Kabal

bladedge12

So lets talk about kabal. And to cover this "You just have to hit him with his fire ball and the chain breaks by hitting the fire with it and you make him not be immune by blowing up his minions and get good." If you say how to beat him here or any term of get good you are a moron that can't read and should be laughed at.

For those that can read we will talk about Kabal. So his powers are
Teleport
Full battle burning you(100-1k damage)
spawn minions (level 73-74)
immune to all CC effects and damage
fire chains (5k-6k damage a second)
fire balls (death) (spawns any where and from 5-10 seconds from getting chained)
and lava lake.

Kabal is by all accounts a puzzle boss and I love that, we have so few. But a puzzle boss is not someone that can kill you in at most 15 seconds from the start of the fight if lucky. To even come close to getting him to be able to get hurt it took me and the best of the best (close to 4k points.) in my guild with the lot of us never having lost a fight knowing how to kill him. And we all died in about 7 second. You have to look watching out for his minions him to use lava healing endlessly from the chain all while trying not to walk into a spawning fireball so you can run it into him so it does not one shot you all while having to chase him down when he teleports and hoping nothing knocks you prone. A few changed I would say would make it a little more balanced would be

minions level 70
fire chains do no damage or no more then 100-1k a second).
Fire balls spawn no more then 2 seconds after a chain gets you.
he can not without fail endlessly burn you.
Fire balls do not spawn within x distance of the player.


With these I see this fight as more of a puzzle and less chuck my xbox out the window and let Kabal have the town because nothing is worth this or join him because the town is not worth it with everything else hounding it and he will do a better job at protecting it then anyone. But anyone else want to give ideas on how to balance him let me know.

TL;DR: worship the overpowered god known as Kabal.

tgwolf

Not only have I never died to him but I'm 2.7k on the character that runs him and I have never run in a group, solo only.

There is nothing even close to OP about him, he dies faster than either of the others.

meraks

3.1 SW, and 2.7 OP went in for the first time for each of us, made it through the "maze" to get to him, and each died twice before figuring out the trick. My SW has not died on any subsequent run. As far as boss fights in end game content goes, all three of these seemed pretty simple to figure out on first run, and easy to duplicate/farm.

bladedge12

tgwolf said:

Not only have I never died to him but I'm 2.7k on the character that runs him and I have never run in a group, solo only.

There is nothing even close to OP about him, he dies faster than either of the others.

meraks#0999 said:

3.1 SW, and 2.7 OP went in for the first time for each of us, made it through the "maze" to get to him, and each died twice before figuring out the trick. My SW has not died on any subsequent run. As far as boss fights in end game content goes, all three of these seemed pretty simple to figure out on first run, and easy to duplicate/farm.

So both of you had high dodge or tank classes I guess?

fearhodorwillie

A couple of tips to help you blade: Kabal's lava lake is related to his location on the map. If you notice, there is an inner and outer ring. He will drop the lava in the ring he is not in. So be sure to be in the same ring as he is when he drops the lava. Then, if you kill the first 2 minions (fire blade axes, I think), the second two minions spawn (hellfire golems, I think is the name) and kill them near him, it will drop his shield and make him vulnerable to your attacks.

ltsmithneko

:P I just stand by the anvil n' kill the minions till the ball appears n' boom the fight is over a few seconds later. It's an alright boss, definitely will keep using him for my weekly, the fire traps pre-boss fight do help boost you if ya use em right.

bladedge12

fearhodorwillie#7723 said:

A couple of tips to help you blade: Kabal's lava lake is related to his location on the map. If you notice, there is an inner and outer ring. He will drop the lava in the ring he is not in. So be sure to be in the same ring as he is when he drops the lava. Then, if you kill the first 2 minions (fire blade axes, I think), the second two minions spawn (hellfire golems, I think is the name) and kill them near him, it will drop his shield and make him vulnerable to your attacks.

ltsmithneko said:

:P I just stand by the anvil n' kill the minions till the ball appears n' boom the fight is over a few seconds later. It's an alright boss, definitely will keep using him for my weekly, the fire traps pre-boss fight do help boost you if ya use em right.

While I think you for trying to help as I said we in the guild all ready knew how and why with him and these are only ideas on ways how to better have him to fit more as a puzzle boss. I do not want to be mean here because you both wanted to help but does no one read any more. Why is it any time I post any type of forum souly for ideas people come from all over to say how to do it or I am wrong or just crying even when I spend time to make well thought out stuff that says what they say before they say it to get people thinking. What do you two say because I do want to be nice. Should I stop trying to bring thought to this forum or go down the road of rage and "Oh my good so unfair." that I see so many others do. Because I can and will. I did not only have 8 of these a number I took down because of people saying nothing to do with it. I am going to bed.

mahburg

None of these Bosses are a struggle once you work out their mechanics, the toughest part of the three is nosturas Stag race due to issues with collision detection in certain parts of the run, get a laggy instance and you will be there a while, get a clean one and you will glide through it.
Kabal is a breeze basically as an end boss imho!

ltsmithneko

bladedge12 said:

fearhodorwillie#7723 said:

A couple of tips to help you blade: Kabal's lava lake is related to his location on the map. If you notice, there is an inner and outer ring. He will drop the lava in the ring he is not in. So be sure to be in the same ring as he is when he drops the lava. Then, if you kill the first 2 minions (fire blade axes, I think), the second two minions spawn (hellfire golems, I think is the name) and kill them near him, it will drop his shield and make him vulnerable to your attacks.

ltsmithneko said:

:P I just stand by the anvil n' kill the minions till the ball appears n' boom the fight is over a few seconds later. It's an alright boss, definitely will keep using him for my weekly, the fire traps pre-boss fight do help boost you if ya use em right.

While I think you for trying to help as I said we in the guild all ready knew how and why with him and these are only ideas on ways how to better have him to fit more as a puzzle boss. I do not want to be mean here because you both wanted to help but does no one read any more. Why is it any time I post any type of forum souly for ideas people come from all over to say how to do it or I am wrong or just crying even when I spend time to make well thought out stuff that says what they say before they say it to get people thinking. What do you two say because I do want to be nice. Should I stop trying to bring thought to this forum or go down the road of rage and "Oh my good so unfair." that I see so many others do. Because I can and will. I did not only have 8 of these a number I took down because of people saying nothing to do with it. I am going to bed.

You'll always have other opinions. ❤

rjc9000

I mostly have trouble with Kabal on my squishy CW. But that's because Kabal is practically a 1:1 port from eSP, with his damage toned down. A large part of Kabal is to test to see if your healer is paying attention. This is exemplified by his persistent DoT effects.

In soloing, most players won't have a healer. Which is why Kabal is pretty hard for most players, since he was designed around having something a lot of players won't have.

fearhodorwillie#7723 said:

A couple of tips to help you blade: Kabal's lava lake is related to his location on the map. If you notice, there is an inner and outer ring. He will drop the lava in the ring he is not in. So be sure to be in the same ring as he is when he drops the lava.

That's actually pretty observant, I never noticed that.

omegarealities

It sounds like the OP only wants people who agree with him.

mordekai

That stag ride can be a right royal pain...
The only other issue I've had (as a super squishy CW) is when you use the pillars to dodge, occasionally one gets destroyed but the block visual stays in place, so when you dash behind it, the ray goes straight through and THEN it's like, "oh... sorry, forgot to mention this one shouldn't be here any more... I'll make it go away now... hope that didn't hurt too much" while you're left cursing all sorts of obscene oaths at the screen.

Once you've figured out (or read in a walkthrough...) how the mechanics work, the thing you HAVE to do is simply pay attention and not fall into button hammering slaughter mode. I've had a couple of burns with Nostura from simply not paying attention to cycles and timing particularly when she's low on HP and I go in for the kill.
That's just me being slack...

bladedge12

ltsmithneko said:

bladedge12 said:

fearhodorwillie#7723 said:

A couple of tips to help you blade: Kabal's lava lake is related to his location on the map. If you notice, there is an inner and outer ring. He will drop the lava in the ring he is not in. So be sure to be in the same ring as he is when he drops the lava. Then, if you kill the first 2 minions (fire blade axes, I think), the second two minions spawn (hellfire golems, I think is the name) and kill them near him, it will drop his shield and make him vulnerable to your attacks.

ltsmithneko said:

:P I just stand by the anvil n' kill the minions till the ball appears n' boom the fight is over a few seconds later. It's an alright boss, definitely will keep using him for my weekly, the fire traps pre-boss fight do help boost you if ya use em right.

While I think you for trying to help as I said we in the guild all ready knew how and why with him and these are only ideas on ways how to better have him to fit more as a puzzle boss. I do not want to be mean here because you both wanted to help but does no one read any more. Why is it any time I post any type of forum souly for ideas people come from all over to say how to do it or I am wrong or just crying even when I spend time to make well thought out stuff that says what they say before they say it to get people thinking. What do you two say because I do want to be nice. Should I stop trying to bring thought to this forum or go down the road of rage and "Oh my good so unfair." that I see so many others do. Because I can and will. I did not only have 8 of these a number I took down because of people saying nothing to do with it. I am going to bed.

You'll always have other opinions. ❤

I know and I want other options. But I don't want the very thing I said said back because no one read what I put because they want to read one sentience and go "No see because." I said in the main thread "You have to watch him so you do not get hit by the lava." And someone said "Where he is is not where the lava is so stay there." What does that add other then showing I called it that people was going to do that in the main post?

rjc9000 said:

I mostly have trouble with Kabal on my squishy CW. But that's because Kabal is practically a 1:1 port from eSP, with his damage toned down. A large part of Kabal is to test to see if your healer is paying attention. This is exemplified by his persistent DoT effects.

In soloing, most players won't have a healer. Which is why Kabal is pretty hard for most players, since he was designed around having something a lot of players won't have.

fearhodorwillie#7723 said:

A couple of tips to help you blade: Kabal's lava lake is related to his location on the map. If you notice, there is an inner and outer ring. He will drop the lava in the ring he is not in. So be sure to be in the same ring as he is when he drops the lava.

That's actually pretty observant, I never noticed that.

Yes you at least see the trouble he is not meant like the others to be a 1 on 1 he is have a full team get lucky or die. You never noticed that? I said that in the main post. "Watch where he is so you do not get hit by the lava."

omegarealities#7219 said:

It sounds like the OP only wants people who agree with him.

If you mean me no I want other people to tell their idea even agents me. But if you say the same thing I all ready said then how does that solve anything?

mordekai#1901 said:

That stag ride can be a right royal pain...
The only other issue I've had (as a super squishy CW) is when you use the pillars to dodge, occasionally one gets destroyed but the block visual stays in place, so when you dash behind it, the ray goes straight through and THEN it's like, "oh... sorry, forgot to mention this one shouldn't be here any more... I'll make it go away now... hope that didn't hurt too much" while you're left cursing all sorts of obscene oaths at the screen.

Once you've figured out (or read in a walkthrough...) how the mechanics work, the thing you HAVE to do is simply pay attention and not fall into button hammering slaughter mode. I've had a couple of burns with Nostura from simply not paying attention to cycles and timing particularly when she's low on HP and I go in for the kill.
That's just me being slack...

Nothing to do with the boss in this thread other then you have to watch them to stay alive. And I said that in the main post. Please keep this about Kabal.

johonxgalt

omegarealities#7219 said:

If you mean me no I want other people to tell their idea even agents me. But if you say the same thing I all ready said then how does that solve anything?

If you think "you have to watch out for the lava" is the same as "the lava will spawn in the circle the boss is not in" you are mistaken or do not understand how more details can really help other players.

Your Generic advice was added onto and made much more clear and usable for me.

Seems like the players here are trying to provide useful tips for others reading this thread on how to beat him instead of clinging to the hope that the devs will change him.

TLDR - Learn to play the boss instead of asking for a development change to him.

omegarealities

johonxgalt said:

omegarealities#7219 said:

If you mean me no I want other people to tell their idea even agents me. But if you say the same thing I all ready said then how does that solve anything?

If you think "you have to watch out for the lava" is the same as "the lava will spawn in the circle the boss is not in" you are mistaken or do not understand how more details can really help other players.

Your Generic advice was added onto and made much more clear and usable for me.

Seems like the players here are trying to provide useful tips for others reading this thread on how to beat him instead of clinging to the hope that the devs will change him.

TLDR - Learn to play the boss instead of asking for a development change to him.

Please, if you edit quotes, make sure to attribute them correctly. You attributed a quote to me, that I did not make.

johonxgalt

man, html is hard. Accept my apologies!

bladedge12

johonxgalt said:

omegarealities#7219 said:

If you mean me no I want other people to tell their idea even agents me. But if you say the same thing I all ready said then how does that solve anything?

If you think "you have to watch out for the lava" is the same as "the lava will spawn in the circle the boss is not in" you are mistaken or do not understand how more details can really help other players.

Your Generic advice was added onto and made much more clear and usable for me.

Seems like the players here are trying to provide useful tips for others reading this thread on how to beat him instead of clinging to the hope that the devs will change him.

TLDR - Learn to play the boss instead of asking for a development change to him.

Yes I will admit that I did not give a lot of heavy detailed info. But I also want people to discuss the main thing. Just pointing out "You are wrong because." Is not helpful. Now if it was more "Well I do not really think the chains should be nerffed any. I think a better idea would be a bigger fire ball so it is easier to find and does not hide. And a little more warning before the lava flow." Ok sure I can understand you don't want him nerffed and you gave me good reasons why. And to your TL;DR. Learn to read. I clearly said my group knew what to do and how to beat him.

meraks

bladedge12 said:

tgwolf said:

Not only have I never died to him but I'm 2.7k on the character that runs him and I have never run in a group, solo only.

There is nothing even close to OP about him, he dies faster than either of the others.

meraks#0999 said:

3.1 SW, and 2.7 OP went in for the first time for each of us, made it through the "maze" to get to him, and each died twice before figuring out the trick. My SW has not died on any subsequent run. As far as boss fights in end game content goes, all three of these seemed pretty simple to figure out on first run, and easy to duplicate/farm.

So both of you had high dodge or tank classes I guess?

I can only speak for myself, I play a 3.1 SW (3150 Item Level Scourge Warlock for those playing at home). I am plenty squishy, die often, and have to learn what effects to move quickly for. So either I got very lucky in figuring this event out quickly, or its not as Over Powered as you suggest... The guy I was partnered with the first run was an Oathbound Paladin, near 2.7k Item level, so yes he is a tank class, who, based on required IL of the end game dungeon, is not yet geared sufficiently for this content.

bladedge12

meraks#0999 said:

bladedge12 said:

tgwolf said:

Not only have I never died to him but I'm 2.7k on the character that runs him and I have never run in a group, solo only.

There is nothing even close to OP about him, he dies faster than either of the others.

meraks#0999 said:

3.1 SW, and 2.7 OP went in for the first time for each of us, made it through the "maze" to get to him, and each died twice before figuring out the trick. My SW has not died on any subsequent run. As far as boss fights in end game content goes, all three of these seemed pretty simple to figure out on first run, and easy to duplicate/farm.

So both of you had high dodge or tank classes I guess?

I can only speak for myself, I play a 3.1 SW (3150 Item Level Scourge Warlock for those playing at home). I am plenty squishy, die often, and have to learn what effects to move quickly for. So either I got very lucky in figuring this event out quickly, or its not as Over Powered as you suggest... The guy I was partnered with the first run was an Oathbound Paladin, near 2.7k Item level, so yes he is a tank class, who, based on required IL of the end game dungeon, is not yet geared sufficiently for this content.

So you had a really good healer? A healer that can heal well over 6k hp a second is the only real way to win.

omegarealities

johonxgalt said:

man, html is hard. Accept my apologies!

That's okay. It happens. I always use the preview button to make sure I don't mess it up too bad.

fearhodorwillie

Blade, i wasn't trying to repeat your outline merely expand on a few details I have noticed about the boss fight. To address your main question, the only change I would like to see are the enemies to spawn a little faster. It kinda sucks to just take DoT with nothing to do. That said, I don't mind Kabul being the toughest of the three new bosses. I still die occasionally when I screw up soloing him, but generally don't have any issues with the rest of the mechanics. BTW I'm a 3.7 TR, squishiest class of all.

bladedge12

fearhodorwillie#7723 said:

Blade, i wasn't trying to repeat your outline merely expand on a few details I have noticed about the boss fight. To address your main question, the only change I would like to see are the enemies to spawn a little faster. It kinda sucks to just take DoT with nothing to do. That said, I don't mind Kabul being the toughest of the three new bosses. I still die occasionally when I screw up soloing him, but generally don't have any issues with the rest of the mechanics. BTW I'm a 3.7 TR, squishiest class of all.

I will admit this boss angers me so I get a little pissed on here so that is my bad. Really faster minion spawn. that can work but the TR is anything but squishy. They can dodge anything easy even without using stamina. To hit a rouge you need loaded dice, luck, and 5 nukes. And if done right they can rival a guardian fighter in hp and armor while healing with every hit.

armadeonx

I take it you don't run a TR? They are nothing like you've described - apart from having a good dodge mechanic (which does use stamina). Actually, what class do you use and what's your item level?

I ran Kabal today and I knew they chains were relevant but I couldn't quite figure it out. I was on my pally though so I just hit stuff and within a couple of mins he was dead. I know the CW can have a hard time with it. I'll figure it out before I take my squishy characters in there.

I really can't see the devs making changes though, they rarely do unless it's a serious problem or costs them money.

I would say though, a number of your posts on this thread have contained insults/put-downs, including your opening post ("you are a moron that can't read and should be laughed at."). That's the worst way to get people talking reasonably, you're trying to dictate to people how they should answer you and putting down anyone who gives you replies you don't like.

You should think about that.

meraks

bladedge12 said:

meraks#0999 said:

bladedge12 said:

tgwolf said:

Not only have I never died to him but I'm 2.7k on the character that runs him and I have never run in a group, solo only.

There is nothing even close to OP about him, he dies faster than either of the others.

meraks#0999 said:

3.1 SW, and 2.7 OP went in for the first time for each of us, made it through the "maze" to get to him, and each died twice before figuring out the trick. My SW has not died on any subsequent run. As far as boss fights in end game content goes, all three of these seemed pretty simple to figure out on first run, and easy to duplicate/farm.

So both of you had high dodge or tank classes I guess?

I can only speak for myself, I play a 3.1 SW (3150 Item Level Scourge Warlock for those playing at home). I am plenty squishy, die often, and have to learn what effects to move quickly for. So either I got very lucky in figuring this event out quickly, or its not as Over Powered as you suggest... The guy I was partnered with the first run was an Oathbound Paladin, near 2.7k Item level, so yes he is a tank class, who, based on required IL of the end game dungeon, is not yet geared sufficiently for this content.

So you had a really good healer? A healer that can heal well over 6k hp a second is the only real way to win.

Are you listening to the words I am writing?
As I said it was a 3.1k warlock (me), and a 2.7k Pally, it was each of our first run. I have since ran it solo, and a couple of other times helping out friends. Its all about paying attention, which your responses lead me to conclude is where your issue begins.

randomdigits

armadeonx said:

I know the CW can have a hard time with it.

Yes, as a CW I had to re-run the fight ~5-6 times even knowing that I'm supposed to somehow hit the boss with the fireball. I would just die before I get to the boss after I'm chained. It doesn't help that CWs can either run or fight (to heal with LS) but not both. I'm still unsure if I figured that right, but my winning strategy was to ensure that I'm very close to the boss before killing the last mob, so the boss is nearby when I need him... And use health potions/health stone.

armadeonx said:

I would say though, a number of your posts on this thread have contained insults/put-downs, including your opening post ("you are a moron that can't read and should be laughed at."). That's the worst way to get people talking reasonably, you're trying to dictate to people how they should answer you and putting down anyone who gives you replies you don't like.

That's a very polite way of saying this. To me the whole post reminds of the best pieces in the The Lower depths of Neverwinter... But even then it had all of these useful replies with fight tips and personal experiences.

bladedge12 said:

With these I see this fight as more of a puzzle and less chuck my xbox out the window and let Kabal have the town because nothing is worth this or join him because the town is not worth it with everything else hounding it and he will do a better job at protecting it then anyone. But anyone else want to give ideas on how to balance him let me know.

Sorry, it's a bit hard to follow you in this sentence. Assuming that you are asking players to share here their ideas for devs on how to "fix Kabal" then it sounds fair to me to expect that some players here would want to disagree with that suggestion and respond why this shouldn't be done... I personally consider Kabal challenging but on par with other bosses and thus far I see no good ideas in this thread on improving it which I would agree with.

mordekai

bladedge12 said:

Nothing to do with the boss in this thread other then you have to watch them to stay alive. And I said that in the main post. Please keep this about Kabal.

The principle is the same for all three.
So, for the sake of pedantry... when dealing with Kabal and the other two who we shall not speak of. You need to learn the mechanics then pay attention when dealing with it. Don't expect Kabal, (and any other similar bosses who may or may not exist) to succumb to standard button thumping and tanking.

If you can't figure out the mechanics that's very different to Kabal being a boss that kills you in "at most 15 seconds... if you're lucky".

bladedge12

armadeonx said:

I take it you don't run a TR? They are nothing like you've described - apart from having a good dodge mechanic (which does use stamina). Actually, what class do you use and what's your item level?

I ran Kabal today and I knew they chains were relevant but I couldn't quite figure it out. I was on my pally though so I just hit stuff and within a couple of mins he was dead. I know the CW can have a hard time with it. I'll figure it out before I take my squishy characters in there.

I really can't see the devs making changes though, they rarely do unless it's a serious problem or costs them money.

I would say though, a number of your posts on this thread have contained insults/put-downs, including your opening post ("you are a moron that can't read and should be laughed at."). That's the worst way to get people talking reasonably, you're trying to dictate to people how they should answer you and putting down anyone who gives you replies you don't like.

You should think about that.

I main a Gwf but have and use all classes. My item score it close to 4k. And you lasted long enough to find out because you are a healer class. Everyone else has to use potions or items. Yes I forgot people do not seem to get jokes now a days. I guess I should remove it.

Sorry, it's a bit hard to follow you in this sentence. Assuming that you are asking players to share here their ideas for devs on how to "fix Kabal" then it sounds fair to me to expect that some players here would want to disagree with that suggestion and respond why this shouldn't be done... I personally consider Kabal challenging but on par with other bosses and thus far I see no good ideas in this thread on improving it which I would agree with.



I was joking about the xbox part. But with how hard he is I want to join his army. I mean come on you can't say you would not want to command an army of loyal flaming suits of armor.

mahburg

Not sure if you guys have picked up on this, but the new fashion gear has some intriguing buffs, the Fire fashion set and the treasure set seem to reduce the fire damage you take when running Emberhollow and Kabal.

kydavi

My squishy HR has trouble with Kabal 'cuz of his harsh DoT, but my lower IL GF has no trouble whatsoever, its a breeze for her.

randomdigits

mahburg said:

Not sure if you guys have picked up on this, but the new fashion gear has some intriguing buffs, the Fire fashion set and the treasure set seem to reduce the fire damage you take when running Emberhollow and Kabal.

I can't decide if you are joking, but no, we didn't pick it up yet.

mahburg

randomdigits#2166 said:

mahburg said:

Not sure if you guys have picked up on this, but the new fashion gear has some intriguing buffs, the Fire fashion set and the treasure set seem to reduce the fire damage you take when running Emberhollow and Kabal.

I can't decide if you are joking, but no, we didn't pick it up yet.

Not Joking, a few of us have spotted this, the fashion gear is peanuts right now and definitely has a major impact, so far six of us have tested this and found it to work.

No idea why and nothing in the stats to reflect this but hey not questioning it or why it works.