SW was nerfed in mod 12.5 (~10%) and mod 13 changes dont address class problems (which you don't even know) plus we can't really take all those "buffed" feats as they reduce the effectiveness of Pillar of Power therefore team perfomance as well. Don't forget (or you didn't know) that SW has been by far the most nerfed class in the last mods.
"I still find where he says they will be the worse damage dealer in Mod 13 a little hard to swallow... "
I explained all SW Class Features which clearly show they're far worse than those of any striker class, that leads to very bad self-buffing which puts warlock at disadvantage to other dpsers. Or perhaps are you going to elaborate on how the SW Class Features are in any way, shape or form even remotely close in bonus damage given to the aforementioned ones from the rest? Run your CW without Chilling Presence, Storm spell and damage multiplier feats and tell me how you do in damage? Perhaps that way you can understand the problem SW has.
"Another player earlier in the thread or one of the others on PREVIEW who plays both a Warlock & Wizard compared performance of both on Preview with similar gear / enchantments between his Wizard & Warlock; while I don't recall the difference's he spoke about on DoT / AoE for Single Target damage he claimed it was comparable on Preview. Now I need to try to find the post and quote it below..."
You don't even need to do that, I know who you mean, probably can't mention him as would be considered name and shame, as you aren't a warlock you don't know he's abusing the +500% effectiveness bug with the warlock, do you? I asked him if he could run with @thefabricant , freedom and the like and video record/ACT the run to compare damage and guess what, he never tried, you may know why. Get him to run without that dps bug vs those top rier CWs (especially now that you guys have that oppressor build for single target dps) and you'll be given clear evidence about where SW truly stands vs other strikers.
There you go. I'm pretty sure you haven't checked that thread so that link can come in handy to know how SW stands in that regard.
Anyway, bottolomline is:
BiS enchantments in mod 12.5 depending on build: Feytouched and dread.
BiS enchantments in mod 13 depending on build: Feytouched and dread
Excuse me, what was your problem about SW and multiprocs?
Feel free to post on the Nine Hells section or SW Discord section any questions you have about the class, you can given clear explanations on anything you may need to know.
You seem to think that SW is very similar to CW and it isn't, nor is dps better than that of CW nor we'll get a large portion of our dps out of multiproccing enchantments (like you guys did before mod 13), we'll be sticking with fey/dread depending on build.
OK fair enough - I never claimed to be an expert on Warlock. So I'm not well versed on them being nerfed in 12.5; but at least they were BUFFED in Mod 13. All I can report is what I saw another player report on PREVIEW who claimed to have both a Wizard / Warlock on Preview who did comparable Damage (DPS) in both classes with similar gear / enchantments on a single target like a Boss. I don't however remember the comments offhand about how they did with respect to DoT / AoE in his comparison between the two classes -- now I need to find the post again.
I also want to be clear - I have zero issues with Warlocks being given a MULTI-PROC power - I think that is great especially if by design as this clearly was! It's just GWF & Warlocks are the only two classes that still have a power that does that; most others saw those abilities taken away. Some however will have it made up as some new powers are able to go critical. Still 'some' suspect GWF may have been an oversight, yet seen no official indication either way.
I'd however encourage you to TRY different Enchantments: Lighting, Vorpol, perhaps even Holy Avenger, depending on your build; not just Feytouched or Dread exclusively.
Still at least Warlocks received a few other BUFFS in MOD 13 as well, one of the few classes who actually received them; although others had some mechanics, powers, or feats corrected. Which I think is also NICE. I'd still like to see a few Classes have some Class powers improved upon tho... ...each class has at least 1 if not 2, possibly even 3, that people avoid like the Plague... This is just a Wizard below and there's likely at least 1 or 2 others that could be improved upon. Most classes except perhaps Cleric have several poor/bad Class powers...
▪ Paragon Independent--Arcane Presence: Why buff Cold, extend Arcane Stack Damage 0.5-0.75 per Rank. ╘ Extend Arcane Stacks from 3% out to 5-6% per stack then people might use it. ▪ Paragon Independent--Frost Wave: Simply Immobilizes players for up to 4s (8s if facing away) that's it? ╘ Move the Cold Based Damage gains from Arcane Presence to increase Cold Damage here.
If I look at a Hunter Ranger for her are three obvious ones but likely at least 1 other as well. I suspect Warlocks have some poor Class powers in addition to Wizard's and Hunter Ranger's. There's at least one Rogue, one Guardian, and one Paladin class power that could use some BUFFS as well.
▪ Pathfinder--Battlehoned: +100 regeneration for 4s per level (+400 max / 16s max) ╘ Change to 5% BUFF per level feature out to 20% max of existing regeneration buff. ♠ Then if you had 2000 it may still only give +400 but at least it will scale as you assign BOONS/Enchantments. ▪ Independant--Crushing Roots: 0.125s DAZE per level (0.5 sec max) for weak roots, or 0.25s per level (1 sec) for strong. ╘ For crushing roots there's not even a damage bonus that using Weak or Strong Grasping Roots mechanic? ♠ Plant Growth roots: yet doesn't use Grasping Root mechanic to extend FEAT root timers--no damage gain for it. ▪ Pathfinder--Cruel Recovery: gain 1% of your max HP for 4s out to max of 16s? ╘ Honestly how long is 1% going to last, not even 1s--should change to 2.5%/5% HP minimum & 4s per level.
Now getting back to my Arcane brothers/sister the Warlocks... Thankfully at least both classes have other abilities they can rely on. Warlocks have DoT / AoE in addition to being decent Healer's too; while Wizard's regardless of Paragon seem encouraged to use Control abilities or DoT / AoE. Still I think BEFORE they add a new Class they still need to review some of the more poor performing Class powers and boost some of them.
My point was that in mod 12.5 ( and before) SWs got nerfed pretty hard so what mod 13 buffs do is getting some lost dps back but, as we have serious class issues holding back our damage potential, as long as they are not addressed, SW will be in a similar spot relative to other strikers (weakest one). As for the player who reported the comparable damage, I felt it was necessary to put that in context because it was most likely done as in bugged dps SW vs good CW and I suggested that person, instead, legit dps SW (him) vs top tier CW (Sharpedge, Freedom and Mystik and a few others) and that way it can be proved that CW > SW as, assuming both are trying their best to squeeze as much dps as possible from their characters, CW, as for the current state of the game, simply has the better tools to deal damage.
Regarding multiprocs and other types of enchantments, you do have a point in that thereay be specific situations in which a non BiS enchantment may be a bit better but, generally speaking, due to how powers proc enchantments and our decent base damage, feytouched and dread will generally outperform proc enchantments which is why either one is BiS depending on your build
Class features is something worth looking at for sure and SW is the prime example because, unlike the rest, SW's "best" ones available are horribly underpowered and that limits damage potential considerably.
Perhaps. Yet again I don't have a Warlock so I couldn't comment on Bugged Warlock features either improving or breaking Warlock damage.
I really would like them to TRY and remove any remaining Class Power BUGS regardless if they are FEATS, Mechanics, or Powers in addition to BUFFING some more poorly performing class powers most classes have... I tried to provide a few of the examples above!
Hopefully all before we see the addition of a new class possibly in the next 3-4 MODS either later this year or in the first half of 2019?
Comments
You were the one who missed the point.
SW was nerfed in mod 12.5 (~10%) and mod 13 changes dont address class problems (which you don't even know) plus we can't really take all those "buffed" feats as they reduce the effectiveness of Pillar of Power therefore team perfomance as well. Don't forget (or you didn't know) that SW has been by far the most nerfed class in the last mods.
"I still find where he says they will be the worse damage dealer in Mod 13 a little hard to swallow... "
I explained all SW Class Features which clearly show they're far worse than those of any striker class, that leads to very bad self-buffing which puts warlock at disadvantage to other dpsers. Or perhaps are you going to elaborate on how the SW Class Features are in any way, shape or form even remotely close in bonus damage given to the aforementioned ones from the rest? Run your CW without Chilling Presence, Storm spell and damage multiplier feats and tell me how you do in damage? Perhaps that way you can understand the problem SW has.
"Another player earlier in the thread or one of the others on PREVIEW who plays both a Warlock & Wizard compared performance of both on Preview with similar gear / enchantments between his Wizard & Warlock; while I don't recall the difference's he spoke about on DoT / AoE for Single Target damage he claimed it was comparable on Preview. Now I need to try to find the post and quote it below..."
You don't even need to do that, I know who you mean, probably can't mention him as would be considered name and shame, as you aren't a warlock you don't know he's abusing the +500% effectiveness bug with the warlock, do you? I asked him if he could run with @thefabricant , freedom and the like and video record/ACT the run to compare damage and guess what, he never tried, you may know why. Get him to run without that dps bug vs those top rier CWs (especially now that you guys have that oppressor build for single target dps) and you'll be given clear evidence about where SW truly stands vs other strikers.
About multi-proccing weapons as SW:
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1235687/official-m13-scourge-warlock-changes/p21
There you go. I'm pretty sure you haven't checked that thread so that link can come in handy to know how SW stands in that regard.
Anyway, bottolomline is:
BiS enchantments in mod 12.5 depending on build:
Feytouched and dread.
BiS enchantments in mod 13 depending on build:
Feytouched and dread
Excuse me, what was your problem about SW and multiprocs?
Feel free to post on the Nine Hells section or SW Discord section any questions you have about the class, you can given clear explanations on anything you may need to know.
You seem to think that SW is very similar to CW and it isn't, nor is dps better than that of CW nor we'll get a large portion of our dps out of multiproccing enchantments (like you guys did before mod 13), we'll be sticking with fey/dread depending on build.
As a striker, CW > SW.
I also want to be clear - I have zero issues with Warlocks being given a MULTI-PROC power - I think that is great especially if by design as this clearly was! It's just GWF & Warlocks are the only two classes that still have a power that does that; most others saw those abilities taken away. Some however will have it made up as some new powers are able to go critical. Still 'some' suspect GWF may have been an oversight, yet seen no official indication either way.
I'd however encourage you to TRY different Enchantments: Lighting, Vorpol, perhaps even Holy Avenger, depending on your build; not just Feytouched or Dread exclusively.
Still at least Warlocks received a few other BUFFS in MOD 13 as well, one of the few classes who actually received them; although others had some mechanics, powers, or feats corrected. Which I think is also NICE. I'd still like to see a few Classes have some Class powers improved upon tho... ...each class has at least 1 if not 2, possibly even 3, that people avoid like the Plague... This is just a Wizard below and there's likely at least 1 or 2 others that could be improved upon. Most classes except perhaps Cleric have several poor/bad Class powers...
▪ Paragon Independent--Arcane Presence: Why buff Cold, extend Arcane Stack Damage 0.5-0.75 per Rank.
╘ Extend Arcane Stacks from 3% out to 5-6% per stack then people might use it.
▪ Paragon Independent--Frost Wave: Simply Immobilizes players for up to 4s (8s if facing away) that's it?
╘ Move the Cold Based Damage gains from Arcane Presence to increase Cold Damage here.
If I look at a Hunter Ranger for her are three obvious ones but likely at least 1 other as well. I suspect Warlocks have some poor Class powers in addition to Wizard's and Hunter Ranger's. There's at least one Rogue, one Guardian, and one Paladin class power that could use some BUFFS as well.
▪ Pathfinder--Battlehoned: +100 regeneration for 4s per level (+400 max / 16s max)
╘ Change to 5% BUFF per level feature out to 20% max of existing regeneration buff.
♠ Then if you had 2000 it may still only give +400 but at least it will scale as you assign BOONS/Enchantments.
▪ Independant--Crushing Roots: 0.125s DAZE per level (0.5 sec max) for weak roots, or 0.25s per level (1 sec) for strong.
╘ For crushing roots there's not even a damage bonus that using Weak or Strong Grasping Roots mechanic?
♠ Plant Growth roots: yet doesn't use Grasping Root mechanic to extend FEAT root timers--no damage gain for it.
▪ Pathfinder--Cruel Recovery: gain 1% of your max HP for 4s out to max of 16s?
╘ Honestly how long is 1% going to last, not even 1s--should change to 2.5%/5% HP minimum & 4s per level.
Now getting back to my Arcane brothers/sister the Warlocks... Thankfully at least both classes have other abilities they can rely on. Warlocks have DoT / AoE in addition to being decent Healer's too; while Wizard's regardless of Paragon seem encouraged to use Control abilities or DoT / AoE. Still I think BEFORE they add a new Class they still need to review some of the more poor performing Class powers and boost some of them.
My point was that in mod 12.5 ( and before) SWs got nerfed pretty hard so what mod 13 buffs do is getting some lost dps back but, as we have serious class issues holding back our damage potential, as long as they are not addressed, SW will be in a similar spot relative to other strikers (weakest one). As for the player who reported the comparable damage, I felt it was necessary to put that in context because it was most likely done as in bugged dps SW vs good CW and I suggested that person, instead, legit dps SW (him) vs top tier CW (Sharpedge, Freedom and Mystik and a few others) and that way it can be proved that CW > SW as, assuming both are trying their best to squeeze as much dps as possible from their characters, CW, as for the current state of the game, simply has the better tools to deal damage.
Regarding multiprocs and other types of enchantments, you do have a point in that thereay be specific situations in which a non BiS enchantment may be a bit better but, generally speaking, due to how powers proc enchantments and our decent base damage, feytouched and dread will generally outperform proc enchantments which is why either one is BiS depending on your build
Class features is something worth looking at for sure and SW is the prime example because, unlike the rest, SW's "best" ones available are horribly underpowered and that limits damage potential considerably.
I really would like them to TRY and remove any remaining Class Power BUGS regardless if they are FEATS, Mechanics, or Powers in addition to BUFFING some more poorly performing class powers most classes have... I tried to provide a few of the examples above!
Hopefully all before we see the addition of a new class possibly in the next 3-4 MODS either later this year or in the first half of 2019?