What is a good ArmPen for PVP in Mod 7?

santralafax

I'm just over the 60 mark that is cap for PVE and often find I can't get the hit through. What do y'all recommend for a ArmPen?

icyphish

60% for pve

santralafax

But what is a good amt of ArmPen for PVP? I have over 60 now.

Unknown

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santralafax

defiantone99 said:

At least 100 percent.

Somehow, I'm not surprised. I recnetly levellled up a GWF and he doesn't have the defense my GF had, so I've got to get the strikes through.

Thanks!

lonewolfmk1

Id say as much as possible, since only at around 60% you will start to see any results against a decently geared player.

cesuke

I am very interested in this... Now i hav 110% in PVP but still hitting very low in some players... U can tell me why ?

urlord283

When I look for arm Pen I only see a number...

There in not a percentage I can find

Where do you find the percentage?

Urlord

cesuke

U may find it going down, in offensive and defensive stats... Remember in PVP companions dont work.

santralafax

urlord283 said:

When I look for arm Pen I only see a number...

There in not a percentage I can find

Where do you find the percentage?

Urlord

It's called "Resistance Ignored" and the percentage is derived somehow from the number you already found.

rayrdan

Around 80 percent. Than stack power

santralafax

rayrdan said:

Around 80 percent. Than stack power

That's something I don't get: why Power and not Crit? I've got a T Vorpal I want to make the most of....

rayrdan

it pretty much depends by your roll and equip. Without a perfec vorpal power is always better than crit, with a perfect vorpal there is bit of math to do. Try searching for ralexinor s last posts in pvp discussion.

urlord283

so when I look at "Resistance Ignored" I see -33.4

Is that bad?

santralafax

That's kinda low. It's supposed to be a negative number. For PVE Mobs can have up to 40 or 50 "resistance"/armor and you want your RI to beat that so that you do maximum damage. Bosses, as I understand it, have 60 resistance, which is why folks say you want up to -60 for PVE.

kweassa

urlord283 said:

so when I look at "Resistance Ignored" I see -33.4

Is that bad?

Doesn't matter if your Armpen is 10% or 1,000%. If you can kill people with it, then you're fine.

There is always a certain "baseline" of numbers for PvP, but like said, it's a "baseline", not a given absolute. In the end, it always comes down to how your playing style, experience, technique, intuition, general tactics, and etc. etc.. all combine itself with those numbers to bring out actual results.

If you feel your results are fine, then you don't need to bother yourself with it. If you think your results can improve in certain areas, then just start tweaking and experimenting yourself little by little until you are content.

Don't be too caught up with bringing your character up to some arbitrary amounts of numbers people come up with. In the end, it's about how you feel with it.

icyphish

I completely agree with Kweassa's comments, its better to build your char based on your play style rather than building stats that might not synergise with your play style.

santralafax

Sorry if I came across poorly, I was just giving my understanding of ArmPen.

santralafax

cesuke said:

I am very interested in this... Now i hav 110% in PVP but still hitting very low in some players... U can tell me why ?

You said with some people. Maybe they have a crazy resistance setup: high defense + negation + shield on tab + ?. What kind of opponents are they?

cesuke

Even Rogues and Mages... but as u say with negation...

santralafax

cesuke said:

Even Rogues and Mages... but as u say with negation...

I'm trying to figure it out as well--a lot of my hits do no damage. I'm going to work toward an 80-100 percent ArPen. But you are sayig with a 110 you are having the same problem! I have mine up to 69 now, and it is getting better. Still many I can't touch, but better.

As for Crit and Power, I"m going to push crit becuase I have a T Vorpal, but I guess Power is better in general.

Everything I know about ArPen came from a forum article by Lazaroth666 "Regarding to the ArPen needed in the campaign maps" he posted on July 8. I dont know how to post links within the forum. Maybe if I was on a proper web browser I could--but it is searchable.

As for play style, I like to hack things up as a GWF, after puncturing them with Hidden daggers a time or two. That's why I'm thinking ArPen is the thing I need....

jonkoca

I've heard a rumour that arpen will get hardcapped at 80%, so, get up to that I guess, then stack power while adopting a wait and see perspective, that's what I'm doing anyway. 75% and rising with the SH boon.

cesuke

Man arpen cant be hardcapped to 80 since PVP armor gives - Arpen the burning giv 60 and Lions mane more than that

jonkoca

Hope you're right. Hrs have enough arpen to go over without stacking any darks at all.

pando83

Remember a guy i talked to time ago, a Paladin, explaining me why the class is so broken in PvP, and he was saying that basically even if DR is capped at 80%, the way Paladin powers work create multiple layers of DR, basically bringing it well above 80%.

The way i understood it, basically they can cap DR to 80%, then add another layer of DR to that resulting amount of damage, then another. Which means your damage gets reduced by 80%, then that amount is reduced again by another %, then again. Don't remember the numbers but overall it was pretty close to 100% DR.

I also remember reading that basically you needed to get past a certain point with ArP to damage the Paladin as a "regular DPS" (SW necro damage seems to be quite effective on paladins, along with TR piercing damage). Until you get past that "point", you deal no damage. Once you can get through, you deal a lot of damage.

I remember a fight between a GWF and a Paladin, both geared. GWF could 1v1 take down the Pally HPs to about 20% or so. Paladin would heal back so 1v1 the GWF had to give up. But still, he could damage heavily one of those "invulnerable paladins".
I inspected him and he got 8k+ ArP stat. Plus constitution and boon, i'm pretty sure he might be close to 100% DRI.

They plan on capping ArP but without fixing that mechanic, if i got how it works, you basically force players to call for a TR or SW to take down the paladin cause regular melee players would deal 0 damage, no matter the numbers.
Or may be some permalock train like a team of trappers and CWs.

kweassa

pando83 said:

Remember a guy i talked to time ago ...

He was probably referring to "defense layers", which is a game system term Cryptic usually uses to explain how defense mechanisms work. It was the same in Champions Onine as well.

For example, the simplest form of defense layers are usually portrayed as [some type of shield] + [defense mechanic].

In this case, when an attack is received, there is a certain sequence as to which defense mechanic works first, and therefore the incoming attack goes through the most 'outer' defense layer first, and then has to go through the next layer, and then the next, and so forth.

It's actually not too different on other classes. Most defenses usually do work this way. He was probably saying the Paly just has more of those layers than others.

santralafax

pando83 said:

I remember a fight between a GWF and a Paladin, both geared. GWF could 1v1 take down the Pally HPs to about 20% or so. Paladin would heal back so 1v1 the GWF had to give up. But still, he could damage heavily one of those "invulnerable paladins".

I have been there==when you finally get some damage on the Pally he starts growing a yellow bar. It's infuriating. I haven't been there as much on my new GWF, but I've seen it plenty on my old main, a GF.

I realize Pally's are here to stay, but I still don't recognize them as a regular class. They are another Mod6 travesty.