Is there any chance that the Soulforge Enchant can be reworked to be linked to the user's Maximum Hit Points rather than providing a static value? For example:
Rank 7 (Lesser) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 5% of your Maximum Hit Points and 1% every second for 3 seconds. This effect can only trigger once every 90 seconds. Rank 8 (Normal) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 10% of your Maximum Hit Points and 1.5% every second for 3 seconds. This effect can only trigger once every 85 seconds. Rank 9 (Greater) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 15% of your Maximum Hit Points and 2% every second for 3 seconds. This effect can only trigger once every 80 seconds. Rank 10 (Perfect) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 20% of your Maximum Hit Points and 2.5% every second for 3 seconds. This effect can only trigger once every 75 seconds. Rank 11 (Pure) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 25% of your Maximum Hit Points and 3% every second for 3 seconds. When you are resurrected you do 2700 damage to any foes nearby. This effect can only trigger once every 75 seconds. Rank 12 (Transcendent) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 30% of your Maximum Hit Points and 3.5% every second for 3 seconds. When you are resurrected you do 4,000 damage to any foes nearby and gain a 3 sec CC immunity. This effect can only trigger once every 75 seconds. Rank 13 (Unparalleled) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 35% of your Maximum Hit Points and 4% every second for 3 seconds. When you are resurrected you do 4,000 damage to any foes nearby and gain a 3 sec CC immunity. This effect can only trigger once every 75 seconds.
Soulforge in its current form is near useless in PVP other than to feed kills to opponents and is not very useful in PVE unless you can immediately heal yourself. Linking it to Maximum Hit Points will also permit it to scale with game content and make it more attractive to non-healers. The damage portion on Pure and above should also be re-worked given current game content.
Regarding the Astral Shield change: Increasing incoming healing in a game where everything either oneshots or then you brush it off a second later will not be worth expending any divinity on. Clerics want to use skills that benefit the party in that moment, so why not just heal when it's very infrequently needed than anticipate something that may not happen or may not even help? Most of the time everyone in the party is at full health.
Reducing Courage Breaker, Trickster Rogue's daily power duration from 10 seconds to 5 seconds does not change nor solve the problem AT ALL, because Best in Slot TRs with like 30k+ Recovery are able to put down daily, especially in combo with Sigil of the Devoted about 3 times to say the least during maybe 10 seconds period, meaning as fast as the CB goes down they are able to lay another one on the target which results the same - being perma Courage Breakered in perma Smoke Bomb. It does not change the situation that it leaves no door to escape for particular classes. What Courage Breaker needs is a cooldown, similar to the cooldown that has been put on the DC daily - Hollowed Ground, for Courage Breaker this cooldown needs to be at least 15 seconds or more.
While I agree, they need to break this power into 2 forms like they have for others. PvE and PvP. Implementing this type of cooldown would make it fully useless in PvE. Personally I've already said they need to go back and make 2 versions of all powers so that PVP can be properly balanced without entirely breaking skills in PvE or a fix to a PvE skill becoming totally overpowering in PvP.
Though, the question remains should they even bother with the skill if you can become CC immune after enough CC? (Unless Courage Breaker bypasses that too.....) Since CB + Smoke should pretty quickly give you temporary CC Immunity (unless I'm mistaken on how that one works).
Empowered bonuses for Break the Spirit, Forgemaster's Flame, Sunburst, and Warding Flare are once again properly applied and provide the proper buff / debuff values.
Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus no longer reduces the damage taken from attacks by a fixed number. Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus now increases incoming healing by 10% for each stack consumed. Developer Note: Even after nerfs, Astral Shield continues to be far and away one of the most game-changing powers in PvP. While we still want it to be effective, the flat damage reduction often results in 0-damage hits. This is an experimental attempt to make the power more reasonable in PvP, and prevent it from further trivializing PvE content, while still remaining useful."
Hello,
With all due respect, that is just an ill-fitted excuse to make another DC power useless. Noone wants incoming healing when you die from instantly from a boss power, it has almost no use! Please STOP, and THINK as a PLAYER. (Code a quick bis DC+ GF + 3DPS, and run TONG or FBI trash-mobs while using the new AS). I hope that will help you understand how useless the new AS version is and maybe some other things. As some other fellow DCs suggested, please separate the PVP from PVE and keep AS as it is now in PVE...
Aside note: is this DC nerfing a foudation to make the unnanounced, possibly "support-based", class more applealing on launch? I really can't understand all this nerfing, why? Because it seems that the DC AC-DO duo is also not "working as planned" (another possible nerf in future), so I don't know what to do with my lil' DC now.
People think ahead in this game as it takes a very long time to viably equip characters, I have no idea what to do with my DC since debuffing is one of the very few things left that won't require an unparalleled amount of time/AD to work decently. (AC raw power minimum cap raise....) I just hope the new class is not the bard...but a druid, maybe then I get to keep my "job".
Empowered bonuses for Break the Spirit, Forgemaster's Flame, Sunburst, and Warding Flare are once again properly applied and provide the proper buff / debuff values.
Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus no longer reduces the damage taken from attacks by a fixed number. Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus now increases incoming healing by 10% for each stack consumed. Developer Note: Even after nerfs, Astral Shield continues to be far and away one of the most game-changing powers in PvP. While we still want it to be effective, the flat damage reduction often results in 0-damage hits. This is an experimental attempt to make the power more reasonable in PvP, and prevent it from further trivializing PvE content, while still remaining useful."
I am afraid you've taken the wrong path here with incoming healing bonus. Incoming healing bonus will not help anyone survive since the shield is being used to help people who are using lifesteal keep themselves up by reducing the damage they are taking. Will this incoming healing bonus affect someone's lifesteal?
Astral Shield used to be one of the most powerful DC skills in the game back before the rework in mod 4. Now I'm afraid it's heading down a path of complete uselessness. If I- the cleric- have 100% healing bonus combined from power and wisdom- is this actually going to mean anything since when I heal I already over heal someone's hit ponts? How is an extra % healing bonus actually going to do anything when people's hit points are already being overhealed? People are either at nearly full health or dead in PVE. I can clutch heal and I do that in some parties but honestly I don't see a reason to empower Astral Shield since extra healing bonus doesn't help me do my job at all. Sure, I just healed them for 300k- 2 seconds later they are dead since they only have like 150k hp and were taking sustained damage.
I don't understand why you can't just change how the skill works in PVP vs PVE. You get no real useful rewards in PVP for anything relevant and since Gauntlygrm's PVE elements were taken out of the game it seems like it's clumsy at best to transition into pvping if you're strictly PVE. I know that you guys are working on making PVP more balanced and I admit I haven't kept up with all the threads on that since it's not something I follow regularly and I get why Astral Shield would be annoying in PVP. I just don't think that Incoming healing bonus is the right answer for PVE.
Relmyna - AC/DC Righteous + Haste| Nadine - CW MoF (working on it)|Buffy - GF SM Tact| Hrist - Justice Tankadin|Healadin (Wannabe Tank)| Lena -MI Sabo TR (Farmer) | Jeska - GWF SM Destroyer (Farmer) | Maggie - HR PF Trapper (Wannabe DPS)
--
I'll never retrace my steps.
This probably isn't the right thread, but it's a patch notes all the same so I'm wacking it here
In short, mod12b seems to bring some changes to how healing works in PvP - By reducing it further. Not gonna lie, after playing countless times VS my mate in a private Q the changes go pretty much unnoticeable for healing powers (As in healing Dailies, At-Wills and Encounters) but hit passive heals like Heal-On-Deflect really hard.
The point I'd like to raise is I think you're achieving the opposite effect than what you want. Ideally Oath-bound Paladin Heals and DC Heals wouldn't allow a team to be untouchable whilst nearby. And yes the changes help to reduce the effectiveness, I can't say it's going to stop the majority of PvP Heals-Support classes from over-performing in their field.
What's actually happening is classes that don't have active heals in the majority of PvP builds (Like SW DPS, GWF, GF, TR and non-renegade CWs) the effects of their healing is getting hit.
All this does is widen the effectiveness gap between classes and create imbalance in destroying survivability options in DPS classes where Team-VS-Team battles occur in which either a DC or OP is present.
Solutions? I think the current mod is plenty effective at negating passive heals and decreasing them further isn't helping. I would advise testing the plausibility of using the "Marked for PvP" event as an anchor for reducing active healing abilities' effectiveness.
If you could pass this on to the dev responsible for this change:
I think astral shield is not the problem with the "unkillable" cleric. The main issue is with gift of faith, the capstone for the faithful paragon tree. GOF stacks up way too fast and heals for an entire health bar, which on a geared cleric means you either burst down a cleric super fast for x2 of their health bar with a fully stacked gift, or you missed your opportunity to get a kill (this is near impossible in some situations if you don't have enough dps). The two other paragon paths don't have this issue and will be severely impacted by this change.
A more appropriate change would be putting a cool down on GOF, or making it only half as effective in PvP (for example it can only heal a target for half of their maximum hp in PvP). This would ease the burden on the dps clerics (which new proposed AS is useless for). It would also make it less of a balance issue with teams that have a faith cleric vs non faith cleric being too resilient.
3
mamalion1234Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,415Arc User
Empowered bonuses for Break the Spirit, Forgemaster's Flame, Sunburst, and Warding Flare are once again properly applied and provide the proper buff / debuff values.
Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus no longer reduces the damage taken from attacks by a fixed number. Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus now increases incoming healing by 10% for each stack consumed. Developer Note: Even after nerfs, Astral Shield continues to be far and away one of the most game-changing powers in PvP. While we still want it to be effective, the flat damage reduction often results in 0-damage hits. This is an experimental attempt to make the power more reasonable in PvP, and prevent it from further trivializing PvE content, while still remaining useful."
I am afraid you've taken the wrong path here with incoming healing bonus. Incoming healing bonus will not help anyone survive since the shield is being used to help people who are using lifesteal keep themselves up by reducing the damage they are taking. Will this incoming healing bonus affect someone's lifesteal?
Astral Shield used to be one of the most powerful DC skills in the game back before the rework in mod 4. Now I'm afraid it's heading down a path of complete uselessness. If I- the cleric- have 100% healing bonus combined from power and wisdom- is this actually going to mean anything since when I heal I already over heal someone's hit ponts? How is an extra % healing bonus actually going to do anything when people's hit points are already being overhealed? People are either at nearly full health or dead in PVE. I can clutch heal and I do that in some parties but honestly I don't see a reason to empower Astral Shield since extra healing bonus doesn't help me do my job at all. Sure, I just healed them for 300k- 2 seconds later they are dead since they only have like 150k hp and were taking sustained damage.
I don't understand why you can't just change how the skill works in PVP vs PVE. You get no real useful rewards in PVP for anything relevant and since Gauntlygrm's PVE elements were taken out of the game it seems like it's clumsy at best to transition into pvping if you're strictly PVE. I know that you guys are working on making PVP more balanced and I admit I haven't kept up with all the threads on that since it's not something I follow regularly and I get why Astral Shield would be annoying in PVP. I just don't think that Incoming healing bonus is the right answer for PVE.
tanks have the tools i guess for the job you described already or similar.
Comments
Rank 7 (Lesser) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 5% of your Maximum Hit Points and 1% every second for 3 seconds. This effect can only trigger once every 90 seconds.
Rank 8 (Normal) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 10% of your Maximum Hit Points and 1.5% every second for 3 seconds. This effect can only trigger once every 85 seconds.
Rank 9 (Greater) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 15% of your Maximum Hit Points and 2% every second for 3 seconds. This effect can only trigger once every 80 seconds.
Rank 10 (Perfect) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 20% of your Maximum Hit Points and 2.5% every second for 3 seconds. This effect can only trigger once every 75 seconds.
Rank 11 (Pure) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 25% of your Maximum Hit Points and 3% every second for 3 seconds. When you are resurrected you do 2700 damage to any foes nearby. This effect can only trigger once every 75 seconds.
Rank 12 (Transcendent) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 30% of your Maximum Hit Points and 3.5% every second for 3 seconds. When you are resurrected you do 4,000 damage to any foes nearby and gain a 3 sec CC immunity. This effect can only trigger once every 75 seconds.
Rank 13 (Unparalleled) When you fall in combat, your Soulforged armor will resurrect you and heal you for 35% of your Maximum Hit Points and 4% every second for 3 seconds. When you are resurrected you do 4,000 damage to any foes nearby and gain a 3 sec CC immunity. This effect can only trigger once every 75 seconds.
Soulforge in its current form is near useless in PVP other than to feed kills to opponents and is not very useful in PVE unless you can immediately heal yourself. Linking it to Maximum Hit Points will also permit it to scale with game content and make it more attractive to non-healers. The damage portion on Pure and above should also be re-worked given current game content.
Increasing incoming healing in a game where everything either oneshots or then you brush it off a second later will not be worth expending any divinity on. Clerics want to use skills that benefit the party in that moment, so why not just heal when it's very infrequently needed than anticipate something that may not happen or may not even help? Most of the time everyone in the party is at full health.
Though, the question remains should they even bother with the skill if you can become CC immune after enough CC? (Unless Courage Breaker bypasses that too.....) Since CB + Smoke should pretty quickly give you temporary CC Immunity (unless I'm mistaken on how that one works).
Classes and Balance
Devoted Cleric
Empowered bonuses for Break the Spirit, Forgemaster's Flame, Sunburst, and Warding Flare are once again properly applied and provide the proper buff / debuff values.
Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus no longer reduces the damage taken from attacks by a fixed number.
Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus now increases incoming healing by 10% for each stack consumed.
Developer Note: Even after nerfs, Astral Shield continues to be far and away one of the most game-changing powers in PvP. While we still want it to be effective, the flat damage reduction often results in 0-damage hits. This is an experimental attempt to make the power more reasonable in PvP, and prevent it from further trivializing PvE content, while still remaining useful."
Hello,
With all due respect, that is just an ill-fitted excuse to make another DC power useless. Noone wants incoming healing when you die from instantly from a boss power, it has almost no use!
Please STOP, and THINK as a PLAYER. (Code a quick bis DC+ GF + 3DPS, and run TONG or FBI trash-mobs while using the new AS). I hope that will help you understand how useless the new AS version is and maybe some other things.
As some other fellow DCs suggested, please separate the PVP from PVE and keep AS as it is now in PVE...
Aside note: is this DC nerfing a foudation to make the unnanounced, possibly "support-based", class more applealing on launch? I really can't understand all this nerfing, why? Because it seems that the DC AC-DO duo is also not "working as planned" (another possible nerf in future), so I don't know what to do with my lil' DC now.
People think ahead in this game as it takes a very long time to viably equip characters, I have no idea what to do with my DC since debuffing is one of the very few things left that won't require an unparalleled amount of time/AD to work decently. (AC raw power minimum cap raise....) I just hope the new class is not the bard...but a druid, maybe then I get to keep my "job".
Classes and Balance
Devoted Cleric
Empowered bonuses for Break the Spirit, Forgemaster's Flame, Sunburst, and Warding Flare are once again properly applied and provide the proper buff / debuff values.
Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus no longer reduces the damage taken from attacks by a fixed number.
Experimental change: Astral Shield's Empowered bonus now increases incoming healing by 10% for each stack consumed.
Developer Note: Even after nerfs, Astral Shield continues to be far and away one of the most game-changing powers in PvP. While we still want it to be effective, the flat damage reduction often results in 0-damage hits. This is an experimental attempt to make the power more reasonable in PvP, and prevent it from further trivializing PvE content, while still remaining useful."
I am afraid you've taken the wrong path here with incoming healing bonus. Incoming healing bonus will not help anyone survive since the shield is being used to help people who are using lifesteal keep themselves up by reducing the damage they are taking. Will this incoming healing bonus affect someone's lifesteal?
Astral Shield used to be one of the most powerful DC skills in the game back before the rework in mod 4. Now I'm afraid it's heading down a path of complete uselessness. If I- the cleric- have 100% healing bonus combined from power and wisdom- is this actually going to mean anything since when I heal I already over heal someone's hit ponts? How is an extra % healing bonus actually going to do anything when people's hit points are already being overhealed? People are either at nearly full health or dead in PVE. I can clutch heal and I do that in some parties but honestly I don't see a reason to empower Astral Shield since extra healing bonus doesn't help me do my job at all. Sure, I just healed them for 300k- 2 seconds later they are dead since they only have like 150k hp and were taking sustained damage.
I don't understand why you can't just change how the skill works in PVP vs PVE. You get no real useful rewards in PVP for anything relevant and since Gauntlygrm's PVE elements were taken out of the game it seems like it's clumsy at best to transition into pvping if you're strictly PVE. I know that you guys are working on making PVP more balanced and I admit I haven't kept up with all the threads on that since it's not something I follow regularly and I get why Astral Shield would be annoying in PVP. I just don't think that Incoming healing bonus is the right answer for PVE.
--
I'll never retrace my steps.
Some of my best friends are Imaginary.
In short, mod12b seems to bring some changes to how healing works in PvP - By reducing it further. Not gonna lie, after playing countless times VS my mate in a private Q the changes go pretty much unnoticeable for healing powers (As in healing Dailies, At-Wills and Encounters) but hit passive heals like Heal-On-Deflect really hard.
The point I'd like to raise is I think you're achieving the opposite effect than what you want.
Ideally Oath-bound Paladin Heals and DC Heals wouldn't allow a team to be untouchable whilst nearby. And yes the changes help to reduce the effectiveness, I can't say it's going to stop the majority of PvP Heals-Support classes from over-performing in their field.
What's actually happening is classes that don't have active heals in the majority of PvP builds (Like SW DPS, GWF, GF, TR and non-renegade CWs) the effects of their healing is getting hit.
All this does is widen the effectiveness gap between classes and create imbalance in destroying survivability options in DPS classes where Team-VS-Team battles occur in which either a DC or OP is present.
Solutions?
I think the current mod is plenty effective at negating passive heals and decreasing them further isn't helping.
I would advise testing the plausibility of using the "Marked for PvP" event as an anchor for reducing active healing abilities' effectiveness.
If you could pass this on to the dev responsible for this change:
I think astral shield is not the problem with the "unkillable" cleric. The main issue is with gift of faith, the capstone for the faithful paragon tree. GOF stacks up way too fast and heals for an entire health bar, which on a geared cleric means you either burst down a cleric super fast for x2 of their health bar with a fully stacked gift, or you missed your opportunity to get a kill (this is near impossible in some situations if you don't have enough dps). The two other paragon paths don't have this issue and will be severely impacted by this change.
A more appropriate change would be putting a cool down on GOF, or making it only half as effective in PvP (for example it can only heal a target for half of their maximum hp in PvP). This would ease the burden on the dps clerics (which new proposed AS is useless for). It would also make it less of a balance issue with teams that have a faith cleric vs non faith cleric being too resilient.