Arc User
    After 2 years of gwf being the "top" dps class it's going to be nice to not be over looked because your tr. Happens constantly. This is by no means a complaint, iv dealt with it and it's nothing new. However it's going to be nice to see them in a spot all trs have been in. The people complaining about the new balance clearly havent had much time on a tr at end game watching groups pass you by.. I am beyond happy this is happening.
  • guille23mxguille23mx Posts: 336Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    This has been FIXED right?
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