If you leave the game because somebody threw a bunch of snowballs at you, then you need to reexamine why you started playing video games in the first place.
I don't intend to leave the game any time soon. I'm here until it goes in the grave, or at least until my cocaine habit resurfaces.
It's like the guy who gets into a snowball fight, then gets mad because someone is "throwing snowballs the wrong way" or some other grumpy old man nonsense like that.
As I've stated before, and people with the reading comprehension skills of a child have noted, it's not 'just snowballs' and 'just waterballoons', it's a series of other things.
Why dont you just ignore them? They will stop on their own.... like in CoH I only did it to bug people if they kelp their mouth shut I would have stop because it no fun unless they are mad....
I find it very amusing when people get annoy at things like that. I wish I had snowballs I might hunt you down just to bug you but I dont..... I might have water balloons.
Oh I can use powers too? >:)
Also reporting them for those reason....I dont think they will get banned. Besides if they did ban trolls they would get less money, also trolls can make as many free accounts so banning the trolls is pointless anyways.
There are circumstances that invalidate those points entirely.
EDIT: And the "they bring in money" argument is a terrible counterpoint in the first place. Cryptic/PWE isn't so desperate for money that they'd be willing to overlook 'sufficiently abhorrent behavior'* in order to continue collecting money from the account responsible.
* - as defined by the TOS and enforced at the discretion of whoever is handling the tickets
There are circumstances that invalidate those points entirely.
Exactly. I can post up in a bar and buy out the top shelf, but if I'm harassing other customers but 'not doing anything illegal', a wise barkeep/owner would show me the door and ask me not to return.
In the end, they weren't trolling you though, so your entire thread is invalid... that'd be why the GMs aren't falling all over themselves to punish someone just because you decided you wanted to be offended. Face it, you're wrong... talk about reading comprehension all you like, truth is, yours failed you on this one.
In the end, they weren't trolling you though, so your entire thread is invalid... that'd be why the GMs aren't falling all over themselves to punish someone just because you decided you wanted to be offended. Face it, you're wrong... talk about reading comprehension all you like, truth is, yours failed you on this one.
I'm sorry, but I can pull the rules to validate that they, in fact, were.
You keep assuming that I'm talking about 'just using snowballs'. I'm not sure where you missed the three separate times where I explained that it wasn't the case, that there was more to it.
I didn't 'decide I want to be offended'. I decided that I didn't want to be harassed, and as a paying customer, I do have that right when I'm being harassed and the damned TOS states that it was harassment, in case you missed it.
But please, child, tell me again how I'm wrong. You seem to be the only person that disagrees, and I'm certain your online antics can confirm why that would be the case.
Perfect World Terms of Service Section 15.2
h. impede or disrupt the Service or the normal flow of game play or dialogue in the Game or in Interactive Areas (defined below) in the Service or use vulgar language, abusiveness, use of excessive shouting (ALL CAPS), spamming or any other disruptive or detrimental methods in an attempt to disturb other users or our employees;
n. take any action that disrupts the Service or that negatively affects or may prohibit other users from enjoying the Website, the Games or any other aspect of the Service.
Tell me again how my 'reading comprehension failed', because if 'fail' was a science, you just went Stephen Hawking.
It's like the guy who gets into a snowball fight, then gets mad because someone is "throwing snowballs the wrong way" or some other grumpy old man nonsense like that.
Except that Cyber has clearly stated that he did not willingly partake in the water balloon fight. In fact he stated that he asked the person to stop.
Unless you're suggesting that if you're walking down the street minding your own business while getting hit by a snowball or water balloon out of nowhere, you automatically smile and wave and act like nothing's happened and you expect everyone else to follow that example. Please spare me the pretense.
Except that Cyber has clearly stated that he did not willingly partake in the water balloon fight. In fact he stated that he asked the person to stop.
Unless you're suggesting that if you're walking down the street minding your own business while getting hit by a snowball or water balloon out of nowhere, you automatically smile and wave and act like nothing's happened and you expect everyone else to follow that example. Please spare me the pretense.
My question would be... does the water balloon do damage, interrupt any action he's doing, cause any other thing other than a change of pose for his character? If the answer is no, then really, he is making a mountain out of a very tiny ant hill.
My question would be... does the water balloon do damage, interrupt any action he's doing, cause any other thing other than a change of pose for his character? If the answer is no, then really, he is making a mountain out of a very tiny ant hill.
If you go back and read the OP, it's been stated that the offender have been constantly reported for their behavior and the difference maker is the repetitiveness of the action. If someone other than a friend throws a water balloon at you and doesn't stop doing so after you've asked them nicely, then that's harassment plain and simple. It doesn't sound like an overreaction due to being hit by a water balloon for just one time.
If you see someone who's apparently engaged in some conversation with another person, or if they're in emote animation, throwing a water balloon at them is a -insert explicit- move. If you continue to do it even after they've politely asked you to stop, then you're an even bigger -insert explicit-. It's simple consideration for others and it shouldn't have to be explained.
If you go back and read the OP, it's been stated that the offender have been constantly reported for their behavior and the difference maker is the repetitiveness of the action. If someone throws a water balloon at you and doesn't stop doing so after you've asked them nicely, then that's harassment plain and simple. It doesn't sound like an overreaction due to being hit by a water balloon for just one time.
If you see someone who's apparently engaged in some conversation with another person, or if they're in emote animation, throwing a water balloon at them is a -insert explicit- move. If you continue to do it even after they've politely asked you to stop, then you're a bigger -insert explicit-.
And the problem isn't anyone else but him. If you let trolls know that they are bugging you then you end up just feeding them. Since the mechanic in question, aka the water balloon, is working as intended, aka harmless and does nothing other than change the pose your character might be standing in, then there is nothing going out out of the ordinary other than someone being pissy about it and letting people know he's pissy about it.
I've had water balloons thrown at me, and I throw them right back. It's harmless does nothing and really, it's an MMO. If you are playing an MMO expecting to be left alone, then you have other issues to take care of first because the first part of joinign an MMO is expecting to interact with other people, sometimes people you don't even know.
I would side with him if said actions were leading to his character being killed constantly or having to fight critters he didn't want to, or anything that is actually harmful. That isn't.
And the problem isn't anyone else but him. If you let trolls know that they are bugging you then you end up just feeding them. Since the mechanic in question, aka the water balloon, is working as intended, aka harmless and does nothing other than change the pose your character might be standing in, then there is nothing going out out of the ordinary other than someone being pissy about it and letting people know he's pissy about it.
You know how parents and teachers like to say that if you ignore the bullies, they'll eventually go away?
It doesn't work that way. The bullies stop what they're doing when they get dealt with in a forceful manner.
Since you're acknowledging the fact that troll behavior is actually involved, then you should know that the TOS flat-out states that it's subject to moderation.
Please re-read the part that I've mentioned about emote animation. Water balloons reset them. It might be trivial to retype the emote command to resume it, but not when it's happening over and over.
I've had water balloons thrown at me, and I throw them right back. It's harmless does nothing and really, it's an MMO. If you are playing an MMO expecting to be left alone, then you have other issues to take care of first because the first part of joinign an MMO is expecting to interact with other people, sometimes people you don't even know.
That's because you've consented.
I don't know what your criteria on acceptable interaction is, but to me it does not involve getting repeatedly pelted by water balloons or similar unwanted effects.
I'm not against use of water balloons, but it has to be within reasonable use. If a person wants to push their right to use them on whoever they please, then anyone who would be a target has the right to ask them not to do so and should have their wishes respected.
I would side with him if said actions were leading to his character being killed constantly or having to fight critters he didn't want to, or anything that is actually harmful. That isn't.
Well if you want to maintain a rigid, black-and-white view on harassment, that's all on you.
You both have valid points but as someone who likes to randomly attack people with water balloons I feel I have to add my view.
Yes the water balloons are working as intended but if someone gets annoyed with my water balloons antics and they ask me to stop then I stop. The OP has been asking this person to leave them alone and yet they persist . Thats breaking TOS no ifs and buts about it.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
And you're all so focused on water balloons. There was also mention of the use of a Teleport power to both interrupt conversation and move Cyber's character about; when done repeatedly and deliberately, is this not harassment? When someone stands next to you while you're trying to RP and repeatedly activates and deactivates Millennium Flight, even after being asked to desist or move, is this not harassment?
(Oh, and the giant Family-Size water balloons can knock you down. I once got four members of Conquer standing near Defender. Key point here is that I hit them once, then went looking for fresh targets.)
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
And you're all so focused on water balloons. There was also mention of the use of a Teleport power to both interrupt conversation and move Cyber's character about; when done repeatedly and deliberately, is this not harassment? When someone stands next to you while you're trying to RP and repeatedly activates and deactivates Millennium Flight, even after being asked to desist or move, is this not harassment?
I seem to also recall mention of other powers with particle effects and auras being spammed repeatedly. But, no... all the trolls respond with is, "lol water balloon y u mad?"
Really, when it comes down to it, the water balloon/snowball thing? That's just like the sprinkles on the icing on the troll-cake.
Again, this isn't about water balloons. I don't think I need to repeat myself again. Sills hit the nail on the head- teleport powers and other powers being repeatedly spammed over and over and over again, and recently- obscene messages to my friends.
Fortunately, I didn't see this player yesterday so action may have been taken.
I also hope someone sees the repeated 'I am coming for you' messages in this thread.
But really, if it's just a snowball or water balloon? I don't care.
And you're all so focused on water balloons. There was also mention of the use of a Teleport power to both interrupt conversation and move Cyber's character about; when done repeatedly and deliberately, is this not harassment? When someone stands next to you while you're trying to RP and repeatedly activates and deactivates Millennium Flight, even after being asked to desist or move, is this not harassment?
(Oh, and the giant Family-Size water balloons can knock you down. I once got four members of Conquer standing near Defender. Key point here is that I hit them once, then went looking for fresh targets.)
How does Moving a character harrass people?
I can only speak of my experience but when someone uses teleport on my character i dont feel any effect irl oO
Are peoply seriously get emotional hurt/touched when you move their characters?
Also whenever people keep throwing ballons or teleport at me if i dont react they select someond else... and from what i see they only continue on those who QQ about it.
Based on logic you should not QQ to make them stop oO
So, r9, you're offering that hoary old advice that "if you just ignore the bullies, they'll go away"? Yeah, folks tried to feed me that one decades back in school, too. Didn't work then either. The only thing that makes someone stop that sort of crap is when someone makes them stop.
And your reasoning is akin to the little boy leaning in this close to his sibling, chanting, "I'm not touching you! I'm not touching you!" Sure, nobody's getting literally touched - but it's aggravating as hell. And everyone playing this game is at least supposed to be able to control the impulse to act like a jackass, as laid forth in the ToS. If someone just can't restrain themselves from such behavior, maybe multiplayer games aren't for them.
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
So, r9, you're offering that hoary old advice that "if you just ignore the bullies, they'll go away"? Yeah, folks tried to feed me that one decades back in school, too. Didn't work then either. The only thing that makes someone stop that sort of crap is when someone makes them stop.
And your reasoning is akin to the little boy leaning in this close to his sibling, chanting, "I'm not touching you! I'm not touching you!" Sure, nobody's getting literally touched - but it's aggravating as hell. And everyone playing this game is at least supposed to be able to control the impulse to act like a jackass, as laid forth in the ToS. If someone just can't restrain themselves from such behavior, maybe multiplayer games aren't for them.
nah dont get me wrong but look at this...
You let them provoke you...in some way you're dancing to their command...
I really have no idea how the correct sentence in english would be...
In my Country if people throw faces at you then there is no way to make them stop since "its only faces/vimeses" .. of course you cann call the cops and sa " hey they are annyoing me" but annoyance is not illegal here
I can only share the method i deal with people who try to annoy me...here is how:
* I lean back and wait...
* i talk to cathy and we discuss about what he might be thinking while doing this
* and the last step is i just continue with whatever i did before i started thinking about the trolll...
* if he spams chat i put him on ignore and continue with what i did before
done.. he might try to push me with teleport but well that dosent stop me from writing or fighting
If you dont care he fails...because all they want is to anger you...if you dont anger hes just wasting his own time
For one, 'ignoring the harassment' works sometimes. I would think that in my many years of gaming online, that I'm quite aware of this approach and doing so has worked in the past. Therefore, this time, if I'm making a point to say something? Then it's obviously failing.
If I'm willing to take the time to report someone, and when I say 'repeated', I mean 'every time I log in' and 'incessantly, without end until I log or go to a private instance'.
Yes, that works. I can leave the instance. I can stop what I'm doing. I can quite playing the game for a while. I can end my conversation, roleplaying, or other activity if I want. I can turn the volume of my computer all the way down so I don't have to hear the repeated thunderbolt effect. I can move back into place after I've been bumped all over the place.
However, the fact that I have to do that to get the problem to cease? Means that it is, by definition, interrupting and disturbing me and it violates the TOS. I should not have to do this to play the game in relative peace.
Sure, throw snowballs and whatever. I laugh most of the time. But repeatedly spamming powers for nearly a half hour to an hour gets old, fast.
And where I'm from, my family didn't tell me to ignore bullies. I was taught to deal with them. However, I lack that capacity here.
For one, 'ignoring the harassment' works sometimes. I would think that in my many years of gaming online, that I'm quite aware of this approach and doing so has worked in the past. Therefore, this time, if I'm making a point to say something? Then it's obviously failing.
If I'm willing to take the time to report someone, and when I say 'repeated', I mean 'every time I log in' and 'incessantly, without end until I log or go to a private instance'.
Yes, that works. I can leave the instance. I can stop what I'm doing. I can quite playing the game for a while. I can end my conversation, roleplaying, or other activity if I want. I can turn the volume of my computer all the way down so I don't have to hear the repeated thunderbolt effect. I can move back into place after I've been bumped all over the place.
However, the fact that I have to do that to get the problem to cease? Means that it is, by definition, interrupting and disturbing me and it violates the TOS. I should not have to do this to play the game in relative peace.
Sure, throw snowballs and whatever. I laugh most of the time. But repeatedly spamming powers for nearly a half hour to an hour gets old, fast.
And where I'm from, my family didn't tell me to ignore bullies. I was taught to deal with them. However, I lack that capacity here.
Well to me it sounds like you guys exaggerate about this.
In PvE for example i never see trolls.
In PvP .. nope no trolls.. only copykids
In RP , yep lots of trolls... but based on how i learned to RP i dont see how they can interupt me sending my *Sips from her Hot Coffee while listening to XYZs Statement* text.
Thats why i am confused when people say they get "interupted" oO
Its visually not really fitting into the RP situation if they push you with teleport .. but does it hinder you from typing?
Well to me it sounds like you guys exaggerate about this.
In PvE for example i never see trolls.
In PvP .. nope no trolls.. only copykids
In RP , yep lots of trolls... but based on how i learned to RP i dont see how they can interupt me sending my *Sips from her Hot Coffee while listening to XYZs Statement* text.
Let me educate you.
Perception does not equal reality.
I've never met an intelligent person that liked DBZ. Does that mean they are all stupid? No. It just means in my personal experience, all, say... 20? People I've met who like DBZ are stupid.
Thats why i am confused when people say they get "interupted" oO
Its visually not really fitting into the RP situation if they push you with teleport .. but does it hinder you from typing?
Yes, it does. When someone is repeatedly spamming a power over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over it ends to annoy the crap out of me. Why?
Again, let's stop playing coy and stupid. I'm convinced some people in this very thread weren't properly disciplined as children- or at least have no social skills, because let's face it- if I get in your ear and breathe heavily all day- it does not hinder your ability to work. If I refuse to shower and work in the desk next to you, my stench does not hinder your ability to work.
Yes, I can still type. It's just very hard when my screen is full of lightning effects and my speakers are blasting the same noise over and over again.
In case you haven't noticed, people like to harass and troll RPers. It's a known fact of CO. It's happened ridiculously often, and many examples of it are seen on the forums.
Please stop excusing this childish behavior. Please stop invalidating the concerns of other players when the very damned TOS of this game expressly states that what is happening is harassment.
I should not have to 'suck it up', simply so some troll silver account can go on harassing me and other players. If you believe so, i question your adult judgement and capability to hold a position of responsibility or authority.
Of note, the very people who don't see the problem here? Are the very same people I've seen disparage RPers in this game.
Also, if you never see trolls in PvP? You obviously haven't been around it for more than 3 seconds. 'Someone in space with precious stones' can attest to that.
Well to me it sounds like you guys exaggerate about this.
In PvE for example i never see trolls.
In PvP .. nope no trolls.. only copykids
In RP , yep lots of trolls... but based on how i learned to RP i dont see how they can interupt me sending my *Sips from her Hot Coffee while listening to XYZs Statement* text.
Thats why i am confused when people say they get "interupted" oO
Its visually not really fitting into the RP situation if they push you with teleport .. but does it hinder you from typing?
Stop being purposely obtuse. For some people there's more to RP than just typing out /me descriptors of what you're doing. Additionally, just because you don't see it happening doesn't mean it's not happening or that things are necessarily being blown out of proportion.
I've never met an intelligent person that liked DBZ. Does that mean they are all stupid? No. It just means in my personal experience, all, say... 20? People I've met who like DBZ are stupid.
Yes, it does. When someone is repeatedly spamming a power over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over it ends to annoy the crap out of me. Why?
Again, let's stop playing coy and stupid. I'm convinced some people in this very thread weren't properly disciplined as children- or at least have no social skills, because let's face it- if I get in your ear and breathe heavily all day- it does not hinder your ability to work. If I refuse to shower and work in the desk next to you, my stench does not hinder your ability to work.
Yes, I can still type. It's just very hard when my screen is full of lightning effects and my speakers are blasting the same noise over and over again.
In case you haven't noticed, people like to harass and troll RPers. It's a known fact of CO. It's happened ridiculously often, and many examples of it are seen on the forums.
Please stop excusing this childish behavior. Please stop invalidating the concerns of other players when the very damned TOS of this game expressly states that what is happening is harassment.
I should not have to 'suck it up', simply so some troll silver account can go on harassing me and other players. If you believe so, i question your adult judgement and capability to hold a position of responsibility or authority.
Of note, the very people who don't see the problem here? Are the very same people I've seen disparage RPers in this game.
Also, if you never see trolls in PvP? You obviously haven't been around it for more than 3 seconds. 'Someone in space with precious stones' can attest to that.
Look, from what i read here and the way how you have written this you seem to invest a decent amount of emotion at this... people may spam effect but they have only success because you care.
Logic is the keyword, logic pretty much solves your problem.
(( if someone calls me names over and over again i just dont care ))
it looks to me like you "demand" others to behave like you want them to...no offense but im calm.. and from my point of view this is all about emotions.. wich never help to solve problems.
Look, from what i read here and the way how you have written this you seem to invest a decent amount of emotion at this... people may spam effect but they have only success because you care.
Logic is the keyword, logic pretty much solves your problem.
(( if someone calls me names over and over again i just dont care ))
it looks to me like you "demand" others to behave like you want them to...no offense but im calm.. and from my point of view this is all about emotions.. wich never help to solve problems.
Getting a GM to take action against a harasser who won't stop with an effects spam or abuse of any sort of game mechanics to harass the player even after being asked to stop is demanding others to behave how we want them to?
What a load of rubbish. No it's not about forcing others to behave in a certain way. It's about stopping abuse and harassment according to TOS.
Your "logic" seems to be "just don't care and it will stop". I'm sorry to tell you that reality doesn't quite always work that way and it doesn't automatically solve the problem.
Your "logic" seems to be "just don't care and it will stop". I'm sorry to tell you that reality doesn't quite always work that way and it doesn't automatically solve the problem.
nah omg.. please... look if you dont care... its not harrasing .. because to harass someone this one has to care about ...
Look , if i call you an apple... and you dont care.. you are not insulted...
but if you hate apples.. you might feel insulted...
So dont feel harrassed then? that easy.. thats how i do it..
i just dont let them harass me by not caring thats logic
P.S. TO ME it looks like people have no other problems in life
At this point, in my opinion, R9 is arguing against the ToS. Cybersoldier has stated several times in this thread what the person has been doing, and it violates the ToS. No if's, and's, or but's. If some people are going to say that he should suck it up, man up, ignore it, or change the way he's viewing it, then I'd like them to think where we would be if we just let everyone do these things all day, every day as much as they'd like.
If we let immature teenagers TP, egg, and ding-dong-ditch our houses for all I care whenever they'd like with no consequences, what do you think would happen at a later date? Technically, doing all of those things do not disrupt your way of living (so to speak, I'd argue otherwise, but I know others in this thread would argue against me), but it is violating personal space and property. We have laws against that and someone can get in trouble for doing it. If no action is taken and the victim tries their best to ignore it, they will most likely keep doing more unethical things until they decide to something extremely serious that will likely cause harm in some way to the victim.
nah omg.. please... look if you dont care... its not harrasing .. because to harass someone this one has to care about ...
Look , if i call you an apple... and you dont care.. you are not insulted...
but if you hate apples.. you might feel insulted...
So dont feel harrassed then? that easy.. thats how i do it..
i just dont let them harass me by not caring thats logic
P.S. TO ME it looks like people have no other problems in life
The issue at hand has nothing to do with name-calling. That is easily resolved with ignore but that's not the problem being highlighted here and you're going off-topic.
Also what in the blue hells do our other problems in life have to do with this?
--Message deleted because not worth saying it due to someone, which by may, should be ignored, supporting the trolls that enjoy breaking the ToS and would just argue that I am wrong--
The issue at hand has nothing to do with name-calling. That is easily resolved with ignore but that's not the problem being highlighted here and you're going off-topic.
Also what in the blue hells do our other problems in life have to do with this?
exaggeration .. that...
i couldnt care less if people use teleport on me...because its not the world or something.. its changing my position within a video-game.. nothing more...
i couldnt care less if people use teleport on me...because its not the world or something.. its changing my position within a video-game.. nothing more...
I don't think you really know what exaggeration really means.
Getting hit just once by a status effect or accidental teleport and calling it harassment is an exaggeration.
Getting hit by the same things repeatedly with the intention of abuse and calling it harassment is not an exaggeration and it's considered against TOS.
I don't know how much more clearer it can get. I advise that you go read the TOS because it's apparent that you're ignorant of it.
I don't think you really know what exaggeration really means.
Getting hit just once by a status effect or accidental teleport and calling it harassment is an exaggeration.
Getting hit by the same things repeatedly with the intention of abuse and calling it harassment is not an exaggeration and it's considered against TOS.
I don't know how much more clearer it can get. I advise that you go read the TOS because it's apparent that you're ignorant of it.
i read the the ToS, but spamming can be defined different aswell.. some consider 20 as spam.. i personaly consider no amount of power use as spam...because i dont care if they use their powers next to me...it dosent affect my gameplay...
if im easy provoked because playersuse power next to me .. jeez i couldnt even play lemurian invasion...with all the gravity pulses ...lol
i read the the ToS, but spamming can be defined different aswell.. some consider 20 as spam.. i personaly consider no amount of power use as spam...because i dont care if they use their powers next to me...it dosent affect my gameplay...
Spam is spam. Be it 5 times, 20 times, 50 times or whatever, the point here is the intent. If someone made it obvious that they're specifically targetting me with a spam of effects then it doesn't matter how many times they do it. It's still harassment.
if im easy provoked because playersuse power next to me .. jeez i couldnt even play lemurian invasion...with all the gravity pulses ...lol
Missing the point again. This has nothing to do with repeated combat effects that are naturally expected in combat, be it from enemies or players. This has to do with purposeful abuse of the effects specifically targetted at someone outside of combat.
Spam is spam. Be it 5 times, 20 times, 50 times or whatever, the point here is the intent. If someone made it obvious that they're specifically targetting me with a spam of effects then it doesn't matter how many times they do it. It's still harassment.
Missing the point again. This has nothing to do with repeated combat effects that are naturally expected in combat, be it from enemies or players. This has to do with purposeful abuse of the effects specifically targetted at someone outside of combat.
Intent... well.. you can never tell.. you can only assume.. but thats no 100% then...
Wow, nowadays people are easy to be provoked... nerves thin as air.
nah omg.. please... look if you dont care... its not harrasing .. because to harass someone this one has to care about ...
Harassment. Let's make an example of 'harassment' in your logic-
It's not sexual harassment in an office if I grab a secretary's butt and make lewd comments and she doesn't say anything about it. As a matter of fact, if I keep grabbing her butt as long as she stays quiet, I'll stop, right?
So dont feel harrassed then? that easy.. thats how i do it..
Don't feel pain when you extinguish a cigarette on your skin. Don't feel angry when someone takes from you. Don't be sad when a loved one passes. All problems solved by your... logic.
P.S. TO ME it looks like people have no other problems in life
Let's pretend this is the case- If it were? I'd be great.
But it's not. I have a life with all the problems and challenges and stressors and all that. Therefore, I think of all things, I should be able to sit and play a video game and enjoy it without being harassed.
Intent... well.. you can never tell.. you can only assume.. but thats no 100% then...
Intent can be pretty obvious. I'm fairly certain spamming powers and bumping characters around for half an hour and then saying 'I love annoying people like this' isn't something you do by mistake.
Wow, nowadays people are easy to be provoked... nerves thin as air.
You say this now, but keep in mind, that your online time is spent differently than mine. Me? I prefer to have some relative peace in Roleplaying with the goofing off and joking around thrown in the mix. That being said, if what I have repeatedly described to you is 'easily provoked' you either have the patience of a 10,000 year old chopping block or you're just talking out your backside. I'm fairly certain it's the latter.
Harassment. Let's make an example of 'harassment' in your logic-
It's not sexual harassment in an office if I grab a secretary's butt and make lewd comments and she doesn't say anything about it. As a matter of fact, if I keep grabbing her butt as long as she stays quiet, I'll stop, right?
Don't feel pain when you extinguish a cigarette on your skin. Don't feel angry when someone takes from you. Don't be sad when a loved one passes. All problems solved by your... logic.
Let's pretend this is the case- If it were? I'd be great.
But it's not. I have a life with all the problems and challenges and stressors and all that. Therefore, I think of all things, I should be able to sit and play a video game and enjoy it without being harassed.
Intent can be pretty obvious. I'm fairly certain spamming powers and bumping characters around for half an hour and then saying 'I love annoying people like this' isn't something you do by mistake.
You say this now, but keep in mind, that your online time is spent differently than mine. Me? I prefer to have some relative peace in Roleplaying with the goofing off and joking around thrown in the mix. That being said, if what I have repeatedly described to you is 'easily provoked' you either have the patience of a 10,000 year old chopping block or you're just talking out your backside. I'm fairly certain it's the latter.
hehe hey buddy calm down you mistake reallife situation with simple game situations =P
please make valid comparisons.
And pease for your own health.. try not to get your emotions into those things ^^
Logic states that sexual harassment is, in fact, harassment. A form thereof, thus making it harassment.
And for the sake of yours credibility, I suggest you re-read what I stated the case was, read the TOS, and never sit on a jury.
what do you want??? does everyone need to share you opinion?
I told you how to be happy and not be emotional touched by "trolls" .. all you give me back is anger... check your emotions please.. its not healthy to get angry that much
what do you want??? does everyone need to share you opinion?
Not at all. But I don't appreciate it being invalidated by childish 'you can still type' responses, thus completely reducing my pastime to 'nothing but typing'. I would rather some degree of understanding be had, especially when I've several times explained my side of it.
I told you how to be happy and not be emotional touched by "trolls" .. all you give me back is anger... check your emotions please.. its not healthy to get angry that much
You assume this is an intense emotional response. Nothing could be further from the truth.
And, considering you don't know how to define harassment in a sensible way? Your advice to me is like hearing computer troubleshooting tips from a Luddite.
Well, Cyber, as regards the person here, all I can offer is a wise saying I first heard from Robert Heinlein:
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig."
Since the forum has no Ignore function, I think we should go with a good old-fashioned Peter David-style shrouding. That way, those of us who comprehend what harassment is (and, for that matter, what logic is, and how to recognize a strawman argument) can discuss the matter at hand.
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
Not at all. But I don't appreciate it being invalidated by childish 'you can still type' responses, thus completely reducing my pastime to 'nothing but typing'. I would rather some degree of understanding be had, especially when I've several times explained my side of it.
You assume this is an intense emotional response. Nothing could be further from the truth.
And, considering you don't know how to define harassment in a sensible way? Your advice to me is like hearing computer troubleshooting tips from a Luddite.
I think this discussion has no end, i stated my point you stated yours, we have different opinions and obviously different levels of emotional sensitivy that beign said it make no logical sense to continue arguing with you.
I hope for your sake that you can figure out a way of this situation you stated.
I was going to post in my opinion on how trolls should be dealt with and what we could do to try and help improve the system but... since we're so off topic by the 20th page..
I think this thread needs to be locked.. Its just turning into a flame fest..
Unfortunately this is not a new problem, this was a major, daily issue in the two years I played CO. I probably reported tons of griefers in that time, how many GM responses did I get? Not one, no tell asking for more information, no GM showing up to actually see what was happening, never even a response to a ticket in any way. I agree this is not a griefer problem it's a GM problem, and it's one that I just don't see changing anytime soon. It's one of the banes of playing a game with zero barrier to entry, and one that does not have a dedicated RP server. Playing a game that has a specified RP server, when I report someone for griefing, I am met with a tell from a GM within 10 minutes usually, asking for names, etc. My ignore list sits at a big fat zero, where in CO, it outnumbered my friends list. I think if a game, by design does not designate a part of the world to be RP focused, then recourse for people harassing roleplayers tends to be non existent.
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I don't intend to leave the game any time soon. I'm here until it goes in the grave, or at least until my cocaine habit resurfaces.
As I've stated before, and people with the reading comprehension skills of a child have noted, it's not 'just snowballs' and 'just waterballoons', it's a series of other things.
CO could use more literate people and fewer sperg trolls. Please let me know when you're on your way out the door.
So do I.
There are circumstances that invalidate those points entirely.
EDIT: And the "they bring in money" argument is a terrible counterpoint in the first place. Cryptic/PWE isn't so desperate for money that they'd be willing to overlook 'sufficiently abhorrent behavior'* in order to continue collecting money from the account responsible.
* - as defined by the TOS and enforced at the discretion of whoever is handling the tickets
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
I'm sorry, but I can pull the rules to validate that they, in fact, were.
You keep assuming that I'm talking about 'just using snowballs'. I'm not sure where you missed the three separate times where I explained that it wasn't the case, that there was more to it.
I didn't 'decide I want to be offended'. I decided that I didn't want to be harassed, and as a paying customer, I do have that right when I'm being harassed and the damned TOS states that it was harassment, in case you missed it.
But please, child, tell me again how I'm wrong. You seem to be the only person that disagrees, and I'm certain your online antics can confirm why that would be the case.
Tell me again how my 'reading comprehension failed', because if 'fail' was a science, you just went Stephen Hawking.
Except that Cyber has clearly stated that he did not willingly partake in the water balloon fight. In fact he stated that he asked the person to stop.
Unless you're suggesting that if you're walking down the street minding your own business while getting hit by a snowball or water balloon out of nowhere, you automatically smile and wave and act like nothing's happened and you expect everyone else to follow that example. Please spare me the pretense.
My question would be... does the water balloon do damage, interrupt any action he's doing, cause any other thing other than a change of pose for his character? If the answer is no, then really, he is making a mountain out of a very tiny ant hill.
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If you go back and read the OP, it's been stated that the offender have been constantly reported for their behavior and the difference maker is the repetitiveness of the action. If someone other than a friend throws a water balloon at you and doesn't stop doing so after you've asked them nicely, then that's harassment plain and simple. It doesn't sound like an overreaction due to being hit by a water balloon for just one time.
If you see someone who's apparently engaged in some conversation with another person, or if they're in emote animation, throwing a water balloon at them is a -insert explicit- move. If you continue to do it even after they've politely asked you to stop, then you're an even bigger -insert explicit-. It's simple consideration for others and it shouldn't have to be explained.
And the problem isn't anyone else but him. If you let trolls know that they are bugging you then you end up just feeding them. Since the mechanic in question, aka the water balloon, is working as intended, aka harmless and does nothing other than change the pose your character might be standing in, then there is nothing going out out of the ordinary other than someone being pissy about it and letting people know he's pissy about it.
I've had water balloons thrown at me, and I throw them right back. It's harmless does nothing and really, it's an MMO. If you are playing an MMO expecting to be left alone, then you have other issues to take care of first because the first part of joinign an MMO is expecting to interact with other people, sometimes people you don't even know.
I would side with him if said actions were leading to his character being killed constantly or having to fight critters he didn't want to, or anything that is actually harmful. That isn't.
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You know how parents and teachers like to say that if you ignore the bullies, they'll eventually go away?
It doesn't work that way. The bullies stop what they're doing when they get dealt with in a forceful manner.
Since you're acknowledging the fact that troll behavior is actually involved, then you should know that the TOS flat-out states that it's subject to moderation.
Please re-read the part that I've mentioned about emote animation. Water balloons reset them. It might be trivial to retype the emote command to resume it, but not when it's happening over and over.
That's because you've consented.
I don't know what your criteria on acceptable interaction is, but to me it does not involve getting repeatedly pelted by water balloons or similar unwanted effects.
I'm not against use of water balloons, but it has to be within reasonable use. If a person wants to push their right to use them on whoever they please, then anyone who would be a target has the right to ask them not to do so and should have their wishes respected.
Well if you want to maintain a rigid, black-and-white view on harassment, that's all on you.
Yes the water balloons are working as intended but if someone gets annoyed with my water balloons antics and they ask me to stop then I stop. The OP has been asking this person to leave them alone and yet they persist . Thats breaking TOS no ifs and buts about it.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
(Oh, and the giant Family-Size water balloons can knock you down. I once got four members of Conquer standing near Defender. Key point here is that I hit them once, then went looking for fresh targets.)
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I seem to also recall mention of other powers with particle effects and auras being spammed repeatedly. But, no... all the trolls respond with is, "lol water balloon y u mad?"
Again, this isn't about water balloons. I don't think I need to repeat myself again. Sills hit the nail on the head- teleport powers and other powers being repeatedly spammed over and over and over again, and recently- obscene messages to my friends.
Fortunately, I didn't see this player yesterday so action may have been taken.
I also hope someone sees the repeated 'I am coming for you' messages in this thread.
But really, if it's just a snowball or water balloon? I don't care.
How does Moving a character harrass people?
I can only speak of my experience but when someone uses teleport on my character i dont feel any effect irl oO
Are peoply seriously get emotional hurt/touched when you move their characters?
Also whenever people keep throwing ballons or teleport at me if i dont react they select someond else... and from what i see they only continue on those who QQ about it.
Based on logic you should not QQ to make them stop oO
This thread is going about as far as contestants in a marathon for people with impressively tiny bladders.
And your reasoning is akin to the little boy leaning in this close to his sibling, chanting, "I'm not touching you! I'm not touching you!" Sure, nobody's getting literally touched - but it's aggravating as hell. And everyone playing this game is at least supposed to be able to control the impulse to act like a jackass, as laid forth in the ToS. If someone just can't restrain themselves from such behavior, maybe multiplayer games aren't for them.
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nah dont get me wrong but look at this...
You let them provoke you...in some way you're dancing to their command...
I really have no idea how the correct sentence in english would be...
In my Country if people throw faces at you then there is no way to make them stop since "its only faces/vimeses" .. of course you cann call the cops and sa " hey they are annyoing me" but annoyance is not illegal here
I can only share the method i deal with people who try to annoy me...here is how:
* I lean back and wait...
* i talk to cathy and we discuss about what he might be thinking while doing this
* and the last step is i just continue with whatever i did before i started thinking about the trolll...
* if he spams chat i put him on ignore and continue with what i did before
done.. he might try to push me with teleport but well that dosent stop me from writing or fighting
If you dont care he fails...because all they want is to anger you...if you dont anger hes just wasting his own time
People throwing faces at each other... Is everyone in your country that one boss from Altered Beast?
Okay, maybe I'm just taking this literally for the sake of comedy.
ohh sry i meant this:
to make faces at sb.((idiom))
http://www.dict.cc/deutsch-englisch/Grimassen+schneiden.html
For one, 'ignoring the harassment' works sometimes. I would think that in my many years of gaming online, that I'm quite aware of this approach and doing so has worked in the past. Therefore, this time, if I'm making a point to say something? Then it's obviously failing.
If I'm willing to take the time to report someone, and when I say 'repeated', I mean 'every time I log in' and 'incessantly, without end until I log or go to a private instance'.
Yes, that works. I can leave the instance. I can stop what I'm doing. I can quite playing the game for a while. I can end my conversation, roleplaying, or other activity if I want. I can turn the volume of my computer all the way down so I don't have to hear the repeated thunderbolt effect. I can move back into place after I've been bumped all over the place.
However, the fact that I have to do that to get the problem to cease? Means that it is, by definition, interrupting and disturbing me and it violates the TOS. I should not have to do this to play the game in relative peace.
Sure, throw snowballs and whatever. I laugh most of the time. But repeatedly spamming powers for nearly a half hour to an hour gets old, fast.
And where I'm from, my family didn't tell me to ignore bullies. I was taught to deal with them. However, I lack that capacity here.
Well to me it sounds like you guys exaggerate about this.
In PvE for example i never see trolls.
In PvP .. nope no trolls.. only copykids
In RP , yep lots of trolls... but based on how i learned to RP i dont see how they can interupt me sending my *Sips from her Hot Coffee while listening to XYZs Statement* text.
Thats why i am confused when people say they get "interupted" oO
Its visually not really fitting into the RP situation if they push you with teleport .. but does it hinder you from typing?
Let me educate you.
Perception does not equal reality.
I've never met an intelligent person that liked DBZ. Does that mean they are all stupid? No. It just means in my personal experience, all, say... 20? People I've met who like DBZ are stupid.
Yes, it does. When someone is repeatedly spamming a power over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over it ends to annoy the crap out of me. Why?
Again, let's stop playing coy and stupid. I'm convinced some people in this very thread weren't properly disciplined as children- or at least have no social skills, because let's face it- if I get in your ear and breathe heavily all day- it does not hinder your ability to work. If I refuse to shower and work in the desk next to you, my stench does not hinder your ability to work.
Yes, I can still type. It's just very hard when my screen is full of lightning effects and my speakers are blasting the same noise over and over again.
In case you haven't noticed, people like to harass and troll RPers. It's a known fact of CO. It's happened ridiculously often, and many examples of it are seen on the forums.
Please stop excusing this childish behavior. Please stop invalidating the concerns of other players when the very damned TOS of this game expressly states that what is happening is harassment.
I should not have to 'suck it up', simply so some troll silver account can go on harassing me and other players. If you believe so, i question your adult judgement and capability to hold a position of responsibility or authority.
Of note, the very people who don't see the problem here? Are the very same people I've seen disparage RPers in this game.
Also, if you never see trolls in PvP? You obviously haven't been around it for more than 3 seconds. 'Someone in space with precious stones' can attest to that.
Stop being purposely obtuse. For some people there's more to RP than just typing out /me descriptors of what you're doing. Additionally, just because you don't see it happening doesn't mean it's not happening or that things are necessarily being blown out of proportion.
Look, from what i read here and the way how you have written this you seem to invest a decent amount of emotion at this... people may spam effect but they have only success because you care.
Logic is the keyword, logic pretty much solves your problem.
(( if someone calls me names over and over again i just dont care ))
it looks to me like you "demand" others to behave like you want them to...no offense but im calm.. and from my point of view this is all about emotions.. wich never help to solve problems.
Getting a GM to take action against a harasser who won't stop with an effects spam or abuse of any sort of game mechanics to harass the player even after being asked to stop is demanding others to behave how we want them to?
What a load of rubbish. No it's not about forcing others to behave in a certain way. It's about stopping abuse and harassment according to TOS.
Your "logic" seems to be "just don't care and it will stop". I'm sorry to tell you that reality doesn't quite always work that way and it doesn't automatically solve the problem.
Your logic picture is to large shorten it please its breaking LOGIC TOS* .
*theres no such thing but still had to be done :P
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
nah omg.. please... look if you dont care... its not harrasing .. because to harass someone this one has to care about ...
Look , if i call you an apple... and you dont care.. you are not insulted...
but if you hate apples.. you might feel insulted...
So dont feel harrassed then? that easy.. thats how i do it..
i just dont let them harass me by not caring
P.S. TO ME it looks like people have no other problems in life
If we let immature teenagers TP, egg, and ding-dong-ditch our houses for all I care whenever they'd like with no consequences, what do you think would happen at a later date? Technically, doing all of those things do not disrupt your way of living (so to speak, I'd argue otherwise, but I know others in this thread would argue against me), but it is violating personal space and property. We have laws against that and someone can get in trouble for doing it. If no action is taken and the victim tries their best to ignore it, they will most likely keep doing more unethical things until they decide to something extremely serious that will likely cause harm in some way to the victim.
The issue at hand has nothing to do with name-calling. That is easily resolved with ignore but that's not the problem being highlighted here and you're going off-topic.
Also what in the blue hells do our other problems in life have to do with this?
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exaggeration .. that...
i couldnt care less if people use teleport on me...because its not the world or something.. its changing my position within a video-game.. nothing more...
true.. or explaining Logics to a Betazoid...
I don't think you really know what exaggeration really means.
Getting hit just once by a status effect or accidental teleport and calling it harassment is an exaggeration.
Getting hit by the same things repeatedly with the intention of abuse and calling it harassment is not an exaggeration and it's considered against TOS.
I don't know how much more clearer it can get. I advise that you go read the TOS because it's apparent that you're ignorant of it.
i read the the ToS, but spamming can be defined different aswell.. some consider 20 as spam.. i personaly consider no amount of power use as spam...because i dont care if they use their powers next to me...it dosent affect my gameplay...
if im easy provoked because playersuse power next to me .. jeez i couldnt even play lemurian invasion...with all the gravity pulses ...lol
Spam is spam. Be it 5 times, 20 times, 50 times or whatever, the point here is the intent. If someone made it obvious that they're specifically targetting me with a spam of effects then it doesn't matter how many times they do it. It's still harassment.
Missing the point again. This has nothing to do with repeated combat effects that are naturally expected in combat, be it from enemies or players. This has to do with purposeful abuse of the effects specifically targetted at someone outside of combat.
Intent... well.. you can never tell.. you can only assume.. but thats no 100% then...
Wow, nowadays people are easy to be provoked... nerves thin as air.
Harassment. Let's make an example of 'harassment' in your logic-
It's not sexual harassment in an office if I grab a secretary's butt and make lewd comments and she doesn't say anything about it. As a matter of fact, if I keep grabbing her butt as long as she stays quiet, I'll stop, right?
Don't feel pain when you extinguish a cigarette on your skin. Don't feel angry when someone takes from you. Don't be sad when a loved one passes. All problems solved by your... logic.
Let's pretend this is the case- If it were? I'd be great.
But it's not. I have a life with all the problems and challenges and stressors and all that. Therefore, I think of all things, I should be able to sit and play a video game and enjoy it without being harassed.
Intent can be pretty obvious. I'm fairly certain spamming powers and bumping characters around for half an hour and then saying 'I love annoying people like this' isn't something you do by mistake.
You say this now, but keep in mind, that your online time is spent differently than mine. Me? I prefer to have some relative peace in Roleplaying with the goofing off and joking around thrown in the mix. That being said, if what I have repeatedly described to you is 'easily provoked' you either have the patience of a 10,000 year old chopping block or you're just talking out your backside. I'm fairly certain it's the latter.
hehe hey buddy calm down you mistake reallife situation with simple game situations =P
please make valid comparisons.
And pease for your own health.. try not to get your emotions into those things ^^
PS
I dont, because it would make no sense to be sad at all.. cant change it anyway so why i bother?
I am. I'm using logic.
Logic states that sexual harassment is, in fact, harassment. A form thereof, thus making it harassment.
And for the sake of yours credibility, I suggest you re-read what I stated the case was, read the TOS, and never sit on a jury.
Too bad you're the duck. Or Betazoid.
what do you want??? does everyone need to share you opinion?
I told you how to be happy and not be emotional touched by "trolls" .. all you give me back is anger... check your emotions please.. its not healthy to get angry that much
Not at all. But I don't appreciate it being invalidated by childish 'you can still type' responses, thus completely reducing my pastime to 'nothing but typing'. I would rather some degree of understanding be had, especially when I've several times explained my side of it.
You assume this is an intense emotional response. Nothing could be further from the truth.
And, considering you don't know how to define harassment in a sensible way? Your advice to me is like hearing computer troubleshooting tips from a Luddite.
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig."
Since the forum has no Ignore function, I think we should go with a good old-fashioned Peter David-style shrouding. That way, those of us who comprehend what harassment is (and, for that matter, what logic is, and how to recognize a strawman argument) can discuss the matter at hand.
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I think this discussion has no end, i stated my point you stated yours, we have different opinions and obviously different levels of emotional sensitivy that beign said it make no logical sense to continue arguing with you.
I hope for your sake that you can figure out a way of this situation you stated.
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