Ok, you guys seem to be thinking that the only solution for PvP is equalize everyone's gear, I don't know why.
That idea is ridiculous, to say the least, I haven't spent much money in the game and most has been in buying cute garbage, but I've spent loads and loads of time, and even I would feel the "equalize gear" thing like a slap in the face, because I grinded for all my stuff and a new level 70 could get the same gear as me without any effort? Don't get me wrong, it would "balance" some things but it would be unfair.
I'm sure most would feel the same way if that happens, and the IL vs IL would't work either because of the flaws of the Item Level per se: someone with rank 12s and Trans but rank 7s in Utility will hit as hard as a 4k while not being 4k himself; someone with 5 3-slotted mounts with Epic insignias will have more sustain and stats than someone with 5 2-slotted mounts or someone that has Uncommon insignias; someone with a pair of Rosegold PvP rings and Elemental Lionsmane will take less damage than someone with Underdark rings because of the tenacity; and we aren't even talking about Stronghold boons yet...
The old gear score back in Mod 5 would tell you more than what IL does, I think if you want an IL vs IL queue, the first step would be to fix IL to read stats instead of only your items.
Ok, you guys seem to be thinking that the only solution for PvP is equalize everyone's gear, I don't know why.
That idea is ridiculous, to say the least, I haven't spent much money in the game and most has been in buying cute garbage, but I've spent loads and loads of time, and even I would feel the "equalize gear" thing like a slap in the face, because I grinded for all my stuff and a new level 70 could get the same gear as me without any effort? Don't get me wrong, it would "balance" some things but it would be unfair.
I'm sure most would feel the same way if that happens, and the IL vs IL would't work either because of the flaws of the Item Level per se: someone with rank 12s and Trans but rank 7s in Utility will hit as hard as a 4k while not being 4k himself; someone with 5 3-slotted mounts with Epic insignias will have more sustain and stats than someone with 5 2-slotted mounts or someone that has Uncommon insignias; someone with a pair of Rosegold PvP rings and Elemental Lionsmane will take less damage than someone with Underdark rings because of the tenacity; and we aren't even talking about Stronghold boons yet...
The old gear score back in Mod 5 would tell you more than what IL does, I think if you want an IL vs IL queue, the first step would be to fix IL to read stats instead of only your items.
That's the thing, people want to revive PvP but they don't want the only solution that will do that. It's a catch 22 that'll ensure that Cryptic continues to ignore it until the game is shut down.
Ok, you guys seem to be thinking that the only solution for PvP is equalize everyone's gear, I don't know why.
That idea is ridiculous, to say the least, I haven't spent much money in the game and most has been in buying cute garbage, but I've spent loads and loads of time, and even I would feel the "equalize gear" thing like a slap in the face, because I grinded for all my stuff and a new level 70 could get the same gear as me without any effort? Don't get me wrong, it would "balance" some things but it would be unfair.
I'm sure most would feel the same way if that happens, and the IL vs IL would't work either because of the flaws of the Item Level per se: someone with rank 12s and Trans but rank 7s in Utility will hit as hard as a 4k while not being 4k himself; someone with 5 3-slotted mounts with Epic insignias will have more sustain and stats than someone with 5 2-slotted mounts or someone that has Uncommon insignias; someone with a pair of Rosegold PvP rings and Elemental Lionsmane will take less damage than someone with Underdark rings because of the tenacity; and we aren't even talking about Stronghold boons yet...
The old gear score back in Mod 5 would tell you more than what IL does, I think if you want an IL vs IL queue, the first step would be to fix IL to read stats instead of only your items.
I don't think everyone is saying equalizing gear is the only answer. Infact, I don't think anyone Is saying equalize the gear is the only answer. Most people are saying that without a fresh influx of new players, PvP will die, & an equalized gear, and/or separate queues for pugs & premades are the first step to get new players come back to the PvP side of the game.
You grinded for your gear, & I respect that. Good for you, congratulations. ( I know that "sounds" a lil snarky, but I mean it, sincerely... just can't think of anything that sounds better) Now, if you really want a slap in the face, swap out that time-expencive gear for cheap blues & pug for a week. Just give it one week. If I could have my wish, I would like the devs to swap all the pre-mades & pug-groups gearz for a couple of days... I think that might actually cause more changes in PvP than any other idea I've seen floated in the forums.
In the end, all this talk is pre-mature. IL is a broken indicator of a ton's strength. In order to implement any real change, that would have to be adjusted for accuracy. But until THAT happens, then @ the very least, separating the weakest players in the game & keeping them from getting ROFLstomped... might keep them from leaving before they get even a glimpse of what PvP can be. That would be something we could re-build the community around.
Ok, you guys seem to be thinking that the only solution for PvP is equalize everyone's gear, I don't know why.
That idea is ridiculous, to say the least, I haven't spent much money in the game and most has been in buying cute garbage, but I've spent loads and loads of time, and even I would feel the "equalize gear" thing like a slap in the face, because I grinded for all my stuff and a new level 70 could get the same gear as me without any effort? Don't get me wrong, it would "balance" some things but it would be unfair.
I'm sure most would feel the same way if that happens, and the IL vs IL would't work either because of the flaws of the Item Level per se: someone with rank 12s and Trans but rank 7s in Utility will hit as hard as a 4k while not being 4k himself; someone with 5 3-slotted mounts with Epic insignias will have more sustain and stats than someone with 5 2-slotted mounts or someone that has Uncommon insignias; someone with a pair of Rosegold PvP rings and Elemental Lionsmane will take less damage than someone with Underdark rings because of the tenacity; and we aren't even talking about Stronghold boons yet...
The old gear score back in Mod 5 would tell you more than what IL does, I think if you want an IL vs IL queue, the first step would be to fix IL to read stats instead of only your items.
I don't think everyone is saying equalizing gear is the only answer. Infact, I don't think anyone Is saying equalize the gear is the only answer. Most people are saying that without a fresh influx of new players, PvP will die, & an equalized gear, and/or separate queues for pugs & premades are the first step to get new players come back to the PvP side of the game.
You grinded for your gear, & I respect that. Good for you, congratulations. ( I know that "sounds" a lil snarky, but I mean it, sincerely... just can't think of anything that sounds better) Now, if you really want a slap in the face, swap out that time-expencive gear for cheap blues & pug for a week. Just give it one week. If I could have my wish, I would like the devs to swap all the pre-mades & pug-groups gearz for a couple of days... I think that might actually cause more changes in PvP than any other idea I've seen floated in the forums.
In the end, all this talk is pre-mature. IL is a broken indicator of a ton's strength. In order to implement any real change, that would have to be adjusted for accuracy. But until THAT happens, then @ the very least, separating the weakest players in the game & keeping them from getting ROFLstomped... might keep them from leaving before they get even a glimpse of what PvP can be. That would be something we could re-build the community around.
I didn't want to sound jerk-ish or anything, I guess I kinda did, lol, sorry. My point is that this entire game revolves around some kind of grind, and removing it completely for a game mode doesn't seem likely, because Cryptic needs income (obviously) and ppl need a reason to grind and/or spend some money in the game.
Like I said, a fix to the Item Level system is needed in order to make IL brackets that actually work, coz IL has always been flawed. If that doesn't happen, then I really think the first step should be a real progressive understandable Leaderboard along with a new PvP campaign, that comes with a new map, mode or w/e. With a nice Leaderboard then everything comes into place, people get match-ups against similar skilled players and everyone can start to see real progress in the PvP side of the game too.
This way players that recently started doing PvP can make their way up and feel some progress while you keep the more dedicated PvP players competing against other high-end players. And of course, Team Queue should be a thing, separated of Solo Queue, and even with their own Leaderboard.
Yeah it'd be really nice if they managed to come out with a pvp mode that didn't revolve around capture this node and this node and oh this node too but against more people.
Although I don't think the mode would work well in nw we could try a tdm or ffa hell a attackers v defenders match would suffice.
I'm really amazed how many people do not understand why matchmaking is so bad and propose this stuff over and over again.
Not only would item level based matchmaking NOT solve the current situation (it's the low population that matches vastly different skill and item levels with each other), but also be the inferior algorithm.
Maybe award glory and seals based on a ratio of how much damage you did vs how much you took on kills, how much damage you healed vs damage you took, modified by number of attackers, etc. In other words, award lots of glory and seals when the battle was glorious and triumphant, award little or none when none are deserved - regardless of whether you win. This would mean a 1000-50 win earns the winner nearly nothing since the win means nothing.
@theguiido I don't know why you are asking me, I don't pvp, lol. Personally, I think they should normalize gear for PvP (make everyone wear exactly the same gear and enchants) and make it be more skill and build based than who has the bigger wallet. That's just my opinion though.
In the end, all this talk is pre-mature. IL is a broken indicator of a ton's strength. In order to implement any real change, that would have to be adjusted for accuracy. But until THAT happens, then @ the very least, separating the weakest players in the game & keeping them from getting ROFLstomped... might keep them from leaving before they get even a glimpse of what PvP can be. That would be something we could re-build the community around.
But even more so. The crux of PVP is that gear gap and build gap is too large between casuals vs BIS... and PVE vs PVP.
We all know the casual vs BIS, so I wont lay that out. But basically boons/artifacts/SH boons/Mounts all add thousands upon thousands of stats that make it impossible for a 3k player to kill a 4k player. No matter how skilled you are.
Another MAJOR issue is the "ideal" stats for PVE and PVP are so vastly different. For PVE players almost dont care about defensive stats (HP/Lifesteal/Defense) and want to stack max crit/power and only enough ARP to get to the max, which seems to be around 6k-8k maybe.
For PVP, its almost the opposite. Most DPS will stack 2-3x the ARP. They seem to NOT want any crit because its double impacted by tenacity and therefore crits do LESS damage than non crits unless you boost your severity over 75%base. In PVP players want HIGH HP and HIGH Lifesteal and some even use defense as something to stack too.
So you combined both these problems: PVE wants A,B,C stats while PVP wants X,Y,Z stats. and the fact that tens of thousands of stats are now available and a "BIS" PVE player doesnt even remotely resemble a PVP player in terms of gear/stats which means... a full PVE GWF for instance, probably spits out 2x the damage in PVE dungeons that his BIS PVP counterpart does... on the flip side, even if that PVE guy put on tenacity gear, chances are he has low HP low LS and will die in 1-2 rotations against his PVP counterpart.
Why do I detail all this out? Because its what makes PVP not fun. Skill is NOT one of the biggest factors in who wins pvp. Its actually gear/power.... The casual will never beat a BIS player. The most hardcore PVE player wont even be able to scratch a PVP player.
These gaps need to be bridged.
ONE SOLUTION would be to remove boons, companions(yes they already are), and mount stat bonuses from PVP. So you zone into PVP and its merely JUST your character, his base gear, rank X enchants, and thats it. This would remove probably 30k in stats from the "BIS" level of PVP.
This bridges the gap, because now the stat difference and stat allocation difference is MUCH smaller between PVE/PVP as well as the casual versus Vet PVP player. A new player merely needs to get his hands on some decent gear, decent artifacts, with no worry about being part of a SH guild... or doing ALL the modules of boons just to have a small CHANCE at winning.
What this also does, is now "item level" actually WOULD be a real value of strength. All the things that dont contribute to item level, wouldnt be allowed in PVP. So itemlevel COULD be used as a matchmaking metric. So the 3k player wouldnt face a 4k player.
Also, the PVE player now could merely swap his gear to PVP gear, and it would be a MUCH closer fight. The PVP player would likely come out on top, however it wouldnt be as much of a takeaway as it is today. Reason being, the 30k+ of stats removed from this suggestion, would likely be stats like ARP/HP/Lifesteal/defense - all the stuff that the PVP player uses those boons to STACK those stats... That are ideal for PVP but not as much in PVE so the PVE player wont stack those things. Not to mention things like Endless Consumption that essentialyl doubles your lifesteal.... It would be REMOVED removing a significant source of self healing.
The OTHER thing I would strongly suggest.... remove tenacity as a STAT on gear. Every character in the game already has a "base" tenacity built into them at 10% values. 10% DR, 10% piercing resist, 10% crit resist, 10% CC resist correct? Just adjust THESE values up to appropriate levels.
Im not sure what they deem as "best" but I would probably target like: ARP resist: 75% (and make this a multipliyer to ARP... meaning if you have 100% RI, * (1-.75) = 25% net RI) DR Resist: 60% (Increased from 42-45%) CC Resist: 40% (kept about the same) Crit Resist: 30% (reduced.. so a basic crit with 75% severity deals about 22.5% damage increase)
NOW players can use ANY gear to PVP, not just PVP gear. The allure of PVP gear should be the high HP pools above the PVE gear (which I believe they already have on the gear, HP gets a higher allocation of stats). This became an issue back in mod 0 because "tanks" would have to PVP to get the best "tank gear" so to that I would suggest SWAPPING them, so the PVP gear is actually more "DPS" oriented for tanks where as the PVE sets have the more tanky stats. Be careful with GWF as destroyer gear should be more DPS and less tank for PVE.
Now what have you done. 1) removed the tenacity gear gap between players. 2) removed 30k+ of stat power difference between PVE/PVP players and casuals. 3) in doing so, created a real metric of power comparison already in game (item level) to use for matchmaking (ditch ELO guys... seriously) 4) removed the need to create BOTH PVE AND PVP CONTENT each module... Remember SHs came out and you had to work on dragon flight AND the SH PVP and both of those basically flopped? Spend the time on new DUNGEONS and PVP players will actually care about PVE armor again because it could be used in PVP if they wanted to lose some HP for more damage stats... 5) Removed some of the biggest sources of self healing from PVP (endless consumption + countless lifesteal % in the boons)
Overall... Now you have as CLOSE to equalization as you can get with minimal steps, minimal work and frankly... it will be MUCH easier to balance PVP with less stats involved... No more super recovery stacking... no more uber lifesteal self healing... no more 150% RI via ARP (that BTW DOES boost your damage past 0% DR......)... No more having to swap gear between PVE and PVP and having to worry about builds as you can use ALL your boon stats for PVE and merely have a better "middle ground" on your gear itself....
It just seems so simple to me.... it simplifies PVP, makes it more casual friendly... more PVE friendly... easier to balance moving forward... more ALT friendly!
heck, just TRY it for 1 month. Offer both Ques - full character que for domination (do it on Dom only) and then offer an "item level only" que where ONLY things that boost item level work in PVP.... call it a "boonless que" or whatever. Doesnt matter... TRY it. See what happens. I bet itll work better than you think!
In a game involving microtransactions (or in some cases macrotransactions given the cost of legendary mounts) suggestions like what your giving aren't sound. While I agree in principle that SH boons and mount bonuses give very strong advantages in PvP, what you are suggesting won't work for two reasons:
1. SH boons donation items and mounts are things you obtain through purchasing lockboxes (in the case of legendary mounts) and buying items from the Zen market to speed up production. This makes the game developers money.
2. SH boons donation items and mounts can be obtained through extreme grinding or clever AH use. This requires a lot of work and are earned through this method.
So basically if you introduce a queue where none of these are allowed it removes the incentive for anyone to obtain them thereby making them irrelevant for anything but pve. Also if there were two queues, one with and one without the people would just not bother with the other queue if they are lacking in both areas essentially killing it off.
I'm not saying it's fair, I'm just saying it's not reasonable.
Pvp stopped being fun when overloads and gwf rework happened. I feel like we all should be nerfed back to old trs and gwfs performances to really enjou both pve and pvp back. Tenacity just killed it
its not just about segregating low gear and high gear ppl, or keep premades away from pub teams.
ultimately its about the gear, weapons and enchantments. for a pvp to be fun, Skill and teamwork and experience should not be trumped by Gear. if you let gear become more important than skill, then you get a situation where unskilled trolls can breeze through the queues and drive off 50-70% of the players. You also can't allow bored max level players to put end game enchants and items on low bracket characters. Those low brackets are where the future pvpers are raised, if you don't give them a good upbringing, they drop out.
Gear should be about variety. the greens and blues in the AH are exactly what should exist for players, life drain, run speed, offense, defense- these stats let you further customize your playstyle after you've agonized over which spec you're using. the moment you let someone overpower and overgear 95% of the competition, you are killing your pvp playerbase. I'm not sure why it was allowed to happen, maybe they thought it would drive ppl to start buying more items. But for the most part it just sours the good majority of pvpers away from ever trying.
Drying up the queue and ending the fun.
Post edited by curagaultima on
0
vinceent1Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,264Arc User
edited September 2016
small correction for you - these trolls sometimes has some skill. i still see some a bit
I dont think cryptic will ever consider bracketing. If yes, we already hear a bit about it, even a small hint. They will probably try rework que, bring more players (they already do first useless steps like pvp armor on trade bar store) and let enhanced matchmaking- elo do the work. create serious matches where teams has similar power capacity, newbies meets bis very rarely. thats the best we can ask probably, but it needs to be done asap. Bis pveers get their toy hard dungeon, pvpers now awaiting things too.
Due the low population in the queue (not pvp event time) You can see the same "premade vs PUG" situation over and over and over and over and over again.
after the 6. or 7. match you think you are a scrub, running full PVP stuffed and just respecced into a new build but get your butt handed 10 times, focussed by 2-4 player all time, 2-3 of your teammamber run 1 and 3, some hide all time, some just die all time. All matches I see are more or less destroyed by disbalances...and the biggest disbalance imo is: one 4k DC or OP in one team and a 2k blue geared "oneshot DC" in the other team No chance to go against a team protected by a unkillable 3k+DC the only class that may be a threat to a DC might be the Hunter these days dealing insane damage with piercing blades 2-3 time more than an average compareable striker, dealing 75% with that little feature, me just jealous
its not just about segregating low gear and high gear ppl, or keep premades away from pub teams.
ultimately its about the gear, weapons and enchantments. for a pvp to be fun, Skill and teamwork and experience should not be trumped by Gear. if you let gear become more important than skill, then you get a situation where unskilled trolls can breeze through the queues and drive off 50-70% of the players. You also can't allow bored max level players to put end game enchants and items on low bracket characters. Those low brackets are where the future pvpers are raised, if you don't give them a good upbringing, they drop out.
Gear should be about variety. the greens and blues in the AH are exactly what should exist for players, life drain, run speed, offense, defense- these stats let you further customize your playstyle after you've agonized over which spec you're using. the moment you let someone overpower and overgear 95% of the competition, you are killing your pvp playerbase. I'm not sure why it was allowed to happen, maybe they thought it would drive ppl to start buying more items. But for the most part it just sours the good majority of pvpers away from ever trying.
Drying up the queue and ending the fun.
"for a pvp to be fun, Skill and teamwork and experience should not be trumped by Gear."
No, it shouldn't be. But it is. Now, how do we get there from here?
Comments
That idea is ridiculous, to say the least, I haven't spent much money in the game and most has been in buying cute garbage, but I've spent loads and loads of time, and even I would feel the "equalize gear" thing like a slap in the face, because I grinded for all my stuff and a new level 70 could get the same gear as me without any effort? Don't get me wrong, it would "balance" some things but it would be unfair.
I'm sure most would feel the same way if that happens, and the IL vs IL would't work either because of the flaws of the Item Level per se: someone with rank 12s and Trans but rank 7s in Utility will hit as hard as a 4k while not being 4k himself; someone with 5 3-slotted mounts with Epic insignias will have more sustain and stats than someone with 5 2-slotted mounts or someone that has Uncommon insignias; someone with a pair of Rosegold PvP rings and Elemental Lionsmane will take less damage than someone with Underdark rings because of the tenacity; and we aren't even talking about Stronghold boons yet...
The old gear score back in Mod 5 would tell you more than what IL does, I think if you want an IL vs IL queue, the first step would be to fix IL to read stats instead of only your items.
You grinded for your gear, & I respect that. Good for you, congratulations. ( I know that "sounds" a lil snarky, but I mean it, sincerely... just can't think of anything that sounds better) Now, if you really want a slap in the face, swap out that time-expencive gear for cheap blues & pug for a week. Just give it one week. If I could have my wish, I would like the devs to swap all the pre-mades & pug-groups gearz for a couple of days... I think that might actually cause more changes in PvP than any other idea I've seen floated in the forums.
In the end, all this talk is pre-mature. IL is a broken indicator of a ton's strength. In order to implement any real change, that would have to be adjusted for accuracy. But until THAT happens, then @ the very least, separating the weakest players in the game & keeping them from getting ROFLstomped... might keep them from leaving before they get even a glimpse of what PvP can be. That would be something we could re-build the community around.
a new pvp map/mode only allow equalling gear (lv1?) , but this map need a ticket to queue and the ticket is costing glory to purchase?
Like I said, a fix to the Item Level system is needed in order to make IL brackets that actually work, coz IL has always been flawed. If that doesn't happen, then I really think the first step should be a real progressive understandable Leaderboard along with a new PvP campaign, that comes with a new map, mode or w/e. With a nice Leaderboard then everything comes into place, people get match-ups against similar skilled players and everyone can start to see real progress in the PvP side of the game too.
This way players that recently started doing PvP can make their way up and feel some progress while you keep the more dedicated PvP players competing against other high-end players. And of course, Team Queue should be a thing, separated of Solo Queue, and even with their own Leaderboard.
Yeah it'd be really nice if they managed to come out with a pvp mode that didn't revolve around capture this node and this node and oh this node too but against more people.
Although I don't think the mode would work well in nw we could try a tdm or ffa hell a attackers v defenders match would suffice.
Not only would item level based matchmaking NOT solve the current situation (it's the low population that matches vastly different skill and item levels with each other), but also be the inferior algorithm.
Sekhmet@kvetchus_
Guilds: Greycloaks, Blackcloaks, Whitecloaks, Goldcloaks, Browncloaks, Spiritcloaks, Bluecloaks, Silvercloaks, Black Dawn
Tredecim: The Cloak Alliance
This is why I had proposed this POLL, that suggests including all of these things in "item level" : http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/comment/12873868
But even more so. The crux of PVP is that gear gap and build gap is too large between casuals vs BIS... and PVE vs PVP.
We all know the casual vs BIS, so I wont lay that out. But basically boons/artifacts/SH boons/Mounts all add thousands upon thousands of stats that make it impossible for a 3k player to kill a 4k player. No matter how skilled you are.
Another MAJOR issue is the "ideal" stats for PVE and PVP are so vastly different. For PVE players almost dont care about defensive stats (HP/Lifesteal/Defense) and want to stack max crit/power and only enough ARP to get to the max, which seems to be around 6k-8k maybe.
For PVP, its almost the opposite. Most DPS will stack 2-3x the ARP. They seem to NOT want any crit because its double impacted by tenacity and therefore crits do LESS damage than non crits unless you boost your severity over 75%base. In PVP players want HIGH HP and HIGH Lifesteal and some even use defense as something to stack too.
So you combined both these problems: PVE wants A,B,C stats while PVP wants X,Y,Z stats. and the fact that tens of thousands of stats are now available and a "BIS" PVE player doesnt even remotely resemble a PVP player in terms of gear/stats which means... a full PVE GWF for instance, probably spits out 2x the damage in PVE dungeons that his BIS PVP counterpart does... on the flip side, even if that PVE guy put on tenacity gear, chances are he has low HP low LS and will die in 1-2 rotations against his PVP counterpart.
Why do I detail all this out? Because its what makes PVP not fun. Skill is NOT one of the biggest factors in who wins pvp. Its actually gear/power.... The casual will never beat a BIS player. The most hardcore PVE player wont even be able to scratch a PVP player.
These gaps need to be bridged.
ONE SOLUTION would be to remove boons, companions(yes they already are), and mount stat bonuses from PVP. So you zone into PVP and its merely JUST your character, his base gear, rank X enchants, and thats it. This would remove probably 30k in stats from the "BIS" level of PVP.
This bridges the gap, because now the stat difference and stat allocation difference is MUCH smaller between PVE/PVP as well as the casual versus Vet PVP player. A new player merely needs to get his hands on some decent gear, decent artifacts, with no worry about being part of a SH guild... or doing ALL the modules of boons just to have a small CHANCE at winning.
What this also does, is now "item level" actually WOULD be a real value of strength. All the things that dont contribute to item level, wouldnt be allowed in PVP. So itemlevel COULD be used as a matchmaking metric. So the 3k player wouldnt face a 4k player.
Also, the PVE player now could merely swap his gear to PVP gear, and it would be a MUCH closer fight. The PVP player would likely come out on top, however it wouldnt be as much of a takeaway as it is today. Reason being, the 30k+ of stats removed from this suggestion, would likely be stats like ARP/HP/Lifesteal/defense - all the stuff that the PVP player uses those boons to STACK those stats... That are ideal for PVP but not as much in PVE so the PVE player wont stack those things. Not to mention things like Endless Consumption that essentialyl doubles your lifesteal.... It would be REMOVED removing a significant source of self healing.
The OTHER thing I would strongly suggest.... remove tenacity as a STAT on gear. Every character in the game already has a "base" tenacity built into them at 10% values. 10% DR, 10% piercing resist, 10% crit resist, 10% CC resist correct? Just adjust THESE values up to appropriate levels.
Im not sure what they deem as "best" but I would probably target like:
ARP resist: 75% (and make this a multipliyer to ARP... meaning if you have 100% RI, * (1-.75) = 25% net RI)
DR Resist: 60% (Increased from 42-45%)
CC Resist: 40% (kept about the same)
Crit Resist: 30% (reduced.. so a basic crit with 75% severity deals about 22.5% damage increase)
NOW players can use ANY gear to PVP, not just PVP gear. The allure of PVP gear should be the high HP pools above the PVE gear (which I believe they already have on the gear, HP gets a higher allocation of stats). This became an issue back in mod 0 because "tanks" would have to PVP to get the best "tank gear" so to that I would suggest SWAPPING them, so the PVP gear is actually more "DPS" oriented for tanks where as the PVE sets have the more tanky stats. Be careful with GWF as destroyer gear should be more DPS and less tank for PVE.
Now what have you done.
1) removed the tenacity gear gap between players.
2) removed 30k+ of stat power difference between PVE/PVP players and casuals.
3) in doing so, created a real metric of power comparison already in game (item level) to use for matchmaking (ditch ELO guys... seriously)
4) removed the need to create BOTH PVE AND PVP CONTENT each module... Remember SHs came out and you had to work on dragon flight AND the SH PVP and both of those basically flopped? Spend the time on new DUNGEONS and PVP players will actually care about PVE armor again because it could be used in PVP if they wanted to lose some HP for more damage stats...
5) Removed some of the biggest sources of self healing from PVP (endless consumption + countless lifesteal % in the boons)
Overall... Now you have as CLOSE to equalization as you can get with minimal steps, minimal work and frankly... it will be MUCH easier to balance PVP with less stats involved... No more super recovery stacking... no more uber lifesteal self healing... no more 150% RI via ARP (that BTW DOES boost your damage past 0% DR......)... No more having to swap gear between PVE and PVP and having to worry about builds as you can use ALL your boon stats for PVE and merely have a better "middle ground" on your gear itself....
It just seems so simple to me.... it simplifies PVP, makes it more casual friendly... more PVE friendly... easier to balance moving forward... more ALT friendly!
heck, just TRY it for 1 month. Offer both Ques - full character que for domination (do it on Dom only) and then offer an "item level only" que where ONLY things that boost item level work in PVP.... call it a "boonless que" or whatever. Doesnt matter... TRY it. See what happens. I bet itll work better than you think!
In a game involving microtransactions (or in some cases macrotransactions given the cost of legendary mounts) suggestions like what your giving aren't sound. While I agree in principle that SH boons and mount bonuses give very strong advantages in PvP, what you are suggesting won't work for two reasons:
1. SH boons donation items and mounts are things you obtain through purchasing lockboxes (in the case of legendary mounts) and buying items from the Zen market to speed up production. This makes the game developers money.
2. SH boons donation items and mounts can be obtained through extreme grinding or clever AH use. This requires a lot of work and are earned through this method.
So basically if you introduce a queue where none of these are allowed it removes the incentive for anyone to obtain them thereby making them irrelevant for anything but pve. Also if there were two queues, one with and one without the people would just not bother with the other queue if they are lacking in both areas essentially killing it off.
I'm not saying it's fair, I'm just saying it's not reasonable.
ultimately its about the gear, weapons and enchantments. for a pvp to be fun, Skill and teamwork and experience should not be trumped by Gear. if you let gear become more important than skill, then you get a situation where unskilled trolls can breeze through the queues and drive off 50-70% of the players. You also can't allow bored max level players to put end game enchants and items on low bracket characters. Those low brackets are where the future pvpers are raised, if you don't give them a good upbringing, they drop out.
Gear should be about variety. the greens and blues in the AH are exactly what should exist for players, life drain, run speed, offense, defense- these stats let you further customize your playstyle after you've agonized over which spec you're using. the moment you let someone overpower and overgear 95% of the competition, you are killing your pvp playerbase. I'm not sure why it was allowed to happen, maybe they thought it would drive ppl to start buying more items. But for the most part it just sours the good majority of pvpers away from ever trying.
Drying up the queue and ending the fun.
I dont think cryptic will ever consider bracketing. If yes, we already hear a bit about it, even a small hint. They will probably try rework que, bring more players (they already do first useless steps like pvp armor on trade bar store) and let enhanced matchmaking- elo do the work. create serious matches where teams has similar power capacity, newbies meets bis very rarely. thats the best we can ask probably, but it needs to be done asap. Bis pveers get their toy hard dungeon, pvpers now awaiting things too.
All matches I see are more or less destroyed by disbalances...and the biggest disbalance imo is: one 4k DC or OP in one team and a 2k blue geared "oneshot DC" in the other team
No chance to go against a team protected by a unkillable 3k+DC
the only class that may be a threat to a DC might be the Hunter these days dealing insane damage with piercing blades 2-3 time more than an average compareable striker, dealing 75% with that little feature, me just jealous
No, it shouldn't be. But it is. Now, how do we get there from here?