Personal Stronghold

cesuke

I am in a big guild but what about the once who not ? The once that are colecting their first épics... They have no chance... or a group of friends that want to make a small brotherhood ... They will be always less... And i read someone that was kicked from his guild and he spent Gold and Effort in that SH... Maybe u devs could made a personal keep or altars... So ppl can still progressing soloing.

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regenerde

Personal Strongholds might become an option, when the Devs place Stronghold Vouchers into the former rAD slots from leadership...

Another idea might be to tie the donations to the player account instead of to a guild, if some guild leader goes on a kicking guild members tour, he will lose his Stronghold in the process too...

urabask

regenerde said:

Personal Strongholds might become an option, when the Devs place Stronghold Vouchers into the former rAD slots from leadership...

Another idea might be to tie the donations to the player account instead of to a guild, if some guild leader goes on a kicking guild members tour, he will lose his Stronghold in the process too...

A personal stronghold that you manage on your own but your guild's contributions count towards would make more sense. Make it more like a profession that you manage based on resources your guild gathers as opposed to something tied directly to the guild. You'd still be encouraging people to join guilds but a lot of the risk would be eliminated.

cesuke

@regenerde u giv a great suggestion so u have a valué for the guild if kicked or leave u take out ur contribution...

regenerde

Just one point to add, you wouldn't get any more marks from refunded Stronghold Vouchers, to make sure that this feature is not exploited.
You could still help building/upgrading a new/other guild with those refunded Stronghold vouchers, but "farming" marks with them would not work.

urabask

regenerde said:

Just one point to add, you wouldn't get any more marks from refunded Stronghold Vouchers, to make sure that this feature is not exploited.
You could still help building/upgrading a new/other guild with those refunded Stronghold vouchers, but "farming" marks with them would not work.

The main problem with that would be the timers on upgrades. Say you leave your guild and they're in the middle of upgrading from 7 to 8, what happens? Would it pause the upgrade until they re-fill their coffer? What if they finish an upgrade, does it bump them back? Do they get an instant upgrade when they refill their coffer? Sounds like it would open guilds up to attacks by griefers. You'd essentially be undermining the guild leader because prominent contributors would be able to kill a guild at will.

It's true that there needs to be some sort of check on the power that guild leaders have but it shouldn't be something that creates opportunities for griefing from all sides.

regenerde

Any update in progress would be put on hold, the loss would show up as "main contribution target", and the remaining guild members would get time to refill it.
When that is finished, the upgrade in progress would continue again.

It would set the guild a bit back, but it would not kill the guild.
Therefore i'm not sure where there is an opening for "griefing"?

I mean, if some people think that players should vet guilds before they join them, then a guild leader has to take the responsibility for players they invite into the guild too.

And just thinking it through, at first you put resources (= time or real money) into your guild, but then you provoke a guild kick, to walk away with only your resources in bound Stronghold Vouchers?
That would make no sense at all...

If that happens in a big guild, the remaining members should have no problem with refilling the loss within a short time.
And even if that happens in a small guild, there should be enough active people in there, to help even out the loss in time.

Besides, such stories would make their rounds, and it would become harder to find a new guild to "grief", even with all those resources in Stronghold Vouchers waiting to be donated again.

Anyway, at least this would give players the certainty, that if the guild leader goes missing or starts kicking players without reason, they will get their invested resources back to continue in another guild or start their own guild with those Stronghold Vouchers.

dsn1118

I want building time booster on Zen Store.Oh mighty money grabbing PWE hear me!Stronghold building time booster will make you richer

urabask

regenerde said:

Any update in progress would be put on hold, the loss would show up as "main contribution target", and the remaining guild members would get time to refill it.
When that is finished, the upgrade in progress would continue again.

It would set the guild a bit back, but it would not kill the guild.
Therefore i'm not sure where there is an opening for "griefing"?

I mean, if some people think that players should vet guilds before they join them, then a guild leaderhas to take the responsibility for players they invite into the guild too.

And just thinking it through, at first you put resources (= time or real money) into your guild, but then you provoke a guild kick, to walk away with only your resources in bound Stronghold Vouchers?
That would make no sense at all...

If that happens in a big guild, the remaining members should have no problem with refilling the loss within a short time.
And even if that happens in a small guild, there should be enough active people in there, to help even out the loss in time.

Besides, such stories would make their rounds, and it would become harder to find a new guild to "grief", even with all those resources in Stronghold Vouchers waiting to be donated again.

Anyway, at least this would give players the certainty, that if the guild leader goes missing or starts kicking players without reason, they will get their invested resources back to continue in another guild or start their own guild with those Stronghold Vouchers.

If an angry members decided to leave when there aren't many players on they pause the timer and overnight the guild gets screwed. If a few people decided to coordinate when they leave they could probably waste a few days of time for their guild. Then if you leave after having been in the guild for a long time your contributions could add up to multiple days of downtime for your previous guild. If multiple people like that leave a guild at the same time they could practically kill all progress on a stronghold. It seems more like a way for guild members to create the same problems that guild leaders are capable of now.

regenerde

urabask said:

regenerde said:

Any update in progress would be put on hold, the loss would show up as "main contribution target", and the remaining guild members would get time to refill it.
When that is finished, the upgrade in progress would continue again.

It would set the guild a bit back, but it would not kill the guild.
Therefore i'm not sure where there is an opening for "griefing"?

I mean, if some people think that players should vet guilds before they join them, then a guild leader has to take the responsibility for players they invite into the guild too.

And just thinking it through, at first you put resources (= time or real money) into your guild, but then you provoke a guild kick, to walk away with only your resources in bound Stronghold Vouchers?
That would make no sense at all...

If that happens in a big guild, the remaining members should have no problem with refilling the loss within a short time.
And even if that happens in a small guild, there should be enough active people in there, to help even out the loss in time.

Besides, such stories would make their rounds, and it would become harder to find a new guild to "grief", even with all those resources in Stronghold Vouchers waiting to be donated again.

Anyway, at least this would give players the certainty, that if the guild leader goes missing or starts kicking players without reason, they will get their invested resources back to continue in another guild or start their own guild with those Stronghold Vouchers.

If an angry members decided to leave when there aren't many players on they pause the timer and overnight the guild gets screwed. If a few people decided to coordinate when they leave they could probably waste a few days of time for their guild. Then if you leave after having been in the guild for a long time your contributions could add up to multiple days of downtime for your previous guild. If multiple people like that leave a guild at the same time they could practically kill all progress on a stronghold. It seems more like a way for guild members to create the same problems that guild leaders are capable of now.

Again... if a player decide to leave a guild, he will not receive any refund.
There will be only a refund, if the guild leader/officer kicks the player out.

If a player wants just out of a guild, he can just leave.

urabask

regenerde said:

urabask said:

regenerde said:

Any update in progress would be put on hold, the loss would show up as "main contribution target", and the remaining guild members would get time to refill it.
When that is finished, the upgrade in progress would continue again.

It would set the guild a bit back, but it would not kill the guild.
Therefore i'm not sure where there is an opening for "griefing"?

I mean, if some people think that players should vet guilds before they join them, then a guild leader has to take the responsibility for players they invite into the guild too.

And just thinking it through, at first you put resources (= time or real money) into your guild, but then you provoke a guild kick, to walk away with only your resources in bound Stronghold Vouchers?
That would make no sense at all...

If that happens in a big guild, the remaining members should have no problem with refilling the loss within a short time.
And even if that happens in a small guild, there should be enough active people in there, to help even out the loss in time.

Besides, such stories would make their rounds, and it would become harder to find a new guild to "grief", even with all those resources in Stronghold Vouchers waiting to be donated again.

Anyway, at least this would give players the certainty, that if the guild leader goes missing or starts kicking players without reason, they will get their invested resources back to continue in another guild or start their own guild with those Stronghold Vouchers.

If an angry members decided to leave when there aren't many players on they pause the timer and overnight the guild gets screwed. If a few people decided to coordinate when they leave they could probably waste a few days of time for their guild. Then if you leave after having been in the guild for a long time your contributions could add up to multiple days of downtime for your previous guild. If multiple people like that leave a guild at the same time they could practically kill all progress on a stronghold. It seems more like a way for guild members to create the same problems that guild leaders are capable of now.

Again... if a player decide to leave a guild, he will not receive any refund.
There will be only a refund, if the guild leader/officer kicks the player out.

If a player wants just out of a guild, he can just leave.

Then you'll just have guilds harass players until they leave instead of kicking them.

regenerde

urabask said:

regenerde said:

urabask said:

regenerde said:

Any update in progress would be put on hold, the loss would show up as "main contribution target", and the remaining guild members would get time to refill it.
When that is finished, the upgrade in progress would continue again.

It would set the guild a bit back, but it would not kill the guild.
Therefore i'm not sure where there is an opening for "griefing"?

I mean, if some people think that players should vet guilds before they join them, then a guild leader has to take the responsibility for players they invite into the guild too.

And just thinking it through, at first you put resources (= time or real money) into your guild, but then you provoke a guild kick, to walk away with only your resources in bound Stronghold Vouchers?
That would make no sense at all...

If that happens in a big guild, the remaining members should have no problem with refilling the loss within a short time.
And even if that happens in a small guild, there should be enough active people in there, to help even out the loss in time.

Besides, such stories would make their rounds, and it would become harder to find a new guild to "grief", even with all those resources in Stronghold Vouchers waiting to be donated again.

Anyway, at least this would give players the certainty, that if the guild leader goes missing or starts kicking players without reason, they will get their invested resources back to continue in another guild or start their own guild with those Stronghold Vouchers.

If an angry members decided to leave when there aren't many players on they pause the timer and overnight the guild gets screwed. If a few people decided to coordinate when they leave they could probably waste a few days of time for their guild. Then if you leave after having been in the guild for a long time your contributions could add up to multiple days of downtime for your previous guild. If multiple people like that leave a guild at the same time they could practically kill all progress on a stronghold. It seems more like a way for guild members to create the same problems that guild leaders are capable of now.

Again... if a player decide to leave a guild, he will not receive any refund.
There will be only a refund, if the guild leader/officer kicks the player out.

If a player wants just out of a guild, he can just leave.

Then you'll just have guilds harass players until they leave instead of kicking them.

Then you'll just write tickets about the harassment and let a GM deal with it.

urabask

regenerde said:

urabask said:

regenerde said:

urabask said:

regenerde said:

Any update in progress would be put on hold, the loss would show up as "main contribution target", and the remaining guild members would get time to refill it.
When that is finished, the upgrade in progress would continue again.

It would set the guild a bit back, but it would not kill the guild.
Therefore i'm not sure where there is an opening for "griefing"?

I mean, if some people think that players should vet guilds before they join them, then a guild leader has to take the responsibility for players they invite into the guild too.

And just thinking it through, at first you put resources (= time or real money) into your guild, but then you provoke a guild kick, to walk away with only your resources in bound Stronghold Vouchers?
That would make no sense at all...

If that happens in a big guild, the remaining members should have no problem with refilling the loss within a short time.
And even if that happens in a small guild, there should be enough active people in there, to help even out the loss in time.

Besides, such stories would make their rounds, and it would become harder to find a new guild to "grief", even with all those resources in Stronghold Vouchers waiting to be donated again.

Anyway, at least this would give players the certainty, that if the guild leader goes missing or starts kicking players without reason, they will get their invested resources back to continue in another guild or start their own guild with those Stronghold Vouchers.

If an angry members decided to leave when there aren't many players on they pause the timer and overnight the guild gets screwed. If a few people decided to coordinate when they leave they could probably waste a few days of time for their guild. Then if you leave after having been in the guild for a long time your contributions could add up to multiple days of downtime for your previous guild. If multiple people like that leave a guild at the same time they could practically kill all progress on a stronghold. It seems more like a way for guild members to create the same problems that guild leaders are capable of now.

Again... if a player decide to leave a guild, he will not receive any refund.
There will be only a refund, if the guild leader/officer kicks the player out.

If a player wants just out of a guild, he can just leave.

Then you'll just have guilds harass players until they leave instead of kicking them.

Then you'll just write tickets about the harassment and let a GM deal with it.

Because that'll work. There are plenty of ways to harass people without actually violating the ToS.

If there is a way around it people will find it. There is virtually no way to stop that sort of interaction between players.

regenerde

urabask said:

regenerde said:

urabask said:

regenerde said:

urabask said:

regenerde said:

Any update in progress would be put on hold, the loss would show up as "main contribution target", and the remaining guild members would get time to refill it.
When that is finished, the upgrade in progress would continue again.

It would set the guild a bit back, but it would not kill the guild.
Therefore i'm not sure where there is an opening for "griefing"?

I mean, if some people think that players should vet guilds before they join them, then a guild leader has to take the responsibility for players they invite into the guild too.

And just thinking it through, at first you put resources (= time or real money) into your guild, but then you provoke a guild kick, to walk away with only your resources in bound Stronghold Vouchers?
That would make no sense at all...

If that happens in a big guild, the remaining members should have no problem with refilling the loss within a short time.
And even if that happens in a small guild, there should be enough active people in there, to help even out the loss in time.

Besides, such stories would make their rounds, and it would become harder to find a new guild to "grief", even with all those resources in Stronghold Vouchers waiting to be donated again.

Anyway, at least this would give players the certainty, that if the guild leader goes missing or starts kicking players without reason, they will get their invested resources back to continue in another guild or start their own guild with those Stronghold Vouchers.

If an angry members decided to leave when there aren't many players on they pause the timer and overnight the guild gets screwed. If a few people decided to coordinate when they leave they could probably waste a few days of time for their guild. Then if you leave after having been in the guild for a long time your contributions could add up to multiple days of downtime for your previous guild. If multiple people like that leave a guild at the same time they could practically kill all progress on a stronghold. It seems more like a way for guild members to create the same problems that guild leaders are capable of now.

Again... if a player decide to leave a guild, he will not receive any refund.
There will be only a refund, if the guild leader/officer kicks the player out.

If a player wants just out of a guild, he can just leave.

Then you'll just have guilds harass players until they leave instead of kicking them.

Then you'll just write tickets about the harassment and let a GM deal with it.

Because that'll work. There are plenty of ways to harass people without actually violating the ToS.

If there is a way around it people will find it. There is virtually no way to stop that sort of interaction between players.

As brought up in another thread, if someone decides to leave on it's own, he could get a partial refund, either a certain percentage based on the timeframe he is a member of that guild, or something based on the whole donation of all guild members.

Or there could be an option to get a GM remove your character from that guild with a refund.
That option could be limited to 3 times, as emergency exit, but that would also make any harassment pointless.

klangeddin

At the moment the biggest discriminant are the boons.
As they are now a character from a maxed out guild will murder any guildless toon. Unless there are some evident class balance issues involved.
Something tells me, though, that they are being kept blatantly overpowered as a bait for the whales to fork up the cash and burn all their millions of AD.
When Cryptic will see the ZEN/AD flow slowing down, they'll suddenly realize that the boons may need a "rework".

As for the OP's idea, on its own it certainly has some merit, guildless players don't deserve to have less content than others, but honestly I do not see it happening as it clearly defies the whole meaning of mod 7 and the vision that this dev team has about the game, and the role that guilds must have on it.

regenerde

Well, at this point all you can ask is, will the Devs come up with something to protect the time and money player invested into Strongholds?

And will the Devs also come up with something to enable solo players and/or small guilds to achieve at least a Stronghold with small boons within a more reasonable timeframe?

The Devs might also want to take a look at
http://steamcharts.com/app/109600
and consider the impact of their visions on the complete playerbase...

zorothegallade

defiantone99 said:

Conquer or Crumble, my friend.lol The plan is to consolidate players into large guilds. No room for solo or casuals anymore.

And that's the approach the devs are failing at. Whenever they want to encourage a certain playstyle, they don't put in new content or incentives to play that way...they simply gimp every other option so that the only vaguely fun thing left in the game is what they want you to play.