new astral diamond bonus and time invested worth it?

givearandomname

if you haven't done the math you can currently earn during events
dungeons 1 run 6000 ad = 10 min
skirmish 3 runs 6000 ad = 30 min
pvp 4 runs 1 win 8000 ad 1 hour
total 20,000 ad 1 hour 50 min

with the new model this is basic break down of the time needed to earn them
dungeons 6000 base 2 runs 20 min and 150 to 750 per run for total of 7200 ad = 10 min per run even at max reward =1.6 hours
pvp 4000 2 matches 30 min and 200 to 300 per match for total of 4800 avg match 15 min = at max reward 4 hours
skirm 3000 two matchs 30 min and 50 to 500 per run for total of 7200 average skirm 10 min= 2.4 hours
total 32200 ad in 8 hours
that's increase of 12000 earned at 1948 per hour at maximum rate

now keep in mind these number are at the MAXIMUM RATE POSSABLE WE ALL KNOW A 10 MIN TOS RUN WILL NOT I SAY AGAIN WILL NOT REWARD THE MAXIMUM BE CLOSER TO THE MINIMUM AMMOUNT.

edit to clarify what the bonus is

The bonus AD earned from the first 2 runs of something (like a dungeon) do NOT count towards the other AD cap. So your first 2 dungeon runs will earn you 3000 AD each. On top of that, you'll be earning AD from a separate pool based on what you ran…

in Astral Diamond Changes Comment by goatshark September 10

givearandomname

No the reward is not good enough for me

something else to think about with the current system if you were to invest the same 8 hours 50 min to farming ad thru the dailies on multiple chars you could earn

96,000 astral diamonds in the time the new system allows you to earn 32,000 at max rate which as we all know your not going to earn max rate on a 10 min dungeon run maybe on an hour long epic dungen run.

blureel

givearandomname said:

if you haven't done the math you can currently earn during events
dungeons 1 run 6000 ad = 10 min
skirmish 3 runs 6000 ad = 30 min
pvp 4 runs 1 win 8000 ad 1 hour
total 20,000 ad 1 hour 50 min

with the new model this is basic break down of the time needed to earn them
dungeons 6000 base 2 runs 20 min and 150 to 750 per run for total of 7200 ad = 10 min per run even at max reward = 1.6 hours
pvp 4000 2 matches 30 min and 200 to 300 per match for total of 4800 avg match 15 min = at max reward = 4 hours
skirmishes 3000 two matchs 30 min and 50 to 500 per run for total of 7200 average skirm 10 min= 2.4 hours
total 32,000 ad in 8 hours 50 min
that's an increase of 12,000 ad earned at 1363 per hour.

I don't understand how you reached your comparison values.

Yes, previously we could make 20k AD in about 2 hrs, and with the new system we can make 19.2k in about 9 hrs by your estimations. But where do you get 32k? You can't make more than 19.2k per day in the new system.

givearandomname

No the reward is not good enough for me

if you add up the base rewards every day
dungens 6k skirmish 3k and pvp 4k = 13000 then you add in the bonus you can earn if you keep running them
dungen 7200 skirmish 7200 pvp 4800 = 19200 so 19200+13000 = 32200 ad 8 hours and 50 min in a perfect world more like triple that.

as for the pvp win when I do pvp I do it for 1 hours and usualy end up with at least 1 win but not always as I said with my chart I am takeing the best possible outcomes

if want to look at worse possible out come just do the math with min reward example

lets say a 10 min run in tos only rewards the min which it proably will which is 150 diamonds for 10 min to get the full 7200 bonus you would have to run ToS 48 times a day which at 10 min per run that's 8 hours just for that one bonus

santralafax

No the reward is not good enough for me

Sounds like slave wages to me. If I wanted a job, ewll, I already have one of those.

blazious11

+Salvage

blureel

givearandomname said:

if you add up the base rewards every day
dungens 6k skirmish 3k and pvp 4k = 13000 then you add in the bonus you can earn if you keep running them
dungen 7200 skirmish 7200 pvp 4800 = 19200 so 19200+13000 = 32200 ad 8 hours and 50 min in a perfect world more like triple that.

as for the pvp win when I do pvp I do it for 1 hours and usualy end up with at least 1 win but not always as I said with my chart I am takeing the best possible outcomes

if want to look at worse possible out come just do the math with min reward example

lets say a 10 min run in tos only rewards the min which it proably will which is 150 diamonds for 10 min to get the full 7200 bonus you would have to run ToS 48 times a day which at 10 min per run that's 8 hours just for that one bonus

Interesting that you read the 7200 as bonus on top of the base amount. I read it as the daily cap for both the base and bonus combined.

givearandomname

No the reward is not good enough for me

blureel said:

givearandomname said:

if you add up the base rewards every day
dungens 6k skirmish 3k and pvp 4k = 13000 then you add in the bonus you can earn if you keep running them
dungen 7200 skirmish 7200 pvp 4800 = 19200 so 19200+13000 = 32200 ad 8 hours and 50 min in a perfect world more like triple that.

as for the pvp win when I do pvp I do it for 1 hours and usualy end up with at least 1 win but not always as I said with my chart I am takeing the best possible outcomes

if want to look at worse possible out come just do the math with min reward example

lets say a 10 min run in tos only rewards the min which it proably will which is 150 diamonds for 10 min to get the full 7200 bonus you would have to run ToS 48 times a day which at 10 min per run that's 8 hours just for that one bonus

Interesting that you read the 7200 as bonus on top of the base amount. I read it as the daily cap for both the base and bonus combined.

hmm now that I re look at the post

New: 1. Automatically get 3,000 AD for each of the first two dungeons. 2. In addition, get 150 to 750 AD for each dungeon played (up to a maximum 7,200 AD per day from dungeons). Amount varies by time.

I do notice that it says 7200 maximum so this change is even worse then I thought

darkstarcrash

blureel said:

Interesting that you read the 7200 as bonus on top of the base amount. I read it as the daily cap for both the base and bonus combined.

The 7200 is on top, as noted by goatshark in one of his follow-up posts:

The bonus AD earned from the first 2 runs of something (like a dungeon) do NOT count towards the other AD cap. So your first 2 dungeon runs will earn you 3000 AD each. On top of that, you'll be earning AD from a separate pool based on what you ran. This other pool is what has the daily cap of 7200 AD. For your 3rd+ runs, you'll only be earning from that separate pool.

I think he means the first two runs give you 3000 AD plus a variable bonus based on the dungeon run. So if you ran eCC 4 times, you would get 3750 + 3750 + 750 + 750 AD.
I guess you could run eCC up to 10 times and still get AD.

silverkelt

No the reward is not good enough for me

It sux wind if THEY keep curring costing, they need to drastically cut and reduce need for AD across the board for this to work..

otherwise.. screw 'em

lorddemonrage

darkstarcrash said:

blureel said:

Interesting that you read the 7200 as bonus on top of the base amount. I read it as the daily cap for both the base and bonus combined.

The 7200 is on top, as noted by goatshark in one of his follow-up posts:

The bonus AD earned from the first 2 runs of something (like a dungeon) do NOT count towards the other AD cap. So your first 2 dungeon runs will earn you 3000 AD each. On top of that, you'll be earning AD from a separate pool based on what you ran. This other pool is what has the daily cap of 7200 AD. For your 3rd+ runs, you'll only be earning from that separate pool.

I think he means the first two runs give you 3000 AD plus a variable bonus based on the dungeon run. So if you ran eCC 4 times, you would get 3750 + 3750 + 750 + 750 AD.
I guess you could run eCC up to 10 times and still get AD.


your math is considering you get the max reward for the 7200 cap, for dungeons its 750 for skirmishes its 500, min for dungeons is 150 and skirmishes is 50. so you may be looking at more than 10+ runs just to reach that 7200 cap. and i'm not sure if they clarified it or not, but is that 7200 cap shared with skirmishes or is that a separate cap? either way you are being forced to farm the 2, or even 3 if you feel like afking a pvp match or 2 for hours.

I think the real questions are:

• does this company think that these changes are worth losing players over?
  
• what do they project the overall player loss to be?
  
• can they recoup it in upcoming sales and attractions?
  
• was it considered that other games are releasing new content that, in conjunction with these changes here, will push players to finally stop playing this game?
  

I'm not in the video game business, i'm in the video game playing portion. I'm the paying customer that wants to be satisfied and entertained.

As of late the decisions made by this company are not only frustrating, but also project the image that this company not only does not care about its players, but does deceitful and morally questionable actions (VIP rewards and lockbox nerfs come to mind amongst others too long to mention here) that added, up makes me wonder just what exactly am i spending my time and money on.

My only suggestion to players, there are other games out there. they are putting out new content that in my opinion, and in light of these events on this game, has grabbed my interest.

To this company: your changes in the leadership, which has been the foundation of your games in game economy, has made me explore other games. Had it not been for this bombshell of an announcement i would have never bothered looking and may have kept playing here. i won't leave permanently, but will probably go inactive save just to say hi to friends that may still be playing (also to see if i can turn them to whatever new title i am on since i enjoy their company). But all of the purchases i would have made to your company will be made elsewhere until either that game makes the same mistake, or things drastically change here in both the game content and the way you treat your players.

givearandomname

No the reward is not good enough for me

i did the math and botters can still earn 9k an hour just botting skirmishes per account

santralafax

No the reward is not good enough for me

magenubbie said:

I hate it that they include PvP in the math. 90% of the game doesn't PvP or would touch it with 50ft tweezers due to the toxic environment, bug abuse and the lack of proper matchmaking. You better expect 90% CF sitters (both PvEers and bots) starting next week.

Oh and your math is wrong. 1h to get a win in PvP for the average player? I hope you're not serious. Make that 2 hours if at all. So half the AD gain, because no PvEer will PvP long enough every single day to get a win.

How do you get 8000AD from PVP? I was only aware of he 4000AD daily from Trade of Blades.

givearandomname

No the reward is not good enough for me

rixx offers daily to play 4 domination matches 4k ad and battlemaster in trade of blades offers one to win a match another 4k total 8k

but don't feel bad even the lead developer of the game did't know that

santralafax said:

magenubbie said:

I hate it that they include PvP in the math. 90% of the game doesn't PvP or would touch it with 50ft tweezers due to the toxic environment, bug abuse and the lack of proper matchmaking. You better expect 90% CF sitters (both PvEers and bots) starting next week.

Oh and your math is wrong. 1h to get a win in PvP for the average player? I hope you're not serious. Make that 2 hours if at all. So half the AD gain, because no PvEer will PvP long enough every single day to get a win.

How do you get 8000AD from PVP? I was only aware of he 4000AD daily from Trade of Blades.

soltasword

No the reward is not good enough for me

If you do the fastest dungeon Cragmire Crypts, most likely that will be one that gives out 150 rad per run meaning you have to run 47 runs to earn all your rad just from dungeons alone. That takes roughly about 15 minutes a run including Que up time ( if you que up fast every time ) which equals roughly 10 to 11 hours a day just running that dungeon. Epic dungeons will probably be the ones with better rad per dungeon but if you have to run a 30 to 45 minute dungeon 10 times, you are still looking at 5 hours to earn all that rad. Then add in skirmishes for another 3 to 10 hours a day depending on how much rad per run you get. All in all, it will take hours on end every day, just running dungeons and skirmishes to make upwards of 90 % less rad you could have made with leadership in a few minutes. Even with just a few leadership alts. When are you supposed to do anything else in the game ?

If you have an just 1 hour to play a day, and you do CC dungeon, you can run it 4 times, maybe 5 in that hour for a total of 6450 to maybe 7000 rad. Worst case, you can make 6300 ( 4 runs in CC for 150 a run ) rad a day in your hour just doing dungeon runs and nothing else because CC doesn't give out anything to sell or salvage, which means at the current rates, you will have to log in and run dungeons until our sun explodes in 3 billion years to make enough AD to get and level up your stuff when this goes into effect.

zekethesinner

Leadership change will be good only if:
2-3 t2 will be able to cover 24k refine restrict (salvage included)
5-6 skirms will do same
3 pvp victories on 70 same

Skirm, cta, dungs, pvp under 70 not included. Period.

So u want to do 3 dungs per day and some skirm, here u go ur 24k AD, do more, and u will be over cap anyway. Tomorrow do all this stuff on another alt, u can keep easly maxed on ad up to 3 toons in only 2h. If u can play more, here u go, u can have more toons maxed.

i dont think ppl will be pleased with 10h of gaming for 24k ad.
I dont know what r they thinking.

(Sin)cerely
Kain

santralafax

No the reward is not good enough for me

givearandomname said:

rixx offers daily to play 4 domination matches 4k ad and battlemaster in trade of blades offers one to win a match another 4k total 8k

but don't feel bad even the lead developer of the game did't know that

santralafax said:

magenubbie said:

I hate it that they include PvP in the math. 90% of the game doesn't PvP or would touch it with 50ft tweezers due to the toxic environment, bug abuse and the lack of proper matchmaking. You better expect 90% CF sitters (both PvEers and bots) starting next week.

Oh and your math is wrong. 1h to get a win in PvP for the average player? I hope you're not serious. Make that 2 hours if at all. So half the AD gain, because no PvEer will PvP long enough every single day to get a win.

How do you get 8000AD from PVP? I was only aware of he 4000AD daily from Trade of Blades.

Duh. I have been getting the 8000AD, my tumors must be acting up again. xD

santralafax

No the reward is not good enough for me

I think the dailies should stay as they are. And they should bring back Neverember's dailies. No need to muss stuff up further. There has been no discussion of bots currently doing the dailies, so they should be left alone and new dailies added.

They can also start adding smaller amounts of AD to the Campaign dailies and lairs. That is what I do the most, but hey, I work for free, eh?

Finally, I think it is unfriendly to suggest that players run T2s for the dungeon runs. These must be the same people who describe them as "too easy."

kitkathd

This is like judging a restaurant by their free bread. I'd much rather run one toon and make a ton of pure astral diamonds selling items I get. Salvaging is and always ill be what gets me any of the RAD and only because its sitting there waiting to be claimed. You guys are dwelling on table scraps. While you all are sitting on 20 standard ToS runs I will be running Elol salvaging any drops from mini's and selling any peridots/aquamarines. And salvaging the seals in the form of 300 seal peices. You guys dwell on the wrong thing.

Also would like to point out that Kessel is retardedly simple to do with the ArP fix a few patches ago. So you will probably see alot more people spamming those for a possible 6k salvage chance with him dropping a peice and the chest having an alliance peice.

kitkathd

santralafax said:

I think the dailies should stay as they are. And they should bring back Neverember's dailies. No need to muss stuff up further. There has been no discussion of bots currently doing the dailies, so they should be left alone and new dailies added.

They can also start adding smaller amounts of AD to the Campaign dailies and lairs. That is what I do the most, but hey, I work for free, eh?

Finally, I think it is unfriendly to suggest that players run T2s for the dungeon runs. These must be the same people who describe them as "too easy."

You do not do T2's for profit, you do them for the daily bag and for gearing up your toon only. T1's drop more money.

ashnvf

No the reward is not good enough for me

This is chicken feed. GMOPs cost 100k and most folks are likely limited by the 24K daily limit. None of this is interesting or worth the time.

givearandomname

No the reward is not good enough for me

had a thought being ad is going to be a time based currency that has a real cash value that can easly be measured thru the zax.

wouldn't it be realy funny if somebody with to much money and to much time filed a law suit against pwe for violation of the minimum wage laws. because in a way there forcing us to work harder for the ad but the hourly reward isn't even equal to what you would get for minimum wage there forcing players to grind slave wages lol.

strous1

No the reward is not good enough for me

I will just delete my toons, delete game from computer. and go back to p&p d&d. Which is a hole lot more fun then this poor excuse to be called d&d in any form.

cjh1983

No the reward is not good enough for me

Do you need ad to progress in pnp?

emeritus73

Has therebeen a single approval (reward v time is good) posting from anyone?

And still the devs think this is a good idea???

cbrowne0329

No the reward is not good enough for me

The changes would have been okay if it was implemented like this from the beginning. However, to introduce this now puts any character leveling equipment at a serious disadvantage. The AD costs are too high to get anything done.

I have 11 Characters (that I play, not a leadership army, albeit I play some more than others), all with an item level of 2.4K or higher. Maxing out at 24K a day, (typically 18K a day), gave me the ability to save up for one or two Greater Mark of Potency a day.

Without the ability to do this now, (as I work a full time job), I will only make the max with one character, cutting time to do anything to level my characters equipment up to 10 times. Any enchant itme leveling I do now takes 10 times longer, and I have 11 characters to gear.

Some people may say I play too many characters, but they at one point not only encouraged, but required you to have more than one toon... think access to Ice Wind Dale.

So now for new people to get to the IL of what us long time players already have, is going to take 3 days for one toon to get enough to buy one GMoP. Artifiacts and Enchants cost at least very least 13 GMoPs to make, or 1.3mil AD, or 35 to 39 days to JUST get the GMoPs!

Like I said, this would not have been problem if it was like this from the beginning. Now you have a bigger gap in the haves and have-nots. Prices or requirements to level enchants and artifacts in this case should be lowered... drastically.

winters323

Yes the reward vs time is good for me

So you math is a little funky, because the bonus during the hourly events you can only earn during those hours. So if you wanted the bonus for all 4 dailies, that would be a minimum of 3 hours, + whatever quickest daily you can get. Essentially 4 hours. You also have to make sure you are online during those times. For people who play all day, that isn't a problem. For people who only have a couple hours a day, they aren't going to make that.

This is my favorite change coming out of the update. The fact that you can earn the bonus AD from the hourlies, by just doing the missions twice.

I do think the changes are for the better. But it would be nice if there was some AD earned for solo play from the campaign.

givearandomname

No the reward is not good enough for me

winters323 said:

So you math is a little funky, because the bonus during the hourly events you can only earn during those hours. So if you wanted the bonus for all 4 dailies, that would be a minimum of 3 hours, + whatever quickest daily you can get. Essentially 4 hours. You also have to make sure you are online during those times. For people who play all day, that isn't a problem. For people who only have a couple hours a day, they aren't going to make that.

This is my favorite change coming out of the update. The fact that you can earn the bonus AD from the hourlies, by just doing the missions twice.

I do think the changes are for the better. But it would be nice if there was some AD earned for solo play from the campaign.

yes you have to be on during the hourly but there set at certain times and very easy to make and the times to complete are the same you just have to be on at right time.

I agree the ablity to do them when ever is a great thing but loseing so much of the reward in trade for a grind from hell yet another one. think Its so great get on privew and see for yourself just how much time it takes to get the cap doing just the new dailies