Just to let you know, Drannic has noticed the activity over on PTS (about the response he gave and has been quoted earlier in this thread) and has commented again:
I've posted a thank you to Drannic on there in response to his statement that, even though the system is working as it was designed to, "...this does not invalidate the feedback provided by our user base, and will be brought up to the CO Development team and discussed if it is possible to resolve or [be changed]." This was followed by an apology.
Regardless of what does or doesn't happen, this is the best response I've seen from everyone I've talked to. Sympathetic, knowledgeable, and it gives me confidence that at the very least, the issue will be made known to the powers that be.
What happens if nothing changes? We continue to voice ourselves, boycott making purchases, and discuss possible solutions. We don't give up. If this does change something? Well that will be an afternoon I look forward to.
I have an idea. You see, report spam only seemed to have become a problem since Free to Play. So either disallow silver members from using the feature, or make it so they have to have actually purchased Zen with real world money from within the game. No cards, no free zen, purchase with a credit card from within the game itself. Or some other limiting factor that makes it harder to just anonymously use it without consequence.
Also impose stiff penalties for abuse of it, whether or not the report-spam abuser is silver.
It's not so much about the money as it is an idea about how to get things back to the way they were in regards to Report Spam.
If someone is spewing something I don't like, being annoying, being vulgar or crude, or just otherwise getting on my nerves with the chat system- I ignore them, and the simple ignore feature takes care of the problem.
Don't the ignores turn into a temp ban if enough of them build up? Or am I thinking of something else?
Don't the ignores turn into a temp ban if enough of them build up? Or am I thinking of something else?
Yup. /ignore and /reportspammer both count towards the 24 hour chat ban.
And the solution is simple - increase the number of reports required to something astronomical. Instead of the 10 or 20 or whatever it is, make it a thousand or two. Should be an easier fix than removing the code for a chat ban out entirely.
Yup. /ignore and /reportspammer both count towards the 24 hour chat ban.
And the solution is simple - increase the number of reports required to something astronomical. Instead of the 10 or 20 or whatever it is, make it a thousand or two. Should be an easier fix than removing the code for a chat ban out entirely.
Also, the "ignore" function should not count towards chat-bans, period. There should be no automated chat-bans to begin with, but tying that function to ignore takes an already poorly thoughtout system into entirely new heights.
People could be "ignored" for any number of reason. They don't have to be doing anything wrong that is "deserving" of any "punishment". There could be simple differences of opinion, particularly if someone brings up politics or religion. It doesn't even have to involve political/religious reasons at all--Smackwell famously got chat-ban for saying that "Wolverine Sucks!"
They could also be simply RPing in local chat (or perhaps Zone chat) in a highly populated area and people that are bothered by the constant stream of text flooding their screen could opt to place them on "ignore". There could be ANY number of reasons someone could be put on "ignore" that doesn't warrant (even by the longest stretch of reasoning) them getting chat-banned as a result.
There is no need to chat-ban someone for that, and people that are bothered by what someone else is saying (for ANY reason), should not have to restrain themselves from placing them on "ignore" just to prevent them getting chat-banned.
IMO, there should be NO automated chat-bans--even for "gold sellers" (GMs should determine is someone actually qualifies for that and ban them themselves). But when it comes to "ignore", there should be no chat-ban from that, period. Having "ignore" count towards getting chat-banned takes an already stupid and irresponsible system onto entirely new heights.
For this exact reason I will not put ANYONE on my ignore list. Even if I cannot stand the sight of them I will not do so. Because it is not really an IGNORE list at all. It is a BAN list. I would rather switch to Local, PM, change Zones, turn off Chat entirely, or just log off for a while.
.
.
.
'Wen considered the nature of time and understood that the universe is, instant by instant, recreated anew. Therefore, he understood, there is in truth no past, only a memory of the past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.' Terry Pratchet The Thief Of Time
For this exact reason I will not put ANYONE on my ignore list. Even if I cannot stand the sight of them I will not do so. Because it is not really an IGNORE list at all. It is a BAN list. I would rather switch to Local, PM, change Zones, turn off Chat entirely, or just log off for a while.
A noble sentiment J, I honestly wish I could do that.
I have 20 some-odd channels, half of which I'm an admin or operator for. My chatbox is a freaking slot machine. I'll privately PM someone spamming, asking them to kindly stop but if after repeated pleas, that doesn't happen? They go on the ignore list.
In order to do my job in the game, I need to be able to answer people's questions and read what they type and no bozo with an affinity for the caps lock or the Ctrl+C combo should dictate which people I help and which I don't.
Well I'm glad to see that Drannic has responded to us all about this issue. Hopefully we are being heard about this issue. Like I posted in the pts forums in response to his intial response to the system, the program has no real bugs. I can understand that this system spans across all their games. But like I have mentioned here and elsewhere, the problem lies in the fact that its the automated function (which doesnt, nor cannot, distinguish between who should and shouldnt be muted) that leaves it open for abuse.
Let's hope that we are on the right path here and something can be done.
I have an idea. You see, report spam only seemed to have become a problem since Free to Play. So either disallow silver members from using the feature, ...
Yes, because gold players won't ever abuse that to lord it over on silver players. "stfu or I'll get you chatbanned silverboy".
Just get rid of the whole system. CO doesn't have gold spammers.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Yes, because gold players won't ever abuse that to lord it over on silver players. "stfu or I'll get you chatbanned silverboy".
Just get rid of the whole system. CO doesn't have gold spammers.
It wasn't abused on anyone prior to the F2P changes to CO. What's more, the point is accountability. A gold account is linked to real world payment, there's a paper trail. This means people can be permanently banned from using it if they abuse it.
I'm not pretending like it'd make abuse go away entirely, but it would allow for Cryptic to make people abusing it have some real accountability.
Also, I find your argument to be sophistry at best. I have never seen anyone ever say to anyone "stfu or I'll get you chatbanned" for any reason... ever... And I haven't seen the prejudice you're talking about regarding gold vs silver. Well, I have seen some elitist pricks that look down on silvers, but I've never seen them threaten a silver player. And those elitist pricks are few and far between. Most golds are perfectly fine with silver players.
It wasn't abused on anyone prior to the F2P changes to CO. What's more, the point is accountability. A gold account is linked to real world payment, there's a paper trail. This means people can be permanently banned from using it if they abuse it.
I'm not pretending like it'd make abuse go away entirely, but it would allow for Cryptic to make people abusing it have some real accountability.
Also, I find your argument to be sophistry at best. I have never seen anyone ever say to anyone "stfu or I'll get you chatbanned" for any reason... ever... And I haven't seen the prejudice you're talking about regarding gold vs silver. Well, I have seen some elitist pricks that look down on silvers, but I've never seen them threaten a silver player. And those elitist pricks are few and far between. Most golds are perfectly fine with silver players.
/signed with this
How many times do your players have to mention this simple fix
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
It wasn't abused on anyone prior to the F2P changes to CO. What's more, the point is accountability. A gold account is linked to real world payment, there's a paper trail. This means people can be permanently banned from using it if they abuse it.
I'm not pretending like it'd make abuse go away entirely, but it would allow for Cryptic to make people abusing it have some real accountability.
Also, I find your argument to be sophistry at best. I have never seen anyone ever say to anyone "stfu or I'll get you chatbanned" for any reason... ever... And I haven't seen the prejudice you're talking about regarding gold vs silver. Well, I have seen some elitist pricks that look down on silvers, but I've never seen them threaten a silver player. And those elitist pricks are few and far between. Most golds are perfectly fine with silver players.
As a Silver level player you mean the money I spent here wasnt real?
Well, dang, let me order that Bentley and Classic Lear Jet I've had my eyes on....
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"Few are agreeable in conversation, because each thinks more of what he intends to say than that of what others are saying, and listens no more when he himself has a chance to speak." - Francois de la Rochefoucauld
"Forums are amazing technology. They can take a seemingly normal and
rational person and make them look like a troll. Short-sighted, misguided, creative effort deprived. Incredible." - Snarlygribbly
As a Silver level player you mean the money I spent here wasnt real?
Well, dang, let me order that Bentley and Classic Lear Jet I've had my eyes on....
Now that's sophistry. Unless, of course, you create a slew of new Silver accounts in order to harass others with false spam reports (the circumstance in question), then make purchases on all of them as well...
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
I come from EQ2 ... so I am used to /ignoring those who I, personally find offensive or spamming things in channel.
Little did I know here, it can give someone a silence ban. Wow.
My husband had me turn Zone and Genral chats off anyway when I first started, but I will be more than sure to not use /ignore unless a person really really needs it.
I'm sorry to hear so many innocent people are getting censored like this. It truly needs looking into.
Comments
I've posted a thank you to Drannic on there in response to his statement that, even though the system is working as it was designed to, "...this does not invalidate the feedback provided by our user base, and will be brought up to the CO Development team and discussed if it is possible to resolve or [be changed]." This was followed by an apology.
Regardless of what does or doesn't happen, this is the best response I've seen from everyone I've talked to. Sympathetic, knowledgeable, and it gives me confidence that at the very least, the issue will be made known to the powers that be.
What happens if nothing changes? We continue to voice ourselves, boycott making purchases, and discuss possible solutions. We don't give up. If this does change something? Well that will be an afternoon I look forward to.
Flare's guide to hosting and judging costume contests!
(link under construction)
Also impose stiff penalties for abuse of it, whether or not the report-spam abuser is silver.
It's not so much about the money as it is an idea about how to get things back to the way they were in regards to Report Spam.
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → Ⓑ Ⓐ
Don't the ignores turn into a temp ban if enough of them build up? Or am I thinking of something else?
Wait? Whaaaa..?
RIP Caine
Yup. /ignore and /reportspammer both count towards the 24 hour chat ban.
And the solution is simple - increase the number of reports required to something astronomical. Instead of the 10 or 20 or whatever it is, make it a thousand or two. Should be an easier fix than removing the code for a chat ban out entirely.
Razira's Primus Database Page
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Also, the "ignore" function should not count towards chat-bans, period. There should be no automated chat-bans to begin with, but tying that function to ignore takes an already poorly thoughtout system into entirely new heights.
People could be "ignored" for any number of reason. They don't have to be doing anything wrong that is "deserving" of any "punishment". There could be simple differences of opinion, particularly if someone brings up politics or religion. It doesn't even have to involve political/religious reasons at all--Smackwell famously got chat-ban for saying that "Wolverine Sucks!"
They could also be simply RPing in local chat (or perhaps Zone chat) in a highly populated area and people that are bothered by the constant stream of text flooding their screen could opt to place them on "ignore". There could be ANY number of reasons someone could be put on "ignore" that doesn't warrant (even by the longest stretch of reasoning) them getting chat-banned as a result.
There is no need to chat-ban someone for that, and people that are bothered by what someone else is saying (for ANY reason), should not have to restrain themselves from placing them on "ignore" just to prevent them getting chat-banned.
IMO, there should be NO automated chat-bans--even for "gold sellers" (GMs should determine is someone actually qualifies for that and ban them themselves). But when it comes to "ignore", there should be no chat-ban from that, period. Having "ignore" count towards getting chat-banned takes an already stupid and irresponsible system onto entirely new heights.
.
.
.
'Wen considered the nature of time and understood that the universe is, instant by instant, recreated anew. Therefore, he understood, there is in truth no past, only a memory of the past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.' Terry Pratchet The Thief Of Time
A noble sentiment J, I honestly wish I could do that.
I have 20 some-odd channels, half of which I'm an admin or operator for. My chatbox is a freaking slot machine. I'll privately PM someone spamming, asking them to kindly stop but if after repeated pleas, that doesn't happen? They go on the ignore list.
In order to do my job in the game, I need to be able to answer people's questions and read what they type and no bozo with an affinity for the caps lock or the Ctrl+C combo should dictate which people I help and which I don't.
Flare's guide to hosting and judging costume contests!
(link under construction)
Let's hope that we are on the right path here and something can be done.
My Characters on PRIMUS
Toons and costumes thread
@Benevon
Leader of Super Serious Brooding Vigilantes
Yes, because gold players won't ever abuse that to lord it over on silver players. "stfu or I'll get you chatbanned silverboy".
Just get rid of the whole system. CO doesn't have gold spammers.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
It wasn't abused on anyone prior to the F2P changes to CO. What's more, the point is accountability. A gold account is linked to real world payment, there's a paper trail. This means people can be permanently banned from using it if they abuse it.
I'm not pretending like it'd make abuse go away entirely, but it would allow for Cryptic to make people abusing it have some real accountability.
Also, I find your argument to be sophistry at best. I have never seen anyone ever say to anyone "stfu or I'll get you chatbanned" for any reason... ever... And I haven't seen the prejudice you're talking about regarding gold vs silver. Well, I have seen some elitist pricks that look down on silvers, but I've never seen them threaten a silver player. And those elitist pricks are few and far between. Most golds are perfectly fine with silver players.
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → Ⓑ Ⓐ
/signed with this
How many times do your players have to mention this simple fix
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
And playing by myself since Aug 2009
Godtier: Lifetime Subscriber
I'll be over 9000 by the time they fixed this
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
As a Silver level player you mean the money I spent here wasnt real?
Well, dang, let me order that Bentley and Classic Lear Jet I've had my eyes on....
"Few are agreeable in conversation, because each thinks more of what he intends to say than that of what others are saying, and listens no more when he himself has a chance to speak." - Francois de la Rochefoucauld
"Forums are amazing technology. They can take a seemingly normal and
rational person and make them look like a troll. Short-sighted, misguided, creative effort deprived. Incredible." - Snarlygribbly
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Anyone who defends this feature is out of their minds.
I suggest investing in ventrillo or it's alternatives.
Edit: with my noteriety, I wonder if I got banned during my hiatus. I wasn't on long enough last night to find out
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Community Rules and Policies -Smackwell
I come from EQ2 ... so I am used to /ignoring those who I, personally find offensive or spamming things in channel.
Little did I know here, it can give someone a silence ban. Wow.
My husband had me turn Zone and Genral chats off anyway when I first started, but I will be more than sure to not use /ignore unless a person really really needs it.
I'm sorry to hear so many innocent people are getting censored like this. It truly needs looking into.