Or you could copy someones build instead of thinking for yourself. An option like that would have more negative effects then positive.[/QUOTEUmm..
People do that already. It isn't hard to see what the "next" guy is using.
Make your own damn build! :rolleyes: Much more satisfying than using a copy.
Or you could copy someones build instead of thinking for yourself. An option like that would have more negative effects then positive.
Umm..
People do that already. It isn't hard to see what the "next" guy is using.
Make your own damn build! :rolleyes: Much more satisfying than using a copy.
Right?
Making your own build is much more fulfilling IMO, but I guess in PvP if someone is doing something better than you can, asking for tips (not copying entire build) is a way to improve your fighting skills...I guess..
Making your own build is much more fulfilling IMO, but I guess in PvP if someone is doing something better than you can, asking for tips (not copying entire build) is a way to improve your fighting skills...I guess..
Nailed it. I'm always open to helping friends. Even concept builds can be maximized to full potential.
And (from my experience) Raven, I wholeheartedly agree with consulting others for PvP advice, heck I ask coPvP stuff all the time, and I almost have my 900 day reward.
~~~The Tidal Tilde Wave of Seperation~~~
I'd rather get STO's level of lockbox suck if worthwhile updates come with it. -Buxom
I'm just not one of them. I find the prospect, most of the time, to be somewhat less appealing than trying to drive the entirety of a 20 foot long stake through my middle leg...
That being said, the main problem with PVP in a game like CO is lack of balance. Say what you will. Not all power sets in the game perform equally. And not all of them are equally useful in PVP.
What's more, with freeform, there's been enough time to suss out which particular powers tend to be MORE useful in PVP and which ones have better synergies for that purpose.
Leading to FOTM builds, mega-optimized builds, etc. Essentially a race to the top. Which then REALLY puts a hurt on attracting newer players.
You get a guy with one of these optimal builds with optimal gear versus a guy who's been playing a few weeks with a more conventional PVE-centric build.
"Tough. Lrn2PlayN00B! They can get there too "eventually" right?"
What you're missing is the whole "skill" aspect has been completely tossed at that point. At that point it's just "Spam this. Gear-quest for that."
Where, EXACTLY, is the skill and competition in xeroxing someone's build and then sitting their all but invulnerable to everyone else?
And that's about as much fun as the aforementioned spike in one's genitalia. And very few people are going to willingly stick around and get their butts kicked on a repeated basis just so they can take the time to amass the gear they need.
ESPECIALLY in a game with currency venues as fragmented as CO is.
Worse, an actual balance pass to make the powers more equivalent in PVP would just homogenize the game, removing reasons to play varying power sets other than pure cosmetic reasons.
And this is all before even addressing the social problems engendered by certain personality types in PVP.
If people just asked, "how can I make this build concept more PvP efficient", I would imagine there would be a lot less FoTM builds running around making non-PvPers angry. Because those angry people could be helped, making them more competitive on their own terms. The problem with FoTM builds is it truly is just amounting to copying the build of what does better. However it doesn't have to be that way. Some builds are best at duels, some are better at B.A.S.H., others are better at ZA and Stronghold. It really boils down to what you want to be good at. I think all passives can work efficiently in PvP but the common misconception is regarding what people see in Ren Center. Why? Because those disgruntled players are only seeing what can work well in a duel, thus it puts them off from even entering the various Hero Games, which is a whole other aspect to PvP.
I agree that people need to see the difference between a duel in the ren center and fighting more than just one person in Bash, ZA , Stronghold , etc.
They are far from the same. I have done very well in duels against what some people would say are FOTM builds. Matter of fact there are a few builds of mine that have yet to lose to a certain type of build. Big deal? Not really. Take that same build to BASH and try and fight 3 or more of those same builds, not going to be pretty if you focus on one foe.
It's a faster more brutal game. You must adapt just as quickly. Remember, i used to play bash and za all day everyday for the first couple of years of this game.
I'm sure it's changed a bit have not qued for tier 4 bash since just a little past the alert pass, but i do remember it being nothing like a singular battle against a lone foe.
Many of my friends who came from COH thought it would be just like the duels they see in the ren center.
Boy were a few of them wrong!! Matter of fact, when is a good time to join Bash?
Need to pass the info on to a few folks. I may even give it a try again.
Regarding B.A.S.H., there is absolutely nothing wrong with using teleport to flee when it gets too rough. Also, having high defense and dodge is almost a requirement due to the number of opponents hitting hard. Just a couple things to keep in mind, having Heroic/Legendary gear with R5/R7 Gamblers mod in your Defense gear will help a lot there. The times that B.A.S.H. pops is rather infrequent and sporadic, but I would suggest getting a group of your friends to queue up at the same time, then you'll mostly be battling each other.
Numbers are numbers; there's no shame in running; it sure beats dying. :P Seems people have been less interested in BASH since all the gang wars stopped. Irony w00t >_> Both B.A.S.H. and ZA are different now that cavemen have nukes; the On Alert patch compounded the problem, and the dumb new mods and devices almost completely hosed it, but if you're determined enough, you'll win.
I remember as a duelist, I started playing B.A.S.H. more seriously only when I knew I would win. That's the only reason I play.
Bash isn't really about who wins... it hasn't been since the first day someone discovered tagging. No one remembers the person who tagged them, everyone remembers who actually took them down.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
I keep hearing that pvp is pretty much dead in the game except for pointless dueling in the middle of the ren center. I used to stay in low lvl hero games matches because they were fun, I quit the game long ago for other games due to people constantly choosing powers like teleport and some others.
I've come back to lvl another toon and see what happens in the end game pvp but sadly I don't know if there will be anything I like to do when i get there, I'm kinda shocked as the game seems to have a decent amount of players but not many people que up at all. Usually I see 1 other person queing up with me at lvl 10, can't ever seem to get a match started, not even the zombie game gets any play....Is it the lack of a good reward system for taking the time to make a build and fight your way to the top?
Only been back for about two days now and i'm pretty discouraged about trying to lvl my toon any further because of the lack of pvp around my lvl, I could go to GW2 or something and pvp right away...I like the customization here though. I think WoWs arena system is pretty good for solid pvp I know some of you frown upon WoW but constantly changing the rewards/gear for pvp makes it fun and rewarding for players that want to test their builds against other players.
Devs have made a lot of changes i've seen so far which are awesome, but I'm only here for the pvp, is there going to be a patch dedicated to the pvpers in the game more than just maps and game types. I would like to stay and see where the game experience takes me...but is it worth putting the time in to lvl, and pay $14.99 a month? I guess what i'm asking is there a strong pvp community here at this state of the game mainly for hero games and bash?
No, B.A.S.H. is about winning. I've already dueled everyone in B.A.S.H. who claims to be good. I have no reason not to cull the weak.
PvP was always dead; it's just that there used to be enough players to get some games going. PvP would've been much more popular if Cryptic didn't make so many mistakes. People need to stop blaming sorcery auras or customization as some sort of reason why this game is broken. Nerfing doesn't fix their ineptitude.
Can I post now? I actually have stuff to contribute!
So ya don't like the Freeform PvP climate, eh? I don't like it either. I enjoy being a squishy striker who does one thing really well and that thing is hitting other things really hard. There's no place in the current PvP climate for that, however! Freeform PvP is all about heals, spikes and flying around with Ascension.
So here's why everyone should have an AT and play AT PvP!
I'm in the same boat. Ferret's concept and RP is all about dashing in first and occasionally getting his head handed back to him. There's no way I'd take him into PvP. I have been looking for an excuse to roll a Soldier though, you may have just given me the reason to do so!
I don't do hand-me-down builds. I'm creative, not imitative.
This is a thread created with the intent to help newcomers to Hero Games. I'll give you benefit of doubt here, & ask if you could possibly contribute rather than distract from said content? Show everyone you can contribute? The ball is in your court & I urge you to be a good sport.
...because PvP is fun! The Freeform system available to Champions Online makes it's PvP system one of a kind!
I really liked the original post until that line at the very end, because it makes propably the best case for CO PvP I've seen. But after a good explanation of why the Freeform system not being all that free in practice (if you want to PvP) isn't such a bad thing, that was a counter-intuitive close.
Also, considering the thread is supposed to help PvP newcomers, I'd argue it'd be good to actually go into "does archetype PvP make sense?" to cater to players who're not sure about taking the subscription plunge. Then again, might be better to have that in a separate posting, anyways.
This is a thread created with the intent to help newcomers to Hero Games. I'll give you benefit of doubt here, & ask if you could possibly contribute rather than distract from said content? Show everyone you can contribute, or is trolling the most your intelligence can muster? The ball is in your court & I urge you to be a good sport.
I really liked the original post until that line at the very end, because it makes propably the best case for CO PvP I've seen. But after a good explanation of why the Freeform system not being all that free in practice (if you want to PvP) isn't such a bad thing, that was a counter-intuitive close.
Also, considering the thread is supposed to help PvP newcomers, I'd argue it'd be good to actually go into "does archetype PvP make sense?" to cater to players who're not sure about taking the subscription plunge. Then again, might be better to have that in a separate posting, anyways.
Some posted about AT's right after me. As I haven't used an AT in about 2 years, I don't think I'm in position to make that post.
Okay, I'll bite. I've been playing off and on since beta. Mostly off, for whatever goofy reason. But, pvp is something I dabbled in back in the day, well, if you count ZA and that one B.A.S.H. I did waaay back in the early launch days. I'd like to give it a go again. I've taken what notes I could from this thread, and plan on trying to put together a build tonight, hopefully anyway. So, tips for a pvp newbie, go go ! ^_^
Okay, I'll bite. I've been playing off and on since beta. Mostly off, for whatever goofy reason. But, pvp is something I dabbled in back in the day, well, if you count ZA and that one B.A.S.H. I did waaay back in the early launch days. I'd like to give it a go again. I've taken what notes I could from this thread, and plan on trying to put together a build tonight, hopefully anyway. So, tips for a pvp newbie, go go ! ^_^
Happy building and good luck
Do be careful, choice of PSS, SSS and gear will play a fundamental role.
Think how all of them can be synergized with your power choices even before actually picking powers. Beware of diminishing returns and plan how to stack your defenses and maximise your healing.
These days, a large part of PvP involves staying alive long enough to kill something.
Okay, I'll bite. I've been playing off and on since beta. Mostly off, for whatever goofy reason. But, pvp is something I dabbled in back in the day, well, if you count ZA and that one B.A.S.H. I did waaay back in the early launch days. I'd like to give it a go again. I've taken what notes I could from this thread, and plan on trying to put together a build tonight, hopefully anyway. So, tips for a pvp newbie, go go ! ^_^
Make sure con is one of your ss and that you get some knock resistance...
As an update, and to get back to the theme of this thread, I've been working on a HW tank build for pvp'ing with. I know its a ranged game mostly anymore, but I don't care, I love me some in yo face action ! I'm happy with the survivability, I'm just working on the damage, still not quite where I want it. I'll be standing around RenCen observing the next few days, so pay me no heed. Just a quick question though, for a tanky build, currently I'm PSS str , with con/intel as SSS. Should I be maining con? Or is going the str route alright?
As an update, and to get back to the theme of this thread, I've been working on a HW tank build for pvp'ing with. I know its a ranged game mostly anymore, but I don't care, I love me some in yo face action ! I'm happy with the survivability, I'm just working on the damage, still not quite where I want it. I'll be standing around RenCen observing the next few days, so pay me no heed. Just a quick question though, for a tanky build, currently I'm PSS str , with con/intel as SSS. Should I be maining con? Or is going the str route alright?
For dmg, PSS strength grants crit chance and crit sev from spec tree through SSS. So most will PSS strength but stack con.
correction: in pss strength, the crit chance comes from strength, not sss. you probably meant to be talking about the defense anyway.
Oh no it is a genuine mistake on my side because I do not use PSS strength and I did not doublecheck the description for crit chance. Sorry for the mistake.
correction: in pss strength, the crit chance comes from strength, not sss. you probably meant to be talking about the defense anyway.
the truth of the matter is i am new to the game and have no idea what i am doing but i like the re pore you guys have .I will be running past the ren center from time to time . I would like to actually get your opinion on support builds in pvp. will i have a chance or not ? i am willing to get in line for the build i may have to make to do it and i am a silver player if it makes a diff.this thread was cool and please excuse my grammar , I'm not good with that.
correction: in pss strength, the crit chance comes from strength, not sss. you probably meant to be talking about the defense anyway.
Wait wut when did Smoochan start trying to have serious conversations? I'm on to you you Lamurian shapeshifter! You'll be glad to know though we are in no rush to have the real Smoochan back :P
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
the truth of the matter is i am new to the game and have no idea what i am doing but i like the re pore you guys have .I will be running past the ren center from time to time . I would like to actually get your opinion on support builds in pvp. will i have a chance or not ? i am willing to get in line for the build i may have to make to do it and i am a silver player if it makes a diff.this thread was cool and please excuse my grammar , I'm not good with that.
Feel free to ask about feedback on builds etc. There are still enough people around who will give you genuine and good suggestions and advice. Most are helpful.
Wait wut when did Smoochan start trying to have serious conversations? I'm on to you you Lamurian shapeshifter! You'll be glad to know though we are in no rush to have the real Smoochan back :P
I think your full forum saturation has dried out a bit.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
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Story .
My Characters on PRIMUS
[#]WeNeedHeroicFashion - <Aura Suggestions> - <CO Wiki (WIP)> - <Crowd Control Discussion> - <Telepathy in Champions Online> - How to review The Force Power Set - Join the Champions Online: On Alert Discord!
I am @RavenForce in game
__________________________
Making your own build is much more fulfilling IMO, but I guess in PvP if someone is doing something better than you can, asking for tips (not copying entire build) is a way to improve your fighting skills...I guess..
My Characters on PRIMUS
[#]WeNeedHeroicFashion - <Aura Suggestions> - <CO Wiki (WIP)> - <Crowd Control Discussion> - <Telepathy in Champions Online> - How to review The Force Power Set - Join the Champions Online: On Alert Discord!
I am @RavenForce in game
__________________________
Nailed it. I'm always open to helping friends. Even concept builds can be maximized to full potential.
And (from my experience) Raven, I wholeheartedly agree with consulting others for PvP advice, heck I ask coPvP stuff all the time, and I almost have my 900 day reward.
I'd rather get STO's level of lockbox suck if worthwhile updates come with it. -Buxom
I'm just not one of them. I find the prospect, most of the time, to be somewhat less appealing than trying to drive the entirety of a 20 foot long stake through my middle leg...
That being said, the main problem with PVP in a game like CO is lack of balance. Say what you will. Not all power sets in the game perform equally. And not all of them are equally useful in PVP.
What's more, with freeform, there's been enough time to suss out which particular powers tend to be MORE useful in PVP and which ones have better synergies for that purpose.
Leading to FOTM builds, mega-optimized builds, etc. Essentially a race to the top. Which then REALLY puts a hurt on attracting newer players.
You get a guy with one of these optimal builds with optimal gear versus a guy who's been playing a few weeks with a more conventional PVE-centric build.
"Tough. Lrn2PlayN00B! They can get there too "eventually" right?"
What you're missing is the whole "skill" aspect has been completely tossed at that point. At that point it's just "Spam this. Gear-quest for that."
Where, EXACTLY, is the skill and competition in xeroxing someone's build and then sitting their all but invulnerable to everyone else?
And that's about as much fun as the aforementioned spike in one's genitalia. And very few people are going to willingly stick around and get their butts kicked on a repeated basis just so they can take the time to amass the gear they need.
ESPECIALLY in a game with currency venues as fragmented as CO is.
Worse, an actual balance pass to make the powers more equivalent in PVP would just homogenize the game, removing reasons to play varying power sets other than pure cosmetic reasons.
And this is all before even addressing the social problems engendered by certain personality types in PVP.
"Champions-Online and Star Trek Online contained hundreds of hours of mediocre content!"
and "nothing was polished".
--Jack Emmert
They are far from the same. I have done very well in duels against what some people would say are FOTM builds. Matter of fact there are a few builds of mine that have yet to lose to a certain type of build. Big deal? Not really. Take that same build to BASH and try and fight 3 or more of those same builds, not going to be pretty if you focus on one foe.
It's a faster more brutal game. You must adapt just as quickly. Remember, i used to play bash and za all day everyday for the first couple of years of this game.
I'm sure it's changed a bit have not qued for tier 4 bash since just a little past the alert pass, but i do remember it being nothing like a singular battle against a lone foe.
Many of my friends who came from COH thought it would be just like the duels they see in the ren center.
Boy were a few of them wrong!! Matter of fact, when is a good time to join Bash?
Need to pass the info on to a few folks. I may even give it a try again.
I remember as a duelist, I started playing B.A.S.H. more seriously only when I knew I would win. That's the only reason I play.
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Community Rules and Policies -Smackwell
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
I've come back to lvl another toon and see what happens in the end game pvp but sadly I don't know if there will be anything I like to do when i get there, I'm kinda shocked as the game seems to have a decent amount of players but not many people que up at all. Usually I see 1 other person queing up with me at lvl 10, can't ever seem to get a match started, not even the zombie game gets any play....Is it the lack of a good reward system for taking the time to make a build and fight your way to the top?
Only been back for about two days now and i'm pretty discouraged about trying to lvl my toon any further because of the lack of pvp around my lvl, I could go to GW2 or something and pvp right away...I like the customization here though. I think WoWs arena system is pretty good for solid pvp I know some of you frown upon WoW but constantly changing the rewards/gear for pvp makes it fun and rewarding for players that want to test their builds against other players.
Devs have made a lot of changes i've seen so far which are awesome, but I'm only here for the pvp, is there going to be a patch dedicated to the pvpers in the game more than just maps and game types. I would like to stay and see where the game experience takes me...but is it worth putting the time in to lvl, and pay $14.99 a month? I guess what i'm asking is there a strong pvp community here at this state of the game mainly for hero games and bash?
PvP was always dead; it's just that there used to be enough players to get some games going. PvP would've been much more popular if Cryptic didn't make so many mistakes. People need to stop blaming sorcery auras or customization as some sort of reason why this game is broken. Nerfing doesn't fix their ineptitude.
I'm in the same boat. Ferret's concept and RP is all about dashing in first and occasionally getting his head handed back to him. There's no way I'd take him into PvP. I have been looking for an excuse to roll a Soldier though, you may have just given me the reason to do so!
This is a thread created with the intent to help newcomers to Hero Games. I'll give you benefit of doubt here, & ask if you could possibly contribute rather than distract from said content? Show everyone you can contribute? The ball is in your court & I urge you to be a good sport.
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Community Rules and Policies -Smackwell
I really liked the original post until that line at the very end, because it makes propably the best case for CO PvP I've seen. But after a good explanation of why the Freeform system not being all that free in practice (if you want to PvP) isn't such a bad thing, that was a counter-intuitive close.
Also, considering the thread is supposed to help PvP newcomers, I'd argue it'd be good to actually go into "does archetype PvP make sense?" to cater to players who're not sure about taking the subscription plunge. Then again, might be better to have that in a separate posting, anyways.
Okay, I'll make a different thread.
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Community Rules and Policies -Smackwell
Some posted about AT's right after me. As I haven't used an AT in about 2 years, I don't think I'm in position to make that post.
Very, very fascinating, good sir!
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Hitting them until they die works very well! Try it, you'll like it! ^_~
We all know "it" is only acting innocent and ignorant to what "it" is doing. Reality often eludes the schizophrenic.
Now.. Please stay on topic. Try helping the community with knowledge rather than pester them due to your own lack of insight.
I tried that but it didn't work! Oh, well. u_u
Happy building and good luck
Do be careful, choice of PSS, SSS and gear will play a fundamental role.
Think how all of them can be synergized with your power choices even before actually picking powers. Beware of diminishing returns and plan how to stack your defenses and maximise your healing.
These days, a large part of PvP involves staying alive long enough to kill something.
Make sure con is one of your ss and that you get some knock resistance...
<--tough cookie :P
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
@Pallih in game
It's just not the same ;_;, sniff.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
@Pallih in game
For dmg, PSS strength grants crit chance and crit sev from spec tree through SSS. So most will PSS strength but stack con.
correction: in pss strength, the crit chance comes from strength, not sss. you probably meant to be talking about the defense anyway.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.
Oh no it is a genuine mistake on my side because I do not use PSS strength and I did not doublecheck the description for crit chance. Sorry for the mistake.
the truth of the matter is i am new to the game and have no idea what i am doing but i like the re pore you guys have .I will be running past the ren center from time to time . I would like to actually get your opinion on support builds in pvp. will i have a chance or not ? i am willing to get in line for the build i may have to make to do it and i am a silver player if it makes a diff.this thread was cool and please excuse my grammar , I'm not good with that.
Wait wut when did Smoochan start trying to have serious conversations? I'm on to you you Lamurian shapeshifter! You'll be glad to know though we are in no rush to have the real Smoochan back :P
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Feel free to ask about feedback on builds etc. There are still enough people around who will give you genuine and good suggestions and advice. Most are helpful.
Nothin in it works well.
I think your full forum saturation has dried out a bit.
Champions Online: Be the hero you wish you could be in a better game.