The Two Thieves

blur

In effort to change the opinion of the community which they have towards the TR's, I decided to show that end game content is done in more than decent run time even with a TR and i added one more TR on top of it.
TR's are great and welcome them into your runs.
Sorry about the shaking in boss fights, its a habit to make it all a bit more blurry
Thanks to all party members.

https://youtu.be/-RyE4PRwtps
Edit: Replaced the video due to copyrights claim.

mamalion1234

blur#5900 said:

In effort to change the opinion of the community which they have towards the TR's, I decided to show that end game content is done in more than decent run time even with a TR and i added one more TR on top of it.
TR's are great and welcome them into your runs.
Sorry about the shaking in boss fights, its a habit to make it all a bit more blurry
Thanks to all party members.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ln--mvalQaM

great rogues:).

hammbo1969

Very nice vid. I've been through 'Rogues are a must' to 'Rogues...why??'

Buffed by others, we can do immense damage. The reason we're not often taken is, people don't realise this...

We need a new buff/debuff to make us relevant again.

spelldazer

I am getting 'Video is unavailable'

blur

It should be fixed now @spelldazer .

spelldazer

Thank you @blur#5900 it's a really nice run and it shows how our power spikes with the right powersharing.

At the same time, it kind of proves the point... we need the power stat to spike to be effective and that means we are far less effective in other team setups. At least, that's my experience. (Just an observation but with a cw in the group my dps goes waaay down, as if there is some sort of buggy interaction. Any idea why?)

Can you give some info on your loadout for this run? Was it MI Exe with dc sigil? Which active companion? Fully potted? I saw quite a bit of whirlwind on adds, did you also use Lurker's on boss? Was the 2nd TR same build?

Thanks for sharing the vid!

blur

Thanks. Not sure about the interaction with CW, no issue that i have heard of, but you are right, sadly. Without the right supports we are hitting the enemies with wet noodles. I have had runs where i almost one-shot mobs and runs where i use DF few times on a single mob and its still not dead lol.
There is an option to keep power high by yourself with WoB+CB with making full use of Artificers Persuasion , probably 25% ap gain Snail makes it easier as well, but thats rather annoying way to play, at least for me.

Build for both of us is same, same like all other MI Exe's, Dying Breath instead of Shadowborn. Shadowborn could work for 2nd boss if you can switch loadout. I did use DC Sigil, other TR was using Wheel i think. Potions/elixirs i use anything crit/power/recovery related and for this run the two pots which increase ability scores. Companions 3 archons, siege master, erinyes/raptor. 2nd boss Lurkers only, first boss both Lurkers and WoB depending if there are mobs or not, last boss Lurkers, WoB on mob phases.

spelldazer

Thanks. Will try to do at least half as well when I finally get a team to take me into t9g. Tried pugging it a few times. Did not get past Orcus, lol.

araxelven

spelldazer said:

Thanks. Will try to do at least half as well when I finally get a team to take me into t9g. Tried pugging it a few times. Did not get past Orcus, lol.

I've endured weeks of frustration in regards to getting in ToNG runs as a TR and finally found the answer last week: It's actually much easier if you're the only DPS there. It's counter-intuitive but having two DPS can't outweigh the loss from habing another buffer, so the "meta" wins. I guess I'll just have to build my own runs because you all know how easy it is to get invited...

Later, I got invited into a group that was already at the last boss because, as they said, they needed more dps for the souls. We were three dps in total but I kept being one-shotted a few seconds into the fight. In contrast, we made it on the first try the both times I was solo-dps. Sadly, buffs>>dps.

sundance777

Nice build and nice run and sweet buff bar! I don't know how you can stand to play with those bars across the screen like that, xbox does not do that. I have not bothered to try my TR in there yet, but I think it could really help with the Orcus fight as that thing is on a bit of a timer.

spelldazer

FWIW, I got my TR to 15k ilvl, 2 legendary pets, a couple of extra r12 rads (lost recovery and crit) and this helped me run it a few times with guildmates. It felt like a lot of the success rests on there being good power sharing support. This is especially true on the final boss. And having run it a few times now, I've stripped my TR and moved all enchants etc. to my OP. It's not as fun, but dang, it's so much easier and smoother to run end game content on it. The only times I miss my TR are in Chult when I have to solo a Rex or anytime I enter the Batiri camp and have to fight the entire camp. Aggro has its downsides. ;-)
Anyway, I don't think I will resurrect my TR until the shadowborn rework hits consoles. We're just too low dps or too limited in group composition for it to be worthwhile doing endgame pve.

dragonlancer

spelldazer said:

We're just too low dps or too limited in group composition for it to be worthwhile doing endgame pve.

No, we are not such low dps as everyone is saying. A well-played TR can do huge amounts of damage. Admitted, he can't beat a well-played GWF, but you don't run with those every time

We tested it in guild. We build a TONG-team of 4 players (2 DCs, 1 OP & me) and asked for a "HDPS GWF 16k+" blah blah blah in channels. We did this 3 times in a row with different GWFs and guess what? Only once did the GWF beat me.

So pls I encourage every TR to NOT give up and walk tall.

jrdiiorio

> @dragonlancer#8992 said:
> We're just too low dps or too limited in group composition for it to be worthwhile doing endgame pve.
>
> No, we are not such low dps as everyone is saying. A well-played TR can do huge amounts of damage. Admitted, he can't beat a well-played GWF, but you don't run with those every time
>
> We tested it in guild. We build a TONG-team of 4 players (2 DCs, 1 OP & me) and asked for a "HDPS GWF 16k+" blah blah blah in channels. We did this 3 times in a row with different GWFs and guess what? Only once did the GWF beat me.
>
> So pls I encourage every TR to NOT give up and walk tall.

The problem is it's not the 1% of tr that can actual do some dmg and stay competitive with those bis gwf. It's the other 99% that cannot and make a tr undesirable to join in any run with the assumption that they will not be any help to the party. Why take a chance on finding that 1% when u can move on and find a class that that can do dmg and contribute in a multitude of different ways since a tr brings none of those to the table. It's unfortunate cause I really love playing my tr but unless u run with friends it's usually unlikely to get picked up in any groups.

spelldazer

Ok, a couple of things to clarify...
Firstly, TR as single dps in a run will get the job done if built right. However, it might take longer than a run with a GWF or HR as single main dps. I have run a number of t9g in order to prove *to myself* that I can do it. But the runs were longish and I couldn't shake the feeling that I was *part* of the reason. I have a wonderful guild and I never had an issue where I was told no on account of playing a TR. We don't exclude. Period. But reality is that a *low geared* TR (1 legendary pet with imperfect gear, sub 15k ilvl) is just not gonna cut it compared to an equally geared dps of another class (other than maybe sw). And please remember, I'm on console, before some of the improvements (or so I hear) that are available on pc.

Secondly, I'm not giving up. I'm being practical about a suboptimal situation and taking a break from TR, instead playing a much desired role that helps me and my friends until devs get the rework done or TRs are worth the continued *investment*. If you stop to assess ths AD cost of making an end game toon, TR has bad ROI in PVE, IMHO. YMMV. So, yeah, I choose to invest 2-3M AD in making a viable DC and a viable OP for the same cost it would take me to make an OMG awesome TR.

So, if there are any awesome sub 15k TRs out there who run with 13-14k support and feel like sharing a vid of their ~40 min To9G, I'd love to see it and be inspired. I miss my TR already.