Nighthawk...don't bother

ccarmichael07 · August 2012

Don't bother doing Nighthawk mission unless you are Level 40, and have a team of Level 40's ready to assist.

I've done the end part 2 times thus far with the following teams:

Team 1

Level 12
Level 16
Level 25
Level 33
Level 40

Team 2

Level 16
Level 25
Level 40
Level 40
Level 40

Both teams, never succeeded in getting the final target below 60% HP. Even the team with 3 40's could barely make a dent.

Additionally, expect lots of deaths, therefore, lots of star refills, therefore lots of cost.

My advice...if you aren't Level 40, don't even waste your time on collecting evidence or any of the other parts of the mission. You will never get past the final part, therefore it's a major waste of time.

Cryptic, why bring out an event, where people that aren't max level, can't succeed? Why couldn't the last mission been a solo which scales to your level?

:mad:

lotar295 · August 2012

Well,after 3 groups I beat stone,what was our reward,a crappy grab bag and not jets,I did the entire thing for jets,that's the major reason to do this mission chain,but a stupid grab bag?

really?

ccarmichael07 · August 2012

lotar295 wrote: »

Well,after 3 groups I beat stone,what was our reward,a crappy grab bag and not jets,I did the entire thing for jets,that's the major reason to do this mission chain,but a stupid grab bag?

really?

All I wanted was the XP out of it. Figured being a special event, the XP might be good.

Can't even get it, and I wasted time collecting evidence, which did nothing but slow down my leveling, since you don't get anything until the end.

quasimojo1 · August 2012

I see whiny posts like this after every new alert/mission, particularly Gravitar, Warlord, and now this. Someone fails 2 or 3 times and decides the challenge is too hard. In every case, there is a strategy which makes the difficulty much more manageable.

I think the challenge level on the mission is fine, if anything it is on the easy side once you know how. I failed to kill Stone the first two times, then realized you have to take out the healing devices.

ccarmichael07 · August 2012

quasimojo1 wrote: »

I see whiny posts like this after every new alert/mission, particularly Gravitar, Warlord, and now this. Someone fails 2 or 3 times and decides the challenge is too hard. In every case, there is a strategy which makes the difficulty much more manageable.

I think the challenge level on the mission is fine, if anything it is on the easy side once you know how. I failed to kill Stone the first two times, then realized you have to take out the healing devices.

What healing devices? Seems there is only Laser drones which annhilate you in 3 seconds.

I spent more time dead than I did alive.

And, to top it off, you don't "Level Up" to match the fight, like you do in an Alert. Instead of fighting at Level 30 like you would in an Alert, you fight at your own Level, which means if you aren't Level 30, you barely make a dent, and you die instantly if attacked.

jonsills · August 2012

I ran it once. My toon was a lvl 27 Master - don't know about the others. We won handily. I got XP, Resources, and Nighthawk's Integrated Chest. It beats getting Salvage and having to save up to buy a costume piece.

flyingfinn · August 2012

At end you get some XP and few Recources. Defender gives you 1795 Recources and a Chance Belt. I was lvl 40. 1795! That's 17 Nationals and 95 Locals.....I think i'll try robbing banks next.
Maybe i'll by a Jet after..umm 2 months.

bluhman · August 2012

You do know about the Engineers, right?

jonsills · August 2012

bluhman wrote: »

You do know about the Engineers, right?

The last surviving clade of the Forerunners, forcibly integrated into the body of the Covenant by attaching bombs to their exoskeletons and threatening to detonate them unless they obeyed? Yeah, I know about them. What's that have to do with CO?

ferrolho · August 2012

So far i have liked it it's fun. My only gripe with it and it seems to be is that it doesn't work like an alert but rather like an event where mobs are all lvl 40 and lower level players aren't scaled up to compensate, therefore creating huge gaps between players that and the Roflstomping lasers that hit you before appearing.

bluhman · August 2012

jonsills wrote: »

The last surviving clade of the Forerunners, forcibly integrated into the body of the Covenant by attaching bombs to their exoskeletons and threatening to detonate them unless they obeyed? Yeah, I know about them. What's that have to do with CO?

They'll solve his practical problems. and also stop the boss from regenerating constantly. Get one person after the engineers when he retreats and you can easily kill him in the time limit.

Also, run away a lot. You can regenerate, he can't (without repairmen).

itsbrou · August 2012

Nevermind the player levels.

Try doing it with action controls. It's all frustration.

This worries me about future vehicle content. If they plan to bully me into using the mmo control scheme in this game, they will be met with a different result.

xgco · August 2012

Hey there,

It took me a little while to figure out what was happening too, so dont feel bad OP. Alright so during the fight against the jet try to avoid the lasers when they are firing at you and definitely block. If you are the Heavy Jet, you can use the shield and plug away with power 6 which is missles or if you have full energy use a power 7 which is a powerful laser blast.

When he says he is retreating for support. Fly as fast as you can toward the Yellow light and make sure to kill the Engineer that is on the building, he is the one who will heal the Big jet.

Other than that it is just a simple, yet annoying fight. Using vehicles takes a bit to get used to and always remembering to recharge your ammo (energy) is important.

I did it twice and once I got a healing item and the second time I got 2 Drifter Salvage from the grab bag. I've seen people with jets so just keep trying.

Your friendly Bubble blowing dragon...

zedulon · August 2012

The jets portion of the mission doesn't sidekick. It is doable with a team of 40's - I finished with 20, 40, 40, 40, 40. But the 40's are hitting a L30 boss. As the L20 of that group, I couldn't damage the boss in any meaningful way.

I expect the lack of sidekicking is a bug.

The fact that the mission seems to be balanced to a team of 5 L40 characters is a separate issue, and probably due to L40 toons doing all the testing on the PTS.

sockmunkey · August 2012

ccarmichael07 wrote: »

And, to top it off, you don't "Level Up" to match the fight, like you do in an Alert. Instead of fighting at Level 30 like you would in an Alert, you fight at your own Level, which means if you aren't Level 30, you barely make a dent, and you die instantly if attacked.

Its not an alert, it was never advertised as an alert, it doesn't even show up in the alert window. So, why exactly are you setting your expectations for it to behave as an alert?

Its a Queued mission. That is all. Be proactive. Instead of just jumping into the Q and praying. Start a group from the folks milling outside the mission. Form up as a real group and use the Side kick feature. Suddenly the level problem can be made moot.

I know, real team work...actually might require work, but it really does pay off.

gerberatetra · August 2012

The lead up and middle of the mission is okay.

The end is annoying.

The vehicles are frustrating, you can't use their powers like you can your characters, the end is annoying because hitting the critters who heal the boos is just easier out of the vehicle than in it.

But you know what really angered me about the mission?

I got a grab bag...

With the Co equivalent of a rock in it.

LvL 5, 1 charge +3496 health [The toon doing the mission was 40 btw]

And laughably it lists a 1 min 18 second recharge time

championshewolf · August 2012

So, this is a post that blames Cryptic for people not working as a team.... Oook.

mersenneprime · August 2012

ccarmichael07 wrote: »

What healing devices?

You notice the green glow around his jet when he gets to the building? that's him being healed.

You need to take out the engineer on the rooftop and then you'll see his health drops when he's not getting healing.

crashdragon · August 2012

Just tried it with all lvl 40's. We knew what to do. But.............

Epic fail, Dev's, epic fail.

We couldn't get him below 80%. We all quit after 10 minutes.
Recharge time for weapons leaves you open to attack.
The fighters handle like a shopping trolly with a wonky wheel. ( so not buying one )
Too many attackers at one time makes it impossible to target Franklin.

Honest opinion : Lame, unthought out, shoddy, feels rushed, frustrating, needs serious work or a major overhaul.

If this is the future of PWE's new content, then it's a joke beyond all jokes.

ccarmichael07 · August 2012

Thanks for all the advice guys, but I gave up the frustration.

This mission just wasn't my cup of tea I guess. And while I would have prefered a solo end to the mission, rather than this particular end, I dont blame Cryptic.

Anyways, back to the grind. :cool:

man515drake · August 2012

I have no problem with the difficulty as I have had successful runs with a level 20 and a Level 35. I find using the medi vac jet and healing my team to be a good strategy.

The thing that gets me is after all the hype we get 3 missions that consist of 3 rooms coupled with running around either killing random mobs or clicking a key at random locations. This leads to a quick scrap followed by a jet dog fight that feels well to be honest a half done idea (you've done it again Cryptic).

Why did they not take they're time and release something as long as a comic series spanning weeks. That would have given them time to finish working on vehicles.

As for rewards I now have ten drifter salvage on 2 toons and a few globals and some exp. This is not great and makes repeating the mission a chore I won't be doing just so I can possibly get a jet that is rushed and feels poorly designed.

I just wish for once Cryptic would do something that lives up to the Hype.

therealtal · August 2012

When I saw the last leg of the mission was forced grouping only I was a bit disappointed.
I almost gave up at that point but gave it a try anyway. We didn't even get to the jet part
because the elevator bugged out. So much for that.
I don't think I will try to finish this.
Besides, these jets are just prototypes of the eventual vehicle system, so I'll not be too sad if I miss out.

cybersoldier1981 · August 2012

Best advice is to get a few friends, make a team, and try it with a balanced batch.

I had hell with it, too.

blueionstormz · September 2012

Just sharing some of my experience. The new Nighthawk event has a nice feel for me. There was a sense of suspense and urgency leading up to the final confrontation. The Nighthawk? alerts which came before set it up pretty well. In the end, it felt like I played a major part in clearing Nighthawk's name.

I tried this mission with all three of my toons.
1st toon - First try was a fail. Second try was a success.
2nd toon - Succeeded on first try. Strangely enough, was unexpectedly the top scorer.
3rd toon - Failed lots of times till I finally teamed up with a friend.

Key to all the victories was the group working together with at least one jet focused on taking out the healers. For example, I would go ahead to the next site in advance just to ensure the healer isn't there to heal the enemy.

That left the others to focus on hitting the enemy plane. When the enemy plane is at the site, one jet with machine gun isn't fast enough to take out the healer, at least two with machine guns are needed either that or one jet using its AoE attack on the healer will do the trick.

Also if you don't get to the next site fast enough, the enemy plane could hover over the building, making it next to impossible to target the Engineer by using the mouse, seeing as there's so many people there that by the time I cycle through the enemies using the tab button, the enemies would have already destroyed my jet. Having a friend there to heal you also helps a lot.

All in all, this was quite fun for me, more so when teamed with friends.

crypticbuxom · September 2012

Vehicles is a new way to play the game. You all remember playing this game for the first time, right? You weren't so good at it.

This is just a new thing we have to learn to use.

The same goes for the Night Warrior. Have to approach the game a bit differently to be good at it.

monaahiru · September 2012

This was the first event I felt "Wow doing UNITY daily is much fun!"

Best thing I got from grab bag was 3 Drifter's Salvage.

BTW those costume drop seems same as 475 Zen one.

battybattybats · September 2012

Here's the problem:

Designers goal failure: this even introduces new gameplay mechanics i.e. vehicles, it needs to function as a tutorial for those mechanics, it needs to teach each new measure of gameplay to totaly unfamiliar players one at a time, it needs to help the player gradually become accustomed to new handling, new powers, new mechanics, it needs to be scaled to the weakest of players with the easiest of learning curves.

It fails on every level.

part 1 of the fight should have been learning to manouver. The loss of the ability to go up or down when locked on was very frustrating to figure out when above the enemy locked on and yet out of range.

part 2 should have taught us how to use each weapon power

This should have been a mission that would be hard for new players just out of the tutorial to fail because it's exactly where new players are going to rush to!

How to fix: reduce enemy healling, reduce enemy damage especially laser drones, add quick instructions on what to do such as seeking engineers. Have Nighthawk tell the players to split between the three types and the role each jet type plays, engineer hunting, heavy damage to the boss etc. Explain how they need to cooperate to succeed.

NEVER listen to people complaining about wanting more challenge on things that are bright and shiny like events dangling before new players. Sure give those who need and want tougher fights challenges like Gravitar and higher difficulty levels, thats good. But for things like this test them on total newbies! Designers, grab a casual gamer off the street and get them to test it and if they don't succeed on their third try then it's too tough for something you are trying to attract new players with.

Otherwise eople will get through the tutorial, try the whole nighthawk thing as it looks like fun, get to the final fight and stumble about awkwardly and quit and find a game with a learning curve without a right angle in it.

P.S. until the last fight this event was AWESOME. Crime scenes were a total delight, the cinematic right before the last fight was really awesome and full of character. The last fight after try 3 has my brother talking about considering canceling his subscription. We had both been going on about how awesome it was right up until that moment where everything got totally ruined by a HUGE miscalculation in how to introduce all the new mechanics resulting in people jammed into buildings, struggling to target, fuming at not being able to ascend or descend etc. Where a bit more of a curve in learning these new manouverings and powers and less difficulty would have kept the experience fun and amazing.

Fix it quick, and learn from the mistake.

klitty · September 2012

I loved the mission, the teamworking to take the engis out before they heal the boss and using freaking jets.

I hate doing all that hard mission and getting a pair of dirty BOLAS >:E

chalupaoffury · September 2012

100% disagreed about making this fight easier. I ran it on my level 20 squishy, without the jet, and still our group won handily. I've done it a few times, and have yet to fail. No, gate it to like level 18-20 so people *have to* be a bit experienced in the game. Less qq, more pew pew, etc... I hate how every time anything in this game is *actually* challenging everyone calls for a nerf and to scale it to the lowest possible skill level.

No offense, but this is an mmo. If you want to play dress up and not get a challenge, go play Second Life. When it comes to special events, it *should* be hard. Otherwise this is just free farming, and yeah... I can't be the only one that grew up in a generation where trophies for participation didn't exist.

That said, you don't just pick some kid up off of a junior varsity football team and drop him straight into an NFL match. I've said this before and I'll say it again: GET THE ELITE MOBS OUT OF THE LEVEL 15 AND BELOW AREAS. Ffs, new players come in and see the pack. Then, attack the pack and get *destroyed*. I actually get a huge kick out of watching it, until I realize that this might have been their first go at the game, and that might have been the breaking point to drive em away.

Who the **** thought putting elite mobs where the level 6-8 characters quest was a good idea? You should fire them.

jonsills · September 2012

Chalupa, I am experienced. I've been playing CO for about a year and a half or so (not sure of the exact join date - I might be closing in on two years). And I've managed to succeed on this mission once, with Spider-Bat. I ran the last segment with HandyMan, who is lvl 28 (leveled up from 27 during the first section) for over two hours last night, until I finally succumbed to exhaustion and went to bed - never managed to bring Stone down. Now, if the reward were definitely a Prototype Jet, that might be worth such an effort; but since what you get is a Grab Bag, with a chance at a Jet, a chance at a costume piece, and (from what we've been hearing) a much higher chance of getting more Drifter Salvage, the effort required is ludicrously out of balance with the potential reward.

Knock down the level of the Engineers, so it's more possible to succeed without a team that works like a well-oiled machine (since it's a PUG, the odds that everyone will know their role is minimal), or Sidekick like the Alerts, and we might be onto something. But as it stands, unless you like fighting your head off, and dying repeatedly, in exchange for what amounts to trash the majority of the time, this mission is just going to leave a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths.

jellycupsowbug · September 2012

It's easier if you don't use the jets. It's just plain easy if you can fly and have Invulnerability. The lasers and various guns become nearly harmless.

wingedkagouti · September 2012

The only thing I really dislike about the mission is that you don't get to familiarize yourself with the powers of the jet you picked before the timer starts.

chalupaoffury · September 2012

jonsills wrote: »

Chalupa, I am experienced. I've been playing CO for about a year and a half or so (not sure of the exact join date - I might be closing in on two years). And I've managed to succeed on this mission once, with Spider-Bat. I ran the last segment with HandyMan, who is lvl 28 (leveled up from 27 during the first section) for over two hours last night, until I finally succumbed to exhaustion and went to bed - never managed to bring Stone down. Now, if the reward were definitely a Prototype Jet, that might be worth such an effort; but since what you get is a Grab Bag, with a chance at a Jet, a chance at a costume piece, and (from what we've been hearing) a much higher chance of getting more Drifter Salvage, the effort required is ludicrously out of balance with the potential reward.

See, we're coming at this from 2 different perspectives then. I agree, the rewards are kinda weak. You're saying, tone down the difficulty. I'm thinking increase the rewards.

Knock down the level of the Engineers, so it's more possible to succeed without a team that works like a well-oiled machine (since it's a PUG, the odds that everyone will know their role is minimal), or Sidekick like the Alerts, and we might be onto something. But as it stands, unless you like fighting your head off, and dying repeatedly, in exchange for what amounts to trash the majority of the time, this mission is just going to leave a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths.

It *really* doesn't help that you can access this mission from such a low level. But, 100% against sking like the alerts. You can easily sidekick, yourself, and there's often a 40 in the group. I mean, communication. It only takes a second to say "make that guy leader and let's sidekick", presuming they didn't make that impossible. Also, if it brought everyone down to 30 like the alerts do? I'd probably be on the forum kicking and screaming about my character being toned down just to even the playing field.

Still, tho, like I said. I've done this a few times (once, without even finishing the setup mission) and haven't failed. I dunno, maybe it's just bad pug luck? I've actually partied with you once or twice, so I'm positive it's not you that's the problem.

Also, random tangent: I hate these events because they're usually one shot/fire and forget kinda missions. I'm not a fan of them generating any content that we'll only see once, for a week or 2. Seems a waste of dev time, considering the fact that lots of us are begging for a new zone or more endgame content. Why wasn't this implemented as a level 40 quest chain in mc? It seems like that'd fix everyone's issues, and it's not like they couldn't just change the drop table at the end of the event. It confuses me, because with everyone scrambling for more stuff to do, you'd think throwaway content would be the last thing on the devs minds.

helbjorn · September 2012

I beat this mission as a level 20 with three 40's and a mid-30 IIRC. Very frustrating with lots of deaths trying to figure out the jets' abilities and the mechanics of the fight.

Most frustrating, however, was using a Medic Evac jet for most of the end mission, painting the target (applying resistance debuff) and healing for almost the entire boss fight (you know, using the jet in the role it was intended) and getting 7 points of credit at the end.

The Smoke Pellets as mission reward was disappointing as well. Won't be running this mission chain again with any other characters, sorry to say.

lotar295 · September 2012

I also did the mission,while I don't think it was worth it,it wasn't that hard after i was informed of what healed Franklin stone,I started going after his engineers,and we're done in a few minutes,the major thing I don't like is we have very little time to learn,"what does this do?" with the jets,and how bad the grab bag rewards are,at least give a permanent power replacer like you did with the Hi-Pan alert and the empowered dragon staff.In fact,I wonder why a grab bag was even in this mission,seeing as vehicle content will be coming out and all,we do NEED a vehicle at some time for those of us who can't fly or use superspeed,even though there are few of us that are like that,there are still some of us.

tharkan · September 2012

Having 40s in your team does NOT guarantee you victory. You need to know what you are doing more than anything else (i.e. kill engineers before Stone arrives, strafe to avoid lasers, realize that the heavy assault jet is designed for defense and not attack, etc.).

malvou · September 2012

As a Hero that can fly, I just avoid the jets and use my electric powers on the big one. Does way more DPS.

lotar295 · September 2012

malvou wrote: »

As a Hero that can fly, I just avoid the jets and use my electric powers on the big one. Does way more DPS.

yea,I tried that with my PA FF,it did more DPS,and had better defense than the DPS jet and the tank jet,only bad side was mobility,even with R3 jet boots,I couldn't keep up with stone,but I could hit him hard when hes stopped:cool:

jonsills · September 2012

I managed to get out of the Jet while in the battlefield once, but it was completely accidental and I haven't been able to reproduce it yet. If I could, Skyfire would eat those Engineers for brunch. So, how do I do it again?

sanguineviper · September 2012

jonsills wrote: »

I managed to get out of the Jet while in the battlefield once, but it was completely accidental and I haven't been able to reproduce it yet. If I could, Skyfire would eat those Engineers for brunch. So, how do I do it again?

Just don't get in a jet. Fly out the windows and go beat him down yourself, it's what I do every time.

This alert made me glad I decided to switch out gatling gun to have Nightwarrior as an alternative passive to switch to on Pink for sniping with the Eagle Blaster. Stone's VTOL doesn't really stand a chance vs. my 27k Eagle Blaster crits every 3 seconds from, *shock* outside his attack range.

About the only problem is the laser drones, which, of course instantly kill me with my ubar-leet 4955HP. But it's easy enough to just fly back out to the fight and keep going, since I'm doing the equivalent DPS of 5 players in jets by myself.

I do like that the instance's open mission has a real scoring table though, just so I can see how much my team is actually leeching when I have over 700 points of contribution and they're all below 100...

Anyways, jets suck... Catgirls with prototype sniper rifles ftw!

helbjorn · September 2012

sanguineviper wrote: »

I do like that the instance's open mission has a real scoring table though, just so I can see how much my team is actually leeching when I have over 700 points of contribution and they're all below 100...

See my post above. This mission does not award points properly. I got 7 points of contribution and was an integral part of the win, just not through DPS.

sanguineviper · September 2012

helbjorn wrote: »

See my post above. This mission does not award points properly. I got 7 points of contribution and was an integral part of the win, just not through DPS.

It awards points for the %of damage you dealt to everything in the instance. Which of course, is totally pointless for a support toon/healing jet. While inaccurate for that purpose, it does in fact give you a direct picture of the group's damage output.

Since I always instantly die every time the drones spawn on me (and this is the only time I'm ever hit.) I'm not sure a support toon/jet could even help me here, sadly.

rapierwhip · September 2012

I've done this mission twice... or I should say that I have succeeded twice... I've actually done the last fight about 8 times.

Needless to say, I will not do it again. Fortunately, with the two bags I got, I received a grapple pull and a bolas. I think if I had opened the bag and found 2 drifter salvage, I might have blown a gasket. The rewards for this level of frustration are no where near worth it. And yes, I said "this level of frustration" not "this level of difficulty". One-hit-kill instadeath attacks do not make for a challenge, they only make for frustration. I sincerely wish Cryptic would learn that. Its the same reason I don't do the Gravatar fight. No challenge, just frustration.

jonsills · September 2012

I could take the instakills, really, if they didn't result in both the loss of a star and time off the clock. We're allocated ten minutes to take Stone down, and so he gets healing whenever he gets to a new building (because the spawn time on the Engineer there is such that it's nearly impossible to kill the Engineer before Stone arrives). Fair enough. But we don't actually get ten minutes, do we? More like two or three, since there are five people getting hit by drone lasers and Stone's own megaweapons, and no healing unless you're in or near a Medevac.

I finally got HandyMan through a successful run, after trying for two hours last night and another hour and a half tonight; after all that, he got two Drifter Salvage. Spider-Bat has had a little better luck - he succeeded twice, and each time got a costume piece. Happifun Security System X-4 hasn't succeeded yet, either in or out of a jet.

Not doing this any more - I don't need a jet that bad.

chalupaoffury · September 2012

I finally failed for the first time tonight. Stealth + acro forced me into a jet. Those things *suck* for this mission. I'd rather put it on auto pilot and fly it into his ship. It might hurt more.

skyranger1414 · September 2012

I must admit I'm at a bit of a loss here. The Jets are clearly totally underwhelming, perhaps only good for keeping up with Stone and taking down the engineers before they heal him. But even that's unnecessary, when it became clear the Jet just wasn't cutting it I flew out and took down Stone and his healing engineers. My team helped, thankfully they at least tried instead of falling into dispair lol.

Maybe players should consider something is wrong with their builds if they can't deal with Stone (non flying heroes are exempt from this, they're kinda stuck in a Jet... in that case make SURE you keep up with stone and take out the engineers!!). Someone even complained about lost stars....? Really? I mean, even for a new AT player stars are kinda... not needed.

All that said I think there are some very valid complaints, no time to learn the Jet powers IS a big deal, as is the weakness of the Jets themselves.

keaixian · September 2012

skyranger1414 wrote: »

All that said I think there are some very valid complaints, no time to learn the Jet powers IS a big deal, as is the weakness of the Jets themselves.

I believe this is the worst problem with the mission, as all of a sudden you are stuck with powers you do not really know working under mechanics you are not familiar with. If you are using the option to deactivate the pop ups during battle you are pretty much flying blind.

And it is a design choice that the players are not teamed up by default or was it a random bug I encountered?

hubrix · September 2012

I do think the jets can use a buff. I know they were built with having teamwork in mind but for the most part they're so weak they may as well be paper. That said I've found it pretty easy once I learned about the engineers and ignored using the jets altogether. Using the lair as a showcase for the jets feels like it has fallen flat on its face. If anything it just highlighted how useless they are. Sure there are people wowed by the burst of that last power the jets have. I assume these are the same people that can't even pull 2k DPS using an offensive role. And come on, 1500 Zen for what's basically a travel power? Cause let's face it, if the Destroid Commander didn't exist these would be up there as the most useless Becomes.

EDIT: I'm curious about the device, do they also have the same crappy stats the jets in the lair do? Because that would just be funny.

lotar295 · September 2012

I have to agree here with the fact the jets are only useful as a method of transportation,which superspeed and jet boots can rival,but they are really just become devices with a speed boost,they can't even do the job of their role as good as we all can,and I mean ALL,from ATs to FFs,any skilled player can out role perform the jets.

DPS jet-DPS ATs and FFs can easily rival,without energy management issues

Tank-anything with invulnerability can tank better

Healer/debuffer-same issue as the DPS jet,energy management,it can only get one heal out,then reload,then debuff,then reload,which takes up too much time.

and to finalize this post,I even did the lair with my PA toon,who put out moe DPS,and could take more punishment than the DPS and tank jets,as well as keep up with Stone

cptmassive1 · September 2012

I found the fights incredibly easy (normal). Aggroed all the mobs in a particular bldg at once including "nighthawk" each time and had no problem. I am playing a power armor toon though.

Won the final fight the first time I tried it with the first team I randomly found. I am 37th. I died twice bc the jet didn't seem to respond to my game pad for activation of some powers.

however, I can't complete the mission because I cannot find any circumstantial evidence anywhere. If it is supposed to drop, I have no idea from where. I read something about "masked mobs standing around outside" but I have never seen any at any of the sites.

jonsills · September 2012

cptmassive1 wrote: »

however, I can't complete the mission because I cannot find any circumstantial evidence anywhere. If it is supposed to drop, I have no idea from where. I read something about "masked mobs standing around outside" but I have never seen any at any of the sites.

Look for groups of three standing where there aren't usually any mobs. For instance, there's a little triangle of parkland on the northeast corner of RenCen, just outside the wall, across from Homestead; there's a group that spawns there, on the sidewalk (this seems to hold true for every open-world mission of this sort). Also, look for squares of floating yellow tape, with a couple of bored cops standing by (there's one on the sidewalk on the north side of RenCen, west of the mob I just mentioned); these are crime scenes, and you can investigate them for more Circumstantial Evidence.

Oh, it just occurred to me - at least as of last night, if you've already completed the first part of this mission on the character you're using, you'll still have all the Evidence. Just talk to Defender, and he'll send you straight out to Surhoff to get the warrant for Stone.

Nighthawk...don't bother

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