incoming GoH change: let's discuss here and be constructive

bitt3rnightmar3

Heroic Feats have long been lacking in comparison with the effectiveness to other classes.

Holy resolves 5 minute cool down is completely worthless. Seriously? This needs to be looked at.

Initiate of faith is worthless-- Could this be changed to gain more Crit from Strength or perhaps-- Give crit from Wisdom or Charisma which would work similarly like Force of Will from paladin tree instead of going off stats directly??

The roles of various paths seem to be from my perspective as follows:
Virtuous more 'Damage mitigation' intensive
Faithful more 'Clutch healing' intensive
righteous more 'Debuffing' intensive

My Take on the Virtuous path:
I love the way I heal with it. I really enjoy ticking HoTs on everyone and keeping everyone at full health. The capstone works great from my perspective and I've been virtuous for years (Since pip 4th of divinity removal from faithful). I do notice some problems though..

The 50% weapon damage shield from unbreakable devotion is not useful when other paths have more utility and paladin healers have access to more damage mitigation than we could ever hope for as virtuous healers.

Why not add in some mirroring for the Damage over time on righteous with Heals over time in virtuous?
Unbreakable devotion
Proposed Mechanics:
-While under effect of heals over time allies are granted a 'Shield' every 20 seconds and take 10% less damage from all sources for 10 seconds-having a cool down is okay but it would be neat if it could stack.

All of the feats that trigger when the DC is at 100% health from the virtuous tree are not reliable my opinion with this new meta. Maybe replace with above 75% or 50% health? To be honest virtues' gift and gift of life seem basically the same and are both very unimaginative. Gift of life seems okay where it is in the feat tree- but a bigger commitment to virtuous healing might warrant more benefit?

Virtues Gift
Proposed Mechanics:

- While under the effect of a heal over time you and your allies regain 1/2/3/4/5% more stamina regeneration and/or have 5/10/15/20/25% increased DR.
or make it mirror condemning gaze-- but instead
-Your heals over time apply stacks of virtue~ at 20 stacks of virtue you get of the effects dealt to you and your allies (something like this - +20% AP/+20% DR/+20% Stamina ANYTHING xyz stat or perhaps a Linked spirit-esq variant. )

In order to make DCs competitive healers with paladins perhaps re evaluating returning feats such as Moontouched (Allies affected by your Hallowed Ground also gain 1/2/3/4/5% of their maximum Hit Points every 3 seconds.) or Linked Spirit (You link with every ally you Heal , increasing their stat ratings by 1/2/3/4/5% of your stat ratings for 10 seconds. Healing multiple targets at once will increase the bonus all targets receive.)

Since paladins basically have moontouched with out having hallowed ground (See Justice feats Beacon of hope/prism+ high recovery) Otherwise- DCs don't appear to be on top for much and are competing more than ever with CWs for support debuffing roles and OPs for healing because it's not unlikely many OP tanks are going to probably switch to healers as a reliable means to be needed in a dungeon post bubble nerf. There are a LOT of OPs in the game right now- assuming they don't quit playing.

I'm seriously considering saving myself the frustration of not being able to do solo PVE content quickly and switching to righteous-- Depends on if healing from my virtuous tree will be enough. I'd rather not go into faithful. It doesn't suit my play style at all.

rapo973

bitt3rnightmar3 said:

Heroic Feats have long been lacking in comparison with the effectiveness to other classes.
[...]

Thank you @bitt3rnightmar3. I will take your proposals.
The purpose of this topic is to create some options to be discussed. Even if I don't agree with some of them, I really want to listen all the voices and collect all the inputs.

rapo973

The new EE campaign will introduce two new end boons providing 24k heals: you can check them on PTS.
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/1214714/improving-the-level-60-70-experience
Those boons will be available for new players only: if you're already 70, you won't get them.

Imo, these new boons are the end of the healer classes (when you add on top of it lifesteal, mount bonuses, drawned shore weapon set, other campaign boons, etc.) , but that's not the place to discuss them.
Please use the info for your cleric review if needed.

bitt3rnightmar3

rapo973 said:

Those boons will be available for new players only: if you're already 70, you won't get them.

I logged into Preview last night.. I was able to pick up the boons and complete all the tasks in the campagin because I did elemental evil. It's retroactive so everything is already done if you did Elemental evil already.

rapo973

bitt3rnightmar3 said:

rapo973 said:

Those boons will be available for new players only: if you're already 70, you won't get them.

I logged into Preview last night.. I was able to pick up the boons and complete all the tasks in the campagin because I did elemental evil. It's retroactive so everything is already done if you did Elemental evil already.

Thank for this. My statement comes from:

commanderander said:

Hi guys,

Here are some of the answers I can give to questions:

1) The content, as it is set up right now, does not allow for level 70's to replay it. I understand wanting that, but the amount of dancing around we would have to do to make it both replayable at level 70, get existing players pre-70 to slide in to the proper neighborhood and not replay older neighborhoods, and have it just work normally for players leveling up, would be a lot and we would be biting off more than we could chew for the already enormous task of revamping 60-70 and also lessening the quality of what we're trying to put out if we try to do it now.
[...]

It says nothing if you already played it, but I understood that it was not available for 70's A bit misleading...

clericalist

For the Gift of Haste, apply the opposite as the cleric healing powers (where clerics get less of their own heals as others), have clerics get more AP gain from it than others, everyone knows this nerf is only there because the bubbledins, a boost to cleric AP will not be part of this problem. Another problem is that Gift of Haste has no relationship to stats, how about tying AP gain from it to stats ? This will provide incentives to increase your stats, right now why would a virtuous want to go to 4k when all they are needed for is AP gain ?

As it has been mentioned, they added another boon that will make healing even more obselete than it is now (if that is even possible). A lot of the boons are there to turn super dpsers into healers, they should also apply the inverse logic, make super healers into dpsers, thus boosting the damage of Burning Guidance would be welcome, but not just the damage, increase the proc rate as well. Another idea is to tie overhealing into some kind of DPS pool, a bit like how the faithful healing pool works, after a certain amount of overhealing it is realesed as damage. As for Gift of Haste why not also create a pool for AP gain, so after a certain amount of overhealing, Gift of Haste gets a boost from this pool.

All the things I mentioned essentially are there to solve the main problem for clerics, healing is not needed, provide something to channel healing to something useful (like DPS orAP gain), if this core issue is not acknowledged and addressed by the developers then they will never provide constructive changes for clerics.

mamalion1234

clericalist said:

For the Gift of Haste, apply the opposite as the cleric healing powers (where clerics get less of their own heals as others), have clerics get more AP gain from it than others, everyone knows this nerf is only there because the bubbledins, a boost to cleric AP will not be part of this problem. Another problem is that Gift of Haste has no relationship to stats, how about tying AP gain from it to stats ? This will provide incentives to increase your stats, right now why would a virtuous want to go to 4k when all they are needed for is AP gain ?

As it has been mentioned, they added another boon that will make healing even more obselete than it is now (if that is even possible). A lot of the boons are there to turn super dpsers into healers, they should also apply the inverse logic, make super healers into dpsers, thus boosting the damage of Burning Guidance would be welcome, but not just the damage, increase the proc rate as well. Another idea is to tie overhealing into some kind of DPS pool, a bit like how the faithful healing pool works, after a certain amount of overhealing it is realesed as damage. As for Gift of Haste why not also create a pool for AP gain, so after a certain amount of overhealing, Gift of Haste gets a boost from this pool.

All the things I mentioned essentially are there to solve the main problem for clerics, healing is not needed, provide something to channel healing to something useful (like DPS orAP gain), if this core issue is not acknowledged and addressed by the developers then they will never provide constructive changes for clerics.

i like your idea boon diversity depending on the class . They can add a rule : for cleric-gf-op works that way for other classes another way.