It's a reality check for people, particularly on Xbox, who are already calling their current artifact weapons "obsolete" because of the new Stronghold ones...yeah...about that...
by the time we get our SH weapons they will be obsolete lol
You're using the wrong number. You're looking at Gems (which is the white diamond icon) and not AD, which is the Turquoise gem icon...confusing? Yes. But those are the icons taken directly from the game.
To get to level 20 on the GH (to unlock level 10 buildings) you need 12 buildings at level 9. So it really doesn't make sense to raise anything other than the boon buildings and market to level 10.
So I got the total cost to get a R20 GH, R10 Market and 4 R10 Boon Buildings (Barracks/Temple/Stable/Workshop) to be 269,300 Chests of AD or 269.3 million AD. Divided by 150, that's about 1.8 million AD each. Or 75 days of 24k/day of AD.
Or you could say 75 x 150 = 11,250 player days worth of time to max out the SH, assuming AD is the limiting resource. Which might not be the case...I think influence is more so, since you can only roughly earn 400 per character. And it looks like the total influence needed is about 10.85 million, or just over 27,000 character days of influence farming. So assuming you could get every player to farm influence each day on an average of 2.4 toons, you're set.
But we also know the build times are hard-coded, and with rank-1 day to build, you have 190 days of build time. So would you be able to say that in order to max out a SH as quickly as you can, you'd need 11,250/190 or about 60 active players contributing the maximum amount of resources needed each day?
If my math is right, that really doesn't seem totally crazy. It's a lot...but not totally crazy.
...let's put a man-hours figure to that: Getting your 24k takes IMHO like 2 hours - 4 Skirmishes, and 4 Dungeons, if you salvage the drops. Might be a wee less if you're lucky with boss drops, but many times those drop nothing or peridots...
11250 * 2 = 22500 man hours, or 562.5 man weeks, or 11 man-years.
That's the time budget for 3-4 PhD theses. Or a mid-sized software project. Or a normal brick house from first principles and sand/clay/trees, or two to three brick houses from building material...
...AND this doesn't even account for all the extra material you have to gather: Influence, Campaign Treasures, Enchantments,...
It's a reality check for people, particularly on Xbox, who are already calling their current artifact weapons "obsolete" because of the new Stronghold ones...yeah...about that...
by the time we get our SH weapons they will be obsolete lol
With module 8 they probably are obsolete already. It depends on which stats one prefers.
So I got the total cost to get a R20 GH, R10 Market and 4 R10 Boon Buildings (Barracks/Temple/Stable/Workshop) to be 269,300 Chests of AD or 269.3 million AD. Divided by 150, that's about 1.8 million AD each. Or 75 days of 24k/day of AD.
I get 259,200 chests. GH 20, barracks/temple/stable/workshop/market at 10, farm/lumber yard/mine/quarry/warehouse/smelter's yard at 9.
Confusing ;-)
Anyway, this will be too much for most guilds. I can't myself see running Strongholds another year. I'm already disgusted by having to do Sharandar/Ice Wind Dale/Well of Dragons/Dread Ring again and again and again. And I can't stand HEs anymore.
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silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
Many of us have suggested they should give alternative pathing and reduce costing especially certain gates, AD/GEMs are my biggest issues as is salvage.. these should be toned down by 50% or more.
I still truly believe that ANY item that is needed in stronghold should drop as well in the dungeons and skirms, make it so you can get it without having to do solo quests, but leave those who would like to do that.. I hate to do them and will only do them when my guilds needs them, then I will try to do whatever group content or fastest impact I can have with it (multi classing Arcane Resorvior for example 4 x 50 sparks.
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ironzerg79Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,942Arc User
@silverkelt I agree. I think the major hang up is the actual process of farming up all these resources just isn't fun.
I've love to see vouchers drop in more places, like the SH HE's, dungeons, skirmishes and drops from leadership. As I said in another thread, they should also up the voucher quality that you can get from the Dragonflight events, to make that something worth farming for resources, or even add SH vouchers to Stronghold PvP.
Right now it feels like WAAAAAAAY too much of a resource sink, and not something that's satisfying to work on.
I'm playing on Xbox only and the prices are crazy all around (probably 10 times higher than they need to be to make us all grinding like slaves through the rest of our gamer life). I think we'll just get a few buildings with boons for PvE and sit still till something new arrives.
Re: Calculator. Looks good to get some high-level look, thank you.
For day-to-day use it would be nice to have: 1) add tooltips for resource icons 2) enable dependencies, this is the most complicated part for new players - which of the buildings are required to build the next buildings based on resources availability, coffer capacity, building requirements. 3) let me export this to Excel as I would like to do some more math on top of these numbers by assigning AD or player*days prices to different resources.
1. Will do. 2. I'm working on it. I ran afoul of some calculation issues, using the current and added (not owned) levels. I'm hoping to have time to work them out in a the next few weeks. My job is kinda absorbing a lot of my brain juices right now. 3. I don't think I'm going to build it to export to Excel. A CSV, or other open format is more likely, but I'll look into it.
alphastreamMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 209Arc User
Hi, thanks for this great tool!
Feature request: It would be great if clicking a "+" when a structure can't be upgraded would tell me any reasons/requirements. For example, it might say that it requires a certain guild hall level, number of buildings at level x, etc.
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1) More than one Warehouse. Our guild is strictly PVE, so we did not build PVP structures and we needed an additional building to advance, so we opted to a second warehouse.
2) Add Alliance discount The Alliance grants a discount on buildung cost, so it would be nice, if we could add the alliance buildung discount somewhere and if it would reflect in the cost of the buildings.
Comments
11250 * 2 = 22500 man hours, or 562.5 man weeks, or 11 man-years.
That's the time budget for 3-4 PhD theses. Or a mid-sized software project. Or a normal brick house from first principles and sand/clay/trees, or two to three brick houses from building material...
...AND this doesn't even account for all the extra material you have to gather: Influence, Campaign Treasures, Enchantments,...
Confusing ;-)
Anyway, this will be too much for most guilds. I can't myself see running Strongholds another year. I'm already disgusted by having to do Sharandar/Ice Wind Dale/Well of Dragons/Dread Ring again and again and again. And I can't stand HEs anymore.
I still truly believe that ANY item that is needed in stronghold should drop as well in the dungeons and skirms, make it so you can get it without having to do solo quests, but leave those who would like to do that.. I hate to do them and will only do them when my guilds needs them, then I will try to do whatever group content or fastest impact I can have with it (multi classing Arcane Resorvior for example 4 x 50 sparks.
I've love to see vouchers drop in more places, like the SH HE's, dungeons, skirmishes and drops from leadership. As I said in another thread, they should also up the voucher quality that you can get from the Dragonflight events, to make that something worth farming for resources, or even add SH vouchers to Stronghold PvP.
Right now it feels like WAAAAAAAY too much of a resource sink, and not something that's satisfying to work on.
Re: Calculator. Looks good to get some high-level look, thank you.
For day-to-day use it would be nice to have:
1) add tooltips for resource icons
2) enable dependencies, this is the most complicated part for new players - which of the buildings are required to build the next buildings based on resources availability, coffer capacity, building requirements.
3) let me export this to Excel as I would like to do some more math on top of these numbers by assigning AD or player*days prices to different resources.
2. I'm working on it. I ran afoul of some calculation issues, using the current and added (not owned) levels. I'm hoping to have time to work them out in a the next few weeks. My job is kinda absorbing a lot of my brain juices right now.
3. I don't think I'm going to build it to export to Excel. A CSV, or other open format is more likely, but I'll look into it.
CSV (or TSV) is exactly what I meant by export to Excel.
Feature request: It would be great if clicking a "+" when a structure can't be upgraded would tell me any reasons/requirements. For example, it might say that it requires a certain guild hall level, number of buildings at level x, etc.
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1) More than one Warehouse.
Our guild is strictly PVE, so we did not build PVP structures and we needed an additional building to advance, so we opted to a second warehouse.
2) Add Alliance discount
The Alliance grants a discount on buildung cost, so it would be nice, if we could add the alliance buildung discount somewhere and if it would reflect in the cost of the buildings.
Wonderful tool, thanks to everyone involved.
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