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Idea for a pvp event
forumnamesuxs
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 490 Arc User
Solo was a great success, it seems.
People seemed to enjoy duo as well.
So, how about next, or at least at some point soon(TM) you give the vanilla pvp idea a try?
Off/def/ut. enchantments capped at 7, no overloads or weapon/armor enchants, artifact/artifact gear capped at 50% of max level, no mount combat powers, boons (no, not even SH boons), insignias, or anything else that isn't on the gear, feats or powers page of the character sheet.
It should allow for some proper data for you to analyse, in terms of class balance, as well as allowing us to reexperience the days pre mod 4, just as a refreshment.
I think we all could learn quite a lot from such an event.
People seemed to enjoy duo as well.
So, how about next, or at least at some point soon(TM) you give the vanilla pvp idea a try?
Off/def/ut. enchantments capped at 7, no overloads or weapon/armor enchants, artifact/artifact gear capped at 50% of max level, no mount combat powers, boons (no, not even SH boons), insignias, or anything else that isn't on the gear, feats or powers page of the character sheet.
It should allow for some proper data for you to analyse, in terms of class balance, as well as allowing us to reexperience the days pre mod 4, just as a refreshment.
I think we all could learn quite a lot from such an event.
Wolves, big as a horse! I need new pants!
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Comments
All it takes is ONE new item to come out that synergizes REALLY well with 1 class and BAM. Balance out the window.
I dont disagree at all that balance IS important and there are some classes (HR atm) that need some adjustments but class balance ISNT the problem with PVP atm. Maybe it is at the TOP level of PVP but that isnt and shouldnt be the #1 concern of Cryptic atm. The #1 concern should be
1) Increasing the population of PVP
2) Decreasing the gear gap of PVP
Both these can be done with my suggestions. Making a Lobby and making class balance WONT bring a bunch of new players or PVE players into PVP more often, all it will do is allow for the BIS players to have a more pleasant experience.
Your solutions cater to the top PVP players, MY solutions cater to the entire population.
If players want all the boons/companions/stats etc they can go to OW Domination and Do BID there...
Heck, one idea that SHOULD be implemented would the ability to QUE for BID, when it pops you zone into that zone and then must run to the Domination. THAT can be a place for all the power creep. But pure "domination PVP" needs to be vanilla in order to work.
And I think if players take a step back from themselves and their investments, they will see that this is needed for the game. Eventually all BIS players come to this realization which is what causes them to quit (most of us anyways) because competition isnt there... Also, many BIS players I have talked to SHARE this same view that I do. It would take an overhaul like this to fix PVP. They just dont post like I do because they dont have any faith in Cryptic that they will actually do anything.
PVP is a subset (or %) of the larger population. The larger population is not growing and if anything its LUCKY if it merely replaces the people who have left. If there was a way to track this, my guess is its been stagnant.
If all you do is propose solutions that will benefit a minority of "top tier" PVPers, you are setting PVP up to fail.
If you instead try to create more PVPers, now you increase your % of the total population which gives you more people to play with and against which will give the game the greatest probability of success in the long run.
You need a solution that fixes the problem with the GAME not just PVP. Otherwise PVP will die. Your solution is short term and will make you happy for now, once it gets old (and trust me it will) people will rapidly quit. All that will be left will be a fraction of what there is today. Which will be a total PUG fest. Itll ruin the game long term.
Like I said Lancer, its not a bad idea. Its just not the right TIME for that idea. We need to breath life back into PVP again and THEN can implement some of those things. What your doing is dressing up a dead horse and calling it pretty... Well its still a dead horse. I am trying to resuscitate the dead horse and THEN we can dress it up.
Remember mods 0-2 where Sentinel was the ONLY GWF PVP build? Then mod 3, Sentinel was HAMSTER and Destroyer. Fast forward and there have really only been 1 build for every module.
Quite frankly man, im VERY surprised you have not been burned long enough by Cryptic to the point you actually trust them with an overhaul. Not only is it not realistic, they wont spend the time or resources because its too risky. Not just that, I dont know if I WANT them doing that. There is a HIGH chance they will screw something up, and end up right back where we are today, just 1 "Meta" build... Sure you might get lucky on half the classes and have 2 viable options but then what? YOur playing the SAME game on the SAME maps we all have been for years with the SAME problem - you smash pugs all day long.
I dont see how class balance will do anything but (again) cater to the top few % of players. Thats what you advocate for. Well how does this help the new player or the PVE player in domination? It only helps the PVP player and FRANKLY, as I said before, even if they DO make 2 paths "viable" eventually every good PVPer sniffs out the BEST path and your back to where we are today.
While I agree 110%, it would be nice to have better balance, that ISNT what the game suffers from.
The Lobby system and the 3 Ques is NOT a bad idea. I keep saying this, but its not at the right time. At the curent moment how many real premades run around that if they knew Synergy was Qued, would Que.... Not that many. The Premade Que would be DEAD.
The Lobby system would work GREAT to create private matches, sure... But now you have essentially forced everyone into a solo/Duo Que system. But you didnt alleviate the issue of a 4K+ Player going in and completely murdering an entire team by his or herself. This is the problem.
You just divided the playerbase into different Ques, and STILL have the same problem that everyone keeps complaining about - Gear Gap.
So the only thing you will really gain is the ability to "Lobby" but that will lose its luster after you have had that for 1 month and run ALL the "inhouses" you have want to run and you will sit back and feel there is no point to the game, noone wants to play us because they cant compete in the premade Que, Inhouses are boring after youve done 50 of them, and you dislike solo/duo Q because you can stomp an entire team. None of that sounds appealing to me frankly.
You make some very good points. I'm not going to argue with you on that. I see no reason why a lobby system, and this couldn't coexist.
I don't belong to a pvp guild, nor do I have enough friends in that part of the community to take a lobby system to use, but for those who do, it would be a great addition to the game, but that is not what this thread is about.
As for the class balances, which Cryptic claims to be working on, would this not help in unveiling just how skewed it is?
If you strip down all the benefits I mentioned in my post, would this not make all these faults really come to surface?
Sure, we all know who's more likely to stand triumphant with their characters in most fights if this event were to become reality, but do you trust the devs to actually have noticed it? I don't trust the data they've collected on this from the other two events to be honest. I don't trust them to make any kind of sound judgement on class balancing at all in fact. Not as long as the insist on unmitigatable attacks/effects being balanced.
However, I honestly believe that this could be a step in the right direction towards make them really see what we see in the arena every day, and speed up the process, so maybe, just maybe they can focus harder on bug fixes.
Cryptic is already planning several pvp events in the future. Let this be one of them, and your idea be another.
Don't fool yourself into thinking they'll add anything like that permanently, without running some tests on it first.
This exactly. I also wonder how many of these problems STEM from having the stat allocation we have. I know for a fact that if you stripped away boons (like endless consumption) and all the lifesteal AND ARP awarded through boons, it would make a HUGE difference to classes that rely on lifesteal (like GWFs) So that is 1 circumstance where boons prop up a class to make them WAY better than the "base" of the class is itself.
I just wonder how many other classes would be hurt in the same way. TRs losing an 8k Power SH boon and other power/recovery boons - which would affect their classes. ETC. I think boons DO make the issues too cloudy and is one major reason the game is never balanced - DEVs dont know how to use and stack these things and test the base classes... This is exactly my point. Why NOW would a focus on class balance all the sudden change the game. In the past, every single time they "adjust" classes it usually BREAKS them, doesnt make them better. A CLASSIC example is GWFs.
In module 2 they were VERY strong. Module 3 they became "gods" because of the DEVs messing with them. They over buffed them. So what did they do in mods 4/5? OVER nerfed them. They have NEVER been able to create a balanced class. The only reason mod 6 saved GWFs were some small buffs and the ability to stack lifesteal combined with the change in lifesteal and the endless consumption feat.