Ok, since we need a way to condense our information on what's wrong with PvP into one spot. Was hoping to get the PvP community as a whole. Working together on listing stuff. Now we need to have valid discussion and reason for listing it. Then hopefully Arc will see this and start to work on it.
We need to get rid of these Cry's to
NERF Class A or B cause it's OP with not much substance. We need way's to make things better for all classes as a whole. If things get balanced out Right instead of huge nerf's or buff's to classes to throw things way out of balance one way or another. Only thing we'll have to worry about down the road is new additions to the game making it easier for Arc to fix as a whole.
Problems With PvP
- Shadow of Demise & Plaguefire working in unintended ways to to cause 100% Piercing Damage.
- HR's Root's work even when dodged.
- Constant Daze/Stun Chains that make a target useless for to long of periods.
Problems That Need Insight (Looking for input on What we Can do)
- Overal Class Power of TR.
- SW needs help to make it more Viable in PvP
Ways to Improve PvP
- Better Matchmaking - A way to setup matches so they are more even from the start based on GS/Leaderboards/Class/Tenacity ect.
- Kills awarded to person who does most damage to target not last hit. Gets rid of kill steals. Will make people care less about the kill and more about helping the team.
- Match points for healing based on a certain amount. Some match's a single cleric could be the saving grace for your team. Make it worth while to keep your team alive.
- More rewards for PvP, make the people that don't normally PvP feel like its worth their time to do it and put an effort in other than a Daily Challenge that makes them enter get it done then leave not caring about how they do. (Thought PvP was sort of an Endgame for people)
- Class Limit for Premades - No more teams of 4 or 5 same class. In Domination Max of 2 (5v5) I could see Max of 3 in (10v10) Make it reasonable based on the game type. (Running too many of one class just means your taking advantage of Broken mechanics)
Comments
Pyx - LvL 60 PvP AC DC Retired
XB1 GT - suDnd3th
Clearly the same people keep rising to the top, but I would agree with you as far as the skill is more related to building your character and having a lot of time/money on your hands to maximize your gear. Also, the ability to network and get a good guild or team going. Not everyone can do those things so perhaps those things are the "skill".
-ASYLUM-
< Goon Squad >
< Goon Squad >
Where is the formula that determines your leaderboard position?
-ASYLUM-
Where is the formula that determines your leaderboard position?[/quote]
I am not sure but I have figured out what helps your rank and what doesnt.
If your in the top 3ish pages and win a game by a landslide you'll go down a spot or so. Your not doing yourself any favors by throwing another game on your stats with only 2 kills and 2 caps. I'm not sure if it affects the players who aren't in the top pages but that's what I've figured out with my own experiences.
Which also helps explain why dc and GF get shafted on the standings... Their role isn't to kill so even those players with a crazy win - lose record are beyond page 10.
Then again this is just what I've experienced, if I'm completely wrong please feel free to enlightened us!
< Goon Squad >
I can't enlighten you because I haven't figured it out myself either. I just wasn't sure if you had found some information that no one else had.
I suspected it was almost completely related to the combined ELO rating of the enemy team vs. your team and whether you win or lose, rather than some sort of complicated formula involving kills, captures, points etc. Maybe not though.
TR's most likely feel like it's WAI.
-ASYLUM-
< Goon Squad >
As for no skill, I cant honestly believe that.
@1. So if no cooldowns on encounters, you can say button smashing takes skill? I honestly think you have to learn how to manage your encounters and learn how to play without each one you use so you know how to use them and when to use them.
@2. I agree there either should be a way that all classes get some form of CC immunity other than oghmas or a timer between Multiple CC effects so you can't just CC lock someone. Honestly If you say there is 2-3s immunity between Daze's would be the biggest help. Its enough so that you can still somewhat CC lock but it allows you to escape the next CC also. Would make team fights a lot more interesting if you have to actually control each member of the team vs CC lock and burst one of them down. I'm more thinking about a long the lines where each CC type has its only category and can't be used back to back on the same person. Roots/Freeze, Daze/Stun/Prones, Knockbacks.
@3. Yes there is a lot of it and it needs to be worked on. But you have to remember this is a tvt pvp setup. A well coordinated group of ppl will always beat 5 players playing individually as a group.
But as for TR being way OP (They are OP but you can beat them with a little more finesse), I can't honestly say they are, I've won against teams of 4 TR's and one CW or Cleric and they weren't badly geared. I know they had 1 Scound, 1 Sab, and if i remember correctly 2 Exec running PF which really annoys me as a TR. I ran it to start with but then got rid of mine when i was running a Exec build. Its cheap and a bug that shouldn't be used. Really turns things into easy mode and takes the fun out of it for everyone. I just can't Remember if i was running my Perma WK build on my TR at the time or if I was on my DC. Either or we would have been running 1 MI Perma TR, 1 SW, 1 DC, 1 HR, and me on my TR WK Perma or DC
Pyx - LvL 60 PvP AC DC Retired
XB1 GT - suDnd3th
Pyx - LvL 60 PvP AC DC Retired
XB1 GT - suDnd3th
Working as Intended
-ASYLUM-
Honestly I've found one game that was never gear dependant in my life. That was The Chronicles of Spellborn. Gear was only for looks. No stats on weapons or armor. It was fps style targeting in 3rd person with no lock on of skills at all so if u didn't anticipate where your target was going to be then you would miss. I wish it hadn't crashed within the first few months of it being out but they failed on marketing it properly and it was buggy. The company ended up going bankrupt
Pyx - LvL 60 PvP AC DC Retired
XB1 GT - suDnd3th
And that was Ultima Online (especially before Trammel introduction)
- Remove stacking stun effects. Put in an immunity timer, make the stun duration 1/2 for every stun "improperly" poured on top of an existing stun. Assist trains on one target now take some skill.
- More maps and game mode variety.
- MATCHMAKING. Look at GS, Specs, Classes, Time Played, Glory earned, Tenacity, etc. I'm sure the devs would know best here, but come up with a formula to help weight teams. A solo and a team queue may also help.
- Duels - why not?
- Personally I think TR's need to be rethought. I love stealthers that can sneak in, execute, and are vulnerable on the way out. That's a ton of fun. A real counter to stealth (maybe a Hunter daily to see stealth or passive is see them in xfeet).
- SWs and GWF do need some love. SW's are glass cannons and I think a lot of the issues is just that class is going to take deaths, but they have almost no utility (with most specs). Personally I'd look into making temptation more viable for PvP as a support role. GWF need single target damage (that's coming).
- Kill awards based on damage done, not last hit.
- More flexible stat awards for healing/clerics. (Show heals in stats)
- More rewards for PvP. Random gold, random chance at some rough AD, etc.
- Fix the leaderboards or something.... I dunno, Leaderboard just spawn elitist behavior.
The most balanced pvp I played is GW2. NW has an awesome combat system, but sadly they take so long to balance classes on pvp that people simply get dismotivated. The p2w gap between non p2w and p2w players is huge also. Maybe learn with skyforge?
DENIAL
DENIAL
I forgot about UO, yeah i really don't relate to that since I've never played it, was a little before the time I got into MMO's,
Added some to the list I have going. Hoping the Dev's/Mod's really see this stuff.
I hear you, Yeah stacking stuns really breaks pvp. IMO A lot of the classes really need to be reworked in general to bring balance to the game.
My views of classes and how they should be and work vs someone elses probably aren't the same.
TR- High Burst damage, easy to kill if caught (squishy), and sneaky.
CW- A more tanky mage with low damage that controls the fight with buffs and debuffs, stuns, binds, and dot's
DC- Mid tanky mage that heals and keeps teamates alive with cures and buffs.
GWF- Frontline sub tank decently tanky with fair amount of burst damage.
GF- Tank moderate damage and protects team members.
SW- Squishy High burst damage mage.
HR- squishy Mid to High damage ranged dps used to protect the mages
They all have their strengths and weaknesses. And they all have their roles to fill in a group and can strengthen a group in different ways.
Pyx - LvL 60 PvP AC DC Retired
XB1 GT - suDnd3th
I've spent quite a bit of time in the PvP arena (solo queue only), and I can say the experience can vary greatly from intensely fun and competitive matches to utterly frustrating complete annihilation. The difference? Matchmaking. Fix the matchmaking system, please.
Specifically, I don't feel premade teams have any business fighting PUG's. That will never be a fair match. I've run into some of the folks from the bigger PvP guilds and spoken with them after one of those 1000-27 score matches. Guess what? They don't like being seen as the bullies; they are just looking to play together against other teams of equivalent skill. Fix it so if a team wants to 5 queue, they can only play against another 5 queue. I understand that would take more time to find a match, but I honestly don't think letting premade teams queue up against 5 random players is any fun for anyone involved. If teams want to consistently play in a premade format, consider a schedule where teams can compete against each other.
Also, consider giving the "leaver penalty" to anyone camping by the fire for a prolonged period (giving up). All too often a game will start out great, but then you have that one person on your team that really doesn't care and doesn't like to die, so they give up and camp the fire for the next 10 minutes so they can collect that precious 4,000 rough AD they must be after. Give them an incentive to continue fighting until the end.
When a PvP match is reasonably balanced it is one of the most exciting experiences this game has to offer. I believe that tweaking the matchmaking system, along with deterring folks from camping the fire during a match, would go a long way towards improving the experience for everyone involved.
Once and awhile if there are actually no 5 man premades running at the time then you'll get to play against a full pug or mostly pug team which just doesn't provide fun for anyone.
Reason I made this post was to hopefully get people working together and get an actual list going for dev's to see what we actually want and what would actually help improve the experience in general, I know we don't have a lot of options for maps right now and pvp content which will be coming shortly come all we are getting. It should help PvP quite a bit and get rid of the monotonous play for a little but they needs to be a lot more added down the road to keep things interesting. Maps would be nice to start with the areas we have.
Pyx - LvL 60 PvP AC DC Retired
XB1 GT - suDnd3th
< Goon Squad >
Pyx - LvL 60 PvP AC DC Retired
XB1 GT - suDnd3th